Actually all of this is false. "Barely" is not a quantifiable word and according to the laws of electromagnetism, yes, the field has a definite effect outside of the body, and so do other sources of EM radiation have an effect upon the fields both inside and outside our bodies that are generated by these organs. Studies have already shown this.

Funny you should say that, because that's exactly what Dr. Bruce Lipton argues of each of our cells, and he even extends the metaphor to include the whole body. We take all of our cues for how to behave based on external stimuli, which in the case of cells is determined by reactions on the outside of the cell membrane. But with skin it's a little more complicated than that, since we also take in information from our eyes, ears, and other senses, and our logical faculties inside our head.

Exactly. I think the whole body is a miracle.

The definition of truth is not the same as the definition of scientific fact. Just making sure you already understand that.

That everything is connected IS already proven. We even have a word for it: universe.

Exactly, but it's not just me, your beliefs are also not "true to reality" without evidence. Your attitude problem is not justified by science, neither are your assertions that EM fields affect nothing. You would be dead without them, and this thread wouldn't have a fraction as much vitriol in it.

And that's hugely significant because we all look up to being as evolved as a fridge magnet.

Only in your case. In most other human cases the EM fields that help keep us alive are actually productive and useful.

That's why you have arms and fingers my friend, which are operated by EM energies carried through your neurons.

Through your body, they most certainly can and do every day.

And considering that you have hands, is this a huge disappointment for you? Is that why you think we are so interested in this topic, because we want to pick up frogs like we're using the force? Do you assume everyone else has equally immature ideals for how to use these energies as yourself?

And remove your heart... You die. Remove your kidneys... You die. Remove your lungs... You die. Remove your intestines... You die. Remove the EM energies from your body... your heart stops beating... You die.

What was your point again? The fact that you die when you remove the brain somehow makes the brain superior to all other organs in the body, like it's a pissing contest between your organs? Is that what you're obsessed with? What are you trying to prove again?

Satisfaction, art, spirituality, none of the higher pursuits of mankind exist. In your life.

The body is still a miracle

I call anything that is beautiful a miracle. And for good reason when you consider that people such as yourself also must exist in this world, because you aren't so beautiful now are you? Come on, let's be honest now. Use other posts on this thread as a meter if you want. I'm not the only one to pick up on your attitude problem, and it speaks volumes about your personal development.

Einstein was infinitely more spiritual than yourself. Want some quotes or will you start puking and punching yourself in the face?

It's simple. The "universe" is one thing.

And it contains all things.

Therefore it involves and relates to all things.

Therefore there is a relationship between all things. We call it "the universe." It is a singularity of everything.

You have proof of this, or you are assuming based on faith? Remember you're the one making this positive claim. I never made it. Let's see who really knows the difference between scientific fact and faith.

Nor does the Em field generated by the human body have any capacity to perform work or generate force upon both magnetic and non-magnetic materials.

Only in your case. In most other human cases the EM fields that help keep us alive are actually productive and useful.

This statement has no bearing on the assertions given in the OP's video.

That's why you have arms and fingers my friend, which are operated by EM energies carried through your neurons.

If I'm not mistaken, a muscular contraction is more due to biochemical reactions which can be initiated by electrochemical influences.

Through your body, they most certainly can and do every day.

Your deflection towards my argument against the OP is duly noted.

Your deflection towards my argument against the OP is duly noted.

The human body is nor more a miracle than a rock.

Both were created by physical processes the naturally exist within our universe. The perception of it being a miracle is due to our lack of current understanding of these natural processes that lead to life emerging.

Beauty is but a concept.

Everything in it's own right can be considered beautiful, even what we may consider the most distasteful of things.

If our species murders another of our kind, it's considered wrong. If a lion murders for whatever reason another of it's kind, it's considered majestic and powerful.

Einstein was infinitely more spiritual than yourself. Want some quotes or will you start puking and punching yourself in the face?

There is only one quote given by Einstein that I need to see. One where he speaks out against those whom have taken his spiritual remarks as false assumptions that he believed in a creator.

Science without religion is lame. Religion without science is blind.

Every one who is seriously involved in the pursuit of science becomes convinced that a spirit is manifest in the laws of the Universe-a spirit vastly superior to that of man, and one in the face of which we with our modest powers must feel humble.

