Top Government Insider: Bin Laden Died In 2001, 9/11 A False Flag and tell to Federal Grand Jury!, page 3

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reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:02 PM by spikey

Originally posted by AshleyD
Can someone please answer a quick question. It stems from this quote from the OP's article:

Pieczenik also asserted he was directly told by a prominent general that 9/11 was a stand down and a false flag operation
.

I know what a false flag operation is but what is a stand down operation? By the sound of it, it means knowledge of coming attacks but they 'stand down' instead of stopping it.

Is that the correct definition? I can't find any clear definition on it.

Yeah, that's my reading of it too Ashley.

Basically, sit on your hands and do nothing...stand the forces down.

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:04 PM by topherman420

Originally posted by gift0fpr0phecy

Originally posted by dontdrinkthewater
I'm new to the whole "conspiracy" scene on the web,

Sadly, 99.9% of the people who still follow Alex Jones or still believe anything he says, is "new to the whole conspiracy scene".

Alex Jones, over the years, has proven himself to be a liar, a sensationalist, a drug addict, and a psychotic douche bag. It's too bad you haven't done any research to find that to be true.

You think this is the first time he used a "government insider" headline to get your attention for his "show"? Back in 2004, he had another "government insider" on his show claiming Bush ordered 9/11....

www.rense.com...

Did anything come of that? Nope.... No proof, no evidence, just another "government insider" saying what you want to hear.

You know, for someone who is so anti-government or anti-establishment and literally says the government is killing everyone, he sure does put a lot of trust in what "government insiders" tell him.

One of Alex Jones' tactics is to use what is called the "argument from authority":

en.wikipedia.org...

Argument from authority (also known as appeal to authority) is a fallacy of defective induction, where it is argued that a statement is correct because the statement is made by a person or source that is commonly regarded as authoritative.

The most general structure of this argument is:

Source A says that p is true.
Source A is authoritative.
Therefore, p is true.

...it is stupidity at is finest.

reply to post by TKDRL

This post should give you a clue.

edit on 5-5-2011 by gift0fpr0phecy because: (no reason given)

Yeah if he had some proof (you know after holding all those higher level positions) it would make this believable. But as you pointed out I see someone saying the exact same thing in a different tone of voice. And the fact that he makes money off of fiction (tom clancy novels) is a redflag for me.
Rip me apart if you will AJ fans, but I find him only as credible as his word, which is nothing since I cannot vouch for his honesty. Interesting none the less, I havent heard of this guy until now.

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:11 PM by Elbereth

reply to post by gift0fpr0phecy

Gee, you left this part out for some reason:

On the other hand, arguments from authority are an important part of informal logic. Since we cannot have expert knowledge of many subjects, we often rely on the judgments of those who do. There is no fallacy involved in simply arguing that the assertion made by an authority is true. The fallacy only arises when it is claimed or implied that the authority is infallible in principle and can hence be exempted from criticism.

I can't imagine why.
Argument from authority: Wikipedia

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:16 PM by Arken

Originally posted by dontdrinkthewater
Wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is INSTANT impeachment if it goes down

Yes, instant Impeachment for Barak Obama.

And,
Instant Execution for George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfovitz, Condoleeza Rice and................. add...

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:18 PM by Elbereth

Originally posted by Arken

Originally posted by dontdrinkthewater
Wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is INSTANT impeachment if it goes down

Yes, instant Impeachment for Barak Obama.

And,
Instant Execution for George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfovitz, Condoleeza Rice and................. add...

The ruling class is never held to account. Watergate was an aberration, and not even serial killers are "instantly executed", as well should be the case in an allegedly civilized country.

edit on 5-5-2011 by Elbereth because: fix

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:19 PM by emsed1

reply to post by Arken

Easy on the speculation in the last line of the post.

might want to replace a word or two

It's a public forum and those names and the word 3xecut1on

in the same sentence might trigger a Carnivore alarm over at the (agency) and or a visit from the Secret Service.

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:21 PM by spikey

reply to post by gift0fpr0phecy

OK...so we all now know exactly what you claim to think about Alex Jones...and how.

But the question here is one of 'What do you think of Steve R. Pieczenik?'
Considering he is the one we're talking about here...

