Israeli schoolbus hit with anti-tank weapon fired from Gaza, critically wounding teen

reply to post by Josephus23

As usual, Josephus, you entirely miss the point.

Now since I know that no one is that stupid, this has to be an intentional ignoring of principles on your part.

Ignorance is not a virtue, nor is skewing additional fluff for the purpose of not addressing the core issue.

Fact: When Israel is shot at and their people are killed, and others have been warned for weeks to stop - or suffer retaliation - they're going to shoot back.

Now, what part of shooting back are you really having trouble with, here?

reply to post by CountDrac

The Gaza Strip is a 100-square-mile area along the Mediterranean that Israel has occupied since 1967's Six-Day War. About 40% of the area is home to 2,200 Israeli settlers. Crammed into the remaining space are 650,000 Palestinian Arabs, making the Gaza Strip among the most densely populated sites on Earth. More than half of Gaza's population is under age 20 and has known only Israeli rule. That rule, never quietly accepted, is again being violently protested. Israel's response has been an excess of force that the U.S. and other governments have rightfully condemned.

pqasb.pqarchiver.com...:FT&type=current&date=Dec+16%2C+1987&author=&pub=Los+Angeles+Times+(pre-1997+ Fulltext)&edition=&startpage=12&desc=The+Fallacy+of+the+Gaza+Strip

Yeah how quickly they forget and lie and distort the history.

I am about creeped out enough for one day, excuse me while I go vomit please.

reply to post by jackflap


I'm not talking about some nebulous contrasting over emotional crap or whatever you're trying to argue around the key point.

Don't shoot at Israel.

They won't shoot back.

Dayum!

reply to post by SpeachM1litant


what part of "unintentionally" you didnt understand. I served there in the hardest time about 10 years ago. Its War and War sucks. But the rules and effort that was put in place to avoid hurting children or civilians was insane.

And keep it mind this was at a time when Muslim Suicide bombers intentionally used to target children and civilian buses. You want me to show you an Israel documentary of the children and civilians without limbs from these attacks over 10 years?

Spare me the BS. War is war and people who never served or experienced it can only judge from afar or by the pictures.

War demoralizes both sides and there is no right and wrong. But there is a line of ethics in war. A line that the US, Israeli and Western armies try not to cross, while Muslim terrorist and armies cross all the time with both their enemies and their own people.

How do you expect Hamas to be civilized when after they took over Gaza from the PLO they killed them by beating them to death with hummers and throwing them off their buildings?

How can you expect Iran to be civilized when they torture and kill their own civilians who oppose the religious government?

How can you expect Syria to be a civilized army when even today Syrian civilians died because the army shot live ammunition at them?

You get my point dude. You can only expect an army to be as moral as it is to its own people. Luckily the west like the American and Israeli army treats their own people differently.

That aside from the fact that the Israeli army is not a paid army likes most places. It’s an army of civilians who have to serve a month a year. People forget that.

The army is made of bunkers, lawyers, schoolteachers and professors with children who once a year must serve for a few weeks. And the rest is composed of 18-year-old western kids who just finished high school and want to smoke pot, and are dragged into three years of service.

Hardly material for an evil army

reply to post by FarArcher


And what is that core issue FarArcher?

Israeli or Palestinian parents who put their children in harms way are horrible parents, but what kind of choice is left for the residents of Gaza?

The link that I provided, which you very obviously did not read, points to the number of deaths of Israeli versus Palestinian children.
A number that shows that many, many more children have been murdered by Israeli terrorists than by Palestinian terrorists.

And the vast majority of those Palestinian deaths came because children in Gaza are being denied healthcare.

Or should I say, they were denied the ability to leave Gaza in order to find adequate health care.

Tell me FarArcher, how exactly does that not constitute at the very least manslaughter charges?

You see, if you would take the time to calm down your adrenal gland and think rationally about this subject then you would see that the vast number of innocent children who are dying are not "collateral damage", as you have insinuated, but intentional deaths.

If a child is locked in an open air prison and denied proper health care after they have been diagnosed with a chronic illness then denying them healthcare is nothing short of murder.

Please, please, please, please, please... I am very anxious to hear your rationale for this.

reply to post by Josephus23


Joesephus these aren't rational people they are all militant fascists promoting the lies of a police state.

You can see how they circle and gang to promote and tell lies, to attempt to bully and defame and slander people.

