U.S. Army kills Afghans who were speeding on bike!!!

Are these the same Armed Forces who invade sovereign countries around the world to "prevent massacres"?

www.rferl.org...

Wow!

The lack of context to make any kind of determination as to the legitimate nature of the engagement is shockingly apparent to anyone with half an objective bone in their body. Along with objectivity would be some basic understanding of combat or security operations techniques.

We all get that the Taliban are fighting for what they believe in and I for one having fought them respect them for that – some are hard corps mofo’s who know their business. However, that said you have to realize that their status in the video as “civilians” is a little suspect given the presence of load bearing equipment. The absence of a clear photo/video of a weapon means nothing – just like gang members in the US who ditch their drugs while being pursued by the cops these guys could have ditched their weapon(s) of camera. There are too many unknowns to make a judgment and the decision to fire is best left to the discretion of the individuals on the ground with all the facts.

While there are thugs and bad apples in the military as in any profession most of the guys are “everyman” who represent a cross section of America just like the members of the forum. They are as a group hardly blood thirsty killers and likely the conscience of many is haunted every time they have to pull the trigger. I know mine was.

We do not know what the mission of the soldiers is...perhaps they are a security element for a raid or cordon and search operation with orders to prevent people from escaping the area of search or the objective.

Perhaps the two guys on the bike had just engaged another element in their platoon (looks like a squad size unit to me in the clip) and they were stopping them from getting away.

Doesn't look like a deliberate ambush to me as the soldiers are not behind any kind of cover or in anything resembling ambush positions.

I don't speak German but my wife does I'll have her look at it later and tell me what the sub-titles say. I also can't hear the audio clear enough to determine any attempt to get the dudes to slow down or stop; however, any Afghani who is old enough to drive knows that you don't speed break neck speed through or into a formation of soldiers without taking your life into your own hands.

The anti-American bias is alive and well it seems. Perhaps all you arm chair generals should enlist and do a tour or 5 like me and see if you have a different interpretation of the words credible threat. One you see a few people blown up by some Hajji with a martyrdom wish your tune will change.

Originally posted by Somehumanbeing
Dead taliban on the left at 41 sec is wearing military equipment (chest-mounted webbing). According to the logic of you people, soldiers should wait for a vehicle speeding directly at them, to stop before firing. Ever heard of suicide bombers?

The one on top also appears to be wearing chest-mounted webbing.

edit on 28-3-2011 by Somehumanbeing because: (no reason given)

Gez i would hate to be a journalist in a war zone around you
"Look out people he has a kevlar vest and helmet on and whats that a AK-47 *camera* he must be a bad guy quick everyone shoot him"

Its a sad thing to see when someone supports this kind of brutality
call it what you will champ but this is murder full stop.
And before you get on you high horse I am ex Australian army

I know what the yanks are like on the battlefield but this takes it to a whole new level
the persons in this tape need to be put behind bars

reply to post by Viking9019


Yup, just like the police.

I hope this illustrates how police should never be able to learn military techniques.

First off this story is old and has been explained plenty of times. They ARE NOT innocent civilians, they are armed enemies. Also vehicle born IEDs have always been such a big threat and these guys didnt want to take any chances.

If you disagree with how the situation was handled go over there and get your change on but Im absolutely certain that anybody who has anything to live for, and of course a little experience fighting cowards, wouldve done the same thing.

reply to post by SphinxMontreal


Look..how were these troops supposed to know these guys were not suicide bombers? The passenger looks like he had some kind of duffle bag or something. I am not saying that this is right or wrong. What I am saying is that if I was in their situation, with these radicals blowing themselves up in crowds and roadside bombs, and cars running at barracades and blowing up, you bet I would take them out before they would even have a chance to get close to me...guaranteed...Don't blame the troops for the situation they are in, they are supposed to just be doing their jobs, blame the war mongers in Washington, and the people who are really controlling this country..the fat cat elite bankers who are protecting their investments abroad.

Originally posted by Golf66
The anti-American bias is alive and well it seems. Perhaps all you arm chair generals should enlist and do a tour or 5 like me and see if you have a different interpretation of the words credible threat. One you see a few people blown up by some Hajji with a martyrdom wish your tune will change.

Right on brother, I thank you for serving this country of ours.

reply to post by deltaboy


The U.S. Army did not such thing. Spiegel is on a propaganda campaign to smear Americans for any reason, as if there are no criminals or bad people in Germany A NWO under their control is so close they can smell it, with all the haters willingly working to guarantee it. We will know who to blame when it happens.

This propaganda is getting hot and heavy. To bad people at ATS can't actually Deny Ignorance and have honest conversations. Hate is like a drug that recreates itself inside the user. Blaming the entire Army for the actions of a few is so dishonest, anyone participating should hang their head in shame out of guilt. Lies are lies and liars are liars. Exaggeration is a lie. Spin is a lie. Pretending they are not lies is another lie.

The Hate is being used as a control device to divide and conquer and I can no longer fathom how many are falling for it. Won't work with intelligent, rational people but it's still maddening all the same. I never could abide liars, intellectual or otherwise.

reply to post by deltaboy


Well first off, war crimes don't exist. They are just ways to punish the loser.

