David Icke, Jesse Ventura, Alex Jones, etc. Crazy or Calculated?

BAD INFO AND THE PROTECTION IT BRINGS

This thread is to discuss the massive amount of information that gets unloaded via alternative outlets. Some of the key names that come to mind are Icke, Jones, Ventura, Fulford, Rense, Bell, Greer, Lazaar, etc.

Hoaxes are very important to the case I am going to make so please consider all people that release information as equal in this thread.

THE CASE:

I believe that within the massive amounts of data disseminated to the public there will be very suspect elements that may have to be reconsidered over time. I base this on my interpretation of the dangers to whistleblowers and people involved in disclosure.

This idea came from a very well understood mechanism in human society: it's dangerous to tell secrets. When your life is in your hands, bad information is an insurance policy.





Whistleblowing and people who go against the grain:

Gary Webb

Webb's "Dark Alliance," a 20,000 word, three-part investigative series alleged that Nicaraguan drug traffickers had sold and distributed crack coc aine in Los Angeles during the 1980s, and that drug profits were used to fund the CIA-supported Nicaraguan Contras.

In 2004, Webb was found dead from two gunshot wounds to the head, which the coroner's office judged a suicide.

Whether Webb's suicide was legitimate or not, his public criticism of the CIA destroyed his professional life and he ended up in a familiar place for whisleblowers.

Webb // ATS Thread on Gary Webb

Shanmughan Manjunath

While working for the Indian Oil Corporation (IOC) in Lucknow, he had ordered two petrol pumps at Lakhimpur Kheri sealed for selling adulterated fuel for three months. When the pump started operating again a month later, Manjunath decided to conduct a surprise raid around November 19, 2005.

During his inspection, Manjunath had been shot dead in Gola Gokarannath town of Lakhimpur Kheri. His body, riddled with at least six bullets, was found in the backseat of his own car, which was being driven by two employees of the petrol pump. Both were arrested and the main accused, pump-owner Pawan Kumar ('Monu') Mittal, was held on November 23 along with seven others.

Manjunath // In Memory

Mordechai Vanunu

Mordechai Vanunu revealed details of Israel's nuclear weapons program to the British press in 1986. He was subsequently lured to Italy by a female Mossad agent, where he was drugged and kidnapped by Israeli intelligence agents. He was transported to Israel and ultimately convicted in a trial that was held behind closed doors.

Vanunu spent 18 years in prison, including more than 11 years in solitary confinement. Released from prison in 2004, he became subject to a broad array of restrictions on his speech and movement. Since then he has been arrested several times for violations of those restrictions, including giving various interviews to foreign journalists and attempting to leave Israel.

Mordechai Vanunu // Interview // ATS Thread

Dead Scientists

Part 1 // Part 2
Silenced?




An alternative opinion:

Misinformation + Consequence = Motivation?

Misinformation is false or inaccurate information that is spread unintentionally. It is distinguished from disinformation by motive in that misinformation is simply erroneous, while disinformation, in contrast, is intended to mislead.

1

While the idea that I am postulating in this thread is that misinformation could be spread for protection, we must also entertain another alternative.


PsyOps

The war in Iraq has spawned a new industry in Washington that could be called Psy-ops Journalism. The new breed of journalists are following the money trail to the Pentagon.

Some $400 million in media consulting contracts has been awarded during the past few years by the Pentagon, for the purpose of helping "to effectively communicate Iraqi government and Coalition goals with strategic audiences." Thus far both the Pentagon and its contract psy-op journalists have experienced a painful learning curve, but the most recent contract award will show how much each has learned. The outlook is not promising.

Source // Interview with Colonel Gardinar // ATS Thread



Are the vocal detractors of the main stream doing it to protect themselves, or are they in cahoots with the very people they speak out against?


List your favorite or least favorite personalities that speak out about conspiracies, UFO's, or anything else against mainstream and whether or not you think they are dumping bad information to protect themselves.

Disclaimer: All information posted in this thread will be indexed and archived by the military. Post at your own risk.

