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Artistic Terrorism: Art Through History That Changed the World

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posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 07:23 PM
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reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux
 


Thank you JPZ, you explained what I was trying to say much better then I ever could, not surprising since I don't consider myself a writer, I can think it but difficult to put it into words.

Just so you know, I do not thinik you are too wordy, I never have to say, is that it.




posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 07:33 PM
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reply to post by Aquarius1
 





Just so you know, I do not thinik you are too wordy, I never have to say, is that it.


I would like to think that I use as many words are as necessary for any given point. Of course, this a subjective thought, but just the same, I tend to believe that what I write has as many words as are necessary. No more, no less, and in regards to this thread, it struck me that few words were necessary to make the point, but like most art, perhaps even all art, the relationship between art and viewer is one of interpretation.

Some saw this as an attack on art, one saw this as an attack on his thread, and few, such as yourself, understood what I attempted to convey. Such is the life of an artist I suppose. Better to be misunderstood than ignored, I guess.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 07:37 PM
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reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux
 



Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
...but "terrorism"? If you are advocating the ever expanding use of the term terrorism to include this sort of behavior then I am calling you out as total bunk!


I will concede this point. You are quite correct that I sloppily overindulged in my exuberance for the subject matter.

I stand corrected.


Language means something to me and I should not cheapen the meaning of some words.


I will admit, I missed your point when you took the route you did in your initial post. (Your title might have also thrown me off.) I jumped in without clearly seeing the bottom.

My sincerest apologies.

edit on 22-3-2011 by loam because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 07:40 PM
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Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
Such is the life of an artist I suppose. Better to be misunderstood than ignored, I guess.



Do tell. Had a show recently where a viewer of a particular work on therianthropes told me, in detail, what my painting was about. Of course, she had it all wrong, but, damn, it sure saved me a lot of explaining.


The sheer amount of speculative history surrounding just about ANYTHING by Da Vinci is hugely encouraging to me. The more obfuscated the work, the wilder the scrutiny.

Yay for pareidolia!



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 07:41 PM
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Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
...one saw this as an attack on his thread...


This, however, is not true.

I actually thought you were falsely establishing a definition not consistent with the facts found within my thread.

(I don't care if people 'attack' my threads.
)

When you replied, and upon reflection, I realized the actual point your were making and responded accordingly.

Just being clear.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 07:44 PM
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reply to post by loam
 





I will admit, I missed your point when you took the route you did in your initial post. I jumped in without clearly seeing the bottom.

My sincerest apologies.


No apologies are necessary at all, my friend. Indeed, your thread was, in part, the inspiration to this one, but my alarm was over Glen Beck's use of the term "terrorist" and did not assume you were advocating that usage with your thread, and figured you were more concerned with what the SEIU were up to.

I was actually surprised to read your post in this thread, but given that a few others have missed my point, I suppose some of the blame belongs with me. Oh well, back to the verbose threads I guess.

Thanks for joining us here, loam.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 07:47 PM
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I can relate as I am also an artist, drawing with pen, pencil and chalk, as a child I was told over and over how talented I was and in the same breath that I was wasting my time, never said I wanted to grow up to be an artist, that was an assumption by some. I am also a Folk singer. Both of these things have given me much personal pleasure over the years, Those who appreciate my talents thank you, those that don't it really doesn't matter.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 07:50 PM
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reply to post by masqua
 





Do tell. Had a show recently where a viewer of a particular work on therianthropes told me, in detail, what my painting was about. Of course, she had it all wrong, but, damn, it sure saved me a lot of explaining.


Conversely, I have had people point to something I wrote and tell me how they really liked how I said such and such, and I will look at what they are pointing to and think to myself, "I never said that", but then read the passage again and realize; "Dear God! I did say that! Huh."

Sometimes a work of art takes on a life of its own and says what it wants to say regardless of the vision of the artist behind it.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 07:56 PM
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reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux
 


True.

Does that mean we artists may be unwitting terrorists?

Oh, look... a MONARCH!!!



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 08:07 PM
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Originally posted by Aquarius1
I can relate as I am also an artist, drawing with pen, pencil and chalk, as a child I was told over and over how talented I was and in the same breath that I was wasting my time, never said I wanted to grow up to be an artist, that was an assumption by some. I am also a Folk singer. Both of these things have given me much personal pleasure over the years, Those who appreciate my talents thank you, those that don't it really doesn't matter.



Ha ha ha ha, this reminds me of when I was first in college and majoring in Theater. People, usually older professional people, would ask me what I was majoring in, and when the discovered it was Theater would look at me gravely and ask me if I didn't have a second major to fall back on. This happened so much for a couple of years that I finally picked a second major.

I wound up double majoring in Theater and Philosophy thinking that nobody would ever hire a philosopher. At the same time I declared my second major I discovered that my little baby sisters were computer literate and I hadn't a clue about computers. This worried me as I feared a revolution was passing my by, so I double minored in English and Computer Science.

Because of my background in Philosophy and Computer Science, by the time I was a Senior I was courted by IBM and invited to several luncheons because they were looking for people who could help them write computer programming for AI, and they were turning to Philosophers because of the proclivity to think outside the box.

I went for the free lunches, being the struggling student and artist I was, and while there I was told that IBM had the hardware necessary to create artificial intelligence but couldn't find anyone yet capable of handling the software. They spared no expense for these luncheons, and I nearly choked on the prime rib I was chewing when they told me that they had the "hardware" for artificial intelligence, just not the software.