The scientists’ religious feeling takes the form of a rapturous amazement at the harmony of natural law, which reveals an intelligence of such superiority that, compared with it, all the systematic thinking and acting of human beings is an utterly insignificant reflection.

There is no logical way to the discovery of elemental laws. There is only the way of intuition, which is helped by a feeling for the order lying behind the appearance.

The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift.

The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious; It is the source of all true art and science.

We should take care not to make the intellect our god; it has, of course, powerful muscles, but no personality.

Whoever undertakes to set himself up as a judge of Truth and Knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter of the Gods.

God does not play dice with the universe.

God is subtle but he is not malicious.

A human being is a part of the whole, called by us Universe, a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feelings as something separated from the rest-a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free from this prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the whole nature in its beauty.

The real problem is in the hearts and minds of men. It is easier to denature plutonium than to denature the evil spirit of man.

It's simple. The "universe" is one thing.

And it contains all things.

Therefore it involves and relates to all things.

Therefore there is a relationship between all things. We call it "the universe." It is a singularity of everything.

An orange and a bouncy balls are both spherical in shape. Therefore an orange is a bouncy ball. The two are connected to each other due to their shape. What god damn infantile excuse of logic you have.

You have proof of this, or you are assuming based on faith? Remember you're the one making this positive claim. I never made it. Let's see who really knows the difference between scientific fact and faith.

The fact that you are alive and not a mess of atoms is the proof.

Light yourself on fire if you need further verification that being physically connected to something with intense heat would mean the end of you.

Your deflection towards my argument against the OP is duly noted.

Do you have evidence for this, too? There is an organization called the Global Consciousness Project which has been collecting data in recent years that contradicts your assertion. So I can only assume you must have some evidence in return to contradict them.

Here's their website:

noosphere.princeton.edu...


Notice "princeton" and "edu" in the URL, and take a couple early tips from that before you start slinging more insults and vitriolic language at anyone who accomplishes the difficult feat of disagreeing with you. Chances are the people running this project are much more educated than you are on the subject, and in general.

And where is the evidence for this? In fact if this were true it would violate laws of physics, because electrons are mass and moving them is performing work, by definition.

The fact remains that I find being alive very useful, and this would be impossible without these EM fields, despite your apparent hatred of them. They still love you enough to keep you alive, and that's saying a lot.

Did you notice the "electro" in the word "electrochemical"? Electric currents are being carried and are the key force involved. That's why when you grab an electric fence of a strong enough voltage, it causes your hand muscles to clamp down as if you stimulated them yourself, despite no chemicals being pumped into your hand. But respond by continuing to talk trash about how your body works, and how it's nothing special or anything to enjoy, please. You're a perfect example of what is wrong with the attitudes of many people in the world today, and will help to educate others.

It's not a deflection unless you can actually find where someone is claiming they can move stuff with their EM field as if they're using the force from Star Wars. I was responding to something YOU came up with. You're the only one who has such a problem with using your hands that you automatically want your EM field to move things for you as soon as you learn about it, and think this is somehow an argument against the OP.

You keep saying this but I am responding directly to crap that YOU posted. If it wasn't in the OP to begin with, that's YOUR fault. I addressed it anyway. You're welcome.

There is nothing about science that tells you how to think or feel. You are very confused if you think science debunks feelings. Choosing to experience life as miraculous is a choice, and one that leads to a life style that you obviously want no part of. That's fine. But you also enjoy pissing on people's parades apparently, and I happen to enjoy pissing on the parades of people who piss on other peoples' parades.

Yes, or by contrast, and as you demonstrate yourself, it is also possible to consider the most evolved and elevated aspects of nature as distasteful and worthless, and to talk trash about them and revile them.

It depends on who you ask. I don't think lions killing each other is majestic. But you want to talk about science. Again, science doesn't dictate what your emotions should be.

That's what you think. I think you need to see these, too, if you want to call yourself a true Einsteinian:

Do you express feelings of "rapturous amazement at the harmony of natural law"?

You seem to be dying to take a poop on all the natural laws that make up the body in this thread, with all the vitriolic language and miserable attitudes. Your words and Einstein's words are like night and day.

I can only assume you never take account of your own personality, unless you thoroughly enjoy being perceived as fatally pessimistic by others.

Whoever undertakes to set himself up as a judge of Truth and Knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter of the Gods.

