Ron Paul A Distaster For The USA. Hes Always Wrong. Why Is There So Much Love For Him ? Wrong Paul

reply to post by gorgi


Thank you Gorgi..

This thread has done more to open peoples eyes to a corrupt system and show people the benefits of electing someone like RON PAUL than any other thread I've seen so far..

Originally posted by gorgi

Originally posted by fakerolex
the case he is making is simple: bigger government means less money and power for the people. therefore, reduce the size of the government and the power and wealth is restored to the people. i think we can all agree this is good, yes?

Wrong, a smaller government does not mean more people will really keep their money. So instead of paying taxes you could pay out of pocket for fire fighters or police.Instead of paying taxes you could just pay a huge few to private road owners instead of having a gas tax.
You are still gonna pay, its just a matter of your taxes taking car of it and not having to do all that work or do it yourself and have payments to dozens of separate for profit corporations at a higher rate.

No, it is you who is wrong. Wrong again and again and again.

Our taxes aren't even paying for our services. Our taxes pay for the interest that the FED owes to banks. Property taxes usually contribute to local services. Taking our the income tax and going with a flat tax is RP's idea. It puts money back into the people's pockets and THEY DECIDE where to use their money. This will encourage saving and strengthening of the US currency. Will we have everything? no. Will lives become simpler? YES, as well as raising the quality of living tremendously.

Once again GORGI/FOODMAN has failed to open his or her eyes and see light.

Get off that brainwash soda you're drinking, it's really not helping your arguments.

reply to post by gorgi

The dollar is not broken. It is fairly normal. Look at this and see for yourself that there is nothing really wrong with the US Dollar.

Pedal that to the ignorant Gorgi. I HAVE been watching the dollar,

Today the Swiss franc made yet another new high against the super dollar, as it has been doing for 120 days. What you are reading in the [following] graphs is less and less of the foreign currency that one dollar can buy...

LOOK at the DARN GRAPHS Gorgi!!

The dollar is losing against the likes of the Russian ruble, Botswana pula, not to mention the European euro despite the "sovereign" debt crisis in Greece, Ireland, Italy, Portugal and Spain:. For the first time in a long time the US dollar is worth LESS than the Australian and Canadian dollars

This is what foreign economists and the IMF are saying about the USA:

The M3 figures - which include broad range of bank accounts and are tracked by British and European monetarists for warning signals about the direction of the US economy a year or so in advance - began shrinking last summer. The pace has since quickened....

"It’s frightening," said Professor Tim Congdon from International Monetary Research. "The plunge in M3 has no precedent since the Great Depression....

The US authorities have an entirely different explanation for the failure of stimulus measures to gain full traction. They are opting instead for yet further doses of Keynesian spending, despite warnings from the IMF that the gross public debt of the US will reach 97pc of GDP next year and 110pc by 2015....

The ECRI leading index of US economic activity has been sliding continuously since its peak in October, suffering the steepest one-week drop ever recorded in mid-May.

Mr Summers acknowledged in a speech this week that the eurozone crisis had shone a spotlight on the dangers of spiralling public debt. He said deficit spending delays the day of reckoning and leaves the US at the mercy of foreign creditors. Ultimately, "failure begets failure" in fiscal policy as the logic of compound interest does its worst.... www.telegraph.co.uk...

J. P. Morgan controls the media here in the USA Gorgi and he will spoon feed us the propaganda he wants us to hear.

U.S. Congressional Record February 9, 1917: J.P. Morgan interests bought 25 of America's leading newspapers, and inserted their own editors, in order to control the media. www.mindfully.org...

JP Morgan: Our next big media player? (April 13, 2010) JP Morgan controls 54 U.S. daily newspapers,and owns 31 television stations. www.newsandtech.com...

reply to post by backinblack

This thread has done more to open peoples eyes to a corrupt system and show people the benefits of electing someone like RON PAUL than any other thread I've seen so far..

Yes he gives us something to sharpen our teeth on.

Usually the banker puppets do a hit and run and will not discuss the points. I give Gorgi high marks for actually sticking around and defending his points.

Originally posted by crimvelvet
reply to post by gorgi

 

Pedal that to the ignorant Gorgi. I HAVE been watching the dollar,

Today the Swiss franc made yet another new high against the super dollar, as it has been doing for 120 days. What you are reading in the [following] graphs is less and less of the foreign currency that one dollar can buy...

LOOK at the DARN GRAPHS Gorgi!!

The dollar is losing against the likes of the Russian ruble, Botswana pula,

not to mention the European euro despite the "sovereign" debt crisis in Greece, Ireland, Italy, Portugal and Spain:. For the first time in a long time the US dollar is worth LESS than the Australian and Canadian dollars

The dollar is not "losing" to any of these. The exchange rate has changed but thats really it. Its still the reserve currency of the world. T-bills are still the safest way to store money. Dont say gold or silver, those are too volatile.
The "PIIGS" are not faring very well. Their debt is major problem for them. Their economies are not as big as ours and the Euro isnt the worlds reserve currency. The future of the Euro is not certain anymore. The US dollar is not going any where any time soon.

