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History repeats itself: WWI, WWII, and Present Day

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posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 03:30 AM
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Hey everyone,
So I was mediating today, and at the end of my session the phrase "history repeats itself" popped into my head.
For some reason, it led me to do a little research, and I will present the information I have found, as I find it interesting, and I think many of you will learn something new, just like I have.
Now I am not saying WWIII is going to break out, but I do see some connections between our current situation, the early 1930s, and the early 1900s.

Before we begin, I would like to make some things clear:
I am not claiming to be an expert on any of these topics, I am merely doing my own research, and presenting you with my findings, because I believe things like this need to be discussed and are important.
Please do not bash this thread, If i made a mistake, please just be nice and correct me, I am here to learn, just like i am sure you all are.
I apologize for some of my sources, mainly Wikipedia, but i find that wikipedia sums up many topics nicely.
If you find any errors in some quotes, or anything that is just flat out false, please let me know.

Anyone with some knowledge on these topics who wants to expand on something or add to the info that i have presented, please do, as i would love to learn more about this kind of stuff.

Now that that's out of the way, Let us begin.
Hope you all get something out of this thread.
Enjoy the ride:

World War 1

The panic of 1907



The Panic of 1907, also known as the 1907 Bankers' Panic, was a financial crisis that occurred in the United States when the New York Stock Exchange fell close to 50% from its peak the previous year. Panic occurred, as this was during a time of economic recession, and there were numerous runs on banks and trust companies. The 1907 panic eventually spread throughout the nation when many state and local banks and businesses entered into bankruptcy. Primary causes of the run include a retraction of market liquidity by a number of New York City banks and a loss of confidence among depositors, exacerbated by unregulated side bets at bucket shops.[1] The crisis was triggered by the failed attempt in October 1907 to corner the market on stock of the United Copper Company. When this bid failed, banks that had lent money to the cornering scheme suffered runs that later spread to affiliated banks and trusts, leading a week later to the downfall of the Knickerbocker Trust Company—New York City's third-largest trust. The collapse of the Knickerbocker spread fear throughout the city's trusts as regional banks withdrew reserves from New York City banks. Panic extended across the nation as vast numbers of people withdrew deposits from their regional banks. The panic may have deepened if not for the intervention of financier J. P. Morgan, who pledged large sums of his own money, and convinced other New York bankers to do the same, to shore up the banking system. At the time, the United States did not have a central bank to inject liquidity back into the market. By November the financial contagion had largely ended, yet a further crisis emerged when a large brokerage firm borrowed heavily using the stock of Tennessee Coal, Iron and Railroad Company (TC&I) as collateral. Collapse of TC&I's stock price was averted by an emergency takeover by Morgan's U.S. Steel Corporation—a move approved by anti-monopolist president Theodore Roosevelt. The following year, Senator Nelson W. Aldrich established and chaired a commission to investigate the crisis and propose future solutions, leading to the creation of the Federal Reserve System.


en.wikipedia.org...
Go the link for more information.
So, the federal reserve did not exist at the time, so instead of the FR feeding money into the system like they do today, the wealthy loaned their money to the banks. John D. Rockefeller deposited $10million US, and JP Morgan got the government and some trust companies to loan out a few million dollars as well.
This was done because everyone was going to the banks to take out their money. The banks needed the extra money because they really didn't have all the money to give back to the people.
I think this video series really sums up the banking business simply:


Here's a little summary of the video:



Debt-government, corporate and household has reached astronomical proportions. Where does all this money come from? How could there BE that money to lend? The answer is there isn't. Today money IS debt. If there were no debt there would be no money If this is puzzling to you. you are not alone. Very few people understand, even though all of us are affected.


This leads us to the panic of 1910-11 and the creation on the federal reserve system.

The panic of 1910

I was searching for "depressions before world war 1" and came across what is known as "the panic of 1910".
There isn't that much information out there on this subject, but basically,



The Panic of 1910-1911 was a slight economic depression that followed the enforcement of the Sherman Anti-Trust Act. It mostly affected the stock market and business traders who were smarting from the activities of trust busters, especially with the breakup of the Standard Oil Company.

