Suicide Pact: Minnesota Teens Haylee Fentress and Paige Moravetz Commit Suicide at Slumber Party

reply to post by sepermeru


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Originally posted by getreadyalready
*************************** Mod Warning *******************************

The Topic of this thread is the tragedy of the two teens. There is the tragedy, the social implications, the education system, religion, or whatever other spins you would like to discuss, but the personal attacks and trolling stop now, or the thread will be closed.

edit on 22-4-2011 by getreadyalready because: (no reason given)

If it wasn't such a horrible thing to stand up for yourself when bullied, I bet there would be less of this. Sadly, those who resort to physical violence in defense of themselves are shunned in this society. I hope those that pushed this are happy.

Sad as to what the world is coming too.

We argue and yet two 14 year old girls still lay dead in the earth. I find that people now a days are too busy arguing with eachother to realise that our youth need to be taken care of better.

People die so we argue about it? The human race is losing it. The world is only the way it is today, because of us. The human race. If there is a god.....he left a long time ago.

For some reason I don't feel sorry for these girls. Something was mentally wrong with them. I've cried before after hearing stories of young teens killing themselves due to being molested, and the pressure to get good grades at school and didn't know these people.

But these 2 girls watched too much tv and were menatlly unstable. I believe they would have surely killed many people in the future had they decided to live.

Kids can be so heartless. I know that bullying can make your life a living hell.

I am surprised these two girls did this though because they had each other to rely on. I wander if they were on anti-depressants?

Its sad that people don't have more respect and compassion for one another. I think some people never grow up and act like little kids on the playground their whole adult life. The ego is the source of all our problems.

This happened in my town, a small community so everybody knows everybody. The girls were NOT mentally unstable. We all know kids can be mean especially when they think 2 friends that are close are actually more than just friends. They got snip on, pissed on, stepped on and snip with by so-called friends and fellow students. So they left a couple notes, made a CD of the music they wanted played at their funerals then ended it. It's all pretty damn sad around town right now. So, some of the previous comments from at least by one of the soulless and heartless members anger me and make me sick. My suggestion is, if you don't have anything nice to say about another humans life than keep it to yourself because you made yourself look like a mindless fool. This thread should end.


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Originally posted by ViperChili
reply to post by Anttyk47

 

Nowhere near perfect

Compassion is simply a useless emotion. These girls made an idiotic choice to kill themselves, most likely because they cared too much what other people thought of them.

If you simply disregard most people entirely, life is much easier and more fulfilling.

The problems arise when other people attempt to interject themselves where they aren't wanted. Did any of these bleeding hearts in this thread know these girls? Safe to assume they didn't because no one has mentioned it yet.

Some of you can spend all of your time being compassionate (

:lol

while others have better things to concern themselves with.

I'll have to respectfully disagree. Compassion is not a useless emotion. And yeah, I'm sure you do have a lot of better things to do... like creating a thread about two girls committing suicide and commenting on how it doesn't bother you at all. Real cool champ.

You don't need to know someone to be able to mourn them. Since, people die everyday, and it totally sucks. I can't say I see everyone that is dying everyday, but of the stories I hear, why not just take a moment to mourn them, and hope that their loved ones are doing alright? That's probably a lot less time consuming than being all smug about it and making such strange comments about it. Two YOUNG girls died. From one read you can notice that these two probably would not do any harm to others (suicide vs. murder statistics are more complicated than you may think). They could have been very self conscious, or they could've felt like they were losers or outcasts. That is sad man, and it makes me feel bad to see that they lost their lives.

And by your religion comment (I'm not exactly religious but I support it, and do have some strange views on life), I can assume you're a hedonist who wears that label on his shirt and likes to bring it up no matter what. There's a difference between saying you are free and happy, and actually being free and happy. When life comes in full swing and hurts you (I'm sure it has before though), then at the least you might rethink your words. Compassion is important. Whether from a purely scientific viewpoint or a regular human being's, it is damn important. So to be completely honest, I'm tired with people rationalizing and analyzing things that are just SAD and should have a normal reaction of kindness, like walking past a homeless person and feeling sad, or just wanting to do a better thing.

Originally posted by ViperChili
reply to post by sepermeru

 

Nothing wrong with me at all.