Just kidding!

Follow the money.
Alex Jones has to work very hard for his funds, which is why he's turning more & more into a giant commercial with breaking news reports in between advertising. I trust that a lot more than I trust corporate funded and controlled media outlets that rely on only a few major "well known" sources of funding.
What I don't trust is how Alex Jones hasn't been pulled off the airwaves by now and black listed from AM/FM broadcasting. It seems like he has protection from somewhere.

David Icke doesn't seem to be rolling in the dough either. He has to travel around the world, do daily interviews, and sell his books to make a living. He also seems to really enjoy what he does, as do I. He doesn't really ever get TV air time, and the TV is the main tool used to brainwash and control the masses. Most people I know who are "good consumers" have never heard of Icke.

Julian Assange seems like controlled opposition incarnate to me. He gets tons of world wide exposure and more TV time than Lindsey Lohan and Snookie. Wikileaks doesn't really release anything that ground breaking or in depth truth that could actually "change" what is broken in the system, broken for US that is.
Everything Wikileaks has released has done what exactly as far as change? Same people in power, same system, more laws still coming out, police are getting worse, judges more corrupt, and the dance goes on. I don't know how anyone could rely on Assange as being any kind of truth advocate and hero.

Jordan Maxwell... well he's getting old, and you got to give him some leeway I think. He doesn't appear to be wealthy at all. He claims to be collecting social security and living modestly. He does radio shows, mostly internet, and has very little TV time under his belt, though he's well known with the Hollywood crowds.
I like Jordan, I don't smell any corporations on his breath, and I think his older research is some of the best around.

Basically my BS detector is set to corporate pawn, and some are unknowingly pawns for these giants, but read the man by the fruits he bares, and always follow the money.

Interesting Link Follow the Money

www.alexjonesmachine.com...

reply to post by JibbyJedi


Julian Assange: I tend to agree with you, if it were a moral crusade he would have released everything all at once. The same as Bradley Manning did.

He has been smeared publicly, but he has also been portrayed a hero in some instances in the MSM. All while never providing any real damaging information.

As bad as some of the war documents and movies were, there has been information already leaked about the same types of things. War isn't pretty, everyone knows that.

My thoughts are that Mr. Assange has been an unwilling participant in a war on information. If he was complacent in the whole thing or he was manipulated the entire way, it's not clear.


Interview with Assange and Ellsberg

What you are afraid of is natural. Yes telling secrets can be dangerous - but what do you suggest the alternative is because in this day and age (which is purely History repeating itself) it is cowardess not to and I for one salute the Bravery of the like of Ventura and Icke as do many many others and I am thankful for their huge amount of research done on your behalf.

If people had been like you in the 1930s & 40s - none of us would be here today and they had more guts in their little fingers. Capitalism is the cause of all this Corporate Greed so if you want to see the depopulation of the planet which is now their aim because we are too many to handle it is threatening their very means then continue doing what many people still do and bury your head in the sand.

Many, many people are starting to wake up at last and yes it takes bravery to abolish slavery. The worker ants are about to be elliminated via WW111 and those who can't see it coming are simply either blind or in total denial.

Just my thoughts as we enter another day in the Ant Hill.

reply to post by Analyze76

John Birch society funded by Nelson Rockafeller


Alex Jones connected to the Birch Society? 12

Originally posted by boncho
reply to post by Analyze76

 

John Birch society funded by Nelson Rockafeller

Alex Jones connected to the Birch Society? 12

I'm no secret agent man but let me tell you that I have personal knowledge that the JBS of my area are cops seeking out the trouble makers. My story is long and ain't worth it because I get jokers challenging when I say "good morning" on this post.

reply to post by Seekeye2

If people had been like you in the 1930s & 40s - none of us would be here today and they had more guts in their little fingers.

What exactly is "like you" imply or mean? I don't understand.

What you are afraid of is natural. Yes telling secrets can be dangerous - but what do you suggest the alternative is because in this day and age (which is purely History repeating itself) it is cowardess not to and I for one salute the Bravery of the like of Ventura and Icke as do many many others and I am thankful for their huge amount of research done on your behalf.

