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Who's in charge? Germans pull forces out of NATO as Libyan coalition falls apart

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posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 03:05 AM
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America has enough fire power alone to fix this rather small 'arms' situation, although this is a political mess. The whole idea was to create a very very fake public relations stunt to show the rest of the world that america and europe will not stand by and watch a nutty dictator kill thousands of his own people in cold blood.

However, the hidden goal and always will be is the oil. We all know this. Oil is power in this very oil dependent world we live in.

If the germans want to go home then thats really up to them, its a politcal mess which a lot of countrys do not want to get drawn in on.

It is a bit like a stab in the back, or the friend that walks away when your in your hour of need. Although who can blame a government for keeping what is in there best interest rather than jumping in to take a few punches.

It will not be forgotten though, ever.
edit on 24-3-2011 by fill0000 because: (no reason given)




posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 04:13 AM
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Let me tell you this as a German: On the one hand it's really a political mess and Germany is in the NATO so Germany should back up the allied forces, but on the other hand I really do think most of the Germans are feeling it's okay if Germany won't join the NATO forces in this "war".

My personal opinion is being a member to the NATO we should join.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 04:17 AM
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I'll just add my feelings. I don't care whether you support war, or peaceful resolutions and what not. What I'd like to address is the Dispicable amount of treachery going on.

I am sick of Countries saying they'll help and support whomever, then in there time of need, they just back away. It's just "politically" not conveinent for them anymore. it's disgusting.

Consider this scenario. What If NATO and the US decides that Libya is to hot to handle, we all back out. What does that mean? We've left our ALLIES, the REBELS on their own. Thats a BIG mistake. Because what if the Rebels pull it off? what if the Rebels, flying solo takes control of Libya. You now have a new government, that is PISSED off at NATO and the US, instead of the PRO Democracy Government we were supposed to get. 10 years later they stabalize and grow the country, before we know it, we are at war with the new government.

We need to stop abandoning our allies.

I find it sickening that France refused to Help take Iraq, and Afghanistan, yet once the new governemnts are in place, they can try to reap the benefits..



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 04:29 AM
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Originally posted by Britguy
This should NOT be a NATO led operation, in the same way as the Afghanistan operations should not be NATO led.
It is outside of NATO's remit to have any involvement in such actions, or has it's role now changed to an offensive stance, attacking anyone, even if no NATO member states have been attacked in any way?



exactly my position...somehow NATO has taken over the missions of the UN Peacekeepers

the Libyan uprising & the crackdown by the dictator is a humanitarian situation...let the Peacekeepers
take the reins...



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 05:04 AM
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Like I said, the U.S. gets left holding the bag, as usual. After World War II other countries just don't have the stomach for war, unless the United States takes the brunt of the whole mess...

Why Obama couldn't see that the United States is the only country "stupid" enough to give a damn about the rest of the world i don't comprehend...

I say pull the U.S. forces out of Libya completely and wash our hands of the whole mess. The U.S. doesn't have the money to back this latest middle east war anyhow.

Like the song says, The Roof the Roof the Roof is on fire, we don't need no water just let the MFer BURN!
edit on 3/24/2011 by Brainiac because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 05:29 AM
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Germany's current chancellor was the last world leader to meet with Col Qaddafi. It was rather recent. Read an article about it today in their own paper. Over the past few years it seems Germany is heading back to her old Imperialistic historical past. What a shame. Its funny how things like the Berlin airlift and creating NATO to protect the remaining parts of Germany that wasn't under brutal occupation of the former USSR get forgotten so quickly. Germany seems to vote with China and Russian on a regular basis now. Maybe they should just leave NATO altogether and start their own organization.... Any ideas on what it would be called?? I have a few..


P.S. What does China Russia and Germany have in common? A Proven Historical Past of Murdering their own civilians. So I guess I can see why they would be against such an intervention in Libya.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 05:43 AM
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Originally posted by JerryB08
why does germany even have a millitary after ww2?

so much for nato, what will they be good for in a real crisis?


