Suicide Pact: Minnesota Teens Haylee Fentress and Paige Moravetz Commit Suicide at Slumber Party

Originally posted by ViperChili
reply to post by Anttyk47

 

Personal attacks are all you are capable of since you lack the mental capacity to understand that not everyone thinks or feels the same as you do.

You sound like some sort of religious person.

edit on 21-4-2011 by ViperChili because: (no reason given)

Yes i radiate religious because i am compassionate.
No i'm kidding. I don't believe in religion, i believe in the human race. Appologies for that, and whatever the opposite of a Touche is, is exactally what you gave me. Just know what i said to you was ment to be a message to you that just because pride is a good reason to mask compassion, doesn't mean you should always do so. Sorry that i seem to want to give advice to a FELLOW HUMAN. We're not all good at communication as you are.

Originally posted by TheRealm
Tell that to the guy that shot up Tucson. He never had any major issues, just a little off till one day he snapped. And everyone including the Senators and media generalized him as being mentally unstable. This dude didn't have any notable issues that caused his brain to change dramatically either...or did he?

Wait, so what does that have anything to do with the topic at hand?

There are a lot of whisperings that the Tucson shooter did have problems: they just weren't diagnosed.



The point I was trying to make is that someone doesn't have to be mentally defective since birth to do something like attempt suicide.

For example: I was severely anemic for years to the point where my blood iron level was only 3 (when they finally decided to check). I could barely even walk, I was so weak. And obviously... that affected my brain. I was extremely physically ill when I tried to kill myself. It was the physical illness that changed my brain chemistry: I wasn't born defective. xP

Not really sure why this is news on ATS, should be local. It happens a lot in other cities & towns.
After READING THE WHOLE STORY(from the OP link), I would have to suggest the school teachers & parents are the ones to blame for this.
The teachers obviously didn't handle the bullying well.
The parents might have thought to take the child with them to Hawaii for the 10 days they were vacationing.
Instead, they left them...
The more parents let their kids grow up with television as their guide, the more this is going to happen.
Talk to your kids- parents... Even when they don't want to talk to you...
Peace

Originally posted by ViperChili

It may be hard to believe, but most people don't care what you think, or how you feel.

And perhaps thats where the line between a compassionate individual and an uncaring/selfish individual is drawn. See I DO care about what others think and feel and it concerns me if for example I hurt someone. I think most people feel the same. We are after-all 'human' and empathy and compassion are natural human traits. The difference however between those that display these traits and those that dont (I believe) is those that dont suppress these feelings. For example, I feel sorry for you whereas you dont feel sorry for me. I'm guessing your an individual thats not known much love in your upbringing. So I feel sorry for you because its quite likely all you have ever known is hate and anger. And I feel sorry for you because I know such emotions are ultimately inwardly destructive.

Originally posted by ViperChili Compassion is just another emotion that is best kept to yourself.

I disagree. Theres much hate in the world. What it needs is more compassion to negate that.

Originally posted by ViperChiliIt would be unbelievably arrogant of you to assume others should feel the same as you do.

No I dont think you should feel the same as me. Your an individual and are entitled to make your own choices and have your own attitude to others. At the same time, I am entitled to mine, and if I feel the need or desire to express sorrow or compassion in response to an event then I will, whether you like it or not. Likewise, I will be critical of those that hate - because I can. Inwardly haters feel a lot of negative emotions. I feel nothing negative inwardly so you can criticize me for my attitude all you like. Its you that will feel the negative effects of that - not me.

reply to post by ViperChili

Compassion, like religion, is best kept to yourself.

Compassion is simply a useless emotion.

Life is much happier and less stressful when you can deem anyone you don't care about irrelevant.

Well, well, well ... what do we have here?

Let's see ... I certainly understand your views and opinions, but I absolutely cannot agree or accept them (for myself).

Compassion. Sympathy. Empathy. Love. Are these things truly best kept to yourself ... or even useless?

Even from a strictly secular and practical view, these "emotions" serve a purpose; they ensure the survival of our species. With these feelings we are motivated to secure and protect our loved ones (or even strangers, if you are like me). Just as an infant cannot take care of itself, its mother intervenes on its behalf, giving it life.

Without concern or regard for others, the chain is broken (I'll get into that later), and people will suffer and perhaps even die due to negligence or inaction. People's motivation become profit and power, empty shells compared to true love.

Now, everyone and everything is connected. We are all apart of a single relationship. Look around your room, notice all of the furnishings and objects, perhaps the chair you're sitting in, or the computer you're using. All of these objects came from the labor of others. Everything that you own and have ever owned is the direct result of someone else. Even you, are the union of your mother and father. That body did not simply exist, it was nourished, clothed, and loved until it became what it is today. YOU would NOT exist without others.

