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Peace with Hamas means no Peace for Israel

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posted on May, 7 2011 @ 04:39 PM
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And this is my proof (as if anymore were needed)


"Soon after bin Laden's death was announced early on Monday, Hamas's government chief in Gaza, Ismail Haniya, said: "We condemn any killing of a holy warrior or of a Muslim and Arab person, and we ask God to bestow his mercy upon him."

Link

Hmmmmmm...So the very same Hamas that praises Bin Laden as a "holy warrior" is one that Israel should negotiate with...?? Even though this same Hamas has been reckoned as akin to Al Qaida in ideology and tactics? How can Israel possibly negotiate with the PLO now that Hamas and Fatah have "reconciled" their differences? This is merely the left hand clasping the right. Hamas has been the proverbial "bad cop" and the PLO the "good cop". And now that theyre united Israel is supposed to ignore Hamas' ridiculously outrageous ideology and vociferous rejection of a Jewish presence, let alone a state in the midst of Dar al Islam, and pretend that this wont lead to further concessions or possibly war down the road?

Anyways. Digest that statement of Hamas' government chief which came right after their making peace with the government in the west bank: obviously they havent changed their tune and have no intenton to.
edit on 7-5-2011 by dontreally because: (no reason given)




posted on May, 7 2011 @ 04:46 PM
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Don't worry the islam shills will be here to explain to us how we are totally in the wrong and had no legal right to kill OBL. And, by the way, it is all Israel's fault anyway.



posted on May, 7 2011 @ 04:50 PM
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with any luck it'll stop isreal acting like the nazi's of the middle east...

but i doubt it!



posted on May, 7 2011 @ 04:51 PM
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Originally posted by sonofliberty1776
no legal right to kill OBL.


a) 187 - murder, death, kill
b) thou shalt not kill

two wrongs never make a right, regardless of how much the msm keeps banging their evil drum



posted on May, 7 2011 @ 04:55 PM
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reply to post by dontreally
 


Many sources indicate that Israel created Hamas. I wouldn't doubt it. Stranger things have happened. So Israel does not want to have relations with an organization that they created? I find that as Ironic as the USA declaring a war on terrorism against Al-Qaeda.

abovetopsecret.com



posted on May, 7 2011 @ 05:15 PM
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reply to post by Corruption Exposed
 


Did Israel also create Islam and the concept of Jihad..or Shahid???

Since this is what motivates Hamas and all Islamic political movements (muslim brotherhood for instance) i dont see how this baseless accusation of yours (which is patently false. The Muslim brotherhood created Hamas and this a fact of history) has any relevance at all to this thread. Youd just choose in your idiocy to ignore every evil Hamas or frankly anyone does to divert th rancor back against Israel.

Your obscene disregard for what this thread is about - ie, Hamas' Gaza chief condemning the murder of the holy warrior Osama Bin Laden, something Israels leadership no matter how much you dislike them would have the temerity to publicly say; and this btw just shows you how filtered the Muslim position is in the west. People dont even know how to logically process this information; the propaganda weighs down on them too heavily. People are already ignoring what this nutcase leading official in Hamas/PLOs government said and will insist that this is in some way Israels fault. They are obsessed! and possessed by this idea.)



posted on May, 7 2011 @ 05:25 PM
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reply to post by dontreally
 




Did Israel also create Islam and the concept of Jihad..or Shahid???


No, just Hamas.



Youd just choose in your idiocy


LOL did you just call me an idiot?




Your obscene disregard for what this thread is about


Please scroll up and compare your thread title to my response. It clearly is relevant to this thread. You don't need to get all worked up just because I don't agree with you and pointed out the irony that Israel refuses to work with an organization they created.



btw just shows you how filtered the Muslim position is in the west.


Leave it to you to pull out the "Muslim" card. I never once mentioned religion. I only discussed Israel, and Hamas. Israel is a country, and Hamas is a political party.

