Freemasons - I have a few questions.

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posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 09:16 AM
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Originally posted by KSigMason
reply to post by Dajjal
 

I wish I could answer but I honestly don't know the answer.


I tried to answer earlier. It isn't "concrete" but it is a very accurate estimate.

There are about 70 ATS staff members (Mod, Super Mod, and Admin), and there are 3 that are certainly Masons, and there might be as many as 7 or 8 that are Masons. Less than 10% probably.

You have to also realize that this is a Conspiracy Theory site, and Masons are surely drawn to a site like this. I would guess that the percentage of Masons on this site is a much higher percentage than the percentage of Masons in a town or state. We have an uneven distribution here, because of the subjects on this site.




posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 09:17 AM
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reply to post by TheLoneArcher
 


In all honesty, I have found some masons in my lodge to be quite sexist. This is generally the older crowd, but some from the younger crowd as well.

My wife had a bad experience at a lodge social BBQ shortly after I joined a few years ago - she asked how she could become involved in Freemasonry and was told by a long-time Mason that "the ladies' place in the lodge is to cook at the afterboard".

My wife, who is a liberal, intelligent businesswoman did not take kindly to this, and refused from that day on ever to attend another of our functions. Personally, I cannot blame her.

As long as this attitude towards women prevails, lodges will remain male, I think.

It saddens me that some Masons have this attitude towards women, but I think this is representative of the population as a whole, and not restricted just to Masons.

EDIT: Just to clarify, I think ML has a very valid point about "male-bonding" and I agree that it makes sense that a fraternity should remain "male." I just think that Masons should not see themselves as "superior" to women, as some of them do.
edit on 31/3/2011 by Saurus because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 09:17 AM
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Originally posted by getreadyalready
Neat graphic! I don't think it applies to Masonry, because there is no real adventure or struggle, except for your personal troubles and vices that you bring in with you.

Ther is no "final moment of obtaining the knowledge." It is kind of like "practicing" medicine. You practice Masonry. The parables, ceremonies, lessons, tales, symbology, and other modes of learning are just to help illustrate a moral code that we already know in our hearts. No one imparts knowledge upon you, instead they just illustrate a moral way of living, and then make themselves available to help you along on your own development. They serve as mentors and examples. Once in awhile we mess up, even as mentors we mess up, and luckily there is a group around you to help you get through it.


The 'adventure' or 'struggle' here is usually used to analyze tales from mythology, but in this case I think 'adventure/struggle' could be replaced with 'ceremony/self improvement'. The diagram itself could be cyclical - i.e. it could represent just 1 lesson (the part about the mentor particularly stood out to me)...Anyhow - it might not apply to Freemasonry as you have stated....maybe just the journey of life/self-improvement in general.


Thanks for sharing the difficult memory - nobody is immune to imperfection...it seems that he did enjoy the time he spent with your lodge though, so I'm glad you did, and that his mother understood that.



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 09:18 AM
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reply to post by D377MC
 

Not all Masons are good and through their bad deeds weed themselves out. I have sat and watched as a Past Master and sitting Templar Commander was expelled for misuse of funds. It's sad when the weaker side of man gets the best of him.



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 09:21 AM
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reply to post by Saurus
 


I am sorry to hear that. Our Lodge tries to involve the wives as much as possible. Recently, we had an open Lodge evening for the Ladies of Freemasonry (or Freemasonry widows) they were shown around the rooms and many questions and fears were laid to rest. I thought that it was a great evening and the women loved it.

Obviously, some things are kept behind closed doors, but I think that FM should be as open as possible and let's face it, the Ladies at home support us, we should do the same.



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 09:22 AM
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reply to post by ILovePeace
 



Come on, you dont need to be part of a club to be a good human being that strives to better him or herself and the community around them.


And, for the millionth time, no lodge or Grand Lodge takes this position. Ditto for every Freemason on this board and every one I've ever met.


And to be part of something you claim helps people be this way but closely guards the secrets is ludicrous! (I am not talking about the silly handshakes that we can all see world leaders and bussiness men engaging in).


A. If these world leaders are really executing Masonic handshakes (and not simply regular ones misinterpreted as such) it should be relatively easy to give us their membership details.

B. What other secrets do you suppose we "guard"? Once again, vague generalities are not argument. Give us specifics or don't bother.
edit on 31-3-2011 by OnTheLevel213 because: formatting



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 09:27 AM
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reply to post by Saurus
 


Wow - yeah, that's pretty sexist.
Can any other Freemasons attest to this? Have your girlfriends/wives ever had bad experiences regarding Freemasons?

As far as it representing the population as a whole - perhaps it does there, but to mention something so bluntly (and with such an old-fashioned mentality) negative to a female would be social taboo here. (I'm from UK but living in Poland - it would be social taboo in either).



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 09:30 AM
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reply to post by SecretSky
 


As a screenwriter, I've been using, teaching and studying the Hero's Journey/monomyth for close to half a decade. There certainly are commonalities between blue lodge progression and the monomyth (and it probably gets stronger in the Royal Arch, though not being a Chapter Mason I can't speak to that); the extent of my experience with both leads me to believe that Masonic ritual is a surviving piece of an older mythos that the monomyth evolved from.

The reigning ATS expert on Masonry and the Ancient Mysteries is Masonic Light; his answer on the topic would probably be more useful.



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 09:31 AM
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reply to post by SecretSky
 


In most Lodges in the USA, the kitchen duties are performed by the Junior Warden and Stewards, who are officers of the Lodge (not ladies).

