Aliens have not contacted us, therefore theres nothing to disclose

reply to post by andre18

Its not just about now. They have been here and coming here for a very long time. Thats where you came from. If you understood the history of UFO's way back to the caves and cave drawings etc etc etc etc then you would realise that Aliens and UFO's are for real. Yes 4.5 billion years. That in itself should be pretty indicative that there are Aliens who are possibly millions if not a billion years ahead of us. Just imagine what we will be doing in 100,000 or 1,000,000 years from now. Travelling accross the universe and no doubt visiting other planets that have some form of intelligent life for sure! we now have the technology and capability to travel to Mars and all that in as little as 50 years. What about in 5000 years time!!! Presto!!

reply to post by andre18
Well at least there is an invasion in Pennsylvania, April 16 2011

Other forms of contact beyond radio transmission replies are presented. We have more proof of them contacting us, allowing to be seen,etc. than currently failed experiments to contact them. Replies to the OP present a lot of great reasons to disclose something rather than nothing.

reply to post by gimmefootball400


Then assuming any UFO sightings are of extraterrestrial origin is a rational mistake. We know that Venus can be mistaken for UFOs, we know that birds, satellites, burning up meteors far off car and train lights shining through a mirage, weather balloons, planes, secret Govt. planes, exotic natural phenomena like ball lightning and earth quake lights can all be seen as Unidentified Flying Objects or Unexplained Aerial Phenomena. What we don't know for sure is that real Extraterrestrial craft are seen as such.

That's not to say it's impossible that ET craft have been sited, its just to say that as far as we know, the only verified things reported as UFO have been these natural explanations. Assuming that at least some UFOs are ET is getting ahead of ourselves into pure speculation.

reply to post by Welfhard


I noticed you were the most vocal in this thread so I took the liberty of pointing out a couple of in-discrepancies from random posts you made.

I don't dismiss it, I'm skeptical of it. That's not the same as denialism. The point is that we have a bunch of natural explanations that are demonstrably the case a lot of the time, and then there's an unsubstantiated belief that they're caused by real Aliens.

This is not correct. Even your answer contradicts itself. The rule of thumb is 95% of UFO activity can be explained. Agree? Then why would you go on to say "unsubstantiated belief" that "they" (the 95%) are caused by aliens? We already know they can be explained?!?

You didn't read what I said. I didn't presume in that hypothetical that there were any extraterrestrials and in any case the rational behaviour would be the same as if there were extraterrestrials as perceived by the et believers. If there was no evidence of ETs there's nothing the govt could do to prove to you people that they didn't know anything about ETs - nor would they have the responsibility to.

You completely dodged the statement. He's not asking about the govt proving ET. He's stating that they wouldn't, and you distorted your answer to make it look like a non issue.

That's an extraordinary claim but the people making it do little to provide evidence for it. If they refuse to, its not our responsibility to believe them. The null hypothesis tells us we should assume its not happening - assume until the natural explanations are ruled out.

While you are correct we need to rule out natural explanations, but you are again obfuscating the fact there is indeed a plethora of evidence. From implant phenomena to molecular mutations etc, etc. Nothing you haven't heard or read about before. So why say there is no evidence? Just because you don't agree with it, doesn't make it so.

But hey, never mind eye witnesses, we can convict on circumstantial evidence!!

Not alone we cant because eyewitness testimony is completely subjective and very corruptible. And seriously, even if I experienced and abduction, I wouldn't assume it was real. I know I can be mistaken and I know how that could be the case. I wouldn't need to be convinced that maybe I was mistaken.

In law, evidence that is drawn not from direct observation of a fact at issue but from events or circumstances that surround it. If a witness arrives at a crime scene seconds after hearing a gunshot to find someone standing over a corpse and holding a smoking pistol, the evidence is circumstantial, since the person may merely be a bystander who picked up the weapon after the killer dropped it. The popular notion that one cannot be convicted on circumstantial evidence is false. Most criminal convictions are based, at least in part, on circumstantial evidence that sufficiently links criminal and crime.

Read more: www.answers.com...

But the eye witness testimony is accepted from the third party circumstantial witness? What an oxymoron.
You're point is extremely invalid.

next...

