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Obama Just Said that 'Welfare' Made This Country Great...While Trying to Quote Lincoln...

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posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 03:43 AM
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Originally posted by fredvcall
You did notice that Obama didn't dare try to quote Reagan during this speech.

Anyway, Obama is right now making a campaign speech....which has absolutely nothing to do with reducing the deficit.........where he subliminally/supraliminally promises that if re-elected in 2012, he will continue to push for everything he believes has made America great: which is more welfare.

Hmmmm. So far all the welfare programs are failing. Including FDR's social security programs. It's taken a while, but Socialism is failing BIG time in America.

Entrepreneurs and industrialists are taking their talents to other countries. There are fewer and fewer jobs in America.

Welfare is balancing on Monopoly money. You can pass GO all you want, cause two hundred dollars in Monopoly money won't get you much.

In the Obama/Soros plan, the rich get richer, while the poor get poorer.
Where is your link? and you can not Quote yourself to start a thread!




posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 03:52 AM
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reply to post by Afterl1fe
 


Why not vote for a 3rd party though? Dont just throw your vote away, there are plenty of 3rd party candidates and if everyone who didnt vote voted for ne of them you could have a more unknown person in who hasn't been corrupted



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 04:01 AM
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You know there is another aspect of this that is over looked...
It is the idea that there are many option available to repair the economy.
I question why the proposed solutions are aimed at

The most vulnerable in the society
Specifically Senior Citizens and Retarded/TBI/Para/abused and Quad people
These are very people who are going to be destroyed by this CHOICE
to put corporate tax cuts above benefit for the people who are not by any standard
free loaders. This argument has become so distorted you fail to even have the
compunction to consider who gets dinged HARD by this GOP campaign.
This society is a great one
Because we do not let our old people eat cat food,
Because we don't throw retarded people on the street

I think this a far better way to protect LIFE, life is more than simple biology



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 04:47 AM
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reply to post by meeneecat
 


Yes I do think you are a bit on the communist side, even if you do not realize it. But, let's talk about some real things, instead of this knee jerk cussing me out and going all ballistic. I must have hit a nerve, and it is obvious that having Russian girlfriend does not make you an expert in Russian history or economics. I also have Russian acquantances. Mostly dance instructors and professionals. My instructor happened to have told me how the mafia now runs business in Russian. His words, not mine. He's from Astrakhan. But I digress, perhaps I should have cited my source on the centralized control of the means of production, which is communism, and what former Soviet Union had. My source is the DeVry University textbook on Economics, the exact title which escapes me at present, and later I will check it. But basically, the concept is that when all the means of production is centrally controlled by govt, the supply chain goes out of balance, because the govt cannot predict the demand of the market for the products on such a mass level. The disruption of the supply chain meant that goods were not always available.
Now if you really want to argue this point, I happen to remember the headlines about the lines for bread and other items. I also remember the heroic leadership of Lech Walensa in Poland around that time as well. I also remember how the US had to subsidize grain for Russia because their production of grains had gotten so out of kilter.
Whereas Glasnost and Perestroika in the 80s are thought to have been behind the breakup of the former Soviet empire, en.wikipedia.org... the centralized control of production had actually failed as a system. Communism is both an ideology and a system of economics. Perhaps your gf grew up during the rocky transition phase from complete centralized control to more market forces and privatization. Here is an excellent article defining some of these changes. www.mongabay.com...
It sesems our own govt wants to pattern things after Russia for some reason, only going in the opposite direction, that is more centralized control and nationalization of industry, while the inflationary apparatus is still working. But remember, even the US has been slowly cooking the frog for decades. The US also engages in price controls, so if you want to pick a fight, we have not been on an entirely free enterprise system. But seems POTUS wants us more on the old Soviet model.
edit on 14-4-2011 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 05:02 AM
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reply to post by meeneecat
 


Ok how about pictures of the lines in the Soviet Union from 1983 before the dissolution of the Empire www.realussr.com...