Why not? Please tell me

edit on 24-3-2011 by verschickter because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 05:47 AM
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the US and it pals are slaughtering civilians
so....
the US has NEVER one a war against an equal opponet and never will
the moralizing is BS
the boasting is pathetic
(remember GREAT BIG Viet nam? the gulf of tonkin was a lie and the US lost)


The US-led military alliance has reportedly escalated its aerial attacks on several strategically-important cities across Libya, killing many civilians.

www.presstv.ir...

yeah I know its press TV
are you gonna compare that to FAUX?
edit on 24-3-2011 by Danbones because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 05:49 AM
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reply to post by JerryB08
 


by not being an imperial stooge a country is heading for its imperial past?
your opinion doesn't seem grounded in reality at all
how come you are not at the front?
edit on 24-3-2011 by Danbones because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 05:51 AM
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The last American Oil Company in Libya left that country in 1986. We have not bought Libyan oil since Regan put a cruise missile through Qaddafi's front door for the bombing in lol GERMANY. In fact there was a Iran-Libyan oil embargo in the United States that expired in 2001.

US ground forces pay more for Iraqi oil than they do when they are buying it in the United States. So for all those people that think our interests in the middle east is about their oil. That theory could only pertain to Saudi Arabia. We buy oil from them. And as of this post we are not at war with them. Personally from what I have read on the subject we have all the oil we need in the United States. It's just a lot cheaper to buy it from the Saudi's. We export most of our own oil. I would be happy to pay more at the pump and leave the middle east to another 3000 years of conflict.It's obvious they don't want peace.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 05:51 AM
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This latest piece of the jigsaw is nothing to do with protecting civilians or even gaining a foothold in an oil rich country. Its plain and simply a means to anger Muslim opinion of the big bad "West". Everything that has happened or is happening are pre-planned steps down an evil pathway towards a 3rd world war.

Create havoc between religions, divisions between allies, mass anger of the common man and very soon a war like no others, to include both China and Russia.

The outcome?...De-population, one world government, religion and the yoke of slavery round the neck of all who are left alive.

Respects



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 05:53 AM
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Originally posted by xaphoocom
why does germany even have a millitary after ww2?

so much for nato, what will they be good for in a real crisis?

Why not? Please tell me



Originally posted by JerryB08
Germany's current chancellor was the last world leader to meet with Col Qaddafi. It was rather recent.

This tells nothing about german relations



Read an article about it today in their own paper. Over the past few years it seems Germany is heading back to her old Imperialistic historical past. What a shame. Its funny how things like the Berlin airlift and creating NATO to protect the remaining parts of Germany that wasn't under brutal occupation of the former USSR get forgotten so quickly.

No, we didn´t forget the terrible bombings coming from U.S weeks after WW2 stopped. Over one and a half million died after WW2. In my hometown and around are still bombing craters and there is nothing military around, the frontline was never there, they bombed and hunted with their guns just for fun. Not speaking about the rapes take a look how much abortions were done in the years around the end of WW2. No my people were not better I fully know that and I´m not a racist or antisemit.


Germany seems to vote with China and Russian on a regular basis now. Maybe they should just leave NATO altogether and start their own organization.... Any ideas on what it would be called?? I have a few..

Please tell me or PN me about that.



P.S. What does China Russia and Germany have in common? A Proven Historical Past of Murdering their own civilians. So I guess I can see why they would be against such an intervention in Libya.

Whats your nationality? If your U.S please step back far away from posts like that.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 05:56 AM
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reply to post by Danbones
 


Well that a new one EH? A Canadian Confederate that supports slavery?? Who says I'm not EH?



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 06:00 AM
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reply to post by verschickter
 


Bombings after World War 2 stopped? Are you seriously going to suggest the US committed war crimes during World War 2? So that's why your country killed 11 million Jews. It was all in protest?

I'd love to see your sources that say the US bombed Germany after the end of World War 2.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 06:12 AM
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Um I never asked why Germany even has a Military. I'm extremely happy that they do. Now they can protect themselves. As far as the massive amounts of abortions in Germany after World War 2..Your country had more last year. And the Russian's were extreamly mad at the German's for the murder of a few million of their peoplel and the slave labor. Plus you had Canadians and the English over there as well. But it seems your 90 and was there to witness everyone. So you like to watch. hahah Um do you have anything that suggests US forces raping Germans during the war. That's a new one.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 06:17 AM
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reply to post by Eurisko2012
 


LIbya is a sovereign country and if the Libyans want to slaugther some of their own - let them do it.

