Do you believe in signals?

Originally posted by Tindalos2013
reply to post by JonoEnglish

 

Sometimes I do not. Chaos, my sirE has tricked me on more than one occassion. I can't be held responsible for bloody every probability my choices put forth. CHAOS is CHAOS. I am at times at its whim and times I am not. For the most part I just play with reality and see what happens. Good or bad. Its how I learn things. About the world, about myself and others. It's all chaos, fricking, chaos. THE BUTTERFLY EFFECT in my opinion is brilliant. Sorry if I ramble on but sirE gets me excited and makes me spin.

LOL Tindalos I love rambles

Chaos is life!
Without chaos there would only be fate.
That is the true death of creativity, freedom and freewill.

reply to post by American-philosopher



Yeah, i believe what doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Daft as it may sound, that advice has seen me through many bad scrapes.

However, to have signals from an outside force or entity, warnng you of an event doesn't make sense. If that entity has the power to influence reality, why doesn't that power prevent the bad from happening given the power of the butterfly effect? To change the small, over time will change the big.

Originally posted by gatewaywithin
reply to post by JonoEnglish

 

Experience?

Yes, 40 years worth.
It's a well known fact, that thoughts become things.
You don't need to be a quantum physicist to comprehend it, a semi-decent memory will do.

How many times have you thought of someone and they call?
How many times have you asked yourself a question and it is quickly answered in some unorthodox way?

We are constantly creating our reality with every thought we think.

Lol Gateway...old man! being such an old age of 40, you will have seen the world change so much! Colour tv, computers......

Cr*p I'm 37.... I'm still younger than you though wise old man.

I do agree, life is all about what we experience. Enough people that nut you (nut in the uk means headbut!!) wearing a blue shirt, will make you weary of people wearing a blue shirt.

reply to post by JonoEnglish


I don;t wanna go around in circles with you. But the higher force is putting that event in motion. It is up to you how you handle it or don;t handle it. what someone else said free will,

Rationally, no, I don't believe in these things.

But in practice I am very superstitious and always looking out for signs and portents, etc.

I think these are two different parts of our brain, the rational and the...whatever it its.

They aren't always compatible, but for some weird reason it is possible for a human to operate in these dual "modes."

That's OK, I don't have a particular problem with that.

I believe this does happen although I won't pretend to know who or what causes it. It seems the more I think about it the more it happens. Maybe I'm just seeing patterns but that doesn't matter. What matters is how I decide to react to these "signals". I don't care what outside influences I come across I am the the final decision maker. Also things can usually be interpreted many different ways so it is truly up to the individual. Blindly following anything is just unacceptable in my book but everything is up for interpretation.

Originally posted by American-philosopher
reply to post by JonoEnglish

 

I don;t wanna go around in circles with you. But the higher force is putting that event in motion. It is up to you how you handle it or don;t handle it. what someone else said free will,

I understand the free will bit, this choice at a given point in our life put in place by a higher force etc. That doesn't make sense. As complex as life is, given the chances and probablities we are faced with, why would a higher force need to intervene in our life to provide the opportunity of the free will to that event. Given that free will is already there in every stage of our lives.

By intervening, and giving us clues, we are not free to choose the right path. We are guided down that path. therefore that choice can't be ours to take any credit for.

If I was a god and i gave you a warning, by playing a songs over the radio that hinted to you, that a bridge would collapse, Then you came across a bridge, would you cross it? You have the fredom to choose, sure, but I would have persuaded you to think twice and warn you about the possibility of a bridge collapsing. Therefore you don't have freewill as you are being influenced to some degree. Yes, you may say freewill is a choice. Yes you are right, but that intervention is a restriction of your life path.

Freewill taken from dictionary.com "The power of making free choices that are unconstrained by external circumstances or by an agency such as fate or divine will."

So by that description, we don't have freewill if there are signs or signals from a higher force to an event.

reply to post by Tarnished Templar


rationally no you don;t believe in those type of things right. But there is something out there in the intangible realm. That you can;t see, touch, hear, smell, taste. But you are superstitious about some things this is that intangible thing that is out there for you that your brain is telling you it is irrational is just your brain being scared off something it doesn;t understand.

Originally posted by American-philosopher
reply to post by Tarnished Templar

 

rationally no you don;t believe in those type of things right. But there is something out there in the intangible realm. That you can;t see, touch, hear, smell, taste. But you are superstitious about some things this is that intangible thing that is out there for you that your brain is telling you it is irrational is just your brain being scared off something it doesn;t understand.

Kids are scared of the dark. Heck, I used to lay bricks in bed at night, as a kid (not anymore I must add) thinking of what was under my bed at night.

If you can't hear, see, smell touch or taste it, it can't be real. Ok, imagination is great, however, that is what makes us work though the possibilities of life. However rational or irrational they might seem.

