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Creator or Chance Accident - I will prove this to you!

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posted on Apr, 13 2011 @ 04:48 PM
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Originally posted by Xcalibur254
reply to post by SuperiorEd
 


You do realize that we didn't have seismographs until the 20th century right? The only way we know of earthquakes before that is through surviving historical accounts. Meaning there is no way to accurately determine the number of quakes or their magnitude.


Which is why you'll find that his post is a copy/paste from a blog website. Just google his post...it's copied word to word from creationists blogs and has ZERO bearing in reality




posted on Apr, 13 2011 @ 05:29 PM
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You caught me. I copied my OP from this site. LINK My user name is SuperiorEd and my blog, as you noted, is where I get the OP. Superior Education Blog. When you put the truth with the evidence, it's amazing what you find. As with God, His prints are all over truth.


Originally posted by MrXYZ

Originally posted by Xcalibur254
reply to post by SuperiorEd
 


You do realize that we didn't have seismographs until the 20th century right? The only way we know of earthquakes before that is through surviving historical accounts. Meaning there is no way to accurately determine the number of quakes or their magnitude.


Which is why you'll find that his post is a copy/paste from a blog website. Just google his post...it's copied word to word from creationists blogs and has ZERO bearing in reality

edit on 13-4-2011 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 13 2011 @ 05:38 PM
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reply to post by SuperiorEd
 





When you put the truth with the evidence, it's amazing what you find.


Sadly you fail at posting real evidence...and what you claim, is therefore NOT the truth. I could start a blog about unicorns, but that doesn't mean they exist



posted on Apr, 13 2011 @ 05:42 PM
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reply to post by SuperiorEd
 


...no, he's saying this generation...the people he is talking too. He is comparing the things he is describing (calamities, wars, etc) to the indicators of a fig tree about to bloom (which anyone in that region would have been aware of). It's an analogy, not a further description. He's using the fig tree as a parable, not a symbol.



posted on Apr, 13 2011 @ 09:10 PM
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No. You need to research the pollination of the fig tree by the fig wasp. It can only reproduce with the aid of another creature. This fig tree failed to bear fruit. Because of this, the temple was destroyed in 70 AD. The new temple is in the heart of man and the gentiles are grafted into the tree. This tree is now able to bear fruit without the aid of the wasp. It has transitioned from a domesticated fig tree to a Parthenocarpic fig tree. The tree then gives its fruit freely without the aid of the fig wasp. In other words, it needed time to mature. Israel has had its eyes blinded until the gentiles have fulfilled fullness and received a grafting into the tree. When this generation that sees the tree ripe and bearing figs on it's own, your redemption draws near. The temple has produced fruit. This is the church. Now, it is time for Israel to wake up to their messiah. When Ariel Sharon dies from his coma, Christ returns. But not yet. The gentiles still have a witness and there are still events left to be fulfilled. Damascus being destroyed for one.

Luke 21:29-32 29 He told them a parable. "See the fig tree, and all the trees. When they are already budding, you see it and know by your own selves that the summer is already near. Even so you also, when you see these things happening, know that the Kingdom of God is near. Most assuredly I tell you, this generation will not pass away until all things are accomplished."

"For I will give you words and wisdom that none of your adversaries will be able to resist or contradict."Luke 21:15

If I were you, I'd get on my hands and knees and repent. You are on this earth as a witness, not to implicate yourself in the crime. You are here for a reason and seeds never fail to grow, even in rocky soil. Read Romans 11.



Luke 13
6 Then he told this parable: “A man had a fig tree growing in his vineyard, and he went to look for fruit on it but did not find any. 7 So he said to the man who took care of the vineyard, ‘For three years now I’ve been coming to look for fruit on this fig tree and haven’t found any. Cut it down! Why should it use up the soil?’

8 “‘Sir,’ the man replied, ‘leave it alone for one more year, and I’ll dig around it and fertilize it. 9 If it bears fruit next year, fine! If not, then cut it down.’”




Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
reply to post by SuperiorEd
 


...no, he's saying this generation...the people he is talking too. He is comparing the things he is describing (calamities, wars, etc) to the indicators of a fig tree about to bloom (which anyone in that region would have been aware of). It's an analogy, not a further description. He's using the fig tree as a parable, not a symbol.

edit on 13-4-2011 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)

edit on 13-4-2011 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)

edit on 13-4-2011 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)

edit on 13-4-2011 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)

edit on 13-4-2011 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)

edit on 13-4-2011 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 13 2011 @ 09:42 PM
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Chew on that last post and then see God at work here with the fig tree.

