It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Imagine that you're taken back in time...

page: 1
2
<<   2 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Apr, 30 2011 @ 05:48 PM
link   
Imagine that you're taken back in time to a small cafe' in Austria at the turn of the 20th Century. There you meet a young Adolf Hitler and have occasion to speak with him. Knowing what path he'll eventually take what would you do?

1 Murder him?

2 Reason with him?

3 Nothing at all leaving the course of history unaltered?

I would do number 1 anything to prevent the destruction he caused




posted on Apr, 30 2011 @ 05:52 PM
link   
Without Hitler World War 2 would start anyway because there are other leaders the Nazis could get. What if it goes from bad to worse(a stronger leader than Hitler)



posted on Apr, 30 2011 @ 05:54 PM
link   

Originally posted by starwarsisreal
Without Hitler World War 2 would start anyway because there are other leaders the Nazis could get. What if it goes from bad to worse(a stronger leader than Hitler)


Good answer but that wasnt the question



posted on Apr, 30 2011 @ 05:57 PM
link   
You left out quite a few possibilities, for instance:

Tell him his future mistakes/decisions.



posted on Apr, 30 2011 @ 06:04 PM
link   
And risk causing a paradox which could:

Destroy the universe
Prevent me being born
Completely change the World we live in forever

I'd do nothing... As much as I'd like to, it just wouldn't be practical. What's done is done, lots of lessons have been learnt and although a lot of bad things happened, a lot of good things have happened since the War too.



posted on Apr, 30 2011 @ 06:09 PM
link   
reply to post by sugarcookie1
 


3. Nothing at all leaving the course of history unaltered?

Without Hitler there would've been no rush to invent the atom bomb. The Jap war would've killed millions and millions more. Russia might've developed the atom bomb sooner and annihilated the U.S., Britian, France, Italy... Discoveries in medicine during this war have probably saved more lives since than were lost fighting it. There are too many variables to consider when messing with history.


edit on 30-4-2011 by jiggerj because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 30 2011 @ 06:15 PM
link   

Originally posted by Tephra
You left out quite a few possibilities, for instance:

Tell him his future mistakes/decisions.


I think that would have come under question no 2
thanks for your reply



posted on Apr, 30 2011 @ 06:16 PM
link   

Originally posted by scottlpool2003
And risk causing a paradox which could:

Destroy the universe
Prevent me being born
Completely change the World we live in forever

I'd do nothing... As much as I'd like to, it just wouldn't be practical. What's done is done, lots of lessons have been learnt and although a lot of bad things happened, a lot of good things have happened since the War too.


I agree we did learn alot of lessons but maybe doing nothing would be the way to go...



posted on Apr, 30 2011 @ 06:20 PM
link   

Originally posted by jiggerj
reply to post by sugarcookie1
 


3. Nothing at all leaving the course of history unaltered?

Without Hitler there would've been no rush to invent the atom bomb. The Jap war would've killed millions and millions more. Russia might've developed the atom bomb sooner and annihilated the U.S., Britian, France, Italy... Discoveries in medicine during this war have probably saved more lives since than were lost fighting it. There are too many variables to consider when messing with history.


edit on 30-4-2011 by jiggerj because: (no reason given)


Those were very good answers ..but i wish the atom bomb was never invented..discoveries in medicine that was a great thing



posted on May, 1 2011 @ 01:38 AM
link   
i would see what hes eating that would tell me a lot about him
then i would probably help him
id say look dont bother with the gas chambers and all that, just get us to the moon.



posted on May, 1 2011 @ 01:04 PM
link   
thats a good one thanks for your reply



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 08:13 AM
link   
Do nothing. A chance conversation would do nothing
to alter the mindset of someone who is totally devoted
to his convictions. The dynamics that existed at that time
where irreversable as history has proven.



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 07:40 PM
link   

Originally posted by 43LEO729
Do nothing. A chance conversation would do nothing
to alter the mindset of someone who is totally devoted
to his convictions. The dynamics that existed at that time
where irreversable as history has proven.


Thanks for your answer leo and your right



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 08:47 PM
link   
I'd tell him his moustache looks silly on TV.
And that comb-over has to go, people will take the mickey for years to come.



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 10:00 PM
link   
Interesting thread OP!

I'd like to say murder him, but it is difficult.
It depends on what stage of his development one would find him there.
Perhaps at a stage one could still have reasoned with him.
Although some leaders and cult gurus are somewhat evil, I think they become immensely more so when they surround themselves with sycophants and people who want to be led by them. They have their own hubris reinforced to God-like proportions.
Perhaps he could have been dissuaded from fighting in World War I.
What people experienced there (and Germany's humiliating treatment afterwards) seriously messed them up.
Perhaps he could have been persuaded not to agree to dangerous experimental treatments on his mom, and had she lived longer and her death caused less guilt she may have been a pacifying influence.
Maybe I could have provided patronage to persuade him to stick to painting?
Maybe if somebody gave him medical marijuana for his chronic pains and conditions he wouldn't have started with the speed?
Perhaps that's all humanizing him too much?

