prostitution should be legalized

1)So now poverty does have something to do with it? A couple pages ago you said it was a completely different subject.....

2)Citing credible sources is not plagiarizing.

3)You are correct that it is not JUST america that has issues with sex. But it is most definitely and issue in america.

As a matter of eating my words you can look here and see that forcible rape rates in Nevada seem to be on the higher side. Not the highest for sure but in the higher side. Around 40 per 100K with most states being around 30 per 100K and the high ones being 50 per 100K.

As this seems to be all over the place I'm not sure it is telling about legalized prostitution. If it was telling we would expect to see Nevada as either highest or lowest as it is the only state in the union with legalized prostitution.

bjsdata.ojp.usdoj.gov...

reply to post by Jinglelord


So it would seem that it has no measurable increase or decrease would it not?

Originally posted by captaintyinknots


1)So now poverty does have something to do with it? A couple pages ago you said it was a completely different subject.....

2)Citing credible sources is not plagiarizing.

3)You are correct that it is not JUST america that has issues with sex. But it is most definitely and issue in america.

Man did you ever hit the nail on the head with point #3......people are so uptight about sexual behavior you would swear some of them just stepped off the Mayflower.

edit on 29-3-2011 by hp1229 because: typo/edit content

edit on 29-3-2011 by captaintyinknots because: (no reason given)

Originally posted by Jinglelord
As a matter of eating my words you can look here and see that forcible rape rates in Nevada seem to be on the higher side. Not the highest for sure but in the higher side. Around 40 per 100K with most states being around 30 per 100K and the high ones being 50 per 100K.

As this seems to be all over the place I'm not sure it is telling about legalized prostitution. If it was telling we would expect to see Nevada as either highest or lowest as it is the only state in the union with legalized prostitution.

bjsdata.ojp.usdoj.gov...

The real telling fact would be to get statistics from vegas and compare them with the rest of the state. Vegas ranks higher than the national average in nearly EVERY crime category which isnt surprising.

id like to know how many of those forcible rapes happen in vegas as compared to the rest of the state.

reply to post by hp1229


I do understand your point. I do not agree because I believe in freedom. You see there are up to 2000 laws passed per month(guessing an average)nation wide, and anyone who is not sovereign is watching their freedom dwindle to dictatorship. Government regulation is no better than dictatorship. I believe in Freedom which is what this country started with. It is people that do not sluff off the big brother attitude that allow this to continue. The reason that this is happening is because people refuse to respect others and take responsibility for their own actions.

reply to post by captaintyinknots


Ideally it would need to be looked at by county examining the counties where it is legal vs the counties where it is not. Of course this would likely also give misleading information as the counties have a smaller population.

The other thing to look at is that I wouldn't exactly call Nevada Brothels affordable or within the reach of most people for any kind of regular patronage. If it was universally legalized and accepted the pricing would become more reasonable while still providing a good living for sex workers. Many of these women can make in a busy brothel can make in excess of 100K working for only 6 months out of the year. And quite a few do much better. And this is after they give the house 50% and pay to rent a room. (This covers operating and legal expenses for the brothel)

I think if it was universally legal more brothels would need offer better packages for the women to attract the best and also need to lower prices for the clients. Everyone wins except the owners.

On the rape issue it is a commonly held belief among psychologists that rape has more to do with asserting power than it does with the sex act itself. If this is truly the case I wouldn't expect to see any change in the rape rate as in the legal brothel trade the man has little power and the woman has all the power.

Originally posted by Jinglelord
reply to post by captaintyinknots

 

Ideally it would need to be looked at by county examining the counties where it is legal vs the counties where it is not. Of course this would likely also give misleading information as the counties have a smaller population.

The other thing to look at is that I wouldn't exactly call Nevada Brothels affordable or within the reach of most people for any kind of regular patronage. If it was universally legalized and accepted the pricing would become more reasonable while still providing a good living for sex workers. Many of these women can make in a busy brothel can make in excess of 100K working for only 6 months out of the year. And quite a few do much better. And this is after they give the house 50% and pay to rent a room. (This covers operating and legal expenses for the brothel)

I think if it was universally legal more brothels would need offer better packages for the women to attract the best and also need to lower prices for the clients. Everyone wins except the owners.

On the rape issue it is a commonly held belief among psychologists that rape has more to do with asserting power than it does with the sex act itself. If this is truly the case I wouldn't expect to see any change in the rape rate as in the legal brothel trade the man has little power and the woman has all the power.

I honestly know nothing about the pricing and whatnot, as I've never actually been to one. I have studied the subject a bit though and do think yo are correct here. In any business model competition breeds lower pricing. If it were legal, there would be more competition.

I do agree that rape is often about power, in most cases, but I dont think that is true in all. Either way though, i do believe that legal brothels would lower rape to some degree.