Taken off wikipedia. (sorry, not the best source)

The next set of quotes were taken from a blog site. I apologize for the source, but it was the best one I could find on the subject.




even though it was a slight economic depression, it's apparently not true that 'nothing was done.' In 1910, seven men held a secret meeting on Jekyll Island off the coast of Georgia. It's estimated that those seven men represented one-sixth of the world's wealth. Six were Americans representing J.P. Morgan, John D. Rockefeller, and the U.S. government. One was a European representing the Rothschilds and Warburgs. In 1913, the U.S. Federal Reserve Bank was created as a direct result of that secret meeting. finance.yahoo.com...


A few years later, America joins in on the world war, in 1917.
Here's a little table to show a few factors that were affected by the war:
US WWI table
Sorry, I couldn't embed the table, but just go to the link and scroll down to table 1.
It is interesting to note the jump in the revenues of the federal government after they join the war.

WWII

Before the start of world war II, there was the infamous Great depression. Here are a few facts:




The Great Depression was a severe worldwide economic depression in the decade preceding World War II. The timing of the Great Depression varied across nations, but in most countries it started in about 1929 and lasted until the late 1930s or early 1940s.[1] It was the longest, most widespread, and deepest depression of the 20th century. In the 21st century, the Great Depression is commonly used as an example of how far the world's economy can decline.[2] The depression originated in the U.S., starting with the fall in stock prices that began around September 4, 1929 and became worldwide news with the stock market crash of October 29, 1929 (known as Black Tuesday). From there, it quickly spread to almost every country in the world. The Great Depression had devastating effects in virtually every country, rich and poor. Personal income, tax revenue, profits and prices dropped while international trade plunged by ½ to ⅔. Unemployment in the U.S. rose to 25%, and in some countries rose as high as 33%.[3] Cities all around the world were hit hard, especially those dependent on heavy industry. Construction was virtually halted in many countries. Farming and rural areas suffered as crop prices fell by approximately 60%.[4][5][6] Facing plummeting demand with few alternate sources of jobs, areas dependent on primary sector industries such as cash cropping, mining and logging suffered the most.[7] Some economies started to recover by the mid-1930s. However, in many countries the negative effects of the Great Depression lasted until the start of World War II.[8]


Source



Herbert Hoover (1874-1964), a Republican, was president when the Great Depression began. He infamously declared in March 1930 that the U.S. had “passed the worst” and argued that the economy would sort itself out. The worst, however, had just begun and would last until the outbreak of WWII (1939)





The Wall Street Crash of 1929 was one of the main causes of the Great Depression. “Black Thursday,” “Black Monday,” and “Black Tuesday” are all correct terms to describe the Crash because the initial crash occurred over several days, with Tuesday being the most devastating.





On “Black Tuesday,” October 29, 1929, the market lost $14 billion, making the loss for that week an astounding $30 billion. This was ten times more than the annual federal budget and far more than the U.S. had spent in WWI.e Thirty billion dollars would be equivalent to $377,587,032,770.41 today.





The Dow Jones market peaked at 381 on September 3, 1929, and bottomed out at 42 in 1932, which is an amazing 89% decline. It did not reach 381 again until 23 years later in 1955 (that doesn’t include inflation losses)





Causes of the Great Depression are widely debated but typically include a weak banking system, overproduction, bursting credit bubble, the fact that farmers and industrial workers had not shared in the prosperity of the 1920s, and a government-held laissez faire policy.





During the worst years of the Depression (1933-1934) the overall jobless rate was 25% (1 out of 4 people) with another 25% taking wage cuts or working part time. The gross national product fell by almost 50%. It was not until 1941, when WWII was underway, that unemployment officially fell back below 10%





The Hawley-Smoot Tariff Act of 1930 increased U.S. tariffs which, in turn, decreased international trade (especially in the farming sector) and helped spread the Great Depression worldwide.j As it spread, it became partly responsible for Nazism in Germany and for WWII (1939-1945)





As news of the stock market crash spread, customers rushed to their banks to withdraw their money, sparking disastrous “bank runs.” Nobel prize-winning economist Milton Friedman argues that the 1930s market crash itself did not cause the depression, but rather it was the collapse of the banking system during waves of public panic during 1930-1933.





