It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

African nations demand urgent ceasefire in Libya

page: 1
8

log in

join
share:

posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 12:38 PM
link   
With this being my first thread on ATS, I decided to keep the topic close to home and thought I would give you fellow ATS'ers a bit of information concerning South Africa's stance on the current Libyan conflict.

South Afican president, Jacob Zuma, has called for an immediate ceasefire in Libya, saying that the UN resolution implementing the no-fly zone was supposed to protect, and not endanger, the lives of civilians.


South African President Jacob Zuma called for an immediate cease-fire in Libya and said his government would not support any foreign effort to overthrow the government of Libyan leader Moammar Gadhafi, which has been battling an eastern-based insurgency for the past month. "As South Africa we say no to the killing of civilians, no to the regime-change doctrine and no to the foreign occupation of Libya or any other sovereign state," Zuma said.


Source


Zuma is a part of a five-man presidential panel tasked by the African Union to negotiate in Libya. "We believe that a peaceful and political solution based on the will of the Libyan people will guarantee long-term stability in Libya," he said.


Source

The African Union is still upholding it's policy to reject any foreign military intervention. I must say I do agree with them. Although I am not 100% up to date with current affairs like most of you, I feel that not all of the possible peaceful steps had been attempted before the strikes began. With Libya being an African country (and also an active member of the African Union), I feel the problem was handed over to Western powers far too quickly.

Although South Africa did vote for the no-fly zone, it was in order to protect the civilians. It was a necessary step to introduce negotiations with the African Union as 5 delegates were headed to Lybia to try and resolve the conflict.

What are your thoughts? Do you think the African continent should have had a chance to sort the problem out by themselves without it being outsourced to the West?








edit on 22-3-2011 by dyllels because: spelling




posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 01:01 PM
link   
personally i think its a joke that people act like they know whats going on in Libya when they're thousands and thousands of miles away... It could be propagana... but from the videos that have been shown here in the US you can clearly see a huge group of people want gadhaffi out of power because he would massacre anyone who opposes his dictatorship. Im not saying its right for intervention... because personally i believe America has a lot of problems at home that they are not dealing with, but it would be a shame to sit back and watch this jerk murder hundreds ands hundreds if not thousands of people who just want to out a criminal thug. Sure people will die ... and libyans will die...and there will be collateral damage. But would you really want to sit back and hear about families getting rushed out of their homes in the middle of the night by secret police just to be executed for their beliefs or act of standing up against a corrupt leader... If i heard of that # going on here... i sure would want someone watching to step in and help out the innocent people getting massacred by their corrupot government...



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 01:10 PM
link   
Where were the African nation leaders when our fellow unarmed human libyan brothers and sisters were ruthlessly gunned down by Gaddafi and his goons for weeks?

Where were the African nation leaders when our fellow ill equipped human libyan brothers and sisters faced tanks and warplanes when they had to defend their own homes?

I am ashamed that such dregs of humanity known as the 'Atrican Union' or African leaders belong to the same species as me - mankind. Power and greed from the Beast's crumbs must have corrupted them and made them a bunch of sub species or our missing link between uncivilised apes and humans.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 01:15 PM
link   
South Africa is not only plagued with disease but with violence and a crippled economy, I'm against foreign military intervention but I don't think South Africa has a choice in the matter.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 01:22 PM
link   

Originally posted by dyllels
What are your thoughts? Do you think the African continent should have had a chance to sort the problem out by themselves without it being outsourced to the West?


The problem is, a "no-fly zone" was always going to include attacks on Libyan ground targets - the US/UN were very upfront about that. I get the feeling a lot of countries voted for (or abstained) because they thought we should probably do something......but now they're getting cold feet once the inevitable bombing has started.

We either don't do anything or go in and do it properly - there can't be any half measures.

Should Africa been allowed to sort it out themselves? Sure. But what would they have done differently?

ps. Good first thread



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 01:34 PM
link   
Good first post, Im fairly new here as well.

I have been playing very close attention to this Lybian situation and some things smell bad on both sides. Gaddaffi is a very central member in the African Union, and one of the richest. This article says he described himself as one of the "Kings of Africa" Source . Besides the fact that he is crazier than a rabbid dog, Gaddiffi is very important to the African power/political infastrucure (other north African uprisings are probably not help either) and owns many busnesses in the continent. He may be a lynchpin of sorts, that funny pushes middle east/African destablization in a tailspin. Count them: Afghanistan/ North Pakistan, Iraq, Bahrain, Egypt, Palistine, Lebanon, Jordan, Tunsia, Algeria, Yemen, Sudan and most recently Syria have had large scale unrest (some external, most internal). How long can chaos reign before very abyssmal results?