I seem to recall someone who was just expressing feelings of satisfaction over their perception of having more "common sense" than myself.

Did Einstein just say God?

Holy crap! "A human being is a part of the whole, called by us Universe"..... Where have I read something like that before? Oh yeah, in my last post to you!

According to Einstein, you are delusional by your thoughts and feelings of being separated from the rest of the universe. Wow, getting called delusional from the grave by your own hero. Must be a pretty big blow to your ego. I'm guessing it'll just make you more arrogant, because what else do you know?


I'm starting to think Einstein had more in common with my own views than yours.

All of those are attributed to Einstein. Feel free to check them yourself.

Ditto. I did not say I was the universe, or anything equivalent to the stupidity you just demonstrated. I said we are part of a whole that we call the universe, and are thus related to everything within it. I did not say we are equivalent to the universe, or even equivalent to any other specific part of it. I said there is a relation, represented by the word "universe." I am very careful in my words and my reasoning. You, on the other hand, have just presented a straw-man due to a misunderstanding of my words. And then on top of that you had the sheer arrogance of following it up with "What god damn infantile excuse of logic you have." I know saying things like that makes you feel good, but others are going to read that and feel quite differently about you.

Nothing in the history of science explains the huge leap you make between me being alive, and therefore I am not connected in any way to x. You are abusing logic by being ignorant of it, yet pretending to understand it out of your vitriolic arrogance. If you are familiar with the concept of a unified field theory in theoretical physics, you already have the context for a direct connection between me and any given star system, and that would be the unified field itself. Or we could make it easier on you and just refer to it as the universe. I'm in the same universe as any given star. I can look at them. Photons that come from them enter my body. There is a relationship in all of that whether you want to admit it or not.

All that proves is where my nervous system ends, which is not the same. For someone so arrogant, your understanding of formal reasoning does not justify your attitude.

If I'm deflecting from your argument, then you must have had no argument. I would ask that you clarify exactly what you think your "argument" against the OP is.

I thought this was going to be a thread about human biology and wondered why it was in metaphysics. Now I understand.

I think we all need to realize how poorly these issues are understood (especially by "science").

For instance: anyone who studies spiritual teachings or uses spiritual practices has more or less certainty that there is at least one other "energy source" in the picture that science overlooks: the being (spirit) itself.

Those that have studied various mystical traditions are aware of the chakras, and each of these could be considered a separate source for its own unique energy field.

To assume that just because most people cannot hear radio stations or similar does not mean that they cannot receive or are not affected by radio-frequency fields.

To assume that all thought occurs in the brain just because the various energy fields involved cannot easily be seen or detected is not particularly good science, either.

In the mystical system, all the chakras as well as the being itself are capable of thought on some level, and in the simplified form I've studied there are at least two spiritual entities associated with a body, and each one has at least one mind that exists as an energy field and not simply as a neural complex.

The concept that the heart is associated with a kind of thinking that could be described as love-based or feminine is ancient and resonates with us. I don't know how literally accurate it is. I see the dissonance between love-based thought and logic-based thought mostly as an artificial product of thousands if not millions of years of mental manipulation. It has created a sort of artificial schizophrenia that pits these to ways of thinking against each other, when they should complement each other.

I see the body and its organization as a metaphor for, or product of, higher-level energetic relationships and not the source of them.

think about this : one person having " good vibes " ( as I will call it ) will not influence the bigger world around !! nevertheless, one person can influence another person with his thoughts : it's called Reiki for example - on the other hand we have voodoo, a curse etc that can influence another person in a very negativ way !

I think we can agree those things exist.

So we do not speak here about ONE person, but about 100.000's man, women,children having all together at the same time the same positiv thinking, feelings, concentration to achieve some positiv target, evolution or whatever. That is the discussion here ! Lot's of people having " good vibes " that will influence the bigger picture.

Lots of heartbeats, lots of energy fields joining together to make one big field.

Otherwise you never can explain some events that occur and are incomprehensible without such theory : revolutions for example : what happens in Egypt, Lybia etc etc the people are in the same mood, with the same expectings, the same feelings, the same enthousiasm and energy that makes it all happen - until sometimes the mood changes and everybody gets scared about the situation, then the force is gone, you feel sad, everybody feels sad.

Global consciousness, global oneness means all together, not just one person in his chair ( does not mean that person is not important of course ! ).