Most of them are involved in the killing process and love it and enjoy it because they make their livings and profit off of it.

They are here to tell lies and sing praises to themselves.

They aren't capable of honest debate or answering questions honestly, they are here to safequard their myths and stories, to manipulate the people of the world, and try to validate themselves through any obscene measure they can.

They are beyond any measure of reason, they have no self respect, and they have no respect for anyone else either.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


I have read and saw everything that you have but also Experienced it for three years.

You are just an angry old man who is a racist. You will die Angry and that is the worst thing for anyone. It’s a waist of my time to even answer you.
Let me deal with the young people who still have a chance.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


I'd like to add, that all you have to do is take a glance through B'Tselem the Israeli Centre for Human Rights in the Occupied Territories, Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International to find cases of IDF war crimes commited by soldiers in occupied Palestine.

Originally posted by CountDrac
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

I have read and saw everything that you have but also Experienced it for three years.

You are just an angry old man who is a racist. You will die Angry and that is the worst thing for anyone. It’s a waist of my time to even answer you.
Let me deal with the young people who still have a chance.

Just when I thought that the poo could not get any deeper.

How in the world can you call Proto a racist?

Because if you call him a racist, then you are calling anyone who takes a stance opposing Israel a racist.

You have been completely exposed Count Drac.

If you looked at the links that he provided, then you must either admit that you made a mistake, or stop talking about the mistake that you made.
Either way...

YOU ARE WRONG.

Look... I don't have a problem admitting when I am wrong.

And I remember earlier in the thread Proto admitting that he made a mistake.

But you have had it shown to you.
You have had your faced rubbed in the truth, but yet, you still cling to a lie.

I feel very confident that any objective reader can see who is on the irrational side of this argument.

reply to post by CountDrac


Wow, that statement is deeply hypocritical. May I remind you of your post history, especially Muslims vs Jews. Some interesting facts. Not to mention that you openly advocate imperialsim and stealing foreign resources. I can find a few instances of you being openly racist. Look through your own post history for the evidence.

Originally posted by CountDrac
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

I have read and saw everything that you have but also Experienced it for three years.

You are just an angry old man who is a racist. You will die Angry and that is the worst thing for anyone. It’s a waist of my time to even answer you.
Let me deal with the young people who still have a chance.

You mean I am someone who won't buy your reinvention of history and the insulting way you present it with deliberate lies.

Sure.

Concentrate on the young people who don't know better so you can try to brainwash them into never taking the time to find out the truth.

Good old uncle dracula, a blood sucker opportunist to the end.

reply to post by Josephus23

The core issue?

What have we been talking about? Understand English?

Don't shoot at Israel, and Israel won't shoot at you.

For the first time since Gaza was an Ottoman backwater ****hole, Israel gave them their right to govern themselves. Egypt didn't do it, the French didn't do it, and the British didn't do it.

Israel turned them loose.

And look at what they did with that self-governance. They elected a group of yahoos who don't have sense enough to get out of the rain.

Those deaths because of inadequate medical attention?

How about all those hundreds of millions that were sent to Gaza, and what did they spend the money on? Hospitals? Nope. Sewer systems? Nope. Water systems? Nope. Schools? Nope.

They used the money to smuggle in more weapons.

There comes a point in de-evolution of a group when any sane, rational, prudent human being has to look at a dumbass group and just shake their heads.

You know what? They've had opportunity after opportunity to better themselves, get peaceful, and even have an opportunity to trade with Israel as neighbors, but what do they do?

Before the border walls and such, they kept sending suicide bombers to bus stops, malls, restaurants, post offices - and killing Israeli civilians - women and children.

I really don't expect the Gazans to ever do very well.

They're not that smart.

Originally posted by SpeachM1litant
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

I'd like to add, that all you have to do is take a glance through B'Tselem the Israeli Centre for Human Rights in the Occupied Territories, Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International to find cases of IDF war crimes commited by soldiers in occupied Palestine.

Thanks my friend, I have been following this all since the 70's so I am pretty familiar with most of what's transpired.

Sadly when it comes to debating some it's not a debate, sources do no good, because they just lie and pretend it didn't happen, and then deflect away if the source is impeachable on to some other rediculous lie and or slander, and if they run out of lies to post, they just start trying to insult and discredit you.

These are our best allies by the way according to the propaganda, my word, can you imagine what our enemies must be like and think of us?

reply to post by FarArcher


Everytime that you type you expose yourself FarArcher.