Pictures worth a thousand words dont you think?

In the Soviet times there was a great short­age of all con­sumer prod­ucts. Clothes or food were no excep­tion. In order to buy some bread peo­ple were ready to spend hours and hours queu­ing up.


More references to the Bread Lines www.infrastructurist.com...

nazret.com...



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 05:04 AM
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reply to post by Janky Red
 


You really like to glorify communism/Marxism don't you? Got a picture of Che in your apartment? Or Lenin? Karl Marx?



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 06:15 AM
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Originally posted by Janky Red

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by Question Fate
 


nope the rich didn't break it and welfare hasn't made this country great it what has destroyed it .

just how and where do you think all the wealth came from? welfare recipients?

yeah all my rich buddies are the reason why

you have a job
you can go get a loan
you can have all those cool little things that you just cant live without like the computer your using and the internet so you can hate on them.


without the rich you would be living in a cave,playing with sticks, with no food and no clothes.

or do you think everything you have comes from the welfare state?


Why are so enamored with the rich?

BTW this country was fine for decade with much higher tax rates and the same social programs in place, explain that please?


Greed has infected the nation.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 06:36 AM
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Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus
I must have hit a nerve,

You are the one that attacked me with the ad hominems. My asking you for actual evidence based on reality and not the fantasy in your head or talking points from the tee-vee is not "hitting a nerve". It's called "not giving a pass to people who want to spout disinfo and bs theories about economics and government policy without any thing to substantiate their claims. I guess asking for actual evidence "hit a nerve" huh?

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorusYes I do think you are a bit on the communist side, even if you do not realize it. But, let's talk about some real things, instead of this knee jerk cussing me out and going all ballistic.

Funny because I, just checked back in the thread and you were the one who first started in on the ad hominems. My response was merely a "satire" of your own logic that you used to attack me...it was not "knee-jerk" or "cussing"...and I even specifically hinted at this by saying "see I can use your logic too"...it was a parody of the absurdity of the logic in your comment. The fact that I was being tongue-in-cheek / satirical was meant to poke fun at the fact that you were the one being completely serious in your incredible leaps of logic.

But yes, let's talk about some real things. I'd like to know some of the "real things" I said in any of my posts in this thread, that leads you to believe that I am "on the communist side"...and that apparently I just don't "realize it".


Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus
and it is obvious that having Russian girlfriend does not make you an expert in Russian history or economics.

Yes, because this is exactly what I claimed in my last post. Obviously.

Here's a novel idea...let's look at the post in question in which you make some of these assertions for which I asked for "evidence" of.

Apparently, you along with POTUS and his commie friends did not learn the lesson of the failures of the Soviet Union in their experiment with centralization of the means of production.

I'll say this again (although I hate repeating myself). Please provide specific examples of this "commie" policy that the president has enacted. Please provide examples of these "commie friends" in his administration and specifically the "commie" policies that they have enacted in their respective gov't bureaus / departments. If the POTUS supposedly "did not learn the lesson of the failures of the Soviet Union in their experiment with centralization of means of production...please elaborate. Where in U.S. policy over the last 2 1/2 years has there been an implementation of the "centralization of the means of production". Again, specifically what policies enacted are requiring "centralization of the means of production" and in what sectors of the economy.

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorusMy instructor happened to have told me how the mafia now runs business in Russian. His words, not mine. He's from Astrakhan.

You have any proof, examples for this? Or just "some guy told you" and you decided to blindly accept what he's saying because it supports your personal view of the world. Hmm.

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorusBut I digress, perhaps I should have cited my source on the centralized control of the means of production, which is communism, and what former Soviet Union had. My source is the DeVry University textbook on Economics, the exact title which escapes me at present, and later I will check it. But basically, the concept is that when all the means of production is centrally controlled by govt, the supply chain goes out of balance, because the govt cannot predict the demand of the market for the products on such a mass level. The disruption of the supply chain meant that goods were not always available.