Hey! I would like to explain exactly why the gut is also called a second brain. It's because
whenever you feel depressed, or agitated, or really stressed out, all this built up tension in
your body gets relieved through the gut. Ask any doctor you know, you'll get the same answer.
There is a psychosomatic connection between our feelings (especially stress and anxiety)
and the way our gut functions by processing those feelings. Even though this fact
has been scientifically proven, the scientists still can't understand why exactly this connection
takes place. So, believing that humans can affect the magnetic field is completely up to you,
since it has not been scientifically proven (yet). However, the gut is referred to as a second brain
because of its ability to express human feelings through body functions, and this is a scientific
fact.

You'll call fallacies when it's convenient for you, but then argue from "common sense" (a totally meaningless phrase) in the next instant. I just know your penchant for slinging insults, as already demonstrated, and you might want to think an extra time before slinging insults when you're talking about an Ivy Leage school. If new information were little-understood, and only the wealthiest schools could afford to invest in them, do you realize how that could relate to your role as basically the status-quo-maintaining mob that always resists new information? I'm just wondering if you've ever thought about that.

Causal, not casual. As in identifying a cause. The fact remains that they observed statistical anomalies on dates like 9/11 that indicate a "coincidence" with large emotional events (emotional to humans). That in itself is what they are studying, and the implications contradict what you were saying earlier about human energy fields being unable to register a change in the environment. Not to mention you don't have any actual proof of your claim anyway, you just assume it from ignorance, and argument from ignorance is another fallacy if you want to jot that down.

So now you're playing the robot whenever your arguments get shot down. Okay. You said our energy fields can't do work. Well work in physics is defined (one definition) as displacing mass. Electrons are mass. They are displaced. The EM energy fields around our body therefore do work. That is not a "deflection," that is what you would call a debunking of your claim. The EM energy fields do work on a much more subtle level than the arms and legs they command, but they do work nonetheless and this is how they interact with your body.

Again you make a statement with no proof. This is argument from ignorance. Do you have scientific papers to validate this claim?

So what do you do with all these "deflections" that you take due note of? Do you count them up and see what score you get at the end?

Yes, I purposefully ignored it, so I could explain what is in the quote of mine immediately above this text. Once again, go back to the original context. You're trying to say electricity doesn't really control the actions of our arms and legs? Put it this way: without electric flow, you arms and legs and etc. wouldn't move.

You just keep saying electric fields can't do work, don't affect anything, are insignificant, etc. And you are obviously wrong because they control your body which is perfectly capable of doing work, including your thinking. Without those energies, you would be totally useless. Do you see why they are significant to talk about now? Not because we think they're going to give us super powers, like you seem to assume. But because of what they do on the subtle level that you seem to hate, unless it gives you those super powers so you can pick up frogs like a magnet.

Yes, I have. I noted that your argument is an argument from ignorance. You just say it doesn't affect it, and that's it. You think because you won't accept any evidence for it, then that means you somehow have evidence to the contrary. Too bad it doesn't work that way. That's why they invented the phrase "argument from ignorance." You confuse being debunked with "deflecting." I'm going to assume that's some form of cognitive dissonance.

This is the problem. If anything, the physics proves you wrong. You aren't even citing any actual field or laws of physics. You are thinking on a mundane level, like these forces should be able to pick up frogs or else they're useless. That's literally what your argument has amounted to. You've posted no sources, nothing to suggest your "criticism" has actually been validated in any way.

I was talking about the human body itself being evolved and elevated, not the idea of thinking of it as miraculous. Apparently the more evolved being to you is a grouch that gets irritated just by people, like Einstein, pointing out that we're part of a much bigger whole, and then starts condescending to them and talking about how great he feels to know he has more "common sense" than me.

Sure, but they can't predict how any one person will react to any given stimuli.

I'm not even religious myself. Apparently me posting Einstein quotes is an "argument that he was a religious man." That speaks for itself.

Aww, you don't like the quotes I posted and you want me to go find your favorite one. Noooo.

Oh you're going into denial now. I guess you're going to say his thing about mankind being part of a whole called the universe was a joke, too? Einstein mentioned God so much that even though he wasn't a Christian, he obviously believed in some intelligent order and he said as much himself on numerous occasions. Of course he thought there is a natural order; he was a mathematician.

"It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it."

