Bible verses clearly condone the Killing of Gays and Witches.

Originally posted by halfoldman
Now, for Biblical literalism, or people who argue that the Bible is so wonderful and just, I'm wondering: Jesus said the laws of Moses stay.
So why have you stopped killing witches and gays?
It only stopped fairly recently, but what made those verses suddenly metaphorical, rather than literal?
Was it a sudden insight?

Jesus did not say the Laws of Moses stay. He fulfilled them.

Fulfill - to bring to an end; finish or complete.

He did not destroy them, but rather made them stricter.

Have you even read his sermon on the mount?

19Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Then he goes on to list and expound upon HIS commandments.

20For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

His followers must be more righteous than the scribes and Pharisees.

21Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: 22But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment:

Not only not kill, but don't even be angry with another!

27Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: 28But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. 29And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell. 30And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

Not only do not commit adultery, but don't even look at woman lustfully. Can one do this? If you cannot, then do not consider it an offense! For it is considering it an offence that leads one to judge harshly.

31It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement: 32But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.

Again, pointing out the flaws in the logic of the old. We cause each other to sin when we do not love one another. Then we judge each other for sinning! Silly people stop the madness.

33Again, ye have heard that it hath been said by them of old time, Thou shalt not forswear thyself, but shalt perform unto the Lord thine oaths: 34But I say unto you, Swear not at all; neither by heaven; for it is God's throne: 35Nor by the earth; for it is his footstool: neither by Jerusalem; for it is the city of the great King. 36Neither shalt thou swear by thy head, because thou canst not make one hair white or black. 37But let your communication be, Yea, yea; Nay, nay: for whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil.

Don't make oaths for no man or woman knows what the next second will bring. It may bring something that goes against your own conscience and thus you will be unable to perform the oath, or perform contrary to your conscience.

There is much more in the Sermon on the mount, but you can go see for yourself. It is a masterful display of logic and love entwined.

Those Christians who go back to the laws of the Old Testament to justify their hate and bitterness at the world know nothing about Jesus and what he taught. They are the blind who have been lead astray by other men or even their own hearts.

Let them have their judgement as they are judged in like manner.

Do not judge Christ because of his followers. Read what he said and learn yourself.

With Love,

Your Brother

reply to post by halfoldman


Told you it was a hard read.

Basically God asked Cain why are you angry? and why do your offerings suck? If you do good, you'll be accepted. If you don't do good sin is at the door.

And the LORD said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen? 7If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door.

Originally posted by IAMIAM
There is much more in the Sermon on the mount, but you can go see for yourself. It is a masterful display of logic and love entwined.

Actually, it contains some bad advice, has no underlying theme and the advice within the sections are contradictory. But you can go see for yourself.

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer

Originally posted by IAMIAM
There is much more in the Sermon on the mount, but you can go see for yourself. It is a masterful display of logic and love entwined.

Actually, it contains some bad advice, has no underlying theme and the advice within the sections are contradictory. But you can go see for yourself.

You made the accusation, you back it up with evidence.

Isn't evidence the foundation of YOUR belief?

Don't be a hypocrite!

With Love,

Your Brother

reply to post by halfoldman


The original covenant ("Old Testament") was a pact between 'God' and the tribes of Israel. Not the world at large, and these verses are referring to people within the tribe of Israel for the preservation of themselves/their heritage under the terms of the contract. Any unpleasantness actually directed outside of the Israelite tribes was for related reasons, to prevent the dilution of their culture and any interference with required bloodlines and the mission set before the jews.

Non-Israelites were never bound under such rules, and in the new testament, the early church fathers/apostles codified what requirements could be placed on gentiles (goyim) coming into the christian faith - and none of these requirements were included.

As far as the 'suffer a witch to live' reference, I need to look further into for validation myself, but indications are this is a mistranslation of the hebrew word actually meaning poisoner.

All told, it's not pretty I'll admit, but when you're dealing with the possible redemption of the entire species...well, you know they say "Can't make an omelette without breaking some eggs", and it is also true - hath not the potter power over the clay?

