Would you kill your child and offer him up to God if he Told You.

Hi all

I'm not hearing voices and I always loved and considered my sons to be a gift. Now I have a tiny Grandaughter so I expect you won't be surprised if I said my answer would be NO! .

I saw a picture of Abraham about to sacrifice Isaac and the human emotion it inspired hit me hard.

Apart from human madness, we have been without Godly interference for some time and this started me thinking about the Second Coming which many think will happen soon.

Even if its Jesus and not Jehovah, Yahweh or Allah whoever, a person will still face that blind love test because Jesus said "Whoever loves Father, Mother more than me is not worthy of me and whoever loves son or daughter is not worthy,." So one could have spent years living a decent religious life to be disregarded by him. Surely some of this is the essence of our relationship with God, yet there is something lurking in the background which is more than incompatable.

Conciliatore, I'm not asking a stupid question. Look at religion today and its fervour with people declaring their unconditional love for God. Should that love be unconditional bearing in mind from rough calculations God has murdered 2.8 million people whilst critising Satan for killing 10.

YourMaker made me laugh with your "Wow you do exist.....What?..........Hail Satan.

xxsomeexpersonxx As you say would you trust this God? is a very real point.

When you look through the ancient world and its not that long ago for some tribes, human sacrifice was carried out all over the world's cultures to appease some deity and slowly through the inner qualities of our natural humanity, we got to stop it IMHO. we moved on past our Lords and with the speculation of the return of our Gods, perhaps we should be asking ourselves do we want them back or would we prefer to trust ourselves?

reply to post by YouDeserveToKnow


YouDeserveToKnow, thank you for replying. that was most excellent, and very well stated. i followed you and i hear what you are saying. i'm glad you wrote back.

God can go to hell if he asked me that. I would die for my children so that means me and god would have to have it out ! He then would have to peel the weapon out of my dead hands if i lost... Not that i would !

If I were and angel, I would fall first.
I would happily die fighting for my child against god if need be.
Or any child for that matter.

i'll flick a v sign at the big bastard and be pulverized on the spot with a machete in my hand. not getting how wise was abraham and the black humor of our alien creators...

There is another thread covering Gobekli Tepe, I don't know if any of you have seen it but its about an area in Eastern Turkey where the archaelogists think they have found The Garden of Eden - or at least a Temple to it.

Why its pertinent is that they have discovered human sacrifice not only in considerable numbers and different methods, such as boiling in vats to death. Its an article in the Daily Mail I'll post the site, I don't know how to do a link, (www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1157784/Do-mysteriouds-stones-mark-site-Garden-Eden.html) The writer tells us that this human sacrifice to God would have been known right through the different cultures.

It makes one wonder whether they were filled with either fear or fervour?

.

uh - It's 2011. sacrifice yourself

Originally posted by KoolerKing
reply to post by Solar.Absolution

 

God wants to know if we will sacrifice the OP of this thread. I told him we would indeed.

OO! KoolerKing, you would do that to Lyndiloo????

reply to post by Lynda101


I don't think that God would do that. In the old testament, people were required to prove their faith in God in different ways. The Abraham situation is a good example of that. God sending Jesus to sacrifice himself for the sins of man changed all of that because now man can prove his/her faith in God by accepting Jesus. Jesus' crucification was symbolic of the sacrifices that people were required to make in the old testament, and took the place of any future requirements.

reply to post by Lynda101


Either he heard voices in his head, as he was really old, or some pshyco who really was going to kill his son, until Satan stopped him. Looks like Satan is the good guy, compared to this G-d. But did all this really happen or are the people, G-d included, just made up?

Originally posted by OptimusSubprime
reply to post by Lynda101

 

I don't think that God would do that. In the old testament, people were required to prove their faith in God in different ways. The Abraham situation is a good example of that. God sending Jesus to sacrifice himself for the sins of man changed all of that because now man can prove his/her faith in God by accepting Jesus. Jesus' crucification was symbolic of the sacrifices that people were required to make in the old testament, and took the place of any future requirements.

That's interesting OptimusSubprime,

I don't have the list to hand,but I do know there is a pagan tradition of a number of individuals through the ages from various cultures who have either died on trees or crosses etc or been sacrificed to help others. I looked at that through the Pagan perspective on death and renewal as it is celebrated annually.