I say this because even in a controlled environment it is still possible that men who are seeking that type of power could get it fulfilled by fantasy situations, and many brothels offer just that.

reply to post by captaintyinknots


Well I'd offer to show you around to find out about pricing but ATS doesn't allow us to form groups and go do "Research".

I'm sure that making prostitution legal would substantially reduce what is termed as "non-violent" rape (if there is such a thing) which is reported differently. This is your typical date rape situation or similar, I doubt that is so much about power as it is about men being unable to control themselves. (Note I find this deplorable and there is no excuse ever,self control is incredibly important for the world I envision).

Violent rape on the other hand I feel is primarily about power and as statistics show has little effect regardless of legal prostitution is available or not.

If you're ever in the Reno area most of the brothels there will let you just go in and hang out in their bar and check it out if you're curious. Be careful though, those women are among the best salesmen on earth...

Morality is still the rusty hammer wielded by those who can neither Find nor Use the Scalpel of Logic.

Every bit of research that is based on actual cases of legalized prostitution from around the world, AND the state of Nevada prove without question that Prostitution causes NO societal harm, or increases in disease, or rape or abortion or crime.
Every bit of available research shows emphatically that legalizing prostitution improves the negative aspects that persist in that sub set of humanity BECAUSE it is kept, illegal, but still highly sought after, and is left to the worst people with the worst set of principles, to be ruled over exclusively because "normal" society shuns it.

When you legalize something that was illegal, you take it OUT of the hands of the criminals who ran it, and put it into the hands of people, who want to be productive members of society.

Simple as that.

And no reasonable person will EVER fall for the false equivalencies of Prostitution and Murder, or Abortion, or disease.

The primary reason!

Reasonable people LIKE SEX. Reasonable people think sex is AWESOME. Reasonable people see sex as a positive thing and a positive reinforcement of our better ideals and values.

Sex is two or more people giving each other Pleasure. Kindness. tenderness. Face to Face time. Trust. Exploration. And Understanding.

Of course, the group most likely to repudiate all those things are the continuing control freak religious descendants of the Puritans.

The noble lie we tell each other in America is that the Puritans escaped religious persecution and found freedom in "the new land".

The reality is that the Puritans were forced out because everyone else in Europe was tired if their creepy hypocritical BS and kept pushing them further and further away from the "normal " people.

Originally posted by captaintyinknots
1)So now poverty does have something to do with it? A couple pages ago you said it was a completely different subject.....

2)Citing credible sources is not plagiarizing.

3)You are correct that it is not JUST america that has issues with sex. But it is most definitely and issue in america.

edit on 29-3-2011 by hp1229 because: typo/edit content

edit on 29-3-2011 by captaintyinknots because: (no reason given)

Well Poverty is part of the reasons besides several others which we have discussed and talked about such as forceful prostitution, molestation etc etc. Poverty in itself is a broad subject. Why are you going back and forth what was discussed couple pages ago where Poverty was used in a totally different context?

2) What is credible when it comes to Media or the Web and News? I am not indicating that citing source is plagiarizing. I am saying that copy pasting of contents from a link or re-typing the content is plagiarizing.

3) Sex might be an issue when it comes to openness and honest discussion about sexuality not just in US but possibly in other countries. Prostitution on the other hand IS an issue and also a byproduct of a society where sex is often abused, misunderstood and people have several misconceptions about sexual practices.

Doesnt knowledge, wisdom, real life interraction with other people count for postings on this thread? Why does everything has to be pointed to a Link on the website? or is this the future where we live our lives and believe others only if they present a web link?

Originally posted by Darkphoenix77
reply to post by Jinglelord

 

So it would seem that it has no measurable increase or decrease would it not?

The way I look at things sometimes is that the more we give, the more we will expect. Human nature is such where over a period of time, it will crave for more. Think about it this way when a person cannot afford to pay for a legal screw so he/she decides to Rape and possibly murder the victim because its free.

How many people(married/unmarried) do you think would pay for the screwing service and be able to sustain the cost of living and taxes in this economy? Only the one's that can afford to pay per screw will go for the service. What about the others who cannot afford to pay for it?

Originally posted by hp1229

Originally posted by captaintyinknots
1)So now poverty does have something to do with it? A couple pages ago you said it was a completely different subject.....

2)Citing credible sources is not plagiarizing.

3)You are correct that it is not JUST america that has issues with sex. But it is most definitely and issue in america.

edit on 29-3-2011 by hp1229 because: typo/edit content

edit on 29-3-2011 by captaintyinknots because: (no reason given)

Well Poverty is part of the reasons besides several others which we have discussed and talked about such as forceful prostitution, molestation etc etc. Poverty in itself is a broad subject. Why are you going back and forth what was discussed couple pages ago where Poverty was used in a totally different context?