Once the mission of the israelite tribes was fulfilled with arrivial of messiah, notice that there were no similiar commandments? It then became, in totality (as was also the case for the most part in the pre-christian era) that kindness, humility, and love rule the day. A lot gets taken out of context when dealing with the history of the jewish and christian faiths.

Originally posted by IAMIAM

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer

Originally posted by IAMIAM
There is much more in the Sermon on the mount, but you can go see for yourself. It is a masterful display of logic and love entwined.

Actually, it contains some bad advice, has no underlying theme and the advice within the sections are contradictory. But you can go see for yourself.

You made the accusation, you back it up with evidence.

Isn't evidence the foundation of YOUR belief?

Don't be a hypocrite!

With Love,

Your Brother

Well, here is a fairly decent review of the sermon that should back up my above assessment
---

Reply to post by lastrebel

Really?

"I did not come to abolish the law, but to fulfill it. Not one jot or tittle will change until heaven and earth have passed away."


Jesus specifically said that he did not come to do away with the law.

Furthermore, heaven and earth are still here, so the law still stands.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

Reply to post by lastrebel

Jesus followed Moses' law. He came to show how it was to be done. Not to over write it.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer

Originally posted by IAMIAM

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer

Originally posted by IAMIAM
There is much more in the Sermon on the mount, but you can go see for yourself. It is a masterful display of logic and love entwined.

Actually, it contains some bad advice, has no underlying theme and the advice within the sections are contradictory. But you can go see for yourself.

You made the accusation, you back it up with evidence.

Isn't evidence the foundation of YOUR belief?

Don't be a hypocrite!

With Love,

Your Brother

Well, here is a fairly decent review of the sermon that should back up my above assessment
---

Ok, I see where you are coming from so thanks for sharing. That review has a lot of bias and misunderstanding in it. I would counter it, but that would only throw this topic off course.

When I get the time to do so, I will write a similar unbiased (I am neither atheist nor christian) look at the sermon on the mount and explain why I think it is logical sound advice.

Would be interested in joining such a discussion if and when I do so?

With Love,

Your Brother

Originally posted by IAMIAM
Ok, I see where you are coming from so thanks for sharing. That review has a lot of bias and misunderstanding in it. I would counter it, but that would only throw this topic off course.

When I get the time to do so, I will write a similar unbiased (I am neither atheist nor christian) look at the sermon on the mount and explain why I think it is logical sound advice.

Would be interested in joining such a discussion if and when I do so?

With Love,

Your Brother

I see bias but not misunderstanding. We could go over that topic if you wish though I don't find much interesting about the SOTM. I would largely parrot the viewpoint in that link.

reply to post by halfoldman


Because someone claims something and acts on his own claims does not make his claims true. But hey you were looking for a chance to try to slam the Bible and Christians and you thought you found one. I would advise you to run with it. The ignorant will love it and the learned will ignore it.

CLICK

Originally posted by theindependentjournal
reply to post by halfoldman

 

Because someone claims something and acts on his own claims does not make his claims true.

He wasn't acting on his own claims. He was acting on the bible's claims.

But hey you were looking for a chance to try to slam the Bible and Christians and you thought you found one. I would advise you to run with it. The ignorant will love it and the learned will ignore it.

The "learned" shouldn't ignore such atrocious verbiage in their holy book.

The guy in the OP story "Was not a real Christian"

Christians love to always say "76% of America is Christian"

But when one of their own does bad, it's always "He was not a real Christian"

So if 76% of Americans are Christian, then a large percentage of the millions in jails are Christians also.

Or are they not "Real" Christians?

Reply to post by Praetorius

No it was not. The covenant was between God and man. Israel was the messenger.

lionlamb.net...


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

Obviously Jesus would never approve of such behavior

reply to post by Nomadmonkey

So if 76% of Americans are Christian, then a large percentage of the millions in jails are Christians also.

certainly makes sense, though "not like those times" eh?