This is what foreign economists and the IMF are saying about the USA:

The M3 figures - which include broad range of bank accounts and are tracked by British and European monetarists for warning signals about the direction of the US economy a year or so in advance - began shrinking last summer. The pace has since quickened....

"It’s frightening," said Professor Tim Congdon from International Monetary Research. "The plunge in M3 has no precedent since the Great Depression....

The US authorities have an entirely different explanation for the failure of stimulus measures to gain full traction. They are opting instead for yet further doses of Keynesian spending, despite warnings from the IMF that the gross public debt of the US will reach 97pc of GDP next year and 110pc by 2015....

The ECRI leading index of US economic activity has been sliding continuously since its peak in October, suffering the steepest one-week drop ever recorded in mid-May.

Mr Summers acknowledged in a speech this week that the eurozone crisis had shone a spotlight on the dangers of spiralling public debt. He said deficit spending delays the day of reckoning and leaves the US at the mercy of foreign creditors. Ultimately, "failure begets failure" in fiscal policy as the logic of compound interest does its worst.... www.telegraph.co.uk...

Deficit spending is bad when its not needed. Right now we do need some of it to keep the economy along. For most of the bush administration it wasnt needed. That was a waste.

J. P. Morgan controls the media here in the USA Gorgi and he will spoon feed us the propaganda he wants us to hear.

U.S. Congressional Record February 9, 1917: J.P. Morgan interests bought 25 of America's leading newspapers, and inserted their own editors, in order to control the media. www.mindfully.org...

JP Morgan: Our next big media player? (April 13, 2010) JP Morgan controls 54 U.S. daily newspapers,and owns 31 television stations. www.newsandtech.com...

True, they do "own" a lot of media outlets, but you can always fact check anything you hear or read.

Originally posted by crimvelvet
reply to post by backinblack

 

This thread has done more to open peoples eyes to a corrupt system and show people the benefits of electing someone like RON PAUL than any other thread I've seen so far..

Yes he gives us something to sharpen our teeth on.

Usually the banker puppets do a hit and run and will not discuss the points. I give Gorgi high marks for actually sticking around and defending his points.

Im not a puppet, I really do believe what I am saying. I did not make this to piss people off. I made this to try and show counter points to Ron Paul.

Originally posted by gorgi

Originally posted by fakerolex
the case he is making is simple: bigger government means less money and power for the people. therefore, reduce the size of the government and the power and wealth is restored to the people. i think we can all agree this is good, yes?

Wrong, a smaller government does not mean more people will really keep their money. So instead of paying taxes you could pay out of pocket for fire fighters or police.Instead of paying taxes you could just pay a huge few to private road owners instead of having a gas tax.
You are still gonna pay, its just a matter of your taxes taking car of it and not having to do all that work or do it yourself and have payments to dozens of separate for profit corporations at a higher rate.

So redundancy is good? Having a township police, then a county sherriff, then state police and then fbi?

In most countries you just have a federal police with local branches! Why do americans need four levels of police in the USA? I am just using this as an example of american overkill. They also have central firefighters, central school planning boards, central everything.

In most countries the fbi is also the police. Then you have the cia equivalent for spying and intelligence gathering. In america you have the nsa and cia-one spies on foreign countries while the other spies everywhere including within the usa. As if that was not enough then we have DHS which consolidated something like 10 federal agencies and now TSA which scans people naked and perverted agents that like to touch small boys and girls.

The american government is wayyyyyyy toooooooo biggg regardless how you look at it. I am socialist and say this! Billions get wasted that could be put to much better use taking care of american citizens in the form of state welfare.

Originally posted by gorgi

Deficit spending is bad when its not needed. Right now we do need some of it to keep the economy along. For most of the bush administration it wasnt needed. That was a waste.

Yeah, keep the economy going for another six months or so, then what? Raise the debt celing again? Then borrow more to spend more, raise debt ceiling...rinse-repeat again and again and again and again...

Sooner or later the american dollar will become a second world currency on par with spain and portugal, that is if america will be allowed to borrow more. If the credit risk is too high then most people/organisations/financial institutions will not lend to her which means the credit ceiling will be reached and the economy will crash aka default on payments.

Then it maybe another 10 years before anyone lends to america another dime, but I am sure the rothschild antichrists will jump in and save the day with their one world digital currency, because by that time the Euro will be nearing default as well. One world currency equals NWO dictatorship. I see this happening within the next 5-10 years at most!

