Two groups of Middle Eastern men caught on the Arizona/Mexico border...others managed to escape

Originally posted by Romeo
and in regards to the election....It will be the ultimate test of your "democracy". Will the election proceed? What if Bush decides he "needs" to toast another country in "retaliation to xyz" a day or 2 before the election. I honestly doubt you'll need to vote this year. If the election goes ahead then maybe my paranoia has been misplaced and I will ask forgiveness.

Hopefully the election will proceed, I'm hoping Bush doesn't have some trick up his sleeve. It would be unlikely we'd let him steal another election
but we'll just have to see.

I will save my smugness when you go and learn something about my country, before you start entering into debate on the subject, I say again there is no Ulsterish people and furthermore no Ulster "Irish" either.

One can be from Northern Ireland and either Irish or British in nationality terms, they can also be an Irish catholic or Irish Protestant. We can also have dual nationality (i.e) Irish/British, but I can assure you that there is no group of people called Ulster.

And this is all political semantics.

Which also just happens to be the truth.

Don�t some of you find it rather hilariously ironic, that the fact is if you go back a few years into �new Americas� Vast (not to make you feel left out lol) history, you might just find a lot of you are all just European emigrants (that were dropped on heads as kids), and at the end of the day have no right to put up boarders, if anyone, this should be down to the native American, indeed to keep you out.

The Indians, or reds, tried their best to kick us out, often with French (pre-Revolution) or British assistance, and repeatedly got their asses kicked in the process. Now they want to complain because they ended up on the losing end of the fight? But I guess that reflects your lack of knowledge on American history. I guess those emmigrants who "got dropped on their heads" had enough sense to go to a country where their descendents ended up living a much more pleasant life than those who stayed ever had.

and that gives you the right to put up borders to keep poeple out?

I guess those emmigrants who "got dropped on their heads" had enough sense to go to a country where their descendents ended up living a much more pleasant life than those who stayed ever had

And we all see the more pleasant life laid out before us today, a so called democratic system, where one gets to vote for ones leaders. so maybe the head dropping started much later in history than i had thought.

Shoot them twice just to make sure!

Ok- now the terror alerts codes are being elevated- Can anyone please tell me, if this government knows (they) are coming here thru Mexican borders WHY OH WHY are they NOT sending Civil Guards, every man who is signed up for ANY duty to cover ALL of the Mexican border- Heck i'd volunteer myself, and im a woman- WHY isnt the government doing anything different in respect to covering the borders?

Doesnt that raise some red flags with you? Call me a nut but i still beleive this is all a bunch of Boogie Boogie flap 1) to take away from the Democratic convention, 2) To set the stage for Bush's speeches at the Republican convention...or worse yet.... to INDEFINATELY postpone elections...this prospect sends a chill down my back........

We are being conditioned mentally and, sorry to say, it is working....
The scariest part about this is the fact that by CONSTANTLY saying "they're coming, they're coming.....", we are inviting- INVITING something to really
happen in our country. So now we wait and see what happens. Those who know the truth will pay. I do beleive this. At this point, many of us wonder what is REALLY going on-

This country is in much need of an overhaul and this is usually done by a new government and administration. I dont specially like Kerry, but who else would be in the position to do overhaul? No one but Kerry.

My intention here is not to Bush-bash, but to try to get a better, clearer grasp on the situation we are faced with today.

We get, Code red, but go about your daily lives- Code orange, but enjoy your day- " They're coming", but dont let that upset your day-Buildings are a target, but go on about your daily lives- Borders are crawling with terrorists, but no extra security- Come on.....This is sheer insanity, and I cannot wait to be rid of this administration

I cant believe so many people are ranting on about how they dont want want to build walls around the border and putting mines arounf the border thats crazy is this not the country that gave so many people oppurtnuity i am totally agreeing with toejam he has a very good idea and its just sad to see that so many white lazy americans are willing to have illegal immigrants do their jobs for low wages and suffer from exploition just because they are looking for a dream and they want to try to get a better life is it their fault that they were born in a country that offers no oppurtuity for them for many iillegal immigrants it is neccary for they to cross the border illegally because the mexican consulates arnt always willing to give them visas many mexican students however are getting visas in about 6 months or less which is wonderfull. and for those who say the border patrol is gettiing less funding you arnt listening to what is happening in california they have been constantly taken back immigrants to mexico they are all over the airport and they are recieving much more funding than they ever have, Its a shame to see xenophobic people that dont value the great people who made this country they were immigrants!! This country was made by immigrants you also forgot about all those immigrants who are making this economy bigger becuase they make their families here and they contribute to the economy they build their own buisness how come people never talk about the immigrants whoh do accomplish many things and build their own buisnesses who were looking for an opputunty its sad to see people who look down on immigrants and think of them as if they wernt people god forbid you ever have to come to such nessesity where u have to leave your country and leave the country you love to seach for a dream called oppurtnutiy.

