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science on how HAARP *COULD* create an EQ

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posted on May, 20 2011 @ 12:53 AM
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reply to post by weedwhacker
 


cheers mate..... chemtrails are a separate topic though i appreciate your input regarding their connection




posted on May, 20 2011 @ 12:54 AM
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Originally posted by Majestyka
reply to post by adeclerk
 


propagation



Radio propagation is also affected by several other factors determined by its path from point to point. This path can be a direct line of sight path or an over-the-horizon path aided by refraction in the ionosphere


3uw/cm2 is indeed quite small, both in energy and area of effect.

3 uw = 0.0000003 W/cm2

3600000 potential watts
----------------------------------- = 12,000,000,000,000 cm2 of "heated" area or 120 000 000 km2
0.0000003 w/cm2

some critical thinking goes along way since that amount of heated sky is about 23.5% of the earths surface!!!!!

im going to assume HAARP cannot cover such a wide area (please correct me if iam wrong)
so common sense tells me if my area of effect decreases the amount of energy available for the area increases. (again correct me if im wrong)


That is not how that works. When the energy reaches the ionosphere, it only ends up being 3uw /cm^2, not that it covers the amount of sky you seemed to have worked out there.



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 01:00 AM
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Originally posted by adeclerk

Originally posted by Majestyka
reply to post by adeclerk
 


all im trying to discuss is whether the mechanics surrounding the HAARP program have a potentiality of creating an EQ event.

It is far too weak to cause any Earthquake, especially by time the radio waves bounce back to Earth. I don't understand why this has to continually be discussed. HAARP cannot potentially create any kind of event on the ground (much less create an event at the depths of tectonic plates).


haarp


Some of the main scientific findings from HAARP include:
Generation of very low frequency radio waves by modulated heating of the auroral electrojet, useful because generating VLF waves ordinarily requires gigantic antennas
Production of weak luminous glow (below what can be seen with the naked eye, but measurable) from absorption of HAARP's signal
Production of extremely low frequency waves in the 0.1 Hz range. These are next to impossible to produce any other way, because the length of a transmit antenna is dictated by the wavelength of the signal it is designed to produce.
Generation of whistler-mode VLF signals which enter the magnetosphere, and propagate to the other hemisphere, interacting with Van Allen radiation belt particles along the way VLF remote sensing of the heated ionosphere

Research at the HAARP includes:
Ionospheric super heating


low freq waves require high energy to produce unless resonance and propagation are utilized
glow effects such as the aurora (possible eq lights? since noone has shown the same seen in china that move like aurora)
also the term SUPER heating does NOT imply anything is gentle



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 01:01 AM
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reply to post by Majestyka
 


In another thread (similar topic) ATS member 'matadoor' wrote this post, repeated in full, because it's quite informative RE: the true nature and abilities of HAARP:



Originally posted by matadoor

Since in this entire thread, I didn't see anyone actually talk to or ask the nice folks at HAARP about these issues.

That friend of mine mentioned in another post, sent me the contact information for the Director over HAARP, and I posed some questions to him. Now I know, first thing that someone is going to respond with is "WHY BELIEVE THEM!!??" Maybe because they happen to know what they are doing?

I'm posting the entire e-mail as is, but this pretty much closes the door on HAARP causing "Earthquakes".

> 1. Do you have any systems that can transmit in the ELF range, say
> 2.5 HZ?

There are no transmitters or other systems at HAARP that can transmit signals in the ELF/VLF frequency range.

It is possible to induce the radiation of frequencies in the ELF range from the ionosphere at altitudes of about 100 km or so, however. The process produces signals on the ground that are measured in the pico-tesla (10^-12 tesla) amplitude range. The signals can be detected using sensitive receivers. The equivalent ionospheric ELF "transmitter"
is on the order of 10 Watts under good conditions.


>
> 2. What frequencies do you transmit at?

Transmitters at HAARP include the IRI operating at 3.6 MW in specific authorized frequency bands between 2.8 MHz and 9.5 MHz. There is an ionospheric radar operating in the 450 MHz range and there is an aircraft alert radar which operates in the S-band.
>
> 3. Can you “directionally” transmit, in other words what
> capability do you have to “focus” your transmit power?

