The big scientific problem with the idea of Creationism

Originally posted by Anastasia
Evolution to Creation, Part 1: Evolution to Creation - Answers in Genesis
www.answersingenesis.org...

This is a four part video series which makes an excellent viewing.

Excellent.

Everyone is creationist. We all see the evidence of creation. Atheists, are just angry about it. That is what I meant in my
posting of John 8:47

I also said, "I can't make you see, what God has said You will not see". For there are non so blind I might add to that.

Originally posted by randyvs

Originally posted by Anastasia
Evolution to Creation, Part 1: Evolution to Creation - Answers in Genesis
www.answersingenesis.org...

This is a four part video series which makes an excellent viewing.

Excellent.

Until you read the mission statement of the place he taught at

We believe in the Genesis account of creation and that it is to be accepted literally, and not allegorically or figuratively; that man was created directly in God’s own image and after His own likeness; that man’s creation was not a matter of evolution or evolutionary change of species...

Which scientifically speaking is complete and utter nonsense

More funny statements

The Master Life program is a one year program for Christian students who think their future vocations may be in something other than church work. The Master Life certificate student can choose his or her own general education courses (like math, history, and English), and receive a quality education from a Christian perspective. We’ve had students from Boston Baptist go on to careers in nursing, education, law enforcement and business. During the first year on your own, we’ll help you settle one thing intellectually as well as spiritually: JESUS is the Master of your life and your mind. Before you hit a secular campus where many professors will critique your Christian faith, before you live in an environment that challenges Christian values at every turn, before you go there, come here.

You might also wanna read the accreditation section carefully. Only one accreditation is worth mentioning (CHEA). That's until you check exactly how they are accredited...clue: Not in the same way Harvard is

Institutional Accreditation by the Transnational Association of Christian Colleges and Schools (TRACS), Accreditation Commission. Please click on the accrediting organization link for the specific dates of the accreditation.

LINK

reply to post by john_bmth


Yet again, a belief in God does not have to provide any answers at all. The belief in God serves ONE PURPOSE and one purpose only and that is the salvation of the soul. It does not even begin to state anywhere, in ANY manuscript, anything about any other purpose other than this!

Something that isn't supposed to provide scientific answers doesnt...... OH NO BIG SURPRISE(sarcasm)!

What the hell do you expect? Seriously?

You're looking for scientific answers in something that isn't a scientific handbook. If I wanted scientific answers I'd ask a scientist. If I want religious answers, I'd ask my local clergy. Two different questions, two different answers. You can't expect to ask a scientist a religious question and get the appropriate answer nor can you expect to ask a clergyman a question and receive a scientific answer, he will undoubtedly give you a religious answer, as the scientist will give you a scientific answer.

Does this make sense yet? Ask a scientist, and you get a scientific answer. Ask a clergyman, and you get a religious answer. Ask a dog and you'll get a bark. Ask a cat and you'll get a meow. Honestly, you can't expect anything more than these answers from their respectable sources....it just makes sense.

A2D

reply to post by Agree2Disagree


I don't know if i totally agree. Many people also try and see the scientific truth of creationism when they read Genesis chapter 1 and 2. Because there must be some scientific grounds to explain creation from start to present time.

How people believe and what people believe also depends on how they approach the subject. Many people think that God is a deity that does magical wonders that science can't explain.

Personally i don't think God did any magical wonders. Its just that Moses was a very poor teacher and writer who didn't have the knowledge needed to make our age comprehend what he had on he's mind.

People of our age have to fill in the blanks which Moses didn't have the knowledge to explain. This is where math and science comes into the picture. We have the ability to fill in the missing knowledge and make it more understandable.

Our problem is that we will rather use our knowledge to judge what Moses wrote instead of filling in the missing pieces.
Our goal as it seams is to prove him wrong for all its worth. That is what we use our knowledge for "as it seams". Because, if we can use our knowledge to comment and argue on what he wrote we can assume that there is no God.

