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The Roman Empire Collapsed Under the Weight of Illegal Immigration and Welfare...

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posted on Apr, 15 2011 @ 10:17 PM
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Originally posted by fredvcall


Would it be fair to say that the illegal immigrants of Rome's day carried swords and spears and burning torches? While the illegal immigrants of today carry drugs and AK 47s?


No.

In Rome's day, barbarian conquering enemies came in successful large scale invasions from highly mobile skilled horse warriors.

The closest equivalent today would be a large scale, disciplined and ruthless mechanized army (this means main battle tanks) versus the Border Patrol.
edit on 15-4-2011 by mbkennel because: (no reason given)




posted on Apr, 15 2011 @ 10:32 PM
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I hear the Mexican Mafia has Russian made tanks brought in through Venezuela.


edit on 15-4-2011 by fredvcall because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 15 2011 @ 10:35 PM
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Originally posted by LDragonFire
reply to post by fredvcall
 

Welfare is something people must apply for, do we have documents with Attila application for government assistance, the Romans were meticulous record keepers...



You might find this difficult to believe, but neither Rome nor Attila had the internet.



posted on Apr, 15 2011 @ 10:39 PM
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reply to post by fredvcall
 


Are you claiming welfare didn't exist before the internet?

At one time it was against the T&C to post false information.

Your labeling a invading army as illegal immigrants. So does that make the US military illegal immigrants in Iraq and Afghanistan....?


edit on 15-4-2011 by LDragonFire because: whooops



posted on Apr, 15 2011 @ 10:40 PM
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reply to post by Ghost375
 

First of all Ancient aliens is highly entertaining.

Secondly OP don't get all pissy because someone who wrote a frikken paper on a subject is telling you to go do more research and not get all your knowledge from the television.

This is ATS. We Question. We Research. We Learn. We don't get our info from just one place.

And we don't trust the media outlets.



posted on Apr, 15 2011 @ 10:42 PM
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Originally posted by LDragonFire
reply to post by fredvcall
 


Are you claiming welfare didn't exist before the internet?


No. I said Attila didn't apply for welfare on the internet, thereby leaving messages for future archaelogists to find.



posted on Apr, 15 2011 @ 10:44 PM
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Originally posted by js331975
reply to post by Ghost375
 

First of all Ancient aliens is highly entertaining.



Exceedingly entertaining. And extremely informative. I have no problem if this discussion seques into discussions about ancient aliens. No problem at all.



posted on Apr, 15 2011 @ 10:46 PM
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Originally posted by js331975
reply to post by Ghost375
 

First of all Ancient aliens is highly entertaining.




And if people want to discuss the use of atomic weapons as indicated in the Bhagavad Gita, I think that would be an enticing topic about history repeating itself.



posted on Apr, 15 2011 @ 10:52 PM
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I really didn't understand the logic of refuting what the History Channel had to say about Attila by refuting what the History Channel has to say about ancient aliens, modern day aliens, the world without people and so forth. The History Channel is among my favorites. Their research and their guests interviewed are exceedingly knowledgeable.

vius Aetius: Civilized men are easy to conquer, but civilization still belongs to the civilized, not the barbarians.
Attila the Hun: It belongs to whoever is strong enough to take it.
From the TV movie 'Attila'



posted on Apr, 15 2011 @ 10:55 PM
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Well thank god we have the internet today, here is a link of Roman Documents

Internet ancient history sourcebook

Please show evidence from history to prove your theories please...

Notice welfare or illegal immigration is nowhere in the official record...its seems to be a opinion of yours as the History Channel program also did not mention these phrases.....



posted on Apr, 15 2011 @ 11:49 PM
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Originally posted by LDragonFire
Well thank god we have the internet today, here is a link of Roman Documents

[


Okay, so now you are saying that some Romans from two thousand years ago left documents on the internet? Are you getting into a discussion about time travelers, now?



posted on Apr, 15 2011 @ 11:53 PM
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Originally posted by fredvcall

Originally posted by LDragonFire
Well thank god we have the internet today, here is a link of Roman Documents

[


Okay, so now you are saying that some Romans from two thousand years ago left documents on the internet? Are you getting into a discussion about time travelers, now?


I guess you are not going to prove welfare existed in the Roman Empire or that the invading Attila and the Huns were illegal immigrants...



posted on Apr, 16 2011 @ 01:24 AM
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reply to post by fredvcall
 


Anyone with an immigration problem really has a
human resource management problem.