I asked two of these guys if that meant they actually had computers that could see, hear, smell, touch and taste, and then it looked like these guys were about to choke on their food. "Uh...no...not really. Why? Do you think intelligence is predicated on the five senses?" I thought about it for a second while chewing slowly for effect, and then replied; "Well..." and continued chewing for greater effect; "...I suppose maybe not, and all that really needs to be done is to write a program that duplicates the soul, or mind." These guys didn't seem to enjoy my company too much, but expressed great interest in me none the less.

I sometimes think back on that, and wonder what it would have been like to accept their offer, and where I would be today. Who knows, but the point I am making is that I actually thought by choosing Philosophy as a second major I was being a major smart ass, only to discover even Philosophers get much more respect than artists. Go figure.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 08:21 PM
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Every artist knows the REAL terrorists are art critics...

We live in an upside down world it seems, where is Alice?

Seriously, though,
We should not allow terrorists to define terrorism, that is our first mistake. Or, maybe just our latest.
But, "we" don't really exist...meaning that there is just "us" individuals thinking we are part of a bigger "we" that really doesn't pan out. At least not very often. Not like Egypt, or Libya, or Yemen, or....whomever in some lesser newsworthy lands, where real people sacrifice for the "we".
"We" just lament the latest assault, the daily assault on our pathetic inability to become anything other than us individuals.
We decent and peaceful people; artists, art appreciators, the young and the young-hearted, and the idealistic among us know that the world is upside down. But, correcting it requires that "we" become better terrorists, "Lennonist" terrorists.
Now HE was a terrorist.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 08:35 PM
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reply to post by Stewie
 





We decent and peaceful people; artists, art appreciators, the young and the young-hearted, and the idealistic among us know that the world is upside down. But, correcting it requires that "we" become better terrorists, "Lennonist" terrorists. Now HE was a terrorist.


Dear God! That guy was the worst terrorist in the whole goddamned history of terrorism! Worse than Bin Laden, worse than Sergey Nechayev, and even worse than Elvis, John Lennon was a monster with all his ranting about "give peace a chance" and "you know it's gonna be all right", that guy was perhaps the most vile terrorist to ever exist. Great points, Stewie. Thanks for joining us.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 08:35 PM
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reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux
 



Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
I was actually surprised to read your post in this thread, but given that a few others have missed my point, I suppose some of the blame belongs with me. Oh well, back to the verbose threads I guess.


I think the title led me astray...

But the real infirmity was mine-- not your words.


Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
Thanks for joining us here, loam.


Thanks for setting me straight.




I honestly mean that.

edit on 22-3-2011 by loam because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 08:44 PM
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reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux
 

Nice to hear from you too, JPZ.
As an artist, I couldn't stay away from a thread with "artistic terrorism" in the title. I thought there would be a HOW TO!
Just kidding, ahem...



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 08:48 PM
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reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux
 





John Lennon was a monster with all his ranting about "give peace a chance" and "you know it's gonna be all right"




edit on 22-3-2011 by Aquarius1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 08:51 PM
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Originally posted by Stewie
reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux
 

Nice to hear from you too, JPZ.
As an artist, I couldn't stay away from a thread with "artistic terrorism" in the title. I thought there would be a HOW TO!
Just kidding, ahem...



I referenced Nechayev earlier, perhaps now it is worth linking his disturbing, yet seminal manifesto: The Revolutionary Catechism. This particular passage resonated with me for its haunting parallel to artists:


The revolutionary despises all doctrines and refuses to accept the mundane sciences, leaving them for future generations. He knows only one science: the science of destruction. For this reason, but only for this reason, he will study mechanics, physics, chemistry, and perhaps medicine. But all day and all night he studies the vital science of human beings, their characteristics and circumstances, and all the phenomena of the present social order. The object is perpetually the same: the surest and quickest way of destroying the whole filthy order.


The difference, I would think, is that where Nechayev seeks to destroy "the whole filthy order", the artist will study the vital sciences and "science of human beings, their characteristics and circumstances" not to destroy, but rather to create.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 08:58 PM
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Today i watched a documentary on graffiti street artists and there is a guy named Banksy that is well known from Britain and the media has labeled him the graffiti terrorist because of his controversial ideas and places he chooses to do his art at times.Very interesting. Worth a looksy.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 09:09 PM
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Originally posted by A por uvas
Today i watched a documentary on graffiti street artists and there is a guy named Banksy that is well known from Britain and the media has labeled him the graffiti terrorist because of his controversial ideas and places he chooses to do his art at times.Very interesting. Worth a looksy.


Dear God! Banksy is almost as vile as John Lennon. When will the madness stop?

Here is the link to Banksy's website so you can see for yourself the horrible terrorism this artist is perpetuating on the world...enter this site at your own peril.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 09:19 PM
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reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux
 

I have not read that, but I can appreciate your point.
Art, and artists cannot really be defined well, but neither can "order", or "revolutionaries", IMO. Heck, Bush the elder was a revolutionary that brought in a new order...
But, Nechayev DID say the revolutionaries were bent on DESTRUCTION didn't he?
I will see you later, I have to count all of the dead bodies.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 09:25 PM
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If you think Banksy is bad check out Thierry Guetta . He butchers it.




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