Secondly, why would men dressed in camo be speeding into soldiers? While a bit of an overreaction, I cannot see how this is not a proper reaction.

At first I was a little shocked at the video, and believed these were innocent civilians. However I'd say that it's been proven that they were armed, and the driver did indeed try to run over the soldier that stepped up onto the road. I'd say it was a justified kill.

I don't support these needless wars, however.

reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL

couldnt agree anymore.........

Originally posted by Vicky32

Originally posted by byteshertz

The reason I say this kill was justified:

That's a disgusting piece of anti-human jargon. Killing is never justfied, full stop.
Vicky

And if you read my post you would see I agree - but as I said if you put yourself in that soldiers shoes it was 2 of them or risk their whole squad being killed. It was a split second decision - To clarify: I am not saying killing anyone is justified, I am saying his decision to kill was based on his situation - as I said, it does not mean they should be their to start with.

Good awareness. There was an instant my second tour in Iraq where I had to take out a driver who was driving straight toward three of our men. I had the visual so I took the shot on the driver, car wrecked and passenger got out, took the shot on him. I went and"checked my kill" both were armed with ak47's. They could have been civilians driving at us at a high rate of speed not paying attention. It is us or them and unfortunately in war your judgement and response time can either keep you alive, or dead.

It's shocking that some people Without knowing the context or background of this video,are outright accusing US troops of going around and gunning people down for the heck of it. It's just begging for some leftist or anti-American people to make lots of uninformed claims.
This video is from 2009. It's of 1/17 INF of 5th SBCT, I don't remember what company,I'm thinking bravo or charlie.
This video was a presence patrol in the Arghandab river valley,( it was NOT an ambush). The lead element accidentally ran into the Taliban trying to exit the area. The TB motor cycle was engaged because it came too close to the patrol and nearly ran into the squad leader
The biker would have only had two choices, stop and surrender or drive forward and get killed. It was a narrow road, so the chances of them turning around were virtually zero, but the squad leader tried to surprise them stepped forward out of his cover to engage the biker, but the driver drove toward him. If the squad had permission to engage these guys, why come out of your cover? Just dump your rounds on them without leaving your cover and concealment and then search their bodies- textbook ambush.
Do not ask me how I know.

reply to post by deltaboy

war zone
narrow alley
and they were racing at troops........Obama wasn't there so will ignore that part....as you never would be able to make it stick nor should you be able to

as far as the troops...well ole' boy who said let me check kill , was out of line after the fact........but truth is ...any military unit would of fired........most even quicker......but just my opinion

reply to post by Rastus3663

My dad was a battalion commander (LTC) in Viet Nam. He tells the story one time of when his helicopter (might have been 2 but included his command chopper) landed in the middle of a fishing village to interrogate the village elders then he noticed the stack of AK-47s (/\) and thought it best to leave and send in a platoon later at night. Real friendly by day but VC by night. I could relate a lot of stories (Korea, too).

Originally posted by CosmicCitizen
Just remember what you said when there is martial law in this country and US civilians are shot like "worthless" Afghans by foreign troops.

By and large, I agree with you - but do you really think that (martial law) is going to happen? And that you'll be shot by foreign troops? If it happens that you end up under martial law, I think it'll be your own troops that kill you.

reply to post by Vicky32

I believe that there are contingency plans for ML that go back to Rex 84 under the Continuity Of Government plans. I also think that many us soldiers will not participate in the order to round up civilians under ML for fema camps or even disarm them when the US Constitution is suspended. Some will (the ones being trained to conduct road blocks and go door to door in the Iraq and Afghanistan) but others will not. The later will be replaced by some foreign troops. To wit I submit the treaty between the US and Canada to supply military troops in the event of civilian insurrection (and informally with Mexico during the Katrina crisis but they were not used). Also one could argue that the NATO action in Libya sets the precedent for international military action to put down a civil war. I hope we never see that in this country but if there is a serious economic collapse and/or a widespread natural disaster then it will happen. The question is for how long.....6 months or long enough to permanently change the structure of our government?

Originally posted by NuclearPaul

Originally posted by lifeform11
this has nothing what so ever to do with the o.p. video.

They're both the 5th Stryker Brigade and possibly the same soldiers.

Gives a great insight into the mentality of these people. I think it's relevant.

possibly the same? so you don't even know your just going to assume?

no it does not give an insight at all. the story of the soliders posing with innocent afghans gives an insight of the mentality of those soliders only. it does not mean that everyone from their division/squadron or whatever has the same mentality or would do the same. your just tarring all with one brush.

with that logic your saying that if 4 people in the company where you work were exposed for bullying other workers and making their lives hell, then that would give an insight into your mentality.

Perhaps I missed something but since when do "kids" have a full-on Jihad beard goin' on? Must be too much testosterone in the the water over there. And this is just a video. I don't know about anybody else but mine had no audio. There could be more to this than meets the eye.

Oh, and let me take pot shots at you and send kids to your neighborhood with bombs strapped to their body for 9 years straight and we'll see if you get a little gun-shy and shell shock.