Why would they be talking to any one individual. If they're going to make contact, they're going to interact with many of us. You'd imagine that a representative team, diplomats would meet with world leaders and leading scientists - maybe they'd heal Hawking in a gesture of good faith. Interfacing with people is the best way to understand them.

You are assuming you know their agenda. No one is in any position, including so called channelers and watchamacallits, to presume to know absolutely anything about an advanced race's agenda 100%. Period.

What's also possible and must logically account for at least some abduction reports is sleep paralysis. We know it happens, we know it results in hallucinations of horrible creatures or witches because the semi-conscious mind don't know why the body can't move. It's entirely possible that all the reports of abductions bore down to either sleep paralysis, simple delusion & psychosis and lying.

THAT'S more likely than creatures coming across the galaxy just to stick things in my butt- uh.. our butts!

Even though sleep paralysis is true, I find it odd you haven't considered the commonalities of alien abductions among sleep paralysis experiencers? A rather disturbing oversight of yours. introspectively you should ask why?Travis Walton was on here last month. You do know who he is right? Your disregard for euphemism wreaks of a desperate action to minimize the "probing" trauma involved in an abduction. If it's not from a lack of compassion then it must be you flat out call him a liar. Or both.

Because that's what governments do when they're investigating something. And then when they're done and find nothing of interest they stop - at which point there's no incentive to declassify anything as much as there is to keep it secret so they follow protocol and wait for it's classification time to expire and then declassify it when they're supposed to. If they had something to hide, they wouldn't be declassifying anything.

What if they DO find something of interest? Moot point really...

You shoud have seen this coming:

So again, lack of evidence IS evidence to you.

abscence of evidence is not evidence of abscense.

reply to post by RoguePhilosopher


There are cave paintings of dragons. Does that make them real or a figment of the imagination of our ancestors?

Originally posted by Welfhard
reply to post by RoguePhilosopher

 

There are cave paintings of dragons. Does that make them real or a figment of the imagination of our ancestors?

Could be either.

reply to post by Welfhard

As there are other animals! And a huge amount of other indicative evidence dating back thousands of years. I guess this is all imagination too then.
Thus there is nothing to disclose...............join the flock!

Originally posted by RoguePhilosopher
reply to post by andre18

 

Its not just about now. They have been here and coming here for a very long time. Thats where you came from. If you understood the history of UFO's way back to the caves and cave drawings etc etc etc etc then you would realise that Aliens and UFO's are for real. Yes 4.5 billion years. That in itself should be pretty indicative that there are Aliens who are possibly millions if not a billion years ahead of us. Just imagine what we will be doing in 100,000 or 1,000,000 years from now. Travelling accross the universe and no doubt visiting other planets that have some form of intelligent life for sure! we now have the technology and capability to travel to Mars and all that in as little as 50 years. What about in 5000 years time!!! Presto!!

I am not sure if this forum allows with photo attachments. I have several photo shots showing alien (sesame seed faced) spirits existence as well as Gremlins.

reply to post by RoguePhilosopher


I have photo evidence showing the spirits of aliens, etc. Does this forum allows with photo attachments?

reply to post by FlySolo

This is not correct. Even your answer contradicts itself. The rule of thumb is 95% of UFO activity can be explained. Agree? Then why would you go on to say "unsubstantiated belief" that "they" (the 95%) are caused by aliens? We already know they can be explained?!?

Clearly I was referring to the left over 5% as being explained by the believers as being genuine abductions, that's the un-substantiation.

From implant phenomena to molecular mutations etc, etc.

None of those things are absent in the general populations anyway. Lots of people have tiny foreign objects lodged under their skin, it happens. People report unusual markers, as if the unusualness of markings could be indicative of something out of this world. If someone found something in their bodies that was definitely ET, the scientist who did the study would win the Nobel Prize and be rich, but it doesn't happen.

But the eye witness testimony is accepted from the third party circumstantial witness? What an oxymoron.

Bad justice isn't my fault. You remember all those cases in the nineties of people suing therapeutic hypnosis practitioners for unwittingly planting false memories of being abused? Eyewitness testimony is the most unreliable form of evidence because it corrupts so easily.

You are assuming you know their agenda.