As he did during WWII, Joseph P. Kennedy (JFK’s father) amassed an enormous amount of wealth through real estate (among other ventures) during the Great Depression. Without this money, he could not have financed his son’s successful run for the presidency




Some scholars find the 2009 economic condition more troubling than that of the 1930s' Great Depression because debt in 2009 includes not only stocks but also millions of homes, property, local governments, and entire nations. Also, in contrast to the 1930s, the U.S. is now a debtor nation and more households in the U.S. are in far greater debt.


Source

Here's a graph of Americas GDP before and after the war:



September 11, 2001 and the war in Iraq

I might be reaching a little with this one, but i thought I'd just provide the facts and let you decide for yourselves.

The early 1990s recession




Causes On Black Monday of October 1987 a stock collapse of unprecedented size caused the Dow Jones Industrial Average to fall by 22.6%. This collapse, larger than that of 1929, was handled well by the economy, and the stock market began to quickly recover. However, in North America, the lumbering savings and loans industry was beginning to collapse, leading to a savings and loan crisis which put the financial wellbeing of millions of Americans in jeopardy. The panic that followed led to a sharp recession through financial contagion, that hit hardest those countries most closely linked to the United States, including Canada, Australia, and the United Kingdom. The economies of much of Europe and Japan were hurt, but not as badly. The US economy continued to grow as a whole, although certain sectors of the market such as energy and real estate slumped. The first burst of the recession was short-lived, as fervent pre-election activity by the governments of the United States and Canada created what many economists at the time saw as an economic miracle: a growing consumer confidence and increased consumer spending almost single-handedly lifted the North American economy out of recession. It soon turned out that the quick recovery was illusory, and by 1990, economic malaise had returned with the beginning of the Gulf War and the resulting 1990 spike in the price of oil, which increased inflation but to less of a degree as the oil crisis ten years earlier. Nevertheless, for the next several years high unemployment, massive government budgetary deficits, and slow Gross Domestic Product (GDP) growth affected the United States until late 1992 and Canada until 1995. The rest of the world was less affected by the downturn; Germany and Japan both grew rapidly. Some pundits guessed that this would be a permanent state of affairs and that both the German and Japanese economies would grow to be larger than the American one. Like all recessions, the one of the late 1980s and early 1990s had a profound impact on society. Rates of alcoholism and drug abuse increased, as did rates of depression.


source



On September 11th, 2001, America was hit with a "terrorist attack", which led them to invade Iraq in 2003.
There is still some debate on the effect of the war on the economy of the US, but I am almost certain the government and oil companies a profiting off that war like crazy.

Late 2000s recession - Present day




The late-2000s recession, more often called the Great Recession or simply The Recession,[1][2] was a severe global economic recession that began in the United States in December 2007 and ended in June 2009, according to the U.S. National Bureau of Economic Research (NBER).[3] However, heightened unemployment and economic hardship remain in many countries.[4][5] The Great Recession has affected the entire world economy, with higher detriment in some countries than others. It was a global recession characterized by various systemic imbalances and was sparked by the outbreak of the 2007 to present Financial crisis. In July 2009, it was announced that a growing number of economists believed that the recession may have ended.[6][7] However, in the United States, the requisite two consecutive quarters of growth in the GDP was not confirmed until the end of 2009.


source

According to the source, the recession ended in June of 2009. I am no economist, but i tend to disagree with that statement. I believe America is still in a recession and things are getting worse as time goes on.




Debate over origins The central debate about the origin has been focused on the respective parts played by the public monetary policy (in the US notably) and by private financial institutions practices. On October 15, 2008, Anthony Faiola, Ellen Nakashima, and Jill Drew wrote a lengthy article in The Washington Post titled, "What Went Wrong".[2] In their investigation, the authors claim that former Federal Reserve Board Chairman Alan Greenspan, Treasury Secretary Robert Rubin, and SEC Chairman Arthur Levitt vehemently opposed any regulation of financial instruments known as derivatives. They further claim that Greenspan actively sought to undermine the office of the Commodity Futures Trading Commission, specifically under the leadership of Brooksley E. Born, when the Commission sought to initiate regulation of derivatives. Ultimately, it was the collapse of a specific kind of derivative, the mortgage-backed security, that triggered the economic crisis of 2008. While Greenspan's role as Chairman of the Federal Reserve has been widely discussed (the main point of controversy remains the lowering of Federal funds rate at only 1% for more than a year which, according to the Austrian School of economics, allowed huge amounts of "easy" credit-based money to be injected into the financial system and thus create an unsustainable economic boom),[3][4] there is also the argument that Greenspan actions in the years 2002–2004 were actually motivated by the need to take the U.S. economy out of the early 2000s recession caused by the bursting of the dot-com bubble — although by doing so he did not help avert the crisis, but only postpone it.