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:21 PM by gift0fpr0phecy

reply to post by Elbereth

I didn't leave anything out, I gave a link to the entire thing...

Yes, if you have a problem with your car, asking a person of authority in the matter (a mechanic) is a good place to start.

However, then you must prove the mechanic was acting in your best interest (the condition of your car) or his own (the size of his bank account). Hence, the reason why "arguments from authority" are a fallacy.

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:22 PM by Solsthime331

reply to post by Arken

most of this article adds on that he did die in 2001 and that posibly they predicted a depression on its way and they falsly started this war and the alkida believed that he was still alive somewhere, or that war would bring both countrys money in witch case is why american government set the states into WWI they needed money...and war would bring it...

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:33 PM by gift0fpr0phecy

reply to post by spikey

What do I think of "Steve R. Pieczenik"?

I think "Steve R. Pieczenik" is just another author trying to gain attention to sell more books! Even if it means saying controversial things. He is buddy buddy with Alex Jones and they both are using each other to gain more attention which translates to revenue for both of them. A mutual business partnership and nothing more.

Like I said, in 2004, Alex Jones had the headline "Government Insider Says Bush Authorized 911 Attacks", the insider was Stanley Hilton. Well, Stanley Hilton was also an author selling books....

Now in 2011, Alex Jones has the headline "Government Insider: Bin Laden Died In 2001, 9/11 A False Flag and tell to Federal Grand Jury" and the insider is Steve R. Pieczenik. Well, Steve R. Pieczenink is also an author who is selling books....

Wow.. what a weird coincidence.... Most of all of Alex Jones guests are selling a book or something. I bet there is even quite a few "plugs" or advertisements for their books during the show too!

Oh yeah, people have to earn a living, of course..... even if it means lying to people.

So whats the next guest on the Alex Jones show? I bet you I can predict it.... It will be another person who is selling something... Acting in your best interest? Probably not.

That is at least 7 years of the same B.S. from Alex Jones.

edit on 5-5-2011 by gift0fpr0phecy because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:38 PM by Elbereth

Originally posted by gift0fpr0phecy
reply to post by Elbereth

I didn't leave anything out, I gave a link to the entire thing...

Yes, if you have a problem with your car, asking a person of authority in the matter (a mechanic) is a good place to start.

However, then you must prove the mechanic was acting in your best interest (the condition of your car) or his own (the size of his bank account). Hence, the reason why "arguments from authority" are a fallacy.

Pieczenik's CV is all the proof I need to give him a fair hearing. Screw Alex Jones. He is a hawker and a pimp.

The thing about links in posts, I think most people don't follow them. Just like most people don't cite information contradictory to the point they are making.

Pieczenik certainly is more aware of the implications of his association with Alex Jones and his internet venue than most of us can imagine. Read that CV again. It would be foolhardy to take any of this at face value. Even if true, something else is at work here, and damned if I know what it is.

edit on 5-5-2011 by Elbereth because: tighten

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:42 PM by Benevolent Heretic

reply to post by Arken

If Dr. Steve R. Pieczenik has something to say, then shouldn't he contact the media? Why is he waiting for a federal grand jury to tell??? We're listening!

How does he know Bin Laden died in 2001? Spill it, Steve! Don't tell Alex Jones, tell MSNBC, FOX, CNN and the networks.

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:46 PM by gift0fpr0phecy

reply to post by Elbereth

So then you disagree that "arguments from authority" are a fallacy??

You are confirming my beliefs you don't think for your self. You need people of authority to tell you what is true or not. That is pathetic.

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:49 PM by ProtoplasmicTraveler

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by Arken

If Dr. Steve R. Pieczenik has something to say, then shouldn't he contact the media? Why is he waiting for a federal grand jury to tell??? We're listening! How does he know Bin Laden died in 2001? Spill it, Steve! Don't tell Alex Jones, tell MSNBC, FOX, CNN and the networks.

Honestly I think we all know how that would go, they would have him on, on to redicule him.

We have seen it before, the anchors and commentators voices rise in anger and feigned indignity, "Surely sir you aren't suggesting the US Government was involed" "Surely you can't expect people to believe Israel was involeved" "Surely you understand why people would call you a whacky conspiracy theorists"

Sure they have you on, on with two other guests who then say things like "Paula studies have shown that people who believe these kings of things are suffering from" and "Paula this is rediculous the 9-11 Commission Report conducted by a bi-partisan pannel found absolutely no evidence of this".