I also notice that you did not address my comments on the healthcare situation in Gaza regarding children.

Innocent people in Gaza do not fire anything into Israel.
They do not have a standing Army.

Small cliques of people, or terrorist cells if you want to be Western about it, are the people firing rockets into Israel.
Homemade rockets that do no damage.

I would post more statistics, but you have shown your contempt for the truth.

You are beyond gone FarArcher.

HB Gary software is working overtime today!!

reply to post by Josephus23


what are you talking about, did you read my last post?
here it is again in case you missed it:

War demoralizes both sides and there is no right and wrong. But there is a line of ethics in war. A line that the US, Israeli and Western armies try not to cross, while Muslim terrorist and armies cross all the time with both their enemies and their own people.

How do you expect Hamas to be civilized when after they took over Gaza from the PLO they killed them by beating them to death with hummers and throwing them off their buildings?

How can you expect Iran to be civilized when they torture and kill their own civilians who oppose the religious government?

How can you expect Syria to be a civilized army when even today Syrian civilians died because the army shot live ammunition at them?

You get my point dude. You can only expect an army to be as moral as it is to its own people. Luckily the west like the American and Israeli army treats their own people differently.

That aside from the fact that the Israeli army is not a paid army likes most places. It’s an army of civilians who have to serve a month a year. People forget that.

The army is made of bunkers, lawyers, schoolteachers and professors with children who once a year must serve for a few weeks. And the rest is composed of 18-year-old western kids who just finished high school and want to smoke pot, and are dragged into three years of service.

Hardly material for an evil army

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


I agree, it is a sad state of affairs that if you rationaly and camly discuss and debate a topic, you will be slandered as a racist and anti-semite, when they have no other possible argument available.

reply to post by Josephus23


I think the other thing to consider here Josephus is that when you look back to the 1980's and the hundreds of children murdered in their teens in street confrontations between children throwing rocks and heavily armed Israeli Soldiers shooting live ammunition and rubber bullets often killing and crictically wounding up to a dozen a day for months on end that Gaza was over half children at the time.

So these kids back in the 80's standing up in the streets to Israeli occupation with nothing but stones, and dying by the scores every day at the hands of the Israeli are the 40 and 50 year olds of today who survived that and were brought up in that kind of brutral repression in the 80's by the militant Israelis.

I am sure they often think about children who will be forever children in their minds because they were murdered as children by the Israelis, kids they went to school with, kids they played games with, kids they watched die on the streets in front of their own homes gunned down by a viscious and heartless army of occupation.

The way that these lying propagandists try to whitewash and obscure history is designed to obscure the real truth of just why the Gazans really do hate the Israelis so bad.

Under blockade, denied equal rights, kept from any kind of international justice because of the corruption in our own goverment by zionists, these are people who really do have just about every reason in the world to be angry.

The make believe half a story of mostly lies these soulless jackalls tell are meant to murder the truth and manipulate us all.

reply to post by Josephus23

What is this Gary Homo thing you're talking about?

I heard Proto mention something about that last night when he was getting so angry that he kept talking around the issues, and never could get to the point without talking about Rome and finally resorted to name-calling.

Since Proto mentioned it last night, and you've mentioned it today, I guess that makes you kind of like a Proto-Lite Lite.

I would welcome any Moderator or SuperModerator to investigate me and my stars and to make the results known, which I assume would be an automatic banning.

You're just another whiner who can't stay on topic, resort to diversions and nonsense when you can't address the most simple of principles.

Tell me. Why shoot at Israel, (schoobus in this case) when Israel will shoot back?

Why start a fight - when you only threaten your children's safety?

Why create casualties, when you've spent your money on weapons and not medicines?

reply to post by CountDrac


I mean for real Drac.

Are you trying now to justify the IDF killing innocent children?

An event that you have said did not happen, but then when you were shown... EXPLICITLY... that it did happen, you now want to wax poetic about the ridiculous nature of war in order to try and spin your way out of just admitting that you were wrong.

It is easy Drac, just say "Sorry, I was wrong".

Now... How in the world can you say that Proto is a racist?

You don't knw Proto and you seem to be trying to play the race card.
And being Jewish does not equate a race. It equates a religion.

Being Israeli does not equate a race. It equates a de-facto illegal occupation.

reply to post by FarArcher


Why do people fight against occupiers? Becuase they would rather die free than live as a slave.