I never mentioned I was afraid of anything. The 'huge amount of research' they do is on whose behalf? That is the point of this thread. To talk about who they are really working for, and do they spread misinformation to protect themselves or because they have ulterior motives.


Suggested Readings

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/f7e746420fd7.jpg[/atsimg]

reply to post by Analyze76

I'm no secret agent man but let me tell you that I have personal knowledge that the JBS of my area are cops seeking out the trouble makers. My story is long and ain't worth it because I get jokers challenging when I say "good morning" on this post.

I won't knock JBS (for one, I don't know enough about them) but I will say that whether or not they are a good organization it doesn't eliminate the fact that they can be manipulated.

Remember that power is achieved through a benevolent appearance. If One funds a moral group that is well respected within the community and the time comes when, that One needs the group's political persuasion, One has seeded a strong ally.

Originally posted by boncho
reply to post by Analyze76

 

I'm no secret agent man but let me tell you that I have personal knowledge that the JBS of my area are cops seeking out the trouble makers. My story is long and ain't worth it because I get jokers challenging when I say "good morning" on this post.

I won't knock JBS (for one, I don't know enough about them) but I will say that whether or not they are a good organization it doesn't eliminate the fact that they can be manipulated.

Remember that power is achieved through a benevolent appearance. If One funds a moral group that is well respected within the community and the time comes when, that One needs the group's political persuasion, One has seeded a strong ally.

edit on 1-4-2011 by boncho because: (no reason given)

Don't get involved with em. They knocked on my door seeking me to join. Seeking me out. I NEVER had any interest in them at all. How did they get my name?

reply to post by JibbyJedi


A correlate of follow the money: follow the fear and empowerment

Alex Jones seems to be one that is always promoting stories designed to put people into fear and the underlying message is that "these people are too powerful for the individual to fight against"

David Icke on the other hand with things like his recent book "Human Race Get off Your Knees" talks about some of the same things but from a perspective of empowerment and generally avoiding the promulgation of fear.

Is 100% of what either of them say truth or misinformation? Probably not, but it's an interesting factor to consider when using discernment about their (or others) communications.

reply to post by Analyze76

Don't get involved with em. They knocked on my door seeking me to join. Seeking me out. I NEVER had any interest in them at all. How did they get my name?

JBS Offering public support for Glenn Beck? From their website

For longtime members of The John Birch Society (JBS) this quote from Quigley and even Beck’s mention of Quigley himself is like encountering an old friend after a long separation.

reply to post by coyotepoet

A correlate of follow the money: follow the fear and empowerment Alex Jones seems to be one that is always promoting stories designed to put people into fear and the underlying message is that "these people are too powerful for the individual to fight against"

A little ironic when he accuses the government of fear mongering, isn't it?

Originally posted by coyotepoet
reply to post by JibbyJedi

 

A correlate of follow the money: follow the fear and empowerment

Alex Jones seems to be one that is always promoting stories designed to put people into fear and the underlying message is that "these people are too powerful for the individual to fight against"

David Icke on the other hand with things like his recent book "Human Race Get off Your Knees" talks about some of the same things but from a perspective of empowerment and generally avoiding the promulgation of fear.

Is 100% of what either of them say truth or misinformation? Probably not, but it's an interesting factor to consider when using discernment about their (or others) communications.

As Joe Pesci stated in his role as David Ferrie in the movie JFK "It's a mystery wrapped in a riddle inside an enigma"

What is completely obvious with the link I provided above, and his public filings, he is in no way on the up and up. Let me add that he is not on the up and up of what he tells his audience. As far as filings he is meticulous and "legally hiding" information.

It's very hard to distinguish the frauds from the guys who are real.

Sometimes when you think someone is for real, you suddenly get new info or just read something that strikes you weird, and when you think about it and try to confirm it, you all of a sudden are in doubt again.