You may deem them as irrelevant, but they are not. Everyone has a place and an impact in this world, even if you barely notice it. Perhaps it is rather that you are unable to comprehend it.

You assume that the two girls, only still children, would have a negative impact on society, so it is better that they killed themselves? Not only do you have no idea what they have gone through, but you have no idea what their influence on this world would be. It's not only cruel, but illogical and unfounded to make such judgements.

Compassion may be "useless" to you, but for people like me, it's a way of life. A reason to serve and to make the world a better place for EVERYONE. Maybe I am just an idealist, but that's fine. I am happy with my opinions and the way I live my life. Let's all hope you can say the same.

Originally posted by metaldave
Not really sure why this is news on ATS, should be local. It happens a lot in other cities & towns.
After READING THE WHOLE STORY(from the OP link), I would have to suggest the school teachers & parents are the ones to blame for this.
The teachers obviously didn't handle the bullying well.
The parents might have thought to take the child with them to Hawaii for the 10 days they were vacationing.
Instead, they left them...
The more parents let their kids grow up with television as their guide, the more this is going to happen.
Talk to your kids- parents... Even when they don't want to talk to you...
Peace

OMG AN ON TOPIC POST
starsz!

Originally posted by TheRealm
Most do, they are a very judgmental group. I would know, Im a former religious nut. ( Until I woke up and saw through the lies)

Ouch dude. I'm religious. I'm getting a bachelors in Catholic theology (and philosophy, so yeah... not just learning about religion).

And I've never been a nut about it.


But I know where you're coming from when you say they are a very judgmental group. But that's just because they are uneducated. Any educated religious person knows you are not supposed to judge anyone and you should love others as you love yourself.

But yeah, they rarely practice what they preach. Being someone covered in tattoos and piercings, I get dirty looks all the time when I go to church. But I'm there for God, not for the ignorant people who feel they need to judge me.

reply to post by Nonchalant

See I DO care about what others think and feel and it concerns me if for example I hurt someone. I think most people feel the same.

You wish to decry being a "human " supporter, and yet, (as an example your avatar) in regards to 9/11 " truth now", in some peoples eyes that believe the OS, may suggest that you are not being caring to those who lost loved ones in the towers. How does that now correspond to the Humanitarian efforts you wish to decry?

( im not trying to derail, just used your avatar as a good example )

Originally posted by xFloggingMaryx
Ouch dude. I'm religious. I'm getting a bachelors in Catholic theology (and philosophy, so yeah... not just learning about religion).

And I've never been a nut about it.


But I know where you're coming from when you say they are a very judgmental group. But that's just because they are uneducated. Any educated religious person knows you are not supposed to judge anyone and you should love others as you love yourself.

But yeah, they rarely practice what they preach. Being someone covered in tattoos and piercings, I get dirty looks all the time when I go to church. But I'm there for God, not for the ignorant people who feel they need to judge me.

Nuts don't know that they're nuts, until they're not nuts anymore.

I won't disagree with you about them not being educated well, generally, but, you can really say that education is what keeps them from being judgmental, and it isn't the religion that's the problem?

Most religions prescribe to the "I'm going to heaven, and you're not " Theory. How much more judgmental can you get? In my opinion, that mindset gets you started on a lot of other 'I'm better than you' thoughts.

Originally posted by jessejamesxx
Nuts don't know that they're nuts, until they're not nuts anymore.

I won't disagree with you about them not being educated well, generally, but, you can really say that education is what keeps them from being judgmental, and it isn't the religion that's the problem?

Most religions prescribe to the "I'm going to heaven, and you're not

" Theory. How much more judgmental can you get? In my opinion, that mindset gets you started on a lot of other 'I'm better than you' thoughts.

Wow. What kind of crazy religious people do you know who think that?

Anyone whose educated in theology knows that it's a sin in and of itself to say whether someone is going to hell or heaven. The only being who knows where people will end up after death is God.

And honestly... who even knows if there is a heaven or a hell? That's a whole other debate.

Also: it is a lack of education that makes them judgmental, not the religion. It's their lack of education about their religion that makes them judgmental. If they knew anything about it, then they'd know that it is wrong to be judgmental!

Haha, so it's not necessary the religion, but the people who practice it incorrectly.

Originally posted by TheRealm

You wish to decry being a "human " supporter, and yet, (as an example your avatar) in regards to 9/11 " truth now", in some peoples eyes that believe the OS, may suggest that you are not being caring to those who lost loved ones in the towers. How does that now correspond to the Humanitarian efforts you wish to decry?

