Public Pensions, Once Off Limits, Face Budget Cuts, page 1

You knew it was coming, well...here it is...

When an arbitrator ruled this month that Detroit could reduce the pensions being earned by its police sergeants and lieutenants, it put the struggling city at the forefront of a growing national debate over whether the pensions of current public workers can or should be reduced.

...officials in strapped states from California to Illinois have begun to take a second look, to see whether there might be loopholes allowing them to cut the pension benefits of current employees. Now the move in Detroit — made possible, lawyers said, because Michigan’s constitutional protections are weaker — could spur other places to try to follow suit.

“These things do tend to be herd-oriented,” said Sylvester J. Schieber, an economist and consultant who studies pensions.

Source - New York Times


There are two things that jump out at me here...

...pensions of current public workers...

That would include most of the baby boomers would it not? Although this is only refering to public employees, how long do you think it will take for everyone else to climb on board too?

...see whether there might be loopholes...

What do you think the odds are of there NOT being at least a couple? Even if there aren't, all that is required is a weak judge to allow for a 'unique' interpretation of one or more clauses.

This was so predictable, and the best part is that it is perfectly in step with the financial crisis (amazingly so actually). I know that the article says that these moves are out of desperation because of the crisis, but given that Social Security has been robbed in every country for decades it seems like this is the magic bullet that they have been looking for.

"Sorry, we spent your pension and because of this global crisis everyone's broke so we can't pay it back..."

My mother actually has to pay close attention here in Canada for this exact same move; the provincial government has been rumbling about maybe discontinuing one of the aspects of her pension. She has to make sure that EVERYTHING is paid off ASAP so that she can retire immediately if the rumbling's turn into an actual proposal.

reply to post by thisguyrighthere

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True, but this isn't a question of limited growth.

They want to reduce the payments. Speak to any person who is close to retirement...they can all tell you years in advance what their monthly retirement income will be.

Now at the last minute that income is going to be rolled back.

reply to post by PurpleDog UK

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While I do agree with you for the most part, we never hear about those who are doing slightly better than just getting by.

It is only the extremes that get media coverage.

Returning to my parents...they have not lived a life that is in any way lavish or spoiled. They have worked hard thier entire lives to be able to provide a decent life for themselves (and raise 1 child).

They have only owned a new car once (back in the 70's), never taken a vacation to an exotic location (in my entire life the only true vacation they have ever taken was a bus trip last year to Boston for the Super-Sports-Weekend...3 pro games in 3 days)...etc. Although there are alot of people who have lived vastly beyond thier means there are substantially more who, like my parents, have just managed to get by with a few comforts here or there.

Now they have to live the last couple years before retirement in fear of what the last few years of thier lives are going to be like?

I understand the point you are making, but it is far to much of a generalization.

Given what we see being done all around us, the middle class dies with the baby boomers.

reply to post by {davinci}

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davinci

Your parents have lived by a set of morales and ethics which they were brought up with and I commend that. They have obviously been 'responsible' to themselves and the world around them........... a fact which is not so true of many in todays world whom expect everything, all the time with little repect or responsibilty for what that means....

In my initial post i made reference to a divide within the baby boomer generation themselves........ some at th etop of the tree have continuously rewarded themseleves more and more and then into retirement, set themselves up to live a lavish lifestyle........ Not true of all i grant you BUT that generation has actually artificially increased the value and therefore costs of everything in our society.......... That is problematic and in my opinion, Unsolvable WITHOUT direct action to change the system we all live under currently.....

This attitude in some has then been passed down the generations to todays youngsters whom have less time, respect and social communication skills (forget Twitter and all that rubbish - just plain taliking and engaging people with civility and intelligence) ............... this IMO is actually the cause of alot of the social issues in our societies today...

Regards

PDUK

reply to post by PurpleDog UK

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I'm 37, and I completely agree that most of my generation is hopelessly out of touch with reality.

I see the things that my friends and 'peers' are doing and cannot help but wonder how they think this is all going to end for them. There are a couple of my friends that had kids young and I see how that generation is living and almost have to laugh to keep from crying.

(I use the term 'peer' very loosely...I've posted in other threads that I'm debt free and that when I tell people that they look at me like I just slapped them. Always the same question with the same stupid look on thier face...What do you mean your debt free?)

Makes me wonder if the word 'consequence' has been removed from the dictionary.

Like I said, I don't think you are wrong; this entire ride ends in a train wreck that everyone should be able to see coming but few bother to look.

Not all of the victims are at fault was my point.

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