The signals transmitted from the IRI can be transmitted vertically or up to 30 degrees off vertical in any direction. HAARP really doesn't have the ability to "focus" the electromagnetic signals. When we speak of focusing, we usually do so in the context of light. Even though light is also electromagnetic radiation, its wavelength is orders of magnitude smaller than the signals transmitted from HAARP. For HAARP to really focus (like a lens does for light) would require a transmit antenna array orders of magnitude larger than what exists - literally miles in dimension. Physically (and financially) not practical.

Radiated signals from HAARP obey the inverse square law, which means that they decrease by the square of the distance traveled. A transmission directed upward toward the ionosphere at 3.6 MW returns to earth with an amplitude measured in the range 0.005 Watts or so, even under the best conditions.

Thanks again for writing to us.

Best wishes,
I.H.



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 01:02 AM
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reply to post by adeclerk
 


im a GMDSS operator... bouncing HF off the ionosphere from my ship happens daily and extends my range well over line of sight my friend, my handheld radio at 25W can be heard over the horizon at night



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 01:05 AM
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Originally posted by Majestyka
reply to post by adeclerk
 


im a GMDSS operator... bouncing HF off the ionosphere from my ship happens daily and extends my range well over line of sight my friend, my handheld radio at 25W can be heard over the horizon at night

I'm aware of how the ionosphere works. How do you expect HAARP to be bouncing back enough energy (especially with the low amount that is being absorbed/heating the ionosphere) to affect tectonic plates?

Why is this even being debated? Doesn't common sense exist anymore?



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 01:08 AM
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reply to post by weedwhacker
 


thank you for that addition. HAARP can also pulse its transmitters which allow it to create interference, this can create an additive effect for wave propagation meaning yes when the first signal reaches back the the ground the energy is minimal but it can create a vibration and reverberation, we all know what happens when 2 waves meet and double** or cancel out

**in a perfect world



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 01:10 AM
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reply to post by Majestyka
 


Perhaps you need to read it again, carefully. This part, near the bottom:


Radiated signals from HAARP obey the inverse square law, which means that they decrease by the square of the distance traveled. A transmission directed upward toward the ionosphere at 3.6 MW returns to earth with an amplitude measured in the range 0.005 Wattsor so, even under the best conditions.



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 01:11 AM
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reply to post by adeclerk
 


its the creation of high energy LF waves that will penetrate the ground..... they admit to using this to find oil and gas. think of it like ground penetrating sonar

if you have ever been in an aluminum boat with a fish finder sometimes you can audibly hear the fish finder echo in the hull depending on conditions



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 01:12 AM
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Originally posted by Majestyka
reply to post by adeclerk
 

they admit to using this to find oil and gas. think of it like ground penetrating sonar


That technology perhaps, but not HAARP, it's a completely different subject.
edit on 5/20/11 by adeclerk because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 01:13 AM
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reply to post by weedwhacker
 


perhaps you should study wave mechanics instead of being spoon fed.....

think of it this way.... if you were on my ship and im conducting a bomb search im gonna feed you BS just like any other emergency..... as a passenger on my v/l the less you think the easier my job becomes. this is what people believe of their gov'ts and of "TPTB"



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 01:19 AM
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reply to post by adeclerk
 





they say 100 billion watts..... who knows..... im off to bed ill catch up tomorrow guys and thanks!



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 01:22 AM
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reply to post by Majestyka
 


Great, a youtube video. What a lucrative source of facts.



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 03:32 AM
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reply to post by Majestyka
 




its the creation of high energy LF waves that will penetrate the ground..... they admit to using this to find oil and gas. think of it like ground penetrating sonar if you have ever been in an aluminum boat with a fish finder sometimes you can audibly hear the fish finder echo in the hull depending on conditions

No. Do not think of it like ground penetrating sonar. What does sound have to do with electromagnetic radiation anyway?