Your thread seems a bit bigoted to me, just saying.



posted on May, 7 2011 @ 05:33 PM
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reply to post by Corruption Exposed
 


Heres a lesson in Islam for you:

Government + Religion = Islam...

Islam regulates EVERY aspect of ones life and Hamas (Islamic resistence movement), Hizbollah (party of God) are RELIGIOUS parties motivted by Islam and Islam alone. There is no c oncept of the separation between chruch and state like there is in the west. Its a completely foreign concept to Muslims. Political consideratons are extraneous to their main concerns: evicting the infidels from Muslim lands or reducing them once again to their former status as Dhimmis.. Pretending to give a crap about democracy and all those other stylish manoevers that the PLO and other Muslim parties employ are for the ultimate purpose of strengthening the umma (the islamic community).

This isnt a religious issue? You cant discuss Middleastern politics without including religion. Once again, this isnt the west. Its an alltogether different paradigm.

This isnt just my opinion either. It comes from their writings.



posted on May, 8 2011 @ 02:40 AM
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Israels too busy committing genocide and crimes against humanity. The israeli idea of peace is murdering every last palestinian man, woman and child..



posted on May, 8 2011 @ 02:42 AM
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reply to post by dontreally
 


What are you talking about? How does a political statement condemning the death of BinLaden relate to peace negotiations with Israel? Sure Hamas represents radical Islam, few would argue with that but radicalism can, in time, be tempered. Look at Israels past. Irgun, Stern Gang, Huganah, All these terrorist organizations in time tempered their ideolgy even to the point of electing that little terrorist Begin Prime Minister who eventually signed a peace treaty with Egypt. So why not Hamas? In fact Hamas has stated they are not opposed to making peace with Israel based on the '67 lines. They could have just as easily said the '48 lines. They have even said Fatah, not Hamas will conduct all negotiations with Israel. Sure they would LIKE Israel to just go away but they know that is not realistic. I suspect you will want to remind me about Hamas' charter but that would only cause me to remind you about the Likud charter both of which mean nothing once peace comes. Israel NEEDS a negotiated peace to legitimize it's borders because under international law Israel is currently in violation of article 42 of the Geneva conventions. I believe a negotiated peace is far better than the UN simply grating statehood to a new state called Palestine based on the '67 lines. Through negotiations neither side will get everything they want but both sides will be satisfied they got everything they could. Both sides are wasting time as September steadily approaches.



posted on May, 8 2011 @ 02:47 AM
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reply to post by dontreally
 


You said "government + religion = Islam" Well religion is infused throughout the Israeli government so if we are to believe your statement we might conclude what? There is no separation of church and state in Israel.
edit on 8-5-2011 by gem_man because: spelling



posted on May, 8 2011 @ 03:14 AM
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reply to post by dontreally
 


There's more terrorists in the Israeli Government than in Hamas...



posted on May, 8 2011 @ 03:59 AM
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reply to post by dontreally
 


Who knows.. This might end up with calm in Gaza.

We've got our extremists in our government, doesn't mean we can't get along.

With respect,
Eliad.



posted on May, 8 2011 @ 04:54 AM
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I would argue the opposite. I would argue to reconciliation between Fatah and Hamas would help to further peace relations. Has anyone considered the possibilty that this may allow Fatah to moderate Hamas. Especially if they are going to be sharing military security as the reports say.

Fatah definetely doesn't want to conspire with another governing body openly involved in terror attacks. I would like to point out however that Hamas rocket attacks have decreased since 2008. In the last 3 years 2 people have been killed as a result of rocket attacks. I think that reconciliation with Fatah can cause these numbers to continue to decrease.

I don't understand the relativity of Hamas condemnation to Osama's death and the process of peace? Extrajudicial killing is illegal under international law. Even though I wouldn't condemn the killing of a mass muderer, frankly I believe they have the right to condemn a violation of international law.



posted on May, 8 2011 @ 09:14 AM
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Originally posted by sonofliberty1776
Don't worry the islam shills will be here to explain to us how we are totally in the wrong and had no legal right to kill OBL. And, by the way, it is all Israel's fault anyway.