They have you on to ridicule you and do a hatchet job.

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:51 PM by gift0fpr0phecy

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
Honestly I think we all know how that would go, they would have him on, on to redicule him.

Oh really?

Why don't they ridicule Alex Jones when he is on the MSM? Alex Jones has worked with Fox, CNN, and I think MSNBC.

edit on 5-5-2011 by gift0fpr0phecy because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 12:58 PM by ProtoplasmicTraveler

Originally posted by gift0fpr0phecy

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
Honestly I think we all know how that would go, they would have him on, on to redicule him.

Oh really?

Why don't they ridicule Alex Jones when he is on the MSM? Alex Jones has worked with Fox, CNN, and I think MSNBC.

edit on 5-5-2011 by gift0fpr0phecy because: (no reason given)

It depends how they have you on, as a celebrity like say Jessie Ventura, where Jessie I hear you have this conspiracy show tell us about it, or if they have you on to discuss a very specific topic.

Bottom line is the Networks control who they want to interview, and how, and when, and what format they want to interview them in, one on one, morning talk show, celebrity appearance, book or movie pitch, pannel, or one on one serious interview on a specific topic.

The network makes all those decisions and potential guests may or may not go on the show depending on what the Network wants and what they will negotiate and what they won't.

It's a managed process, it's a managed business.

edit on 5/5/11 by ProtoplasmicTraveler because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 01:01 PM by Benevolent Heretic

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

But can we believe this snippet from Alex Jones? I honestly don't know what to think here. But THIS is the kind of news we need to hear if it's true. If someone knows of Bin Laden's death years ago, I would LOVE to hear it. There's so much speculation, it's hard to know what to believe.

What do you believe, Proto?

Bin Laden died years ago? The whole raid and everything is a lie? Or are you taking a stand? Just curious because I respect your opinion.

edit on 5/5/2011 by Benevolent Heretic because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 01:04 PM by marg6043

reply to post by Arken

This was dismissed by our then president Bush and kept behind the scenes by the corporate media that is run by the private military complex.

Why? because we were invading two nations and needed an excuse to do that, a death Martyrs was of no use.

Is plenty of sources that confirm the Death of Bin laden due to medical reason beside the one telling that he died in a raid by coalition forces in Bora Bora.

But if the news doesn't come from our corporate government is not true, that is why we most believe our government even if deep inside we know they are lies.

edit on 5-5-2011 by marg6043 because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 01:09 PM by Arken

Originally posted by emsed1
reply to post by Arken

Easy on the speculation in the last line of the post.

might want to replace a word or two

It's a public forum and those names and the word 3xecut1on

in the same sentence might trigger a Carnivore alarm over at the (agency) and or a visit from the Secret Service.

Thanks for your friendly advice, but I'm already listed...

reply posted on 5-5-2011 @ 01:11 PM by AshleyD

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

I'm at the same place as you.

*IF* this is true, then it needs to get out and be all over the place. I am just always so hesitant to jump on any bandwagon of Alex Jones. So I have been reading this topic intently but am not sure what to think.

It is the same as Alex Jones' story about OBL's body being on ice. I will admit it's at least possible but not something that is really moving me one way or the other.

So I would like to know more. Just not sure what to think about this at the moment. Please no Jones fans flame me but I am cautious when it comes to his versions of events.

I would love to hear more from the insider himself straight from the horses mouth without him being associating with Jones. Along with any accompanying evidence he may have. As it stands, what he has going for him is his credentials and hearsay. I'd like something more than that, though.

If true, this is huge.

Also, is he just now coming forward? If so, why? I would have hoped he would have been all over this back during 9/11. Not coming forward just now because of OBL's death. Has he been around before then? I would like to believe he wouldn't sit on such world changing information if he really had the goods.

Nevermind that last paragraph. Just looked some stuff up and it appears he has been trying to get the word out previously but that his account came back into the spotlight upon OBL's death. So that is good it's not just for spotlight time in light of recent events.

edit on 5/5/2011 by AshleyD because: (no reason given)