All people are worth something and if this is your basic premise you have no problem.

Welcome to America.

What do you do?

Great.

This is what we have.

You have the people, now build the barn.

A country or empire or any group can be compared to a family.
Everyone chips in, cooperatively, knows what they do best and gets it all done.

The family is like the microcosm for a country.

The world is a jamboree of many families.
Numbers come in handy for a few of the games, tug of war for example.
Building pyramids or high speed rail. Any plan at all.

Criminals need fast rejection and ejection but I can't help but think
If they gave Attila a job
functioning as a contributing member
instead of paying him not to function
things might have been different.



posted on Apr, 16 2011 @ 01:50 AM
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Originally posted by fredvcall
I've been watching the History Channel biographies on Attila the Hun.

The Huns and other barbarians were the illegal immigrants roaming through the Eastern and Western halves of the Roman Empire.

Rome thought they could bribe Attila to take it easy on their territories. They offered Atilla a whole lot of welfare. The more welfare Rome offered Attila, the more Attila laughed at Rome as having grown weak.

Attila did his fair share to take apart the Roman Empire.

So, looks like history repeating itself. Will we today learn a lesson from Attila?


It depends upon which lesson is being learnt, the great empires now are similarly expending valuable resources quelling rebellions abroad which deplete man-power, which requires them to encourage immigration in order to keep the numbers up on the home front. They have been bribing and buying loyalty for decades, now they are taking it by force. History tells us that this can only go on for so long before implosion or explosion occurs.

So, as history repeats itself, quite literally often, what happens next do you think?



posted on Apr, 16 2011 @ 03:38 AM
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The last time I checked Illegal immigration takes place for the following reasons:

Immigrant is trying to escape persecution/ or hardship in home country (also falls under assylum)
Immigrant is in new country seeking work because it is scarce / badly paid in their own country
New country offers freedoms or lifetsyle not offered in own country

Ive met a LOT of illegals in my time in the US - hell I was even an overstayed VISA myself for 4 years!
but I NEVER saw an illegal immigrant move to a new country with the sole intent of RULING/PILAGING and generally just taking over the whole damn show.

Tell me WHAT part of what Atilla the Hun did looks ANYTHING like immigration to you?



posted on Apr, 16 2011 @ 05:56 AM
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reply to post by mbkennel
 


Small point but The Eastern Empire lasted from 306 AD to 1453 AD (approximately) which is 1147 years which yeah you're right not bad for an empire. still not as long as Rome and the catholic church which was instrumental in the decline of The Eastern Empire due to the Fourth Crusade in 1204.



posted on Apr, 16 2011 @ 06:09 AM
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This thread and the OP seems to be using history ( from a tv show) to justify their own political view of imigration and welfare. How you can compare ancient Rome and modern day immigration and welfare problems is beyond me. Is this an example of how people can interpret information based on their own preconcieved ideas ?

The modern American Empire has bigger problems than hordes of immigrants and welfare such as a weakening economy, over extended military campaigns, corrupt banking practices, loss of good standing in the international comunity. Their main problem is another expanding empire - China - which looks to replace them as the major super power within twenty years or so.

If you wish to worry about your empire then there's more to worry about than immigration and welfare.
edit on 16-4-2011 by Hopeforeveryone because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 16 2011 @ 08:01 AM
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Originally posted by LDragonFire

Originally posted by fredvcall

Originally posted by LDragonFire

I guess you are not going to prove welfare existed in the Roman Empire or that the invading Attila and the Huns were illegal immigrants...


First, you have to watch the History Channel biography on Attila the Hun, illegal immigration and welfare to the barbarians.



posted on Apr, 16 2011 @ 08:04 AM
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Originally posted by newcovenant
reply to post by fredvcall
 


Criminals need fast rejection and ejection but I can't help but think
If they gave Attila a job
functioning as a contributing member
instead of paying him not to function
things might have been different.



It went both ways for the Romans. They tried welfare payments to get Attila to work for them. They tried welfare payments to get Attila to just leave them alone. Neither effort worked for the Romans. The more welfare the Romans paid Attila, the more Attila sacked, pillaged and plundered Roman goods.



posted on Apr, 16 2011 @ 08:06 AM
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Originally posted by Hopeforeveryone
This thread and the OP seems to be using history ( from a tv show) to justify their own political view of imigration and welfare. )


And you are using the internet in an attempt to justify illegal immigration and welfare. What's the difference between television and the internet, anymore?



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