2 mentally unstable individuals removed themselves from the planet. Is it not better they do it early and by themselves, as opposed to later, and taking others with them?

edit on 21-4-2011 by ViperChili because: (no reason given)

Wow man i just dont know what to say other then you seam to be into the corporate way. today we teach the kids. not to be independent but to always depend on something. weather its a cell phone or just other people in general. its a good chance that its not the parents fault. but in our schools. a 14 year old girl. hormones going like crazy, everything is multiplied by 10x. if there cell phone stopped working. its like a b2 bomber just used a laser guided bomb and hit my house with what i call a drama bomb. Yes i have 2 daughters a 20 year old and a 16. i know what im talking about. Its really a shame that they did not get the help that was needed.

Anyway my point is this try to have a little compassion. It helps make you be a person. different from a number.

Originally posted by ViperChili

Originally posted by unknownman024
reply to post by ViperChili

 

You sound mentally unstable yourself, with no regard to these two lives; now gone.
And here you sit and talk s*** and really you have no clue as to what drove them to this breaking point. No regard for human life. No regard for anothers feeling. Peace.

I don't care. I didn't know these girls, didn't know their families. Why should I feel bad when people I don't know die?

Someday, in the not too distant future, everyone will come to understand that we are all part of one human family, and that anyone's unneccessary premature death is our collectively shared loss.

The century of the self is over - wake up people and get with the program of real life, which is a much larger framework of sympathetic understanding.

Having compassion on the ignorant and the foolish, that might be the hardest work to do, so you pose an important challenge to us ViperChili..

Originally posted by Quasar_La-Zar
Wheres the almighty loving god now?

Seems clear to me that nobody cares about what we do in our lives, in the super natural sense.

I do not remember the time before i was born, So I must assume that no matter how crappy life can get, including killing yourself, it does not really even matter in the end, because I promise you, you will die, and life will start again in a new body case with a new brain.

Seems clear to me that any omnipresent being [god] that people like to "believe" in, is indeed meaningless. I do not question why cats lick themselves, or why ants build colonies to survive, or why humans kill other humans, I just accept it as required behavior to survive, and god has nothing to do with any of that.

Believing in god is just a required behavior for many of us to survive, and for others like me, its not.

Do you think in 10,000 years, people will still be worshiping gods? And do you think it will be the same as today?

If your answer is no like mine, then that makes all this just one whole big waste of time and effort by good people trying to do good, in the end it makes the person doing it feel a bit better about themselves, that is all. God is just entertainment for some.

edit on 22-4-2011 by Quasar_La-Zar because: (no reason given)

Just to clarify, are you asserting that we will start life in a new body/mind (because I can dig that ).

But anyways, congratulations on making such a great and powerful argument. Regardless of whether there is a God or not (you have to define clearly what 'God exactly is), I would truly like to believe so. How is anything that humanity does the fault of that God though, whether he exists or not? If a dictator kills thousands of people, is that God's fault? No. It is the dictator's fault. Same here, as sad as it is. If there was a force that intervened when people were sad, wouldn't it be just to interfere when people are happy, and # it up? Thus a force that intervenes and brings a neutral life.

The ability to do great evils gives you the power to do amazing goods. How you view life is whether you look at evil as the absence of good, or good as the absence of evil. Saying that "god didn't do anything about this!" as a reason for nonexistance is just dense to be completely honest. There are better arguments supporting your position, but regardless, we know nothing. We may try to feel like we've got a good grasp on things, but we're nowhere near there yet. I'm going for my masters in BioChemistry (SFU), and I don't claim to be some big genius or anything, and I am stupid in many many categories, and still have a lot to learn. That being said, arguments like that usually come from an extreme exposure to Christianity (or some other religion), and jumping all the way to the other end of the spectrum (belief in nothing). It's probably not too wise, as as much as I respect Dawkins and Hitchens, they fall back on fallacies and generalizations as much as other people do as well, even with better arguments. We don't know much, and we honestly should just leave it at that.

And finally, if you look at God as a meaning of life, and thus God=Purpose, then people will always believe in God. People look for purpose in EVERYTHING. Do not undermine that. And as a scientific guy (which I assume you are), you have to look at the fact that religious people have constantly lived through the years. They strived for answers (albeit not always the right ones), and strived to add a moral code (Morals weren't created by religion, but they damn sure were upheld by it), and managed to live through and be selected as the 'top' survivors from that category. Whether religion dies or not, purpose never will, so you shouldn't jump to such big conclusions based on nothing.