There is NO question about the contributions of immigrants to the US. We are an entire nation of immigrants. I am sorry that some people who wish to emmigrate are denied visas in their home country, but that is a problem for them to solve there. NO ONE has the right to enter the country illegally.


Immigrants

Illegals

This isnt your land to decide who to let in and who to let out. The original inhabitants of this land were the native american tribes that lived here for hundreds of years before us until we came and took their land because we believed we were doing them a good thing so what gives "americans" the right to decide who they want in and who they want out!!!

So, because we dont want people coming into this country without the proper documentation from their host governments we're xenophobic?

Do you even know what is being discussed? We are talking about how easy it is for someone to make it into the US over the southern border.

Originally posted by Kaiser617
This isnt your land to decide who to let in and who to let out. The original inhabitants of this land were the native american tribes that lived here for hundreds of years before us until we came and took their land because we believed we were doing them a good thing so what gives "americans" the right to decide who they want in and who they want out!!!

Youve opened a completely different can of worms here. This IS our land now, just like many lands that at one time belonged to another group of people, and we DO have the right to protect our borders. If you went around to every country telling them the land belongs to someone else, you'd have a tough time. I guess you should start by telling the Australians they have no rights on their land because it belongs to the aboriginees, and Europe and the Middle-east? Good luck. Are you suggesting we should continue to let illegals come through at their leisure, commit whichever crimes they wish, and slip back down to Mexico never to be caught because we had no idea who they were or even that they were here? I guess the only way to make you happy would be to pack up our bags, trace our family history, and move back to whichever country the majority of our blood originated from. Sure, that'll happen.

Do you know how easy it is to go across the border i'm just asking people not to think of these people as things that u can just fence and look down upon. i am asking people to consider even maybe come up with ideas to solve the problem that leads so many to leave their homeland and risk their life for a dream, i am asking people to look beyond the illegal immigratin and notice that people dont just cross the borders illegaly risking their lives for the hell of it i am asking you to accept the fact that there is a problem with some countries in the world that causes people to immigrate in search for a better life

Your compassion is a good thing, but we cannot let other countries problems turn into ours. Illegal immigrants are a HUGE drain on our resources here in AZ, do you think they should get taxpayer paid assistance here while the government turns down citizens who are also in need? We have plenty of our own problems, we cannot just let people waltz in and out as they please without us knowing they're here. If you lived here in Phx you would see the problems first hand. There are coyotes (people smugglers) who hold immigrants hostage until their families pay whatever amount they ask for, meanwhile they dont feed them and rape the women. There have been several cases where an illegal has murdered somebody here and slipped back down never to be brought to justice. Im not against honest immigration but the term "illegal" is just that.

Most Mexican nationals I've met are hard working people that come here to have a better life. I see where they are coming from. They come here in search of work because the governments down south are corrupt and dont care about there own citizens. If they did there would be no problem to discuss in this post. I can see where you're coming from. You need to understand that it is the minority I am concerned with. The less than 1 percent of border traffic that is causing this country harm. The criminals, possible terrorist.

I should say I'm more concerned about the really bad guys. The fact that illegal immigration exists in this country is a problem that can't be ignored either. Hell I need to learn Spaniish just to go to the store or drive there for that matter.

[edit on 2-8-2004 by TexasConspiracyNut]

I thank you for understanding my point of view at least to some point and i understand that sometimes a small percent can give a bad name to a larger community like they say a single grain of rice can tip over the scale

Originally posted by Kaiser617
This isnt your land to decide who to let in and who to let out. The original inhabitants of this land were the native american tribes that lived here for hundreds of years before us until we came and took their land because we believed we were doing them a good thing so what gives "americans" the right to decide who they want in and who they want out!!!

Kaiser,

Since I DO have native american ancestors, I guess by your statement I DO have that right. And so do a large number of other folks in this country.

But be that as it may, at this point in time anyone who is a citizen in this country has the right to demand that the laws are upheld. It's not just a matter of who can walk across a border, it's who does it legally.

As I said, I don't have a problem with ANYONE who wishes to come to this country. I've seen many other places in the world, and I know which one I think is the best place for me. There are many different LEGAL ways to enter the US. Pick one. If your country won't give you a visa, seek asylum.

IMO if a person doesn't follow the laws about entering the US, I don't have a whole lot of confidence they will follow the laws that govern any other part of life here.