They will NOT LET america and europe rebuild themselves and start over. All of this is planned chaos. Enjoy your last few paychecks traitor. You deserve no sympathy from anyone and are expendable just like the rest of the desperate, idiotic shills on this site!

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07

Originally posted by gorgi

Deficit spending is bad when its not needed. Right now we do need some of it to keep the economy along. For most of the bush administration it wasnt needed. That was a waste.

Yeah, keep the economy going for another six months or so, then what? Raise the debt celing again? Then borrow more to spend more, raise debt ceiling...rinse-repeat again and again and again and again...

Sooner or later the american dollar will become a second world currency on par with spain and portugal, that is if america will be allowed to borrow more. If the credit risk is too high then most people/organisations/financial institutions will not lend to her which means the credit ceiling will be reached and the economy will crash aka default on payments.

Then it maybe another 10 years before anyone lends to america another dime, but I am sure the rothschild antichrists will jump in and save the day with their one world digital currency, because by that time the Euro will be nearing default as well. One world currency equals NWO dictatorship. I see this happening within the next 5-10 years at most!

They will NOT LET america and europe rebuild themselves and start over. All of this is planned chaos. Enjoy your last few paychecks traitor. You deserve no sympathy from anyone and are expendable just like the rest of the desperate, idiotic shills on this site!

edit on 5/11/2011 by EarthCitizen07 because: (no reason given)

You why did you have to bring up the rotchchilds? I was trying to have a debate with you until you brought them up.

reply to post by gorgi


Because the Rothschild family did not amass $500 trillion by playing fair or producing anything of value. They are/were satan worshippers and CHEATS of the first degree. Watch a video and read some conspiracy material to get a clue!

And its not about zionism either. Its about world domination!

I agree that certain parts of the government should be reduced. Spending should be reduced in certain areas (and perhaps raised in others, like on the infrastructure of the country). But no way do I support a flat tax.

It's policies like that which will make it impossible for me to ever vote for Paul. It's policies like that which will make this country worse. That just means more money for the wealthy (who are getting continually richer, regardless) to soak up.

Originally posted by origamiandurbanism
I agree that certain parts of the government should be reduced. Spending should be reduced in certain areas (and perhaps raised in others, like on the infrastructure of the country). But no way do I support a flat tax.

It's policies like that which will make it impossible for me to ever vote for Paul. It's policies like that which will make this country worse. That just means more money for the wealthy (who are getting continually richer, regardless) to soak up.

What do you think "flat tax" does? Do you think it means everybody pays $X.00, no matter what their incomes are? You understand it just means a flat percentage for everybody, right?

Originally posted by Cuervo

Originally posted by origamiandurbanism
I agree that certain parts of the government should be reduced. Spending should be reduced in certain areas (and perhaps raised in others, like on the infrastructure of the country). But no way do I support a flat tax.

It's policies like that which will make it impossible for me to ever vote for Paul. It's policies like that which will make this country worse. That just means more money for the wealthy (who are getting continually richer, regardless) to soak up.

What do you think "flat tax" does? Do you think it means everybody pays $X.00, no matter what their incomes are? You understand it just means a flat percentage for everybody, right?

I understand what it is.

A flat tax would shift even more of the tax burden on the middle and lower classes because the rich would then not be paying what proportionally they earn. Not only that but it would it still mean wages are being taxed twice - payroll and income. But unearned income would not be. Again, no thanks!

It's like a sales tax, which again, shifts more of the burden on the middle and lower classes.

I don't understand how people that say "Down with the Elites!" would be in support of this. It makes no sense.

Originally posted by origamiandurbanism

Originally posted by Cuervo

Originally posted by origamiandurbanism
I agree that certain parts of the government should be reduced. Spending should be reduced in certain areas (and perhaps raised in others, like on the infrastructure of the country). But no way do I support a flat tax.

It's policies like that which will make it impossible for me to ever vote for Paul. It's policies like that which will make this country worse. That just means more money for the wealthy (who are getting continually richer, regardless) to soak up.

What do you think "flat tax" does? Do you think it means everybody pays $X.00, no matter what their incomes are? You understand it just means a flat percentage for everybody, right?

I understand what it is.

A flat tax would shift even more of the tax burden on the middle and lower classes because the rich would then not be paying what proportionally they earn. Not only that but it would it still mean wages are being taxed twice - payroll and income. But unearned income would not be. Again, no thanks!

It's like a sales tax, which again, shifts more of the burden on the middle and lower classes.

I don't understand how people that say "Down with the Elites!" would be in support of this. It makes no sense.

edit on 11-5-2011 by origamiandurbanism because: (no reason given)

How would the rich not be paying proportionally what they earned?