Thank god for the jew shills to keep the islam shills on check o ATS. lol



posted on May, 8 2011 @ 09:22 AM
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reply to post by dontreally
 


I tend to agree with your OP, Israel will never see peace with Hamas, that being said if Hamas is kept in check by Fatah and the other more moderate Palestinian factions then there might be a chance at a negotiated peace. It's not worth writing the truce between Hamas and Fatah off as doom and gloom for Israel straight away, it might work in Israel's favour.



posted on May, 8 2011 @ 11:30 AM
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reply to post by gem_man
 


Israel is a completely SECULAR state. What on earth are you talking about? The country still functions on the Sabbath - no national day of rest on Shabbat - so how exactly is this a country that respects Judaism?

Christians and Muslims are accorded the same religious rights that Jews are. If youre a religious Jew, you get Saturday off. If youre christian or Muslim you get sunday or friday off..... And actually, some muslim governments in their history forced Jews to clean the streets and son Shabbat.

I dont think i have ever heard anything more ludicrous than Israel being a religious country...Its completely leftist and Liberal ie; look at it major institutions, Hebrew University, Bar Ilan University, Tel Aviv University....All the intelligentsia are secular liberals. Look at its government. Israel has yet to have a truly religious, conservative Jewish prime minister or president. Theyve all been secularists.



posted on May, 8 2011 @ 11:43 AM
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reply to post by SpeachM1litant
 


Ummm....The complete opposite is likely to occur. First, this peace deal happened a few weeks ago. This statement by Hamas chief in Gaza came AFTER and he clearly and unequivocally called Osama Bin Laden a religious warrior. Hes a Martyr to them. The man who killed 3,000 people on September 11th is a religious hero. So how on earth can you properly reason that Fatah will "temper" Hamas, when the exact opposite is likely to occur; Hamas will radicalize Fatah and thus the West Bank.

The sheer ignorance at this site is beyond alarming. Did you know just a few years ago Hamas militants through Fatah officials off a building? You think those who control the Gaza strip, who shoot hundreds of Rockets into Israel monthly are now going to be mollified..??!! WHY? Why on earth would you think that? This is simply a political gesture to strengthen the international perception of Palestinian unity. When they declare a state in September (which would be in violation of the Oslo accords), and all signs appear to be indicating this, than they will atleast have the ostensible impression of being unified in this endeavor. And since this would be in violation of the terms set by the international community, that is, that the creation of a palestinian state must be bilateral, involving Israel, the PLO and a third party, this will provoke war with Israel. And since the PLO intends to bring into the west bank the 3 million or so Palestinians living abroad, they will probably start killing Jews - the 500,000 of them, most likely the settlers (Look up the Ben Yosef Livnat murder by palestinian policemen), Israel will be forced to step in and this will cause a huge international frenzy.....And Hamas adds something to the west bank that the west bank hasnt had enough of (in their eyes); religious extremism.



posted on May, 8 2011 @ 11:45 AM
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reply to post by dontreally
 



Israel is a completely SECULAR state.


You're kidding me?


Israel gained independence in 1948 to become the world's only Jewish State. It is home to over seven million people, most of whom are Jewish.

www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...



posted on May, 8 2011 @ 12:01 PM
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reply to post by dontreally
 


Ismail Haniya also said this

"We accept a Palestinian state on the borders of 1967, with Jerusalem as its capital, the release of Palestinian prisoners, and the resolution of the issue of refugees," and stated that if the Palestinian electorate approves such a peace agreement with Israel his government will abide by it notwithstanding previous Hamas positions on the issue.

www.jpost.com...

Hamas are not a simple organisation with one view, and an all powerful leader, and should not be represented as so.



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