Yes perhaps you should cite some sources...which is what I have been asking you for. Why do you believe, and what evidence do you have that the "means of production is centrally controlled by the gov't" in the U.S. Specifically which sectors of the U.S. economy are centrally controlled by the U.S. government and which policies have been enacted by this "commie" president that reflect that.

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorusNow if you really want to argue this point,

No, actually what I really want is for you to provide you reasons and evidence as to why these assertions you are making are true as opposed to some dogmatic fantasy in your head. YOU are the one that brought this subject up by asserting that both myself the president and his "friends" were a bunch of "commies" that "did not learn the lesson of the failures of the Soviet Union in their experiment with centralization of the means of production." and then somehow made the great "logical" leap from that statement to "Or you are just too young to remember stories of those long bread lines" and something about Pete Seeger being my "hero". Are you serious?

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorusIt sesems our own govt wants to pattern things after Russia for some reason, only going in the opposite direction, that is more centralized control and nationalization of industry, while the inflationary apparatus is still working.

Where do you draw this conclusion from that the government is "patterning things after Russia". Specifically. Examples. Which policies...and what specifically is being "centrally controlled". Which industries had Obama "nationalized". How does the U.S. economy in any way resemble a centrally planned economy. Evidence please.

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorusBut seems POTUS wants us more on the old Soviet model.

He said this? How do you know he wants to base the U.S. on "the old Societ Model"? Hmmm?

Until you can provide some verifiable, objective, evidence for these wild claims of yours, they are, until then, unproven, unsubstantiated, in essence, a fantasy of your own making...much like McCarthyism in the 60's...and everyone knows that if you disagree with McCarthy in any way you were by default a dirty commie.
Continue on with your witch hunting and scapegoating.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 06:56 AM
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reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus
 

Seriously, a link to an article entitled "Why American Traffic Jams are like Soviet Bread Lines"? Did you even read your own article. So, basically you are advocating "congestion pricing" and other forms of road tolls.


Currently, we ration traffic capacity the same way the old Soviet Union rationed bread–by having everyone wait in line. It’s a wasteful way to allocate bread, and it’s a wasteful way to allocate scarce road space at rush hour. Pricing the roads to reduce peak volumes even slightly–by encouraging those with flexible schedules to take the trip at some other time, go by another mode, or forego the trip altogether–makes the system work better for everyone else and actually increases its capacity.

The technology for implementing road pricing is already in hand and has been implemented around the country through “fast pass” electronic tolling. Large scale demonstrations of road pricing have had a significant effect on congestion in London and Stockholm.


As if "traffic" is anything even remotely like "bread lines".



But the bigger question is what this has to do with anything? How is that even relevant to your original claims about how the POTUS is a "commie" who is trying to model the U.S. after the old Soviet model / centrally planned economy. (or is this some type of breadline-pete seeger "logic", like you used in your previous post) I already posted a reply to all the other claims that you made. So lets see you back this all up with something real.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 08:13 AM
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reply to post by fredvcall
 


Entrepreneurs and industrialists are taking their talents to other countries. There are fewer and fewer jobs in America.

Yes they are taking jobs to other countries, but they are paying workers very low wages in those countries and are basically exploiting them and their countries, and at the same time are making huge profits. So it is a win win situation for American entrepreneurs.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 08:17 AM
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Free trade did the deed, as soon as Reagon,used his evil wizard pen, the automaker's were the first to go, and nobody said a word. exept for, it will never get to my job?and then were in a show time, of everything is good, then Cheney and the jew's, along with Marvin Bush, blew up trade center's 1,2,7, and crashed two milatary jets painted to look like passenger jet's for effect, and that was the end of america as we know it happened, either we get off are butt's and take the country back, or turn into an automatron zombie's, and watch fake new's and read made up blog's, on the net, unplug dont become a bug.and most of all give someone in need a hug.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 08:40 AM
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Originally posted by Whereweheaded
reply to post by Dwigt
 


What else I find amusing, that most liberals do not wish to address, is the fact that the top 2% of the richest pay the most in annual taxes....but we need to tax them even more. Where is that logic? if the middle class paid the most in taxes, and we were told we may have to pay more, we would be pissed too. But we dont want to discuss that.