Viper isnt that far off....all of you who think he/she is this/that might want to read what he says. Mental illness is a disease that hurts society and everyone in it. Back in the 50s there were programs to sterilize these people..now..there are not and it is wreaking havoc on our already degraded society. Given we dont know the circumstances yes it is sad, however, there is truth in what he/she says. Additionally females have a higher rate of being mentally unstable..I am not going to post this proof or that proof..check yourselves..it is what it is.

Seeing as how:

• A mentally unstable person need not always remain so and might later go on to contribute something important or beautiful (subjective on that facet, I know) to the rest of humanity
  
• People who are suicidal, be it due to depression or other causes, need not ever be violent or homocidal
  
• Some of the most beautiful art in history (in my opinion) has arisen from the minds of people with what today might be diagnosed as personality or mood disorders
  
• Evolution (if one adheres to that theory) has resulted in the vast majority of our species having some capacity for empathy therefore rendering any argument that empathy is entirely useless moot in my opinion (although it could be argued that it is "useless" in specific contexts depending on one's own subjective point of view, or perhaps that we have outgrown its utility depending again on the context and point of view within which and from which such an argument is mounted)
  
• I do care about all the people who "die every day" regardless of whether I know them, and regardless of whether anyone views that as rational or "useful" ...

... I am going to say that this saddens me. The above should not be construed and is not intended as telling anyone else that their opinion or belief is "wrong," however. I respect everyone's opinion whether I share it personally or not.

Peace.

Originally posted by kix
WOW.

Some thoughts I have on the matter:

Off topic... If you care so much for people you do not know, and get so worked up by this tragedy, are you using you energy in the right way? You surely have loved people and sons, and friends and brothers and parents, dont waste energy in mourning unknown people, show the close people you love them and help them...

Now ON TOPIC:

The Bulling we are now experiencing is a lot worse than the one it was like 30 to 40 years ago, because back then the system actually stopped a "bad" kid. they hit them, smacked him/her, suspended her and reprimended THEIR PARENTS, or expelled from school and no school took back expelled kids.
Nowadays Schools are full of wackos, armed kids, drugged out kids , medicated kids AND BULLIES. The teachers, and school authorities cant do nothing because god forbids them to grab and eraser and hit a foolish kid.
Bullied kids latter in life (not all of them but a large part), have "scars" and tend to snap easily at any situation, tend to go from "nice" to "nuke" if the conditions are right for that.

I wonder if the parents bought some hawian shirts for their daughter. Or if they really cared.

BTW I am a licenced Psychologyst and my major is depression, so I know what I am talking about.. This suicide events are going to be more popular if there is no change in society.

No you're not, and it's really clear that you aren't. So stop trying to pass yourself off as one, when you make stupid assertions based on nothing (have "scars and tend to snap easily? While that may be true in some cases, that's a really really big statement to make based on little to no back-up information). If you had a major in Psychology, you would at least be able to spell your own profession right.

This is truly sad. Of course I didn't know them, who they were or if they had problems. But when two young lives go lost, either at their own hand or other, it's a sad day.

May the girls find the peace they so desperately sought and their families too. I personally hope I never have to witness anything like this myself.

God bless 'em.

Originally posted by paearmor
Viper isnt that far off....all of you who think he/she is this/that might want to read what he says. Mental illness is a disease that hurts society and everyone in it. Back in the 50s there were programs to sterilize these people..now..there are not and it is wreaking havoc on our already degraded society. Given we dont know the circumstances yes it is sad, however, there is truth in what he/she says. Additionally females have a higher rate of being mentally unstable..I am not going to post this proof or that proof..check yourselves..it is what it is.

And why is there so much of it? Might it be because kindhearted and sensitive people are CRUSHED by the unfeeling, coldhearted, callousness of the "humanity" all around them, and all the bad training which is out of alignment with the way the world really works..? Might the ass-holes possibly have some of the responsibility for all the insanity..?!

more food and air for me ,

but, in all seriousness i seam to recall eutanasia is legal at the age of 12 in holland , onoes!

2 cents on the vendingmachine

reply to post by ViperChili


talk about Vipers...no doubt the reason they killed themselves was because they woke up and realized the world was filled with the likes of your kind. Heartless and uncaring and selfish.
I hope they found understanding. I hope their families can find peace.