But as you say, the significance of God sacrificing his own son for us, was a breaking away from the old faith Judiasm and a bringing in of a new and different faith Christianity. However it was not till I read Ezra and other threads etc that the two faces of God suddenly made sense - because it was two Gods, El and YHWH that were blended into one and christianity clearly didn't reflect YHWH, though many Christians use that name for their God.

In one respect I'm going off topic slightly because although its very comforting to think that God, or the El God, takes us as his children, not servants, I am still thinking of how far would my loyalty to El go if serving him would damage my loved ones and humanity in general.

Originally posted by Lynda101
We know although later God provided a ram, God commanded Abraham to sacrifice Isaac on a pyre to prove his obedience.

If God told you today to sacrifice your child, would you do it?

"we know although..."
We don't know. We know some person wrote a story telling this adventure. That we do know.

And to answer your question:
as I am an atheist, I don't have to deal with issues like this. No one, not even an imaginary friend, will tell me to harm others.

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13


No i wouldn't. Aye, Enlil (i lack people skills)-El Shaddai. The public relations back then seemed a bit more intense, maybe Abe did hear voices in his head. Having been told that of all his sons, 'my covenant will I establish with Isaac' (17:18-21), perhaps Abraham called his bluff. If he knew the bloodline of Isaac was vital, then why would El-Shaddai want him to be sacrificed? He was daft or cunning.

Absolutely not.
For one, I would question why God was talking to me and check into a psyche ward.
And two, I wouldn't like any God who needs me to prove my devotion by destroying what I love most.

What kind of cruel , sick, twisted , perverse GOD of any description worthy of worship or obedience would ask a parent to murder their child?

To answer the loaded question posed in the thread title. HELL NO

reply to post by Lynda101



Currently I am of sound mind and body, so no, I would not sacrifice my child to the Gods. However if someone is delusional enough to believe he or she is actually hearing a god tell them to kill their child as a sacrifice, then they are delusional enough to do it.

Not sure if I'd do it. I try to picture it as a family member and see what types of feelings I get but they're all grown up and honestly they'd all want me to do it. Don't have kids, but I know it might be a good opportunity to seend your kid up the evolutionary ladder.
Cause I mean if you're staring God in the face you're assured that there's an afterlife and your actions certainly wouldn't be putting a stop to his life, or more importantly, the self awareness of his soul.
Matter of fact, it's an action like this that might get your son a pretty good spot in heaven. Would i want my kid to skip highschool and go straight to university? Probably.
The most important thing would be him convincing me he's not satan, or whatever spirits it is that messes with us.
I realize if i had kids my answer would probably be a lot different, but the key is how your view on what life is would change when you have the proof right in front of you that death isn't the end. You know that if he's got a problem with it you can present to him your case after you yourself are dead.

Originally posted by MisterMiyagi
What kind of cruel , sick, twisted , perverse GOD of any description worthy of worship or obedience would ask a parent to murder their child?

To answer the loaded question posed in the thread title. HELL NO

If you look at the amount of people worshipping God today, most of them will regularly sit through readings from the bible about Jesus's life and also stories from the old Testament. They hear that God destroyed the earth, apart from one single family (with a very strange looking father named Noah), every living man, woman and child, animals and the plants. We even get our kids to draw pictures of the arc, I remember seeing some pictures on the wall with dying people in the water, which were never questioned or given a second glance at. Then there's Abraham's devotion to God and the pain God caused to him knowing how long he had waited for children. When the priest finishes one of his gory tales, he says, "Thanks be to God, praise be to God". The people didn't seem to see God as being in the wrong in any way and sing out Amen..

I didn't post it as a deliberate 'loaded question', I wondered what others thought because when I looked at a painting of Abraham about to kill his son only to obey God's wish, I realized that all my religious teaching had obsessed only, and purely about God's relationship with me, a human not once in all the religions conditioning piled on my head was considered my relationship with God.

I forgot to say in an earlier thread that the Garden of Eden Temple, Gobekli Tepe, and its human and especially child sacrificial function was deliberately buried, although strangely not destroyed be people who must have felt very strongly about what it stood for. I can't recall any other temples being deliberately buried, they just, when neglected fell down.

reply to post by heyo


Again, I would not want to share space with a deity that 1) would promote someone else based on my actions, or demote someone based on my actions.
A child has to make their own way and their own decisions. You may want to send your child to a university, but he is still doing his own homework. He got himself there.

If I think God is talking to me, sure there is an afterlife. I still don't want to share it with someone who forces such decisions on their devotees.