You are not the only one that thought the western powers are being over zealous on this. China, Russia, the Arab Union, Brazil, India and the African Union have called for ceasefire of Anglo-French-American forces imposition of a no-fly zone because the attcks were "imperiling civilians" Source.

The nation of Lybia should have had much more time before any intervention, and intervention should not be direct fighting, just economic support. I also have the eerie notion we are on the verge of something major in the coming months. All it takes is one false flag on a U.S. ship in the medditerainian



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 01:55 PM
link   
(FinalCall.com | 03-11-2011) - Minister Farrakhan blasted Pres. Obama and Secy. Clinton for their arrogance in meddling in another sovereign nation's affairs and publicly recommending regime change. He then instructed Americans to look beneath the surface to see who stands to benefit from the unrest and warned Pres. Obama to be careful of the words coming from advisors lobbying him to move in with military forces to depose Libya leader, Col. Gadhafi video
www.informationclearinghouse.info...

It is a hard one to figure out ...The first link above is more of a scolding but he makes some valid points ...this next vid. is a long but is very well worth watching ... Hezbollah Chief Sayyed Hassan Nasrallah Speech Any accusation that the US manufactured and launched these revolutions is unjust speech toward these peoples, especially that we are talking about regimes which are allied with the USA, serve the American project and pose no threat to Israel.

Speech March 19, 2011 www.informationclearinghouse.info... ................peace



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 02:02 PM
link   
reply to post by gloomyblue707
 


I totally agree with you. I would definitely want somebody to step in if it were me as well, but then again I want somebody to step in even though it is not me and my family in Libya. I would just want to know for sure that people were stepping in for my best interest, and not for political or monetary gain. It is very hard to know nowadays with all the propaganda and misleading reports though, as you said.

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101
 


I hear you and thanks you for your input. As i said in my post, I am not completely up to date with the situation. If they were being gunned down for weeks then I completely agree with you. They had there chance, so to speak. Now it's time for the bigger organisations to step in. Is that what you are trying to say?

reply to post by CordDragonzord
 


If you are a South African citizen then shame on you for incorrectly categorizing our country. If you aren't, please show some respect and add something to the discussion rather than mocking a country mentioned in the post.

reply to post by Curio
 


Thanks Curio, I agree. In a way it seems like the African countries voted because it was the right thing to do, but then maybe realized that it would end up in contradicting the African Unions stance on foreign military involvement.
I agree with you though, If something has to be done, then it should be full force in order to reduce the amount time taken before a resolution.
After reading your point I now wonder how long it would have actually taken the African Union to sort things out, if ever. What would they have done besides try and negotiate when the situation might be beyond that stage.
Hopefully the current chain of events will end up being the most beneficial.

reply to post by Skerrako
 


Thanks for your points, Skerrako. I think the main point to ponder is the one you also highlighted. Was the intervention too soon? And could support have been given in a different way rather than direct fighting as you said.
I guess we'll just have to wait and hope that everything will work out. I must admit that something doesn't sit well with me either. If all this is for a reason other than the protection of Libyan citizens, then maybe things could have been handled differently, and by different organizations.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 02:17 PM
link   
This article is very good ....Obama’s Bay of Pigs in Libya: Imperialist Aggression Shreds UN Charter www.globalresearch.ca...

snip..On March 19, US and British cruise missiles joined with French and other NATO combat aircraft in Operation Odyssey Dawn/Operation Ellamy, a neo-imperialist bombing attack under fake humanitarian cover against the sovereign state of Libya. Acting under UN Security Council resolution 1973, US naval forces in the Mediterranean on Saturday night local time fired 112 cruise missiles at targets which the Pentagon claimed were related to Libya’s air defense system. But Mohammed al-Zawi, the Secretary General of the Libyan Parliament, told a Tripoli press conference that the “barbaric armed attack” and “savage aggression” had hit residential areas and office buildings as well as military targets, filling the hospitals of Tripoli and Misurata with civilian victims. Zawi accused the foreign powers of acting to protect a rebel leadership which contains notorious terrorist elements. The Libyan government repeated its request for the UN to send international observers to report objectively on events in Libya.