2) What is credible when it comes to Media or the Web and News? I am not indicating that citing source is plagiarizing. I am saying that copy pasting of contents from a link or re-typing the content is plagiarizing.

3) Sex might be an issue when it comes to openness and honest discussion about sexuality not just in US but possibly in other countries. Prostitution on the other hand IS an issue and also a byproduct of a society where sex is often abused, misunderstood and people have several misconceptions about sexual practices.

Doesnt knowledge, wisdom, real life interraction with other people count for postings on this thread? Why does everything has to be pointed to a Link on the website? or is this the future where we live our lives and believe others only if they present a web link?

You are right prostitution IS an issue and also a byproduct of a society where sex is often abused, misunderstood and people have several misconceptions about sexual practices. However it has been supported by facts that if prostitution were LEGALIZED these problems may very well go away.

Because without a source of proof anyone could say anything...doesn't mean that it is true. I could say that Armstrong never went to the moon, a bear named Barney that spoke english fluently was there first and had a conversation over tea and crumpets with aliens from the Wolf 359 system about the state of the union address the other night while Elvis Presley played a private concert for them on top of the space capsule . It doesn't make it remotely true or even plausable. That is why hard concrete proof helps substantiate your case as opposed to just someone's opinion over what might happen.

Originally posted by Darkphoenix77
Originally posted by captaintyinknots

Man did you ever hit the nail on the head with point #3......people are so uptight about sexual behavior you would swear some of them just stepped off the Mayflower.

Ever heard of Kamasutra? Its not a sex manual but its a scientific and spiritual approach to human nature and one of the necessity (SEX). Below is the link with some information (not detailed). There are several versions and variants of this book available all over the world.

KAMASUTRA

In addition, there are intructions and physical exercises in the Tantric Yoga practice that actually helps with Sex Life for those who're interested in improving their sex life (male or female) and enjoy a happy sex life with their partner.

Below are 2 links with some information on tantric sex.

TANTRIC1
TANTRIC2

Getting back to the topic, why do you think people are so uptight about Sex? I know sex is natural, beautiful and part of human nature just like other behaviours.

Originally posted by hp1229

Originally posted by Darkphoenix77
reply to post by Jinglelord

 

So it would seem that it has no measurable increase or decrease would it not?

The way I look at things sometimes is that the more we give, the more we will expect. Human nature is such where over a period of time, it will crave for more. Think about it this way when a person cannot afford to pay for a legal screw so he/she decides to Rape and possibly murder the victim because its free.

You can't really cite this as an example, if someone decides to resort to anything because they cannot afford it THAT makes them a crimnal plain and simple. It would not contribute to such behavior.

How many people(married/unmarried) do you think would pay for the screwing service and be able to sustain the cost of living and taxes in this economy? Only the one's that can afford to pay per screw will go for the service. What about the others who cannot afford to pay for it?

If it were legal competition makes the price go down. If you do not have the money for it you do without or *gasp* it may actually help people become SOCIAL and less introverted.

sorry...accidental double post

Originally posted by Darkphoenix77

Originally posted by hp1229

Originally posted by captaintyinknots

edit on 29-3-2011 by hp1229 because: typo/edit content

edit on 29-3-2011 by captaintyinknots because: (no reason given)

However it has been supported by facts that if prostitution were LEGALIZED these problems may very well go away.

Somehow I find it hard to believe that it will help the society in the long run.
It might make a difference in the short run but definitely not in the long run though there hasn't been any extensive case studies conducted in Nevada for now. I am not sure if any studies were conducted in Netherland.

I can site to several websites for readings but that would be once again speculation in reality by others on the web.

reply to post by hp1229


I think you have a point as exaggerated as it MAY be. In my mind I see the answer thusly, Just as we have 5 star restaurants we also have fast food. They both feed you but the quality is vastly different. I know a few "Escorts" that charge $1000/ night and I have met women that give a BJ for $5 quality goes down but is affordable.

reply to post by hp1229


I believe that our(majority) sexual beliefs are based on the Puritan thought pattern. For some reason the retentiveness remained. As I spent a good amount of time in Europe I realize that sexuality is far more free than it is in the U.S.

Originally posted by Darkphoenix77

Originally posted by hp1229

Originally posted by Darkphoenix77
reply to post by Jinglelord

 

So it would seem that it has no measurable increase or decrease would it not?

If it were legal competition makes the price go down. If you do not have the money for it you do without or *gasp* it may actually help people become SOCIAL and less introverted.

Or rely on the age old practice of stealing or forcing for something that one cannot obtain through the use of currency. It remains to be seen if it helps or not in the future when and IF prostitution becomes legal in other states and not just Nevada for the US.