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Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by Wonders
In each of those instance their faith was accounted to them for righteousness. There is no contradiction. People can be righteous, it's their faith in God and trust in Him that God considers righteousness. But also Paul is correct in quoting the OT prophet. We have all failed, we are all born unrighteous. Christ is the only perfect on with His own righteousness.
Originally posted by bogomil
Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by Wonders
In each of those instance their faith was accounted to them for righteousness. There is no contradiction. People can be righteous, it's their faith in God and trust in Him that God considers righteousness. But also Paul is correct in quoting the OT prophet. We have all failed, we are all born unrighteous. Christ is the only perfect on with His own righteousness.
I see, that you still haven't got the knack of the difference between faith and facts.
Ignoring this difference is one expression of hypocricy.edit on 14-9-2011 by bogomil because: typos
Originally posted by NOTurTypical
Originally posted by bogomil
Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by Wonders
In each of those instance their faith was accounted to them for righteousness. There is no contradiction. People can be righteous, it's their faith in God and trust in Him that God considers righteousness. But also Paul is correct in quoting the OT prophet. We have all failed, we are all born unrighteous. Christ is the only perfect on with His own righteousness.
I see, that you still haven't got the knack of the difference between faith and facts.
Ignoring this difference is one expression of hypocricy.edit on 14-9-2011 by bogomil because: typos
"The just shall live by faith."
In each of those cases, the people being examined did things that they got, from one form of inspiration or another, from God but not from the Law, since the Law was not given yet by Moses. So they were not considered righteous by the law, but by what Paul was explaining is what has now replaced that old law, which is being called, faith.
. . .In each of those instance their faith was accounted to them for righteousness. . .
Thanks for collecting those verses.
. . .Noah was a righteous man. . .
Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by Wonders
Thanks for collecting those verses.
. . .Noah was a righteous man. . .
NOTurTYPICAL has this thing about people not trying to be righteous.
He seems to think that we will go to heaven or somewhere to get fixed up but meanwhile are not to be concerned about trying to be righteous. Though I have numerously pointed out the fallacy of this philosophy, he dogmatically sticks to it.
Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical
In each of those cases, the people being examined did things that they got, from one form of inspiration or another, from God but not from the Law, since the Law was not given yet by Moses. So they were not considered righteous by the law, but by what Paul was explaining is what has now replaced that old law, which is being called, faith.
. . .In each of those instance their faith was accounted to them for righteousness. . .
Paul was not talking about a mere intellectual assent to something being told to them, but a guiding influence that they were obedient to.
You are narrowly defining it to suite yourself, while ignoring all the other meanings to it.
In a Biblical sense, "faith" means "trust".
No. You never have.
I've corrected you. . .
Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical
You are narrowly defining it to suite yourself, while ignoring all the other meanings to it.
In a Biblical sense, "faith" means "trust".
Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical
No. You never have.
I've corrected you. . .
If you have, and know how to do it, how about doing it right now?
He seems to think that we will go to heaven or somewhere to get fixed up but meanwhile are not to be concerned about trying to be righteous.
Though I have numerously pointed out the fallacy of this philosophy, he dogmatically sticks to it.
Originally posted by bogomil
reply to post by NOTurTypical
You wrote:
["If faith isn't trust then it's just an intellectual affirmation."]
Maybe you sort this out with yourself in a way, which is communicable and accetable for people not sharing your premises. I have seen a lot of skipping around from position to position, according to the circumstances.
And once again I must emphasize, that 'faith' is nothing I reject.
(PS Any answer from me may take a few days. I'll be probably be busy with my new house).
Originally posted by NOTurTypical
Originally posted by bogomil
reply to post by NOTurTypical
You wrote:
["If faith isn't trust then it's just an intellectual affirmation."]
Maybe you sort this out with yourself in a way, which is communicable and accetable for people not sharing your premises. I have seen a lot of skipping around from position to position, according to the circumstances.
And once again I must emphasize, that 'faith' is nothing I reject.
(PS Any answer from me may take a few days. I'll be probably be busy with my new house).
The context here is the Biblical understanding/concept of faith in general, saving faith in particular.
Originally posted by MagoSA
If I had time, I'd reorganize a church to simply focus on Jesus' words and actions.
Originally posted by MagoSAIts a shame that the most damning part of being a modern Christian came from Gandhi, of all people.
"“I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.”
You are doing your red herring switch again, as usual.
If faith isn't trust then it's just an intellectual affirmation. Christ wants us to trust in Him, trust in His sacrifice, trust in His resurrection. Not to just believe it happened, or have better than 50% faith that it happened. That's not Biblical "faith".
That's your personal understanding but it does not make it truth for anyone other than yourself.
. . .when I say I have "faith' in Christ I mean to assert that I have my "trust" in Christ and His atonement for my sins.
I should point out that your correction is not of my theology so much as your personal position. Let me quote what you are referring to.
. . .I did a few posts ago. But if you won't read it there, or in the other numerous places in this forum then why bother saying it another time?
Nice, if pushed. But you don't say things like that unprompted and you feel people will be saved even if they do not do "their best", but can freely sin as much as they want.
. . .nor encourage people not to do the best they can to live for Christ here and now.