Ladies are always welcome at open Lodge functions, and are treated as honored guests.



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 09:34 AM
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reply to post by SecretSky
 


Perhaps I should clarify before my story gets misinterpreted...

This was a single individual, and by no means reflects the fraternity as a whole. I did not mean to imply that Masons are more sexist than others.

I just meant to say that there are some who I do find to be sexist, but it was never my intention to make out that the entire fraternity is this way inclined.



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 09:35 AM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light
reply to post by SecretSky
 


In most Lodges in the USA, the kitchen duties are performed by the Junior Warden and Stewards, who are officers of the Lodge (not ladies).

Ladies are always welcome at open Lodge functions, and are treated as honored guests.


I wish it were so in my lodge...



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 09:37 AM
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reply to post by ILovePeace
 

Freemasonry is not secular, in that we are neutral not denying or elevating one religion over others.

Please describe this structure to me with all the various bodies and orders. If anything it's like a ladder or stairs.

Even the honorary groups that one is invited still must be joined at ones own choice.

Can you name anyone of these global dominion? Can you really say you know the minds of men and why they join? I have the knowledge and dues cards to back that up.



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 09:44 AM
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Originally posted by OnTheLevel213
reply to post by SecretSky
 


As a screenwriter, I've been using, teaching and studying the Hero's Journey/monomyth for close to half a decade. There certainly are commonalities between blue lodge progression and the monomyth (and it probably gets stronger in the Royal Arch, though not being a Chapter Mason I can't speak to that); the extent of my experience with both leads me to believe that Masonic ritual is a surviving piece of an older mythos that the monomyth evolved from.

The reigning ATS expert on Masonry and the Ancient Mysteries is Masonic Light; his answer on the topic would probably be more useful.


Really interesting response, thanks! As a screenwriter - I can imagine how familiar you must be with the monomyth (I have Joseph Campbell's - 'The Hero With a Thousand Faces'). Are you also a Freemason? It certainly seems to make you very qualified to comment on the similarities of the monomyth.

My opinion is that the monomyth may actually just be in-built human nature...a common goal or vision which seems to be shared by many cultures.

Anyway - I'm getting a bit off-topic.

Care to comment on this please MasonicLight?



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 09:50 AM
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Originally posted by Saurus

Originally posted by Masonic Light
reply to post by SecretSky
 


In most Lodges in the USA, the kitchen duties are performed by the Junior Warden and Stewards, who are officers of the Lodge (not ladies).

Ladies are always welcome at open Lodge functions, and are treated as honored guests.


I wish it were so in my lodge...


Hi Saurus - I thought no females were allowed into the Lodges? Or is that just when ceremonies/meetings are taking place? When it's lunchtime, they're allowed?



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 09:56 AM
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reply to post by SecretSky
 


There's always two parts to a craft (blue) lodge evening - first the meeting, which includes the degree ceremonies if there are any candidates, followed by a dinner. In our lodge, the ladies (wives and girlfriends who volunteer) prepare the dinner while we have the meeting, and then join us for the dinner. In my jurisdiction, the dinner is always open to wives/friends/potential candidates, but the meeting is obviously closed.

However, in the side orders to which I belong, there are no ladies present at the dinner.



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 10:00 AM
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reply to post by SecretSky
 


reply to post by Saurus
 


My Lodge is opposite of that. We eat dinner first, and it is open to anybody. Visitors, families, lookilous, etc. We are always open at dinner time, and we appreciate the company.

When the Lodge is later opened for business in the Master Mason degree, only Master Masons are allowed. Depending on the business at hand, sometimes only Master Masons from our Lodge are allowed, and we kick out the visitors! It has happened on occasion where a member of our lodge needed some type of charity or special consideration and they didn't want their business spread around to everyone, so we were open for business, but we didn't even allow visiting members.

So, Meals=wide open, Business Meetins=Master Masons, and sometimes Personal Business=Only members of our Lodge welcome.



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 10:10 AM
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2. Apart from doing good for the community, is there a specific goal of Freemasonry?
"To make good men better."


O.k, since every mason on here has responded word for word, I'm starting to think you all just read the guidelines and are re-iterating them here. No offense, but such a task can be achieved elsewhere, no need to resort to some separatist club in order to go about doing this.



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 10:16 AM
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reply to post by Ewok_Boba
 


Nobody said there was a need. This is just one of many avenues. Everyone is free to choose their own path, that is why we don't recruit. Most of the Masons have also said that we don't teach anything that one shouldn't already know, or couldn't learn on their own in some way.

And that particular phrase is one of our favorites, there are T-shirts, bumper-stickers and everything!



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 10:19 AM
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Originally posted by getreadyalready
I tried to answer earlier. It isn't "concrete" but it is a very accurate estimate.

There are about 70 ATS staff members (Mod, Super Mod, and Admin), and there are 3 that are certainly Masons, and there might be as many as 7 or 8 that are Masons. Less than 10% probably.
Off the top of my head I can think of getreadyalready, skyfloating, mirthful me, and GAOTU789. I think I've probably come across a couple more, but they're not coming to mind. Intrepid is not, though he does agree with many of our philosophies. Not many of them post in the Secret Societies forum very often to avoid conflict of interest.



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 10:19 AM
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reply to post by SecretSky
 


I am a Freemason, but of the blue lodge/"low-level" variety, in that I'm not yet a member of any appendant bodies. The royal Arch (a set of degrees in the York Rite) was considered the completion of traditional Freemasonry in its time; events may occur in their degrees which further reconcile Freemasonry and the monomyth.





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