It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Thank you.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
Originally posted by getreadyalready
Unfortunately, I know that the short-form certificate is not valid for many sensitive positions within government, so Obama is not being held to any higher standard than any other applicant for a high security position would be.
Originally posted by Sinnthia
I would agree 100% if my question were a general, what is the glaring hole in our election process but I was specifically asking what hole Obama highlighted.
Unfortunately I find it harder to see what Obama did with this birther issue to highlight the fact that my congrsssman is not properly vetted. Get my drift?
Originally posted by Sinnthia
With all apologies to BH, I feel more justified now than before in calling a lie a lie. This statement above, put forth as fact is either wrong or a lie. You pick which or prove me wrong and humilate me.
Originally posted by Sinnthia
Originally posted by getreadyalready
Unfortunately, I know that the short-form certificate is not valid for many sensitive positions within government, so Obama is not being held to any higher standard than any other applicant for a high security position would be.
With all apologies to BH, I feel more justified now than before in calling a lie a lie. This statement above, put forth as fact is either wrong or a lie. You pick which or prove me wrong and humilate me.
Originally posted by getreadyalready
I personally know people that have had to produce more than an official short-form certificate.
Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by Sinnthia
You picked my post apart for answering your question, and then saying it was irrelavent? If it was irrelavent, why did you ask?
I said that this has served to illuminate a glaring hole. You asked what the hole was, and I pointed out the potential problems with our process, then you said none of that matters, because it is what it is?
#1. He has never satisfied the Constitutionaly requirement, no one has declared him a "natural born citizen." For whatever reason, everyone has stopped just short of making that statement, and that is why the controversy lives on. In fact some of the do-gooders that tried to help, like Hawaii's governor, actually added fuel to the fire, because they had to back off their own statements.
#2. I have stated that I do not want to see him impeached, I just want to see it fixed before the 2012 election. Officials are saying the campaigns will probably top $1 billion in spending each. That is ridiculous!! Lets eliminate one of the stupider points before the election really heats up.
#3. Whether or not it is politically correct, Obama is our first "black" president, he has a "Muslim" sounding name, while we are at war with several Muslim countries, he attended foreign schools, and he was relatively unknown before he became a candidate.
Of course he is going to fall under extra scrutiny compared to most previous presidents. It isn't fair, some of it is based off hatred and bigotry, but it is what it is, and it is to be expected. You can pretend you are blind to these things, but no one is. If there was a better system in place, then we could avoid some of these sillier arguments, but as it stands now, Obama is left to defend himself with the information he has, and unfortunately that information is not adequate at this point.
Obama is not the first president to face this scrutiny. Lincoln's bloodlines were often called into question, many people thought he was partially black, and he faced a lot of scrutiny for it. JFK had to constantly defend his Catholic faith, and declared he was running "as a Democrat, not as a Catholic," and Bush Jr. is still being criticized for the religious undertones and possible motivations for invading the Middle East. It is not a new phenomenon.
Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
You're right, Sinn. It's wrong.
Originally posted by getreadyalready
I personally know people that have had to produce more than an official short-form certificate.
I don't know exactly how to "prove" that to you, but it is a fact.
Originally posted by getreadyalready
Unfortunately, I know that the short-form certificate is not valid for many sensitive positions within government, so Obama is not being held to any higher standard than any other applicant for a high security position would be.
I have friends that currently work for the FBI, I have a friend that is an EOD specialist for the Secret Service, and I have a friend that was a special advisor to Colin Powell. Each of those sensitive positions requires much, much more than a short-form certificate. In fact, one of those people took an extra year getting hired, because what they provided was inadequate, the application was denied, and they had to go back and corroborate the information. Everyone of those positions required many months of interviews with family, friends, ex-neighbors, and even a battery of lie-detector tests!
I, myself, went through several layers of interviews with the CIA, and I know from experience what they require in the form of documentation. Just to get started, you have to list every address you have ever lived at since age 18, and at least one person unique person that knew you while you lived at that address.
If my personal experience isn't enough, then check it out for yourself. Go apply.
Originally posted by getreadyalready
I personally know people that have had to produce more than an official short-form certificate. I don't know exactly how to "prove" that to you, but it is a fact.
Originally posted by getreadyalready
Unfortunately, I know that the short-form certificate is not valid for many sensitive positions within government, so Obama is not being held to any higher standard than any other applicant for a high security position would be.
Everyone of those positions required many months of interviews with family, friends, ex-neighbors, and even a battery of lie-detector tests!
Originally posted by getreadyalready
My opinion is that the "birther" discussion should now be centered on what we propose to do about the 2012 and subsequent elections. Do we want them to be similar to every previous election, or do we want to make some changes?
Originally posted by aero56
What does it mean? I posted earlier and no one responded. The Constitution says "natural born citizen, OR, citizen of the United States."""" What does "or" mean?
Article II Section 1
No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President;
The grandfather provision of the "natural born Citizen" clause provided an exception to the "natural born" requirement for those persons who were citizens at the time of the adoption of the Constitution. (The first several Presidents prior to Martin van Buren as well as potential Presidential candidates such as Alexander Hamilton were born as British subjects in British America before the American Revolution and this grandfather clause would cover them.
Originally posted by boogiegk
I don't recall ever having a President or anyone running for the office bolding saying out of his own mouth, "I was born in Kenya".
Also, his wife says her husband was born in Kenya.