ROMANS 11

16 For if the firstfruit is holy, the lump is also holy; and if the root is holy, so are the branches. 17 And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, were grafted in among them, and with them became a partaker of the root and fatness of the olive tree, 18 do not boast against the branches. But if you do boast, remember that you do not support the root, but the root supports you.
19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off that I might be grafted in.” 20 Well said. Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, He may not spare you either. 22 Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness,[f] if you continue in His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off. 23 And they also, if they do not continue in unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. 24 For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, who are natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?
25 For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. 26 And so all Israel will be saved,[g] as it is written:


“ The Deliverer will come out of Zion,
And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;
27 For this is My covenant with them,
When I take away their sins.”[h]



posted on Apr, 13 2011 @ 09:44 PM
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Originally posted by SuperiorEd
All other life on this planet occupies a domain that is fixed. Birds have the air, fish the sea. Humans exceed any domain, therefore we have moved beyond the limitations of the domain of Earth. Purpose is not fixed for the conscious observer who possesses reason and logic (knowledge of good and evil). Entropy acts on all substance and the material world fades. Entropy does not act on the mind, which is capable of moving substance to purpose. There are no examples to be found where substance acts with purpose apart from consciousness.


Umm, Australian lungfish would beg to differ. As would Penguins, Whales and Gecarcinidae (land crabs).
Maybe I'm missing something here ?



posted on Apr, 13 2011 @ 10:42 PM
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You are missing the fact that these animals occupy a domain(s) within their purpose and natural habitat. They exist on instinct. Humans exist by reasoning. Humans exceed what science calls their source (Earth). This is not observed in nature apart from consciousness and programming of information to purpose. No exceptions. Since man is greater than the earth, his source is not the earth. Reproduction goes against entropy, pushing away from disorder. This is not observed in nature apart form consciousness. Animation away from the flow can only come from a desire from the programming. No information, no moving away from the flow. If an acorn dies and suffers information degradation, it will not produce millions more acorns from its transition to the tree. If it is alive, it animates to transition. Animation can only be present where there is information. Information is not absent from nature. It represents the overall governing programming of God's law. Law is final and does not change. No governing laws without a governor. No unification of purpose apart from a plan. Everything is in relationship to everything else above and below. It is a mirror of concrete reality reflection the abstract mirror image. This is purpose by design. Light with illumination for the mind. Enlightenment to dispel the darkness. Love to vanquish hatred.

"For I will give you words and wisdom that none of your adversaries will be able to resist or contradict."Luke 21:15


Originally posted by Noncompatible

Originally posted by SuperiorEd
All other life on this planet occupies a domain that is fixed. Birds have the air, fish the sea. Humans exceed any domain, therefore we have moved beyond the limitations of the domain of Earth. Purpose is not fixed for the conscious observer who possesses reason and logic (knowledge of good and evil). Entropy acts on all substance and the material world fades. Entropy does not act on the mind, which is capable of moving substance to purpose. There are no examples to be found where substance acts with purpose apart from consciousness.


Umm, Australian lungfish would beg to differ. As would Penguins, Whales and Gecarcinidae (land crabs).
Maybe I'm missing something here ?




posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 01:23 PM
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reply to post by SuperiorEd
 


You'd be surprised at how much we are dominated by our instincts...we're really not all that different from animals...no matter how much you want to believe we're special.

Claiming we are governed by reason, while animals only follow instinct is complete and utter nonsense.



Either way, I'm still waiting for your objective proof of a creator...been waiting kinda long

edit on 14-4-2011 by MrXYZ because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 01:49 PM
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Created or chance...

Can chance create a defence for the butterfly against birds? The natural enemy of the butterfly is the birds, the birds are afraid of the howell... but is the butterfly intelligent enough to understand and do this, is it chance, or is it
by design.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 02:35 PM
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reply to post by mkkkay
 


Here's what happened...and no, animals (or humans for that matter) can't just "choose to evolve". It's a natural process, not a conscious one.

1) Butterflies were eaten by birds.
2) Suddenly a few of them developed mutations..like big spots on their wings that look like eyes. Some birds are deterred or at least don't recognize the butterlies becaus of that.
3) Fast forward a few 100,000 years, the butterflies that look the most like a certain type that won't get eaten by birds survives and gets to reproduce. And over all that time, the "look" is perfected to fit the environment. In some regions, they are red to look like flowers, in others they look like owls.

Again, no magic required.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 02:39 PM
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Originally posted by SuperiorEd

Christ is the updated code you need to properly reboot.


If one makes a case for creationism, or creation of the universe by a deity, all one has done is make a case for deism. And even if the case were convincing one still has another case to make to get from creationism to Jesus.

(BTW, the argument presented, though eloquently written, was unpersuasive)



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 03:41 PM
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Explain the bumble bee moth. Design.





Originally posted by MrXYZ
reply to post by mkkkay
 


Here's what happened...and no, animals (or humans for that matter) can't just "choose to evolve". It's a natural process, not a conscious one.

1) Butterflies were eaten by birds.
2) Suddenly a few of them developed mutations..like big spots on their wings that look like eyes. Some birds are deterred or at least don't recognize the butterlies becaus of that.
3) Fast forward a few 100,000 years, the butterflies that look the most like a certain type that won't get eaten by birds survives and gets to reproduce. And over all that time, the "look" is perfected to fit the environment. In some regions, they are red to look like flowers, in others they look like owls.