There is new data for 2001. The share of total income taxes paid by the top 1% fell to 33.89% from 37.42% in 2000. This is mainly because their income share (not just wages) fell from 20.81% to 17.53%. However, their average tax rate actually rose slightly from 27.45% to 27.50%.


www.taxfoundation.org...


The top 1 percent of taxpayers paid 33.7 percent of all individual income taxes in 2002. This group of taxpayers has paid more than 30 percent of individual income taxes since 1995. Moreover, since 1990 this group’s tax share has grown faster than their income share.






It's really quite simple, if they have most of the money...who else has the room to pay?



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 08:46 AM
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For the people who throw around the terms Marxist, Commie, Socialist: If benevolent aliens arrived on Earth today, what type of society do you think they would have? What economic plan would they be using? Do you suppose it would be a capitalist society? I wonder how much they spent for the fuel it took to get here? I wonder are they distracted when they're here because they're facing foreclosure when they get home?

What type of society are they living under, Capitalism or some form of Socialism? Answer that question and then rethink your views on Commies/Socialists and ascertain which system is really primitive and savage.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 08:53 AM
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reply to post by fredvcall
 


Yes I see all the poor recipients of the welfar system pulling up to the office to sign up in the lexus's and the what not.

I should go down to the local office and take some pictures of the scammers.

One thing to be a single mom out of work with a dead beat ex.

but some of the people down there are scammers.

Go get a job you lazy bums.

I see them all the time.

How can one be broke and on welfare and be a very fat person.

Go to any other country and usually the poor are malnurished.

Nooooo not here.

They eat out every night and drive around in a BMW or Lexus and sit on the porch all day and drink beers.

I understand that some need assistance when diasaster stikes.

But to this extent the poloticians should all be fired and we should start over.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 09:08 AM
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Originally posted by Whereweheaded
What else I find amusing, that most liberals do not wish to address, is the fact that the top 2% of the richest pay the most in annual taxes....but we need to tax them even more. Where is that logic?


The logic comes in when you put your talking points aside and do some actual math and a little bit of real thought.
If I make $35,000 a year and pay 35% taxes then I contribute $12,000 in tax dollars.
If I make $84.5 Million dollars a year and pay 18% taxes then I contribute $15,210,000 in tax dollars.

Obviously you can say the second one pays the most taxes but is it at all proportional?

Would you suggest that I use up more resources with my Dodge than the CEO of Viacom does with his private jet? Do you thin I enjoy the protection of the US military more or less than a billionaire CEO of a major multinational corporation? Do the police and fire pay more attention the person making $35,000 a year or the billionaire that sponsors all those policeman's grandstanding backpatting events?

Yeah, technically the richest pay the most taxes unfotunately the reality of numbers goes a long way to point out how they are raping America and sticking the middle class with the bill. What you call asking them to pay more, many of us like to remind you is actually just asking them to pay their fair share. How they trick people like you into standing up for them paying less in taxes than even yourself will always confuse me.
edit on 14-4-2011 by Sinnthia because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 09:12 AM
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Originally posted by clintdelicious
reply to post by Afterl1fe
 


Why not vote for a 3rd party though? Dont just throw your vote away, there are plenty of 3rd party candidates and if everyone who didnt vote voted for ne of them you could have a more unknown person in who hasn't been corrupted


The Tea Party is alive and well, regardless of the obituaries that MSNBC and CNN are attempting to write. The Tea Party is getting a might upset with the Republicans who are not up to snuff for the job that needs to be done.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 09:18 AM
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Originally posted by illuminazislayer
reply to post by fredvcall
 


Entrepreneurs and industrialists are taking their talents to other countries. There are fewer and fewer jobs in America.