Some economists - those of the Austrian school and those predicting the recession such as Steve Keen - claim that the ultimate point of origin of the great financial crisis of 2007–2010 can be traced back to an extremely indebted US economy. The collapse of the real estate market in 2006 was the close point of origin of the crisis. The failure rates of subprime mortgages were the first symptom of a credit boom tuned to bust and of a real estate shock. But large default rates on subprime mortgages cannot account for the severity of the crisis. Rather, low-quality mortgages acted as an accelerant to the fire that spread through the entire financial system. The latter had become fragile as a result of several factors that are unique to this crisis: the transfer of assets from the balance sheets of banks to the markets, the creation of complex and opaque assets, the failure of ratings agencies to properly assess the risk of such assets, and the application of fair value accounting. To these novel factors, one must add the now standard failure of regulators and supervisors in spotting and correcting the emerging weaknesses.[7] Robert Reich points out the amount of debt in the US economy can be traced to economic inequality, where middle class wages remain stagnant while wealth concentrates at the top, and households "pull equity from their homes and overload on debt to maintain living standards


source

Here's a graph comparing job losses from our current recessions:



As you can see, our current situation is pretty serious to put it lightly.

Conclusion

I hope you enjoyed all the information that I have presented to you in this thread. I have personally learned a lot today through my research, and i hope you have come out with some new knowledge.
I believe history really does repeat itself, and I have tried to show you all this through this thread.
America has always been in major economic struggles before major wars, and before the system collapses and the people in power with the majority of the country's wealth lose it all, they start a war, but make it look like they are the victims so that they have the majority of the country's support (look up the Lusitania sinking, pearl harbor, 9/11, etc.)
It looks like we are heading in the same direction once again, and tensions are rising with all the things going on in Libya, Afghanistan, Iraq, etc.
Some people may think that this isn't as bad as the depression in the 1930s, but our current situation could very well be worse than that already. There are things that make our current situation not look as bad as it may really be. Some of the effects may not be felt until the next few years. On top of that, the government just prints trillions of dollars and puts it into the economy and bails out bankrupt businesses, which doesn't solve anything, but just masks the problem for some time, and probably makes it worse over that span.
How can we say that this is a so called "free market" when we have the government bailing out companies that failed?
Anyway, I encourage you all to do your own research, and it would be great if you could share some info with us all in this thread. For those of you with more insight, I'd love to hear what you have to say.
Also, please correct me if i was wrong with anything i said.
I am not claiming to know all about this, I am just doing my own research and trying to connect the dots, just like all of you should be doing.
I think it is great to have a site like ATS where we can share our thoughts, ideas, and research with each other.

Thanks for reading,
Bulletproof_monk

Mod note : Posting work written by others.– Please Review This Link.
edit on 25-3-2011 by xpert11 because: Mod note , add external quotes




posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 03:49 AM
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Good thread ,War what is it good for ?Absolutely Nothing, except the economy,population reduction , employment,technology advances and bigger,better killing machines that can be used next time around. Onwards and upwards

edit on 24-3-2011 by 12voltz because: i am to old to be drafted



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 04:06 AM
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I think that is a fair observation. It's not like we ever go "Oops! We're killing ourselves!" or "Woops, did it again! Dang!" Yeah, we're doomed. If only there were someway to convince people that wars are bad, and murder is bad. . .I don't know what it would take to accomplish such a feat.

However, you can bet if one group of people figure it out, another group will kill them for that secret!



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 06:15 AM
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reply to post by bulletproof_monk
 


OP, to make a bit more sense out of this, I think you should read Albert Pike's "Morals and Dogma", as it outlines the prime objectives to the three major global conflicts known as "World Wars".

