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Homosexual Activity Among Animals Stirs Debate

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posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 12:29 PM
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But, actually, some same-sex birds do do it. So do beetles, sheep, fruit bats, dolphins, and orangutans. Zoologists are discovering that homosexual and bisexual activity is not unknown within the animal kingdom.
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Roy and Silo, two male chinstrap penguins at New York's Central Park Zoo have been inseparable for six years now. They display classic pair-bonding behaviorentwining of necks, mutual preening, flipper flapping, and the rest. They also have sex, while ignoring potential female mates.

Wild birds exhibit similar behavior. There are male ostriches that only court their own gender, and pairs of male flamingos that mate, build nests, and even raise foster chicks.
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On the other hand, they could just be enjoying themselves, suggests Paul Vasey, animal behavior professor at the University of Lethbridge, Alberta, Canada. "They're engaging in the behavior because it's gratifying sexually or it's sexually pleasurable," he says. "They just like it. It doesn't have any sort of adaptive payoff."

Matthew Grober, biology professor at Georgia State University, agrees, saying, "If [sex] wasn't fun, we wouldn't have any kids around. So I think that maybe Japanese macaques have taken the fun aspect of sex and really run with it."

The bonobo, an African ape closely related to humans, has an even bigger sexual appetite. Studies suggest 75 percent of bonobo sex is nonreproductive and that nearly all bonobos are bisexual. Frans de Waal, author of Bonobo: The Forgotten Ape, calls the species a "make love, not war" primate. He believes bonobos use sex to resolve conflicts between individuals.

Other animals appear to go through a homosexual phase before they become fully mature. For instance, male dolphin calves often form temporary sexual partnerships, which scientists believe help to establish lifelong bonds. Such sexual behavior has been documented only relatively recently. Zoologists have been accused of skirting round the subject for fear of stepping into a political minefield.

"There was a lot of hiding of what was going on, I think, because people were maybe afraid that they would get into trouble by talking about it," notes de Waal. Whether it's a good idea or not, it's hard not make comparisons between humans and other animals, especially primates. The fact that homosexuality does, after all, exist in the natural world is bound to be used against people who insist such behavior is unnatural.
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So how far can we go in using animals to help us understand human homosexuality? Robin Dunbar is a professor of evolutionary psychology at the University of Liverpool, England. "The bottom line is that anything that happens in other primates, and particularly other apes, is likely to have strong evolutionary continuity with what happens in humans," he said.

Dunbar says the bonobo's use of homosexual activity for social bonding is a possible example, adding, "One of the main arguments for human homosexual behavior is that it helps bond male groups together, particularly where a group of individuals are dependent on each other, as they might be in hunting or warfare."

More: news.nationalgeographic.com...


It is the same old info on homosexuality in the animal kingdom, but I thought it should be shared none the less.




posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 12:36 PM
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Important story, do scientists believe that this is a recent development or that these kind of things have been happening forever. It certainly lends creedence to the point of view that homosexuality is genetic.



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 12:36 PM
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My two dogs engage in homosexual relations. I do not approve of it when I'm in the room. Why would I want to watch anyone 'doing it'?! They're both male dogs, but one is fixed. The other tries to get it any way he can which includes humping the fixed dog's head. :shk:

Homosexuality seems to be very natural for them.


What's the big deal? Why does this bother some people to no end? I could care less about one's sexual preference, as long as I don't have to watch!



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 12:37 PM
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Well it looks like some animals are born with the same problem that some humans sufer. Being gay.



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 12:41 PM
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Originally posted by lockheed
do scientists believe that this is a recent development or that these kind of things have been happening forever.


Well from this article there is no indication that this is a new phenomenon in the animal kingdom. I found the section on using homosexuality to cause closer bonds in the group quite interesting. Makes sense to me.



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 12:41 PM
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Originally posted by HumptyDumpty
Well it looks like some animals are born with the same problem that some humans sufer. Being gay.

I find that comment quite rude.
Why call it a "problem"? Why consider it "suffering"?

ps) No offense to Jonna, but if this thread turns to a bashing session...it will be locked/trashed and the offenders warned. Consider this fair notice.