And sales tax? Why doesn't that make sense? I'd prefer a complete sales-tax society. He who consumes more, pays more. That totally makes sense to me. Wouldn't that mean the people who buy luxury items would be taxed more? Often, in states with sales tax (like Washington), certain items don't even get taxed because they are necessary to survive.

Originally posted by Cuervo

Originally posted by origamiandurbanism

Originally posted by Cuervo

Originally posted by origamiandurbanism
I agree that certain parts of the government should be reduced. Spending should be reduced in certain areas (and perhaps raised in others, like on the infrastructure of the country). But no way do I support a flat tax.

It's policies like that which will make it impossible for me to ever vote for Paul. It's policies like that which will make this country worse. That just means more money for the wealthy (who are getting continually richer, regardless) to soak up.

What do you think "flat tax" does? Do you think it means everybody pays $X.00, no matter what their incomes are? You understand it just means a flat percentage for everybody, right?

I understand what it is.

A flat tax would shift even more of the tax burden on the middle and lower classes because the rich would then not be paying what proportionally they earn. Not only that but it would it still mean wages are being taxed twice - payroll and income. But unearned income would not be. Again, no thanks!

It's like a sales tax, which again, shifts more of the burden on the middle and lower classes.

I don't understand how people that say "Down with the Elites!" would be in support of this. It makes no sense.

edit on 11-5-2011 by origamiandurbanism because: (no reason given)

How would the rich not be paying proportionally what they earned?

And sales tax? Why doesn't that make sense? I'd prefer a complete sales-tax society. He who consumes more, pays more. That totally makes sense to me. Wouldn't that mean the people who buy luxury items would be taxed more? Often, in states with sales tax (like Washington), certain items don't even get taxed because they are necessary to survive.

I could be wrong but if everyone is paying the same percentage in taxes, that's not proportion, that's percent. Let's say everyone is getting taxed 15%. For someone that makes $20,000 a year, that 15% is going to effect them MUCH more than someone that makes $500,000 a year. It's not really based on what they proportionally make.

I believe the way the way the tax system is now is based more on what people proportionally make, thus the reason why the wealthy pay more in taxes (but not really that much more now a days!).

It's funny that you brought the Washington state sales tax because in a recent state election Bill Gates' father was a strong proponent of lowering the state sales tax and instituting a state income tax on the wealthy. The reason for it was because he believed the burden was unfairly on the middle and lower classes in the state due to the high sales tax. I agree.

The argument you laid out for a sales tax based system is one I've heard before but I just don't agree. I'm pretty sure that someone that is making $500,000 isn't going to be spending nearly the amount proportionally to what they earn vs. someone who makes $20,000 on taxed items. It's going to hit the person who makes way less much more.

reply to post by origamiandurbanism


Then again, we are talking about on a federal level. A flat tax and a sales tax would happen in the scenario of drastically reduced federal government (replaced by respective state governments). I'd imagine virtually all of your taxes would be going to state at that point and not the feds. Each state would obviously have their own flavors for taxing, just as they do now.

On a state level, I do not agree with a flat tax. We are talking about a federal level, though. So, what you are saying isn't something I'd disagree with; we are just talking about two different entities doing the taxing.

the dollar rallied again today. will ron paul ever be right on the dollar. its been over 3+ years hes been wrong. lmao @ 'ron paul' ALWAYS

watch as the cpi released this friday shows little inflation. which is good. a little inflation is good for economy. ron pauls deflation will ruin our country.

There is no chance at all Iran will be attacked this year. ron paul will be wrong again. With oil this high, or even if oil was trading @ $80, a attack on Iran will make oil soar, and as a result destory our economy. All the trillions we have spend through bailouts/stimulus and all the qe would have been wasted. There is no chance the usa will allow a attack on iran.

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07
reply to post by gorgi

 

Because the Rothschild family did not amass $500 trillion by playing fair or producing anything of value. They are/were satan worshippers and CHEATS of the first degree. Watch a video and read some conspiracy material to get a clue!

And its not about zionism either. Its about world domination!

They do not have 500 trillion dollars of wealth. They do not own the world. And there is already a thread about this going on.

Originally posted by Cuervo

Originally posted by origamiandurbanism
I agree that certain parts of the government should be reduced. Spending should be reduced in certain areas (and perhaps raised in others, like on the infrastructure of the country). But no way do I support a flat tax.

It's policies like that which will make it impossible for me to ever vote for Paul. It's policies like that which will make this country worse. That just means more money for the wealthy (who are getting continually richer, regardless) to soak up.

What do you think "flat tax" does? Do you think it means everybody pays $X.00, no matter what their incomes are? You understand it just means a flat percentage for everybody, right?

A flat tax will favor the rich people of the country as the percentage is lower so they will have more excess cash . A flat tax is similar to a sales tax which has a flat rate paid by everyone. Flat taxes are in a sense a regressive taxes and they will hurt the lower/middle class and favor the rich.