"I am a deeply religious nonbeliever. This is a somewhat new kind of religion. I have never imputed to Nature a purpose or a goal, or anything that could be understood as anthropomorphic. What I see in Nature is a magnificent structure that we can comprehend only very imperfectly and that must fill a thinking person with a feeling of humility. This is a genuinely religious feeling that has nothing to do with mysticism. The idea of a personal God is quite alien to me and seems even naive."

Well Einstein just put value on feeling the rapturous amazement at the harmony of natural law, so I thought I would share that quote with you, so you could reflect rapturously on that amazing harmony of natural law yourself some time and get to know your hero Einstein's view on the world a little better.

Well maybe pessimistic isn't the right word. It would probably take a harsher word. I mean you resorted to slinging insults early on, and gloating about how much more sense you had. Those are the kind of personality traits I was comparing to Einstein's quote.

Yeah, ignore your own words just to point it back at me. I bet you wish Einstein had been vaguer so you could have pulled that with all his quotes huh?

How many people do you know of that don't believe in God, but use God in profound quotes to explain points of view on life, nature, etc.?

Einstein's quote reads almost as if he was summing up our entire discussion, rather than just the one point about us being "part of the whole, called by us Universe." Part of something. That is a relation. You can deny it all you want. It's sad, like you're denying your own family member or something, like a Westboro member denying their own daughter. You came from the universe yet want to claim that you have nothing to do with it.

What you just did, was confirm exactly what that quote above is talking about. You don't even understand what I'm saying and you respond anyway. You don't even respond to what I say. That is exactly what I was just talking about, and you DID IT AGAIN while responding to me pointing it out to you. Ridiculous. The common sense is just oozing out of you isn't it?

Did I say physically connected to each other? No. The closest thing to that I said, was that my spine ISN'T physically attached to anything else. What did I just say about responding to things I didn't even post? You seem to have some kind of negative religious obsession where you assume everyone is out to convince you of something that was always wrong and always will be wrong, forever, no matter what, "amen." If you didn't try to read between the lines you would be alright.

That's your fault for reading too much into my posts. Respond only to things that I actually say, and you won't be so confused. Same with the OP. There is nothing about being physically bonded to anything else, nothing about picking up frogs like we're human supermagnets, nothing about anyone else screaming when you set me on fire or any kind of garbage like that. You're right that something isn't clear here, but it's not been my language or terminology, and same with the OP.

It would mean that a unified field gave rise to both me and the star, and that we both continued to exist within that unified field. It's basically the same thing as saying we are in the same universe, and yes, that in itself is significant. NO!, it doesn't mean "now you have super powers, you can pick up that frog and other people will scream if we burn you." Okay, is THAT clear enough for you yet?

we also may not forget the " aura " which is also, I think, a manifestation of the body ( electromagnetic ) force ....

you will tell me those heart EM radiation does not go very far, but what do we know about it ?
First of all, our instruments are maybe just too rudimentary to pick this up on a bigger distance

the one that will combine the spiritual level and the material one, like we see already happening in quantum physics.

Well, it actually does. Because the gut is the ONLY organ in our body which can
process our feelings so quickly.

Of course our body has its way to process them,
but no other part of our body can do such a thing so effortlessly and quickly.
Just think about it.. I 've known many people who run to the bathroom whenever
they're sad and stressed. And that's just the simplest example I could find.

what do we NOT know yet and we want to know !! what can science learn us about those strange phenomena

can you explain voodoo ? shaman ? reiki ?

when you love somebody it's also placebo ? did you ever love somebody Sirnex ? did you ever HATE somebody ?? yeah placebo ....

did you ever try the experience with the 2 plants ? you do not know what I am speaking about ?
Well stop then, have a nice day and a good beer !

Hello fellow Sirnex, must be more polite : or do I have to say Mister Sirnex .? Miss Sirnex .?....

as I can imagine and see you, I see a person with 1980's believings in science .....

you just don't fellow the evolution of quantum physics and the power of "spiritual" or META-HUMAN / meta-physical consciousness and spiritual implications.

You know, you do not bring anything new into the discussion, you just leave it the way it all was in 1980.

Sorry man or woman, but I feel science is going full forwards and quantum physics already makes us feel aware of some strange influences and strange behaviour of some particles.
stop - cannot discuss more with you because you are not updated ! have a nice day !