[edit on 28-7-2004 by ZeddicusZulZorander]



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 12:56 PM
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Originally posted by ZeddicusZulZorander

Originally posted by HumptyDumpty
Well it looks like some animals are born with the same problem that some humans sufer. Being gay.

I find that comment quite rude.
Why call it a "problem"? Why consider it "suffering"?
[edit on 28-7-2004 by ZeddicusZulZorander]


I call it suffering cause if you were a person that feels like they are a man trapped in a womens body, what would you call it? I call it suffering.

You can think what you like about my comments Zed, its my opinion. My opinion is that being gay is a problem/decease/genetic default that might have a solution in the genetic field. Iam not Homophobic, that emplies that Iam afraid of gay people. Iam not afriad. How ever I do, unlike so many, think that is more of a decease/genetic default than most people do. I also think that there could be a solution for this "problem" as I put it.

Sorry if others dont agree with me, but I'll tell you right now you will never be able to make me think different unless you prove to me that Iam wrong, and that cant be done as of yet.... So like String Theory, my theory is untouchable. Flame me if you like, but you will only be makeing yourself mad, as my mind is made up.

[edit on 7/28/04 by HumptyDumpty]



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 01:07 PM
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Originally posted by HumptyDumpty
I call it suffering cause if you were a person that feels like they are a man trapped in a womens body, what would you call it. I call it sufering.

I don't think any of them would consider it "suffering". More often, they feel like they are attracted to the same sex and want to have a relationship like anyone else, without fear of people who think thay have a "problem".


You can think what you like about my comments Zed, it my opinion. My opinion is that being gay is a problem/decease/genetic default that might have a solution in the genetic field. Iam not Homophobic, that emplies that Iam afraid of gay people. Iam not afriad. How ever I do, unlike so many, think that is more of a decease/genetic default than most people do. I also think that there could be a solution for this "problem" as I put it.

Right. Hitler thought the Jews were a "problem" too. So your thinking is to force everyone that has a different lifestyle to conform to your way of thinking? How incredibly old fashioned, to say the least.



Sorry if others dont agree with me, but I'll tell you right now you will never be able to make me think diferent unless you prove to me that Iam wrong, and that cant be dont as of yet. So like string theory, my theory is untouchable. Flame me if you like, but you will only be makeing yourslef mad, as my mind is made up.

I know of some that agree with you. I believe they beat a gay person and then dragged him behind a truck for a few miles in Texas. Prove to you that they are diseased? Prove that they have a genetic "problem"? Yeah...right.

So, all-in-all...there is no need to flame someone like you. Your hatemongering only shows everyone else reading this about your personality. A personality I might add that is more of a "default" than someone who is gay.

Have a nice day.



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 01:50 PM
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I think being gay is an imbalance of female/male energies.

Within gay relationships there is still male and female energy, there is no escaping it as it MUST exsist in order for a relationship to take place.

I do NOT agree with science trying to make a male egg so men and make men preganent. However I know a few gay people and get along with them fine. However they all act the same even though they do not know each other? I never understood why that is? nor do they when asked!


thats my 2p.



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 01:52 PM
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Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
However they all act the same even though they do not know each other? I never understood why that is? nor do they when asked!



You know...I believe many heterosexual people act the same as well and I'm darn sure they don't all know each other either.



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 02:06 PM
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I'm just waiting for someone to post, "God said it's not ok for humans, he never mentioned animals!'



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 02:07 PM
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Good greef!

Why does every conversation concerning homosexuality have to turn into gays being evil/wrong? I am merely providing information about it existing in nature which many people refuse to believe. I'm sorry, but I thought I was somewhere that I was suppose to deny something. What was that pesky little slogan? Oh Ya! Deny Ignorance.

It is funny that a country (USA) with so many gaybashers has the motto of "Life, Liberty and the persute of happiness". I guess that slogans and mottos don't mean a hell of a lot anymore.

So you say that homosexuality is wrong? Just look at what the article is saying about the logical reasoning behind the act. It states that one aspect of it is closer knit communities and stronger bonds to love your fellow human. That is pretty evil and wrong!



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 02:11 PM
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I knew this along time ago......... My dog also tries to get alittle happy around other male dogs sometimes, I do not let him, however it's not like they just decide one day I think i'll be gay like alot of people think about humans...
It's just not so......
I agree with the above poster, I could give two #s about what people do in their private lives just don't' do it within my peripheral vision.