E.g. Jesse Ventura...It was hard to take him serious because of his WWF history and his Hollywood like presenting of his show. But OK, Let's give him a chance. Now I talked about that with a friend of mine and he asked me if I was blind. Apperently Venture wore a Freemason ring in one of the first episodes of his show.

Alex Jones. Seemed real to me, but one thing I resented was his website and the fact that he was SELLING information. My believe is that if you have some real info, don't sell it, spread it for free. And next to that him allegedly being a Jesuit!? No, I don't trust him either.

Ron Paul, I really liked that guy from the start. With him I had no doubt at all being an honest guy, but he also seems to be affiliated with the Freemasons. His dad was a Freemason, his wife is a member of the Velasco Order of the Eastern Star. His daughters were RainbowGirls, also affiliated to the Freemasons. And then there is of course other "rumours" and "evidence" that is real hard to figure out if right or wrong.

Here is the entire story

I still hope I'm wrong on him, I really like(d) him.

Last but not least David Icke, him I liked also from the beginning, he seemed to be a normal guy from the neighbourhood. But then I hear Bill Cooper talking about him and realizing Bill was murdered and all of them are still alive and kicking, although all the others revealed much more than Bill did.

That's making me doubt again. It's just, IMHO, very hard to deceide who's phony and who's for real.

Ukuthula !

reply to post by WeirdOldDude

It's very hard to distinguish the frauds from the guys who are real. Sometimes when you think someone is for real, you suddenly get new info or just read something that strikes you weird, and when you think about it and try to confirm it, you all of a sudden are in doubt again.

But then again, that's part of the game isn't it? Who to trust? Who to doubt? I've been thinking about that aspect a lot lately. When you don't know who to trust or how much it makes you question everything, which is good and the way a real critical thinker does things, but for the majority of people it just overwhelms them to the point of giving up even trying to find the truth. Effective tool.

On a side note, when I went to school they used to teach critical thinking skills. Now, thanks to the AIMS test, No Child Left Behind, etc. they just teach how to regurgitate information, not how to analyze it. Good thing I am able to pass that kind of thing on to my son, other kids might not be so fortunate. How better to create a generation of people that just accept what they are told?

I will have to admit that Alex Jones and Ventura are helping all of us from the molestation taking place in the airports. (as long as they win) That is a dehumanizing religion destroying practice.

Originally posted by Analyze76
I will have to admit that Alex Jones and Ventura are helping all of us from the molestation taking place in the airports. (as long as they win) That is a dehumanizing religion destroying practice.

What have they really done though?

I would like to know what the contracts were on those scanners they use. Were they bought outright by the government or were they leased? If they get removed does the company that made them still get paid?

They were ready to ship within weeks after the underwear bombing incident. If the company that made them keeps the money it means they could still walk away with a profit if they were removed...

Interestingly enough OP, all three of those people you mentioned are disinfo agents. I'm not sure about David Icke. He might just be misguided, but the other two are both Catholic, and supports the concept of a Vatican/Jesuit led NWO, not a Zionist one as is commonly believed.

reply to post by finalword


I wouldn't deny it, but does that mean all their information is invalid?

[(In my mind it seems so) but every so often something useful will come from the strangest source]

The problem with dealing with these subjects is it is easy to drop someone as soon as you figure out (or think you've figured out) their motives, without ever uncovering a broad perspective of all the players.

So are Jones, Ventura and Icke just out there to confuse everyone, do they release good informaton once in a while or is there something we can learn by analyzing what they want people to believe?

Here is someone else who investigated the elite.

Antony C. Sutton — Feb. 14, 1925 - June 17, 2002

Antony Sutton has been persecuted but never prosecuted for his research and subsequent publishing of his findings.

His mainstream career was shattered by his devotion towards uncovering the truth. In 1968, his Western Technology and Soviet Economic Development was published by The Hoover Institute at Stanford University. Sutton showed how the Soviet state's technological and manufacturing base, which was then engaged in supplying the North Vietnamese the armaments and supplies to kill and wound American soldiers, was built by US firms and mostly paid for by the US taxpayers.