I just thought of something ...the Libyan were not peaceful protesters but armed rebels ....the people in Bahrain were peaceful ..no weapons ...it seems strange that the Bahrain Govt got Saudi Arabia to help them when the US has a base right there ...

On March 14 Saudi Arabia and its Gulf Cooperation Council partner the United Arab Emirates deployed 1,000 troops, 500 security personnel and armored troop carriers across the 25-mile King Fahd Causeway to Bahrain to shore up their fellow monarchy after a month of protests against the Al Khalifa dynasty. The following day the Bahraini government declared a three-month state of emergency and authorized the military "to take necessary steps to restore national security." On March 16 government security forces staged a violent crackdown against protesters in the nation's capital with tanks, armored personnel carriers and helicopters, killing at least two people and injuring hundreds www.globalresearch.ca... peace



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 02:23 PM
link   
reply to post by the2ofusr1
 


Thanks for the links and info. I guess it is very hard to know the exact motives of any country or organisation. We really can only just wait and see if they stick to their promises.

If more civilians die as a result of foreign involvement, we have to decide whether it was the right thing to allow.
If after 10 years, the problem still isn't resolved, we have to question if we could have maybe handled the situation differently.

But... If in a short amount of time, with minimal civilian casualties, the conflict is resolved and Libya is reborn into a self-governed free and fair country, we can rest knowing that it was indeed the correct move.

I hope the involvement of Western powers results in the latter point, rather than contributing to the first two.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 02:34 PM
link   
reply to post by the2ofusr1
 


According to the Global Research site you posted, it says:


Libya had responded to the UN vote by declaring a cease-fire, but Obama and Cameron brushed that aside. .........At the UN vote, the Indian delegate correctly pointed out that the decision to start the war had been made on the basis of no reliable information whatsoever, since UN Secretary General Ban-ki Moon’s envoy to Libya had never reported to the Security Council.


It seems like many people are pushing for a ceasefire. But the fighting continues, maybe even with it beginning prematurely. It worries me when many call for peace, and fighting continues. There are always avenues for peaceful reformation, but how can one attempt them if people aren't prepared to listen? [If that is indeed the case.]



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 07:25 PM
link   
reply to post by dyllels
 
I think this article is probably the best to try and understand what their plan might look like ...it seems by hook or by crook things are going to change ....Plans for Redrawing the Middle East: The Project for a “New Middle East”

by Mahdi Darius Nazemroaya www.globalresearch.ca... peace



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 07:33 PM
link   
We are in Libya to secure the oil, not to free any people from a horrid dictator. We care as much for the innocent victims in Libya as we have cared about the innocent people in lraq and Afghanistan. Love Gadhafi or loathe him, lt has suited the west for forty years to have him in power. but like Mubarak the west has decided to get them out and put new puppets in their place. This is ALL about securing the oilfields and the west controlling the countries. The innocent deaths will be called collateral damage as they always are. The arms dealers will coin it in and the taxpayers will pay for the war down to the last bullet. All we have to wait for now is the false flag. Peace starchild.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 11:46 PM
link   
i]reply to post by star child
 



We are in Libya to secure the oil, not to free any people from a horrid dictator. We care as much for the innocent victims in Libya as we have cared about the innocent people in lraq and Afghanistan. Love Gadhafi or loathe him, lt has suited the west for forty years to have him in power. but like Mubarak the west has decided to get them out and put new puppets in their place. This is ALL about securing the oilfields and the west controlling the countries. The innocent deaths will be called collateral damage as they always are. The arms dealers will coin it in and the taxpayers will pay for the war down to the last bullet. All we have to wait for now is the false flag. Peace starchild.
[

I second this. the question is starchild when WILL it stop. This can not go on forever, our American way of life is nearly at an end. It will stop eventual but is it in Lybia? Iran? Im convinced that we wont make it even two years from now



posted on Mar, 23 2011 @ 04:29 AM
link   
Did you know that apart from the sea of oil that Libya is sitting on, lt is also sitting on a sea of water? Gadhafi, years ago found this underwater sea, lt is probably the purest, fresh water on the planet. This water holds more value than the oil. l think that is the reason the US is taking a step back now. What good is it going to do the west to occupy the country when the water is contaminated with depleted uranium and whatever other poisons in their bombs. When will all this maddness end? When every soldier from the top brass down to the soldier in the field lays down their arms and refuses to kill their fellow man for corporate greