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Originally posted by Shamatt
reply to post by madnessinmysoul
Mate, it is very simple. Yoiu can tell me I am wrong all you like, but that will not make me or anyone else wrong. I know you will stick dogedy to your point, fair enough, you go for it.
You say I have not offered a counter argument., I think I have, but I will summarise:
There are 3 possible possions, not 2. Just because I do not beleive in a god does not make me an athiest.
This has been explained to you by so many on this thread but you tell everyone who subscribes to this point of view that they are wrong. Just that, wrong, end of story.
You, however, are right in your novel new way of interpreting things. Lucky you! :O)
An athiest does not beleive in spirits, magic, divination, holistic healing, clairvoyance etc. An agnostic might.
You seem to be coming closer to the truth though, Terms like Agnostic Athiest.... Ummm are you starting to see that your initial premise was wrong but feeling too proud to make a climb down? Sounds like you might be.
See, if we could agree the following sematic translations, I think you and I would agree wholeheartedly on this topic:
You Say....................I Say
See much diference between us?
I would add that these are only labels, however it is important we are able to label ourselves as we feel comfortable. I would call myself a spiritual agnostic - I think most people would understand this, even if it does not fit into your very strict defanitions. This is why I don't like strict definitions - they are restrictive.
Open your mind and accept that there are traditional meanings behind these words which no amount of arguing on here will ever change.
Be humble enough to look at those old defanitions and say "you know what - that is reasonable" and perhaps start to use the language the same as everyone else.
This would serve you well. These meanings have been arround a lot longer than you or I have.
Originally posted by Blue_Jay33
reply to post by madnessinmysoul
If you don't believe in any deity, even if you are still undecided and deliberating, you are an atheist. Those who lack any active belief in any deity are atheists.
Really Madness does your arrogance have any limits on this topic?
Now you want to speak for other peoples personal opinions based on your personal perspective.
I think enough posters have come into this thread to set you straight, yet you stubbornly and dogmatically continue to cling to your stated position. A position that is totally your own personal opinion on other peoples perspectives. So you arrogantly think you know how all agnostics think and feel.
This thread is just digging your unreasonable reputation even deeper, as some other posters have alluded too.
Keep digging buddy.
Originally posted by Buddha1098
I'm not cow-towing to anyone, I don't label myself. I am.
I'm trying to understand i just don't. Science made my computer. Cool.. Science works. Yup.. scientific thinking works.. Sure.. Scientific method is required for me to validate my spiritual experiences.. Huh?
I'm having a hard time following the logic there.
Magnetism is a complex question that science cannot yet explain. How much more complex do you think the nature of god is vs magnetism? How about infinitely more complex.
Which is why I'd never say anyone else's beliefs are wrong. Because how would I know? I can disagree of course but I'll never know.
For an agnostic atheist you certainly don't act like one. If an omnipotent God tried to hide from you would you be able to find it? If you answer anything but no you are not using logic, if you answer yes then how can you be sure anyone else is wrong?
It's not a personal perspective.
Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
reply to post by mbartelsm
So you just quoted a full post to ignore it? I'm sorry, but your definitions are merely wrong.
Atheism, without deity(ies). This doesn't require the positive assertion that no deities exist. For instance, I have no way of knowing whether or not Thor exists, for all I know he could very well exist. I do not, however, have a justification for claiming to believe aforementioned deity exists. Therefore...I do not believe. I do not make the positive claim that Thor does not or cannot exist, but I also do not accept the claim that he does.
Why yes, I did just get back from watching a movie, how did you know?
Originally posted by babloyi
I guess 1 line responses to 1 single point of my post is something to be expect, no matter how annoying.
So let me direct it: Answer this one:
If a person says "I do not hold the belief in the existence of any deity, neither do I hold a belief that no deities exist. I contend that to know this information is impossible", would they be an atheist?