We can only rationalise what we can prove. Not only by our own unique experiences but that of other people who witness the same thing too.

However, witnesses can also tell the same story in many ways. So I guess we can only rationalise things based on science and mathematics.

That's why we love them subjects (not that I'm good at either of them). At least you can prove it correct, if not you are a genius.

reply to post by JonoEnglish


okay you mentioned intervening lets go with that. And since were talking about God lets use an example from the bible. Moses when he parted the red sea that was god intervening so he could lead his people across. But moses still had his free will to act and go forward. does that make sense??

If you can't hear, see, smell touch or taste it, it can't be real. Ok, imagination is great, however, that is what makes us work though the possibilities of life. However rational or irrational they might seem.

reply to post by JonoEnglish


What?! Bulloux!! isn;t that how it is said in Britain. I think. You have never heard of expanded consciousness? Is this the type of thinking the reason why we can't unloack 1/10th of the mysteries of the universe??

reply to post by Yeah-Alright

I believe there are "check-points" or "markers" in life to remind people of their path and be "on track" on the life experience that they chose to experience.

Originally posted by American-philosopher

If you can't hear, see, smell touch or taste it, it can't be real. Ok, imagination is great, however, that is what makes us work though the possibilities of life. However rational or irrational they might seem.

reply to post by JonoEnglish

 

What?! Bulloux!! isn;t that how it is said in Britain. I think. You have never heard of expanded consciousness? Is this the type of thinking the reason why we can't unloack 1/10th of the mysteries of the universe??

No my friend, it's pronounced bollox, well depending on which County you come from.

I've never heard of expanded consciousness. Is that something to do with sudoku? (just kiddin guv! )

Yes, there are things we don't understand, and people will come up with theories but those theories don't make it a fact until proof can be obtained. Even then, that proof maybe one day be proved wrong.

Please, I'm not poo-pooing any ideas or notions on things, I'm just expressing my own opinion. Which, usually is wrong, well, according to my girlfriend anyway.

Originally posted by American-philosopher
reply to post by JonoEnglish

 

okay you mentioned intervening lets go with that. And since were talking about God lets use an example from the bible. Moses when he parted the red sea that was god intervening so he could lead his people across. But moses still had his free will to act and go forward. does that make sense??

Not being funny, but if I was being chased by guys with spears, then the sea parted, I'd run through the gap like hell was chasing me.

That's just a story though.

This really breaks down into two specific arguments. One, that there are no coincidences; there is meaning or otherworldly direction behind specific events. Two, events that occur that seem to point to otherworldly intervention are simply a coincidence, or luck. Can this debate be answered? I say no, not with our current understanding of the world, physics, reality. Take a look at the double slit experiment performed at the quantum level if you really want to bend your understanding of reality. Basically, matter on the smallest level behaves differently when it is observed/measured than when it is not observed. Why? We really can't answer the question. But it really makes you think, does a tree that falls in the forest make a sound if no one is around to hear it?

Originally posted by truthwilout
This really breaks down into two specific arguments. One, that there are no coincidences; there is meaning or otherworldly direction behind specific events. Two, events that occur that seem to point to otherworldly intervention are simply a coincidence, or luck. Can this debate be answered? I say no, not with our current understanding of the world, physics, reality. Take a look at the double slit experiment performed at the quantum level if you really want to bend your understanding of reality. Basically, matter on the smallest level behaves differently when it is observed/measured than when it is not observed. Why? We really can't answer the question. But it really makes you think, does a tree that falls in the forest make a sound if no one is around to hear it?

Yes, but I'm sure that double slit experiemnt is wrong! it doesnt make sense!

Ok, there must be a point geographically where that proton acknowledges it's being observed in order for it to split. At what point does it split? Does it have intelligence?

reply to post by JonoEnglish

Well that's just the point isn't it. We can't tell geographically when it decides to split, because at that point it is implied that it is being observed and therefore behaving differently. Catch 22, chicken or the egg, etc.

Originally posted by truthwilout
reply to post by JonoEnglish

 

Well that's just the point isn't it. We can't tell geographically when it decides to split, because at that point it is implied that it is being observed and therefore behaving differently. Catch 22, chicken or the egg, etc.

That's just the thing that makes me question the science behind it.
I'm going to have to look that one up again, it confussed the hell out of me the first time i saw it no doubt it will do again.

The only thing we can say for sure is the fact of observing causes the effect of the proton to go through both holes. Not seen by a human but by machine.

However, seeing as a proton can't sense it is being observed we must agree that it must happen, regardless of being observed, or else how would it know to at that point in time?

Have they tricked that little tricky proton, pretending not to observe it, then at the last millisecond (or whatever) for it to go past that point of spltting to get through those two holes?

Off topic, Going to check on a thread about this.