No I'm not. I'm responding to someone who presumes the aliens are here to study us and I'm pointing out that if they were, it would make more sense if they'd actually interface with us. That's far more likely and that's all what my point was.

Even though sleep paralysis is true, I find it odd you haven't considered the commonalities of alien abductions among sleep paralysis experiencers?

Paralysis delusions are going to be based on a standard issue thing taken from popular culture. In old times, it was consistently witches in the same way it's consistently aliens now. Everyone's heard of what supposedly happens in Alien abductions, so people hallucinate in consistent ways. That's what you'd expect. What you wouldn't expect is people's reports diverging from the common significantly and still being vivid because in such a case it becomes hard to see where a subconscious mind might source such images from if not from popular culture.

What if they DO find something of interest? Moot point really...

Then why are they declassifying everything nowadays? My point is that from the perspective of an ET believer, governments not declassifying stuff means they're hiding something and yet perplexingly governments actually declassifying stuff means they're hiding something.

reply to post by takso


Not sure, never posted one. Spirits of Aliens?.........you sure

Originally posted by Welfhard
reply to post by FlySolo

 

Clearly I was referring to the left over 5% as being explained by the believers as being genuine abductions, that's the un-substantiation.

So yes, we have 5% in a category all by itself. So why ignore the testimony attempting to explain this 5% That isn't how a skeptic should remain indifferent.

From implant phenomena to molecular mutations etc, etc.

None of those things are absent in the general populations anyway. Lots of people have tiny foreign objects lodged under their skin, it happens. People report unusual markers, as if the unusualness of markings could be indicative of something out of this world. If someone found something in their bodies that was definitely ET, the scientist who did the study would win the Nobel Prize and be rich, but it doesn't happen.

Lodged under the skin? Attached to the nervous system would be more accurate.
aliens.monstrous.com...
www.legjoints.com...

What if they DO find something of interest? Moot point really...

Then why are they declassifying everything nowadays? My point is that from the perspective of an ET believer, governments not declassifying stuff means they're hiding something and yet perplexingly governments actually declassifying stuff means they're hiding something.

Have you seen some of the stuff they declassified? They have blacked out 90% of the memo's, transcripts etc. I could probably go find some but I'm sure you know exactly what I'm talking about. Don't forget, it takes nagging and phone calls and letters and more nagging just to get anything out from the FOIA. The good stuff is never voluntarily publicly admitted.

reply to post by andre18


I don't know you very well and your post is intelligent enough but falls flat on my ears. I think there is enough evidence already to declare there has been and probably still is life on Mars, scientifically even.

Beyond that, when you compound all the eyewitness testimony from people all over earth and obvious government cover ups, there really is a mountain of "evidence" that would suggest we are NOT alone and in fact, brimming over with other life forms in the universe.

We are as babies who have just been brought into the world at this stage of our universal evolution, we can see and hear everything around us but we struggle to understand what it all means, most of it just sounds like gibberish but after hearing it for long enough, it starts to make sense. In my opinion, we have just learned how to say, mama, dadda and bobba.

reply to post by FlySolo


People get foreign bodies lodged EVERYWHERE. That's just what happens, it's not otherworldly.


And how is that different to anything else they declassify. They've all declassified documents about espionage from the wars and they're rife with censorship.

Originally posted by RoguePhilosopher
reply to post by takso

 

Not sure, never posted one. Spirits of Aliens?.........you sure

You can go to the following web site. I have posted there many intriguing photos for evaluation by all.

family.psychics.co.uk...

reply to post by takso

Peronally Im not into Psychic or bible babble.
Atheist interested in the truth.

Originally posted by RoguePhilosopher
reply to post by takso

 

Peronally Im not into Psychic or bible babble.
Atheist interested in the truth.

Simply, you are just requested to view the photos in that web site coz I have attached it there and nothing else.

You can also see a real life photo of Gremlins.

reply to post by takso

I only asked you the question and if you were sure. I did not ask you to show me anything!

Originally posted by RoguePhilosopher
reply to post by takso

 

I only asked you the question and if you were sure. I did not ask you to show me anything!

Yes, I am rather sure judging from the outlook feature that is commonly depicted (sesame seed face). If you have a recommended site for photo attachments, I can show it to you now.