That is how i see the conclusion of most bright people who have looked into this subject. But i ask my self: is that the right way to make a conclusion?

reply to post by spy66


Why did it take God such a long amount of time to inscribe a stone tablet? 40 days and 40 nights to make a puny inscription in a stone tablet? Seems to me that Moses was up on the mountain chiseling those tablets out himself with his own hand and claimed that God made it.

reply to post by idonotcollectstamps


God has no hands himself, he uses us humans to veiw the world. He speaks through people and sees the world through our eyes. Although really it is the other way around, when we know god, we know it has always been his eyes and ears that see and hear.

reply to post by madness mysoul

When it is seen that everything is being created from nothing in this very instant, this is awe inspiring.
Created though is not the right word. When it is seen that everything appears from nothing and disappears to nothing, it will blow your mind.
It is obvious that 'things' appear to be here and then they disappear, although we have been hypnotized into thinking 'things' are solid and real. 'Things' as such are no more than mirages, rainbows, illusions. Quantum physics are in the process of discovering this.
The only 'thing' that is a constant fact is the seer of the mirages, rainbows and illusions.

Science will beable to tell us of this act of creation (appearance and disappearance) in scientific words soon.
Unfortunately though there is no profit from knowing the truth, well not in monetary terms any way. Looking and searching always comes with a price, that price is in pain and suffering (people and money).

When the truth is seen no more is needed as it is obvious that everything is provided. There is nothing left for us to do because it is seen that everything is being done.
All that is required is to sit back and enjoy the show.

I think contentment and peace are the more important than raping the world.
I think there is a great benefit in seeing the truth.

reply to post by Itisnowagain

Originally posted by Itisnowagain
reply to post by madness mysoul

 

When it is seen that everything is being created from nothing in this very instant, this is awe inspiring.
Created though is not the right word. When it is seen that everything appears from nothing and disappears to nothing, it will blow your mind.
It is obvious that 'things' appear to be here and then they disappear, although we have been hypnotized into thinking 'things' are solid and real. 'Things' as such are no more than mirages, rainbows, illusions. Quantum physics are in the process of discovering this.
The only 'thing' that is a constant fact is the seer of the mirages, rainbows and illusions.

...I hate it when people who aren't quantum physicists talk definitively about quantum physics. I do like how you're shifting the goal posts on 'creation' to make it so that the existence of virtual particles would definitively prove your assertion about creation...except that this isn't a prediction of creationism. You're also not being very clear in explaining your ideas.

Science will beable to tell us of this act of creation (appearance and disappearance) in scientific words soon.
Unfortunately though there is no profit from knowing the truth, well not in monetary terms any way. Looking and searching always comes with a price, that price is in pain and suffering (people and money).

...actually, scientific research has quite a lot of profit. Understanding the world around us allows us to manipulate that world.

When the truth is seen no more is needed as it is obvious that everything is provided.

Says the person ignorant of the scientific method. Science is about testing and retesting.

There is nothing left for us to do because it is seen that everything is being done.
All that is required is to sit back and enjoy the show.

Typical Abrahamic hatred of science.

I think contentment and peace are the more important than raping the world.

The contentment and peace that you are able to enjoy only exists because of scientific progress...the same progress that you seek to limit. Without modern technology you would likely be toiling or dead.

I think there is a great benefit in seeing the truth.

Yes, there is. Of course, the truth can only be determined via reason.

reply to post by Itisnowagain


So an omnipotent being can't give itself hands or other limbs? So much for omnipotence...

reply to post by Itisnowagain

God has no hands himself,

But I thought he created humans in his image and the last time I checked, pretty much everyone has hands

Originally posted by Griffo
reply to post by Itisnowagain

 

God has no hands himself,

But I thought he created humans in his image and the last time I checked, pretty much everyone has hands

Maybe they're the Devil's contribution? After all, "the devil makes use for idle hands".

reply to post by john_bmth

Maybe they're the Devil's contribution?