I'd have to come prepared to murder him, with poison or a gun.
But then the killing of one man would be on my karma, without any certainty that a terrible war and holocaust still wouldn't occur.
In fact, it could have been led by somebody more efficient and sane.
Ultimately there were many attempts on his life (I believe something like 40), so one couldn't just have walked into a bar and strangled him.
Perhaps I could have given him HIV if I went back in time to his very formative years.
Some say he had some gay tendencies, but I wouldn't count on that.
I'd tell him I wanted to swear loyalty by holding my cut over his (I think they did stuff like that back then), or maybe a little injection.

Assuming it would take a decade for him to die of AIDS, I'd have to do that around 1920.
I don't think he had a normal sex-life gay or straight, so he wouldn't have infected anyone else.
However if all the top Nazis started dying of AIDS around 1934, then the world will know I'd had a busy evening.
edit on 4-5-2011 by halfoldman because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 10:02 PM
link   

Originally posted by Chukkles
I'd tell him his moustache looks silly on TV.
And that comb-over has to go, people will take the mickey for years to come.


lol good one



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 10:10 PM
link   

Originally posted by halfoldman
Interesting thread OP!

I'd like to say murder him, but it is difficult.
It depends on what stage of his development one would find him there.
Perhaps at a stage one could still have reasoned with him.
Although some leaders and cult gurus are somewhat evil, I think they become immensely more so when they surround themselves with sycophants and people who want to be led by them. They have their own hubris reinforced to God-like proportions.
Perhaps he could have been dissuaded from fighting in World War I.
What people experienced there (and Germany's humiliating treatment afterwards) seriously messed them up.
Perhaps he could have been persuaded not to agree to dangerous experimental treatments on his mom, and had she lived longer and her death caused less guilt she may have been a pacifying influence.
Maybe I could have provided patronage to persuade him to stick to painting?
Maybe if somebody gave him medical marijuana for his chronic pains and conditions he wouldn't have started with the speed?
Perhaps that's all humanizing him too much?

I'd have to come prepared to murder him, with poison or a gun.
But then the killing of one man would be on my karma, without any certainty that a terrible war and holocaust still wouldn't occur.
In fact, it could have been led by somebody more efficient and sane.
Ultimately there were many attempts on his life (I believe something like 40), so one couldn't just have walked into a bar and strangled him.
Perhaps I could have given him HIV if I went back in time to his very formative years.
Some say he had some gay tendencies, but I wouldn't count on that.
I'd tell him I wanted to swear loyalty by holding my cut over his (I think they did stuff like that back then), or maybe a little injection.

Assuming it would take a decade for him to die of AIDS, I'd have to do that around 1920.
I don't think he had a normal sex-life gay or straight, so he wouldn't have infected anyone else.
However if all the top Nazis started dying of AIDS around 1934, then the world will know I'd had a busy evening.
edit on 4-5-2011 by halfoldman because: (no reason given)


Its really hard to say if anything would have stoped him.. i think he already had this mindset even back then ..thanks for your reply



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 10:28 PM
link   
reply to post by sugarcookie1
 

There were no ARVs back then, so AIDS would have stopped him dead.
Probably already in 6 years, considering his weak constitution.

It would have been a disfiguring end that he couldn't hide, and they wouldn't even know what it was.

Imagine: One reasoned with him and told him about the holocaust and what he would cause, and then one day an old comrade of his says: "This mysterious guy came along in an Austrian cafe and put that idea in his head. It was all his fault, the schweinehund"!
Oops!
Is one reasoning, or motivating him?



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 10:39 PM
link   
reply to post by sugarcookie1
 


World War II would start anyways with or without Hitler. It would probably be better to leave him alive actually, he wasn't that great of a strategist. Hitler gets blamed to much for the decisions the people around him made.



posted on May, 5 2011 @ 12:32 AM
link   
reply to post by Nosred
 

Perhaps, but I'm not so sure.
There might have been a nationalistic (anti-communist) movement that wanted to reclaim some historic territory where Germans were oppressed, but I think ultimately Hitler's control caused it all to happen as it did.
He already set most of it out in "Mein Kampf".
The people may first have projected their common aspirations and desires onto Hitler, but by the time they realized what was going on, his personality infused everything.
I can't think of any major decisions that he didn't order or approve.

Luckily one of his final orders was resisted - that Germany have its remaining infrastructure blown up because the German people had failed him.

Its very debatable, but I think Hitler's personality eventually dictated supreme.

Going back to the OP's moral puzzle, I'm also not comfortable with just leaving things if I had the chance.
What happened was bad enough for me to say that any "what if?" would have been better.

So to me:
1. One cannot just leave Hitler as is in the scenario. It is not moral, even compared to an unknown outcome.
2. One cannot reason with him in the formative years because one never knows whether one CAN reason with him, or one is giving him ideas and he would be pleased with that legacy.
3. One would have to try and kill him or incapacitate him.
And if I had my time-machine I'd know exactly how...


edit on 5-5-2011 by halfoldman because: (no reason given)



new topics

top topics



 
2
<<   2 >>

log in

join