Even that question came up only because of some so-called Christians there—false ones, really—who were secretly brought in. They sneaked in to spy on us and take away the freedom we have in Christ Jesus. They wanted to enslave us and force us to follow their Jewish regulations. But we refused to give in to them for a single moment. We wanted to preserve the truth of the gospel message for you. NLT

the chief priests and the teachers of the law were looking for some sly way to arrest Jesus and kill him.

He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him up for us all, how shall He not with Him also freely give us all things? Who shall bring a charge against God’s elect? It is God who justifies. Who is he who condemns? It is Christ who died, and furthermore is also risen, who is even at the right hand of God, who also makes intercession for us

But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name

Then you shall know that I am the LORD, when I have dealt with you for My name’s sake, not according to your wicked ways nor according to your corrupt doings

the purpose of God according to election stands, not of works but of Him who calls

Originally posted by halfoldman
Well, if unwanted advances are an excuse to kill people, then why not Exodus 22:18?

Though shalt not suffer a witch to live.

Oh how King James has changed things.
It was originally "Thou shalt not suffer EVIL to live." Brush up on some Aramaic.

reply to post by Lemon.Fresh


??

Jesus said to them, "there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust."

For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.

For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son

But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind

How do ye say, We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us? Lo, certainly in vain made he it; the pen of the scribes is in vain.

For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak.

If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron? For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.
For he of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar.

But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses. And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter. And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe. And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us; and put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? But we believe that through the grace of the LORD Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

As it absolutely SHOULD!

Gay people are clearly controlled by Satan, because in the Bible it states that you should NOT be gay. Therefore, since God is perfect, he would not and could not create gay people. Therefore, it is LUCIFER controlling humans and making them kiss guys.

However I'm still kind of stumped about why perfect God would create people born with diseases all through history. That must be Satan too, maybe someone can help me where it talks about that in the Bible.

And witches?! They are PUREST evil and need to be burned out wherever they may be! As all people with a brain know: magic is REAL and witches cast SPELLS on God-fearing folks. SAAATAN gives them this horrible power...or mother nature...or from their own inner power...depends on the type of witch we want to burn. Who cares where they get their evil powers from? As long as they are a witch and we get to burn them for GOD, then that makes me wet. I mean it makes me feel full of the Holy Spirit of the LORD who loves ALL of his creations...except gays and witches. And many other things, but that's really not the point...

The point is that GAYS should be burned JUST LIKE WITCHES! Harry Potter and all those who read those filthy books of evil need to be burned as well...just to be sure. We can't have more witches popping up after reading those books. I'm sure they contain spells as well, and it's only a matter of time before Slytherin rises up and takes over America. America, of course, being founded on Christian Principles, despite all the quotes from the founding fathers to the contrary. Those quotes are from Satan re-writing history making it look as though they didn't approve of religion.

Bottom line, love the Bible, love God, love Jesus, and love each other!!!! (Unless they are gay, a witch, or follow any other religion, then they must be burned)

PRAISE THE LORD!

reply to post by halfoldman


So? It also advocates stoning adulterers to death as well as unruly children.

I get so sick of the selective reading of the Bible.

www.openbible.info...

Leviticus 20:9

For anyone who curses his father or his mother shall surely be put to death; he has cursed his father or his mother; his blood is upon him.

Deuteronomy 21:18-21

“If a man has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey the voice of his father or the voice of his mother, and, though they discipline him, will not listen to them, then his father and his mother shall take hold of him and bring him out to the elders of his city at the gate of the place where he lives, and they shall say to the elders of his city, ‘This our son is stubborn and rebellious; he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton and a drunkard.’ Then all the men of the city shall stone him to death with stones. So you shall purge the evil from your midst, and all Israel shall hear, and fear.

www.answering-christianity.com...

Deuteronomy 22:22 "If a man is found sleeping with another man's wife, both the man who slept with her and the woman must die."

Leviticus 20:10 "If a man commits adultery with another man's wife--with the wife of his neighbor--both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death."