Why should we worry when our "western" governments have no qualms about slaughtering us.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 06:19 AM
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I guess that means he doesn't. His grand pap must of told him that's what happened and thats why he's half American... I'm just kidding. TTYL



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 06:57 AM
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Im wondering why people are quoting 'sources' from the MSM, like the 'Daily Mail'- a well know right wing UK comic, and the Iranian 'Press TV' (hardly unbiased reporting there) as though their reports are all fact. I thought this was Above Top Secret, where we deny ignorance, not echo dubious MSM claims.

Yesterday, journalists in Tripoli, after repeated requests to see the supposed 'civilian casualties' that Gaddafi's spokes-people had been shouting about for days, were put into three buses then driven around the town for an hour, stopping occasionally whilst their Lybian handlers had heated conversations. After an hour, they were returned to their hotels, after not being shown one single casualty, and told "We will get back to you" which they never did. This incident was reported on Al-Jazeera, Sky News, Reuters and the BBC. MSM media outlets I grant you, but of a higher standing that the Daily Mail or Press TV.

If these casualties existed, do you not think Gaddafi's people would be showing them on a loop on their national TV all day every day- so where are they? Where are the hospitals full of dead and injured due to 'coalition air strikes'. I do not doubt for one minute they would be all over our televisions if they existed. One can only assume they do not.

As for the (misleadingly named) Press TV claim quoted by a poster above: "Libya ground attack likely: Russia"- exactly how would Russia know what the coalition- which it is not part of- is going to do next? Do you really think an Iranian government mouthpiece would support anything Europe or America do? They are also claiming today a French aircraft has been shot down which isnt true either. All you have to do is turn on RT (Russia Today) to hear the anti American and European rhetoric pouring out on every subject from the Russian MSM(I can remember a RT report from a few weeks ago saying that all Europe was 'in flames' due to widespread rioting about the financial crisis! Kinda missed that where I live......), and we can assume from these reports Russia would have been quite happy to stand back and watch Bengazi fall and the anti government protestors be slaughtered en-mass. Actually that is not the case, and although Russia abstained from the UN vote, they had called on Gaddafi to call an immediate ceasefire- which he said he had done and then continued to shell Bengazi.

Today in Bengazi there are thousands of men, women and children in the streets expressing their gratitude for the coalition air-strikes and asking for more of the same, and I for one, am happy to see America and Europe's enormous arsenal put to a good use for once- hopefully getting rid of Gaddafi quickly and with minimal casualties.

edit on 24-3-2011 by Thunda because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 07:07 AM
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Originally posted by Brainiac
Like I said, the U.S. gets left holding the bag, as usual. After World War II other countries just don't have the stomach for war, unless the United States takes the brunt of the whole mess...

Why Obama couldn't see that the United States is the only country "stupid" enough to give a damn about the rest of the world i don't comprehend...

I say pull the U.S. forces out of Libya completely and wash our hands of the whole mess. The U.S. doesn't have the money to back this latest middle east war anyhow.

Like the song says, The Roof the Roof the Roof is on fire, we don't need no water just let the MFer BURN!
edit on 3/24/2011 by Brainiac because: (no reason given)


Lets not forget the UK has been with The US on most of the military escapades in recent times. But I agree with you that you are holding the bag on this one. The UK and France were very quick to push for a no fly zone, knowing full well they dont have the military logistics to carry it out with out US help. It's all very well calling for a NFZ, but if our military is not fit for the job we have to rely on America.

The arab league called for the NFZ too, why cant they be the ones who put troops on the ground.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 07:16 AM
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Originally posted by JerryB08
I guess that means he doesn't. His grand pap must of told him that's what happened and thats why he's half American... I'm just kidding. TTYL


a bit of a low blow joking or not. I think you should research some of the facts you have been sprouting in reply to verschickter.


edit on 24-3-2011 by oddnutz because: (no reason given)

edit on 24-3-2011 by oddnutz because: (no reason given)




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