HAARP is not capable of producing high energy LF radiation. Under ideal ionospheric conditions it is a very inefficient process. A 960 kW HF signal produces ELF radiation at about 4-32 watts. Not very impressive

We present calibrated measurements of ELF waves generated by modulated HF
heating of the auroral electrojet by the High frequency Active Auroral Research Program (HAARP) HF transmitter in Gakona, Alaska, and detected after propagating more
than 4400 km in the Earth-ionosphere waveguide to Midway Atoll. The magnitude of the
2125 Hz wave received at Midway Atoll is consistent with the radiation from a
horizontal dipole located at the altitude of the maximum Hall conductivity variation
(created by modulated HF heating) and radiating ~4–32 W. The HF-ELF conversion
efficiency at HAARP is thus estimated to be ~0.0004–0.0032% for the 2125 Hz wave
generated using sinusoidal amplitude modulation.

www.dtic.mil...

While more power can be applied to the signal there is a saturation effect. It doesn't matter how much power you put into it beyond a certain point.

For modulation depths less than 100%, the dependence of ELF/VLF amplitude on average HF power is investigated, yielding an optimal average HF power level which maximizes the observed ELF/VLF amplitude. Observations of ELF/VLF amplitude saturation under a large range of geomagnetic conditions indicate that the identified saturation process occurs on a regular basis.

gradworks.umi.com...

Do you really think that 30 watts is "high energy". Even if the HF-ELF conversion were 1000 times more efficient than it is, the most powerful ELF signal it could produce would be something like 32kW. There are natural and manmade sources of ELF/VLF radiation which are much more powerful than that. HAARP is a terrible way to produce ELF waves. 0.003%!

No, HAARP cannot create earthquakes. BTW, the frequencies used by fish finders start at about 38kHz. Unless you have a very unusual hearing range you won't hear it (but your dog can).


edit on 5/20/2011 by Phage because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 03:54 AM
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So many defenders of HAARP has to make you wonder why...

Also, there are many "HAARP like" facilities we know very little about..

I just wonder why Governments around the world are spending $billions on these places and what are they actually doing?



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 04:13 AM
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reply to post by backinblack
 




So many defenders of HAARP has to make you wonder why...


I guess there's many who know what HAARP is actually capable of doing.



Also, there are many "HAARP like" facilities we know very little about..


Selective ignorance comes to mind...just because someone doesn't know much about something doesn't mean little is known about it.



I just wonder why Governments around the world are spending $billions on these places and what are they actually doing?


The budget of these facilities is tiny in comparison to most other government spendings.

And we've been over this before...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Selective ignorance.

:shk:



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 04:34 AM
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reply to post by Chadwickus
 


The thread you linked to answers NOTHING about the other facilities..
No costings, no abilities....

Deny ignorance???
Maybe give it a try..



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 05:41 AM
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reply to post by backinblack
 


And as I said there, the information is available, you just gotta go find it.

so don't preach to me about denying ignorance when you're being lazy and choosing to be ignorant.



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 05:32 PM
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Originally posted by Chadwickus
reply to post by backinblack
 


And as I said there, the information is available, you just gotta go find it.
so don't preach to me about denying ignorance when you're being lazy and choosing to be ignorant.


But being ignorant sometimes means believing everything you read..
There's so much we are NOT told..

What are the US bases in Australia for Chad?
What are their capabilities?

If you can't give me a full run down on them then it's obvious we don't know everything in regards to these facilities.



posted on May, 20 2011 @ 05:46 PM
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Originally posted by backinblack

Originally posted by Chadwickus
reply to post by backinblack
 


And as I said there, the information is available, you just gotta go find it.
so don't preach to me about denying ignorance when you're being lazy and choosing to be ignorant.


But being ignorant sometimes means believing everything you read..
There's so much we are NOT told..

What are the US bases in Australia for Chad?
What are their capabilities?

If you can't give me a full run down on them then it's obvious we don't know everything in regards to these facilities.


Please link me to at least 3 other HAARP like facilities. I'll be eagerly awaiting your response.



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