How am I being uncaring to the families of those that died on 9/11 simply because I don't believe the OS and ask questions? To the contrary - I ask questions because I care. If this offends some people that lost family members then I'm sorry, but they have been lied to and I want to know the truth. If I didn't care I wouldn't be asking questions. I'm not going to ignore a lie and bury my head in the sand because my beliefs may be different to other peoples.

reply to post by Nonchalant


Ok, I just wanted to see your thought process. ( keep in mind i used that as an example we will leave at that as not to derail the thread )

Originally posted by ViperChili
Compassion, like religion, is best kept to yourself.

OK, but if you're at all intelligent, you'd realize that most people, or at least the ones here on ATS, would be react negatively to your comments. You were the FIRST one to post a response and if you believe compassion should be kept to yourself than why not keep callousness to yourself too? Really, it's a legit question. Why not just pass over this topic? Why post unsympathetic remarks and then preach your "keep your compassion to yourself" philosophy to other grown adults who are aware we COULD keep our compassion to ourselves but CHOSE not to. You either honestly didn't expect people to react adversely to your comments (which shows you are unable to understand the world around you), or you knew you'd have a whole bunch of people upset with your callousness when you posted, but chose to do it anyway (showing that you would rather put negativity and callousness into the world rather than compassion, which you admittedly keep to yourself). So you're are one of two things, really unintelligent, or purposefully cruel. Thus, by your own philosophy, the world would be a better place without you. So nuts to you.

reply to post by ViperChili


I was like you once, pure logic, I think mainly out of a misdirected perception that to be strong and "nietzschean" one must shun weaker emotions and perceptions. The truth is, a mixture of both is good.


I think what ViperChili here is saying is tied to genetic disease. You see, in our society, our nanny society, we no longer dismiss the weak, frail, and mentally impaired. We care for them, and let them propagate, ensuring that their genes are also propagated. This in turn lends to increased cases of "disadvantageous" genetic traits and diseases. These girls, through this perception, have eliminated their genes from the pool and are no longer posing a such a disadvantage.

But on a more down-to-earth emotional, social human being point of view; I have to say that although the aforementioned seems logical to me, selective culling is just reminiscent of nazi behaviour. These girls were stupid, i must say though. I was young like that like anyone else, and lived in #-holes and never felt the urge to commit suicide. It seems they did it to be "cool" or seek "attention". They just needed psychological attention.

reply to post by ViperChili


you should feel bad when someone you dont know dies. When I hear about some poor african war orphan dying I know that there are many MANY like them buyt it doesnt stop me from caring and feeling bad for them. Any death can make you feel bad and in this case you should feel bad, I hope that these poor girls families dont blame themselves too much, this mus be pure hell for them. I cant imagine anything worse for a parent.

reply to post by Somehumanbeing


I dont think we can make that assumption. Some people go through hell and come out the other side a better persom, other go through less and cant handle it. These were 14 year old girls, never underestimate the power of hormones and social pressure etc. Just hormonal imbalance can make a teenager very emotionaly unstable, having a friend who feels the same way must be a comofort and even though its wrong when you're 14 its easy to be mislead. One of my best friends has struggled with severe depression all her life and is certainly not stupid, its just that everyone has their breaking point no matter how high or low it is and when its reached there is only one way out to end to torture. This friend of mine is now better and even more positive than myself in her life and it goes to show that these sort of things can be remedied if addressed. Noone should underestimate the power of depression though, it can make a person literally go insane and is more prevelant in our society than most of us know.

reply to post by Somehumanbeing


Eugenics isn't an entirely bad thing.

Most people just equate eugenics with Hitler, and automatically think it's some evil idea. They fail to realize that eugenics was around before Hitler gave it a bad name.

i would think technology is to blame in many of these cases that have taken place in the last few years. our lives are so much more easily documented and retrieveable to the public.cyber bullys are out for blood and there is no real safeguard against it with how fast tech changes. peoples lives can be ruined with a simple key stroke.dont get me wrong i love all the advances we have made in our world but when it is so easy to destroy lives something realy needs to be done about it. it realy is too bad sucide is never the answer.

Well, that was a cute little story... not sure when eugenics got mentioned.

I can hardly see how this article is deemed worthy of ATS and my awareness. It's just the kind of rubbish that pollutes a B grade conspiracy site. Not that I have ever gained much knowledge here... only wisdom of self.

Keep in mind, their souls have simply passed over the veil... into universal awareness and their higher selves. Now, they are planning a new incarnation to learn a separate set of values. Killing themselves was pure, guided fate and an important lesson in the lower realms of duality. So who are you to judge, seeing things from such a limited perspective?

I think most people on ATS should kill themselves, sadly... that is not the case.