Yes they are taking jobs to other countries, but they are paying workers very low wages in those countries and are basically exploiting them and their countries, and at the same time are making huge profits. So it is a win win situation for American entrepreneurs.


And there's no argument that the wealthy entrepreneurs are making even more money under the Obama regime by taking their capital and resources to other countries, leaving grumpy American workers even grumpier.

There's no argument that wealthy entrepreneurs are maintaining private police and militarily trained security forces for their protection.

There's no argument that the wealthy have underground condominiums in preparation for whatever civil war 2012 has to throw at them.

So what? There's nothing you can do to stop them. The best you can do is become more like them. Be better prepared for any calamities ahead. Sitting around wringing a crying towel isn't going to do much for you, is it? Feeling sorry for the shiftless who are waiting for Big Brother to board them onto an imaginary gigantic arc of a space ship to take them to the promised land is only going to set you back in your preparations.

Unless you are planning on joining the Peace Corp to spend the rest of your alloted time trying to save those who can't save themselves.

But, you have free will. Go for it.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 09:21 AM
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Originally posted by Rocky Black
reply to post by fredvcall
 


Yes I see all the poor recipients of the welfar system pulling up to the office to sign up in the lexus's and the what not.

I should go down to the local office and take some pictures of the scammers.

One thing to be a single mom out of work with a dead beat ex.

but some of the people down there are scammers.

Go get a job you lazy bums.

I see them all the time.

How can one be broke and on welfare and be a very fat person.

Go to any other country and usually the poor are malnurished.

Nooooo not here.

They eat out every night and drive around in a BMW or Lexus and sit on the porch all day and drink beers.

I understand that some need assistance when diasaster stikes.

But to this extent the poloticians should all be fired and we should start over.



And there we have the welfare liberal socialist game plan to make people feel guilty that there are the scammers that we are not properly taking care of in due course.

Sorry, scammers. I have my family, friends and myself to take care of today and tomorrow. The scammers are not on my shopping list. I DO NOT feel guilty for the people living on the streets selling drugs on street corners in between cashing their food stamp allotments.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 09:24 AM
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Originally posted by Donkey_Dean
reply to post by fredvcall
 


There are plenty of democratic capitalist countries with no social services. Lagos is an excellent example! We do not keep people out of the dirt because it is the humane thing to do, we do it to maintain a certain standard of living for us all. They will bring us all down with shanty towns/Tin Cities an Americans will starve on the streets etc. Attacks on medicare, medicaid and our social services are direct attacks upon our living standards.

IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH OBAMA!

These is fighting words friend! I will fight and die is need be to defend the American way of life I hold so dear, many millions will fight as well! If its war you want just tread a little further!
edit on 14-4-2011 by Donkey_Dean because: (no reason given)



Oh, yes. It would be a Utopian world if everyone said, "I do not want war today. Everyone will act civil and not try to steal from me or kill me."

Very Utopian, indeed.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 09:29 AM
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Originally posted by Sinnthia

Originally posted by fredvcall
What kind of person would study to be poor? Except those on welfare who are raking in big bucks.


That is the most interesting sentence I have ever read. People study to be poor so they can get on welfare to rake in big bucks???? Um what? If they are raking in big bucks, they what happened to them studying to be poor? If welfare makes people rich, why are we not all giving up our homes, cars, healthcare to go live in a shelter and get rich like them?


Like I said, watch the John Stossel report. Stossel had a makeup artist fix him to look like a homeless person. He sat on the sidewalk collecting collecting a hundred dollars per day, tax free. Their cameras followed panhandlers from the streets to their suburban homes, because they were making easier money panhandling, rather than getting a job. Being on welfare has become a profession. Not a need.

stossel.blogs.foxbusiness.com...



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