So the devil created (arguably) the most useful parts of the human body? But according to the bible, which I presume you believe, god created everything

Originally posted by Griffo
reply to post by john_bmth

 

Maybe they're the Devil's contribution?

So the devil created (arguably) the most useful parts of the human body? But according to the bible, which I presume you believe, god created everything

But the Devil's the good guy, in my country he'd have God's ass in court for libel. At the end of the day, it's God's word against his, and I don't see the Devil demanding first born's as sacrifice. Just goes to show what good PR can do for you.

Originally posted by idonotcollectstamps
reply to post by spy66

 

Why did it take God such a long amount of time to inscribe a stone tablet? 40 days and 40 nights to make a puny inscription in a stone tablet? Seems to me that Moses was up on the mountain chiseling those tablets out himself with his own hand and claimed that God made it.

I agree. Why would God take such a long time to make the stone tablets.

Moses probably made the stone tablets himself. I am not going to argue that, I wasn't there to witness the event.

As i said, a lot of people think that God does magic. But i don't.

reply to post by spy66


Simple answer: It doesn't have to make sense...or be supported by facts for that matter...all your require is blind ignorant belief

reply to post by Faith2011


You're quoting the wrong Ten Commandments. Please refer yourself to Exodus 34 which are the commandments that Moses didn't destroy the first time. They aren't all the same ones that you just quoted.

Originally posted by MrXYZ
reply to post by spy66

 

Simple answer: It doesn't have to make sense...or be supported by facts for that matter...all your require is blind ignorant belief

I agree, some people have no clue as to what they have put their faith in. Because they don't coexist with my faith Get it?

Some don't even try to look for answers.

A lot of people think that all the answers to their questions are found on the Internet and believe them all to be facts. Hint hint = religion .)

A lot of people think that they personally understand everything that they read, and that every one else is wrong.

Which one are you?

Originally posted by Aggie Man
If a creator created the universe, then who created the creator? If the creator spontaneously came to be, then why is it not possible that the universe spontaneously came to be? If both options are equally as probable, then I will go with the universe spontaneously coming to be, as there is absolute evidence of the universe, but zero evidence of a creator.

my 2-cents

it's not about that though, at least for me. both options are equally as probable, but our technology and understanding of the things around us remain limited, why not keep the option open that with time and the evolution of the mind and technology, we may perhaps discover evidence of a higher intelligence creating us and/or the universe. we haven't explored anything outside of our planet.. and even so, this planet has had some unexplainable things occur. the manifestation of unexplained events that present themselves, yet science cannot accurately measure them due to our current abilities to comprehend certain elements of the universe. all i'm saying is, don't jump the gun until our species has progressed a bit more. when we're able to artificially create a human and still have no proof of a creator then take a definite stance, but why be so adamant when it comes to denying something that can potentially bring joy to humanity amongst other beings?

reply to post by BastianCain

Originally posted by Aggie Man:
If a creator created the universe, then who created the creator?

If you read this, it clearly spells out that this person has no clue as to what he is talking about.

A creator/dimension who is infinite can't be created/formed or destroyed. It always existed.

A finite universe/dimension on the other hand can be created/formed, and it can be destroyed. But the energy that "is" the finite universe can not be destroyed.

The problem the author of this topic has, is that he doesn't understand the difference between infinite and finite.

Because there is a saying that goes:

The total energy contained in an object is identified with its mass, and energy (like mass), cannot be created or destroyed.

He clearly thinks that finite is infinite. That is because he doesn't know the difference between a object/dimension and the energy that formed the object/dimension.

If he knew about compression and expansion i bet he would understand that a finite object/dimension can be created (We create different objects all the time), but the energy the object is built up by can not be destroyed (we can destroy the object/dimension, but not the energy it is built up of), because it belongs to the infinite dimension which can't be destroyed.

reply to post by BastianCain

we haven't explored anything outside of our planet

Oh and all those trips to the moon; space probes to various planets; voyager 1 and 2 which are at the edges of the solar system and Mars rovers don't count, I suppose?