Again, no magic required.

edit on 14-4-2011 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 03:49 PM
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reply to post by SuperiorEd
 


It's called convergent evolution and there's a lot of papers on it if you bother to look it up


Again, no magic

edit on 14-4-2011 by MrXYZ because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 03:56 PM
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There is a good case for Jesus. It fits the rest of the biblical story. Reference my post above about the fig tree. Adam and Eve covered themselves after eating of a fruit that brought knowledge. Israel is the light unto the nations that covers sin. The fig tree did not produce fruit when Christ came. Christ initiates the church to bring light to the world by clipping the branches and propagating new growth from within the original tree. Fig trees that can produce fruit without the help of the fig wasp are developed with the planting of cuttings. Christ planted new shoots and developed the desired production of fruit by making the gentile nations produce through parthenocarpic means. This is a mutation of nature caused by the original husbandry of Christ. Gardening is a metaphor used throughout the Bible.

As far as I know, I may be the only person on earth drawing this analogy, but it seems pretty obvious what the Bible is saying.

LINK


Originally posted by traditionaldrummer

Originally posted by SuperiorEd

Christ is the updated code you need to properly reboot.


If one makes a case for creationism, or creation of the universe by a deity, all one has done is make a case for deism. And even if the case were convincing one still has another case to make to get from creationism to Jesus.

(BTW, the argument presented, though eloquently written, was unpersuasive)

edit on 14-4-2011 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 04:08 PM
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Originally posted by SuperiorEd
There is a good case for Jesus. It fits the rest of the biblical story.


Then what you're saying is that you can get from creation to Jesus because you personally believe the bible. Why then do you believe that book instead of any of the scores of other religious texts that also reference a creation? At some point you'll need to rule out all those others and provide the convincing evidence that establishes the bible's claims as being the correct and true one. Though really, I don't think there's been any convincing evidence presented that the universe or anything in it was created by a deity.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 04:14 PM
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reply to post by SuperiorEd
 





Israel is the light unto the nations that covers sin.




Israel's crimes against humanity
More crimes against humanity...



I claim there's dozens of more peaceful countries than Israel...Iceland for example.







edit on 14-4-2011 by MrXYZ because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 04:36 PM
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reply to post by MrXYZ
 


Very convenient, these sudden mutations that cause some of a species to so closely resemble a natural enemy or a handy camouflage--thereby providing a survival advantage. I've come across a myriad other examples before, and it's truly amazing and stunning just how close the resemblances can be.

That said, the odds must be absolutely astronomical that it would be so nearly perfect a mimicry. When you think about it, the end result of these mutations could have been, and by all rights should have been, anything else (i.e., a subtle difference in pattern or coloring, etc. that doesn't have that kind of resemblance to anything else and wouldn't really make a difference either way in terms of survival) if the mutations were just random chance.


edit on 14-4-2011 by Ariel because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 04:40 PM
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Originally posted by Faith2011
reply to post by SuperiorEd
 



GOD IS AWESOME!

Worthy are You, our Lord and God, to receive the glory and the honor and dominion, for You created all things; by Your will they were [brought into being] and were created. Revelation 4:11



Just check something out for yourself. Look up the meaning of Baal or Ba'al in the Strong's concordance. Even just dictionary, you will find it means Lord. The Creator has a name and its Yahuwah, not yahweh. Do some research, surpise yourself.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 07:22 PM
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I can connect Issac's brother to Islam and the blessing given by God to his seed. I can connect the religions of eary Babylon and Egypt through the Biblical story. Ishmael was born of the flesh and Issac was born of the promise. Galatians 4. Islam will set his hand against everyone and everyone will be against him.

Genesis 16:13-16 Ishmael will be "...a wild donkey of a man, His hand will be against everyone, and everyone's hand will be against him; and he will live to the east of all his brothers."

I can then trace the Eastern religions through the trade routes. The Greeks represented vane interpolations of all the religious beliefs that swirled around the trade routes of Rome. Any other religion has it's roots in nature worship and observation. God choose the people of Israel to be the light of the world through the promise of Abraham, Issac and Jacob. Enoch, Joseph and Moses also had their hands in this thread of salvation. The Bible holds up to what it claims.

It claims to be an account of creation. It claims to predict the future. It claims that Jesus was the Word (Logos) who wrote the entire story into the physics of reality. God is the Light and Jesus is the Word (Wave). Physics confirms this with its description of the duality of light, both particle and wave. Science draws its own metaphor and the Bible gives another. They match perfectly.

It really doesn't matter what you throw at me. God promised to give the words when the time was right. The time is right and the words are available thanks to Google and 200 years of science, archeology and an unlimited access to ancient texts.

Nothing compares to the Bible. Scoffing at it is useless. Man and God are both in the image that it reflects. If you choose to only look at man in the image, you will miss God standing right there beside. God's word is Christ. The Bible is merely the reflection of both man and God.


Originally posted by traditionaldrummer

Originally posted by SuperiorEd
There is a good case for Jesus. It fits the rest of the biblical story.


Then what you're saying is that you can get from creation to Jesus because you personally believe the bible. Why then do you believe that book instead of any of the scores of other religious texts that also reference a creation? At some point you'll need to rule out all those others and provide the convincing evidence that establishes the bible's claims as being the correct and true one. Though really, I don't think there's been any convincing evidence presented that the universe or anything in it was created by a deity.




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