I believe they are as follows --

WW I - to dismantle the Ottoman Empire
WW II - to establish a Jewish State in the Middle East
WW III - to simultaneously destroy Islam, Christianity, and Atheism in one fell swoop
(I have a hunker that massive depopulation may have been re-written into the fine print of this one)

it's a fairly laborious and wordy read... however among many things.. illustrates a trajectory that top socio-political planners still follow IMO.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 08:23 AM
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reply to post by 12voltz
 


Thanks,
Yeah, i think that the system that we rely on is bound to collapse. This is why the government keeps starting wars, so that they can keep this system going for as long as possible.
Just when things are about to hit rock bottom, we always end up going to war with somebody to either "spread democracy", or to get revenge for the people that the "enemy" killed.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 08:27 AM
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reply to post by Divine Strake
 


Well, i think there is a minority that think war is bad.
The majority of people are brainwashed and agree with everything the government says. They've been conditioned this way for all their lives.
There are those people that think it makes them more manly and tough if their country is fighting wars and killing the terrorists and bad guys. We really need to get rid of this nationalism crap because it causes much more bad then good.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 08:29 AM
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reply to post by prevenge
 


Thanks, I'll check it out.
So are you saying they are going to try and kill all the islams, chistians, and atheists like Hitler tried to kill all the jews in WWII?



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 09:10 AM
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In trying to contribute to this thread
I fumbled around with a bunch of charts and graphs.
Overlaying GDP with population charts, showing how birth rates
and aging populations has a lot to do with all of this, but in the end
I decided to just add this chart. I feel it is more on topic with the OP.


David Grouchy





Notice the relationship between the years 1910 and a scaled version of one chart in the first post.

So if we want to know what is next,
all we have to do is look at population.
Do we have a sustainable birth rate of 2.3.
Do we have more young people than old, or
do we actually have people living longer, and few children.






Great thread.
I hope this contribution helps
and does not detract from the work in the OP.



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 12:02 AM
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Thanks for the contribution.
really like that graph.
I think the US is under the 2.3 rate isn't it? You also have to consider immigration, which is probably a big part of the US population even today.



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 02:19 AM
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Originally posted by bulletproof_monk
reply to post by prevenge
 


Thanks, I'll check it out.
So are you saying they are going to try and kill all the islams, chistians, and atheists like Hitler tried to kill all the jews in WWII?


If Pike was a high level Grand Master Mason, and Fremasonry is solidly based in Judaic / Kabbalistic Esoteric principles... And Pike layed out this 'plan' (if it was indeed Pike's writing or a council of collaborative writers that published it through him..) ... AND Hitler was funded by Freemason money... ie: IBM, Harriman & Co, Prescott Bush etc.. then one could suggest that the 'extermination' reasoning that is commonly taught in history about Hitler's "plans".. might be a sort of half-truth cover... for genetic and chemical experimentation on certain haplogroups within the Jewish people....

I don't think it's about 'extermination' .. i think it's about 'solving' the 'problem' of conflicting versions of concepts of reality .. ie: religions.. I think the elimination of Christianity, Islam, Atheism could come from the scientific proof of man transversing into divinity.. a metamorphosis put into action by the powers that be.. biologically activating 'junk' DNA through world wide kundalini awakening.. spurred by a tipping point circa 12/21/2012 ... to scientifically play out the processes within the activation of the churches in Revelation (chakras) ..to essentially activate and metamorphosis certain people who are genetically viable to experience the change ASAP... thus producing a race of 'super-men' .. ie: Hitler's goal.. disguised in villany...

I'm in NO way any.. neo-nazi blank minded ignorant fool singing his praises mind you...
it's a difficult wire to walk and I don't go around preaching it.. for the sake of the subject matter's absolutely sensitive material in relation to people's feelings about it...

produce the end-time Apocrypha of Christianity and Islam, with REAL human divinity resulting.. and you've destroyed Christianity and Islam and Atheism.. or at least set the stage for their destruction....

That's kind of what I'm saying they're aiming to do... who knows.. maybe there was fine print under each "goal" for every main world conflict Pike had set out in paper for Freemasons to follow...




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