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 02:14 PM
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Originally posted by Jonna
thing. What was that pesky little slogan? Oh Ya! Deny Ignorance.

It is funny that a country (USA) with so many gaybashers has the motto of "Life, Liberty and the persute of happiness". I guess that slogans and mottos don't mean a hell of a lot anymore.



Actually it does, it just means that those people obviously have a double standard and are full of hypocrisy and bs views.. The classic this is allowed but this isn't... If you truly believe in TRUE FREEDOM, that should go for ALL no matter color,race,religion affiliation, being GAAAAAYYY.......... ect.

Clam up homophobs... Your double standard just makes you look like an ass, and if anything, you guys are the ones who are judgemental and wrong not the other way around *tisk tisk*

*pie in your faces*

[edit on 28-7-2004 by TrueLies]



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 02:21 PM
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Originally posted by lockheed
It certainly lends creedence to the point of view that homosexuality is genetic.

I don't see how this is possible. If genitcs played a part in homosexuals, shouldn't we be out of them by now? That is to say if penguins recieved homosexual behaviour from genetics, then how would theses genes be passed on? Two male penguins can not produce offspring together. Even if some male homosexual penguins had sex with female penguins, their preference for mating with male penguins would eventually thin out the homosexual penguin population so that their occurrence would be rare, and eventually extinct.



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 02:26 PM
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Well I know what I am talking about!! Thats the main thing!!



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 02:43 PM
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Originally posted by dbates

Originally posted by lockheed
It certainly lends creedence to the point of view that homosexuality is genetic.

I don't see how this is possible. If genitcs played a part in homosexuals, shouldn't we be out of them by now?


Some say it is a natural mechanism to control population. Seagulls, for example, turn gay to control populations, when food is low and the flock is high.



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 02:47 PM
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Originally posted by ZeddicusZulZorander
I know of some that agree with you. I believe they beat a gay person and then dragged him behind a truck for a few miles in Texas. Prove to you that they are diseased? Prove that they have a genetic "problem"? Yeah...right.

So, all-in-all...there is no need to flame someone like you. Your hatemongering only shows everyone else reading this about your personality. A personality I might add that is more of a "default" than someone who is gay.


Thanks I will have a nice day Zed.

Zed, I think you are misinterperting my was of useing the word "problem". I think I used the wrong word, not your fault.

All Iam trying to say is that I think that there is a more scientific way of looking at Homosexualism. I understand that it is a cold, unpersonal, almost ugly way of looking at Homosexualism...but we study cancer, physcological disease, and many other "problems" as I have called it in my above posts in that same ways. This just happen be a "problem", or as I will call it from now on, a "disorder" that deals with peoples every day, every moment, their very being.

Now what Iam trying say in my first posts (not in as many words) is that animals seem to have the same "disorder" as humans do...is that not interesting to you at all...that means its most likely not just an emotional problem in humans, or a sudden thought to all of a sudden go against nature and be with your own sex, in humans only. It means that its most likely GENETIC.... It means that animals that are not as smart as us do it, so that means that we could study their action and try to understand why humans do it better than we do now. I mean Zed, tell me why do humans engage in homosexual ways? ......"because they do" is not good enough for the scientific world/people.

I said nothing about killing them all in gas chambers as you have tried to say. I said nothing about tieing up gays and dragging them behind my car as it seems you have experience in. I said nothing about them being any "problem" to me, Iam only trying to add some scientific looks at homosexuality...the holocaust is over Zed, get with the times.




[edit on 7/28/04 by HumptyDumpty]



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 02:57 PM
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Originally posted by curme
Some say it is a natural mechanism to control population. Seagulls, for example, turn gay to control populations, when food is low and the flock is high.


...Well this explains San Fransico
Iam kidding of course.

[edit on 7/28/04 by HumptyDumpty]



posted on Jul, 28 2004 @ 03:07 PM
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So the homosexual penguins (It's safer to just reference penguins) are the ones that are being trimmed off by mother nature as a poplulation control measure. Interesting that the males are targeted in this situation. I guess lesbian penguins would just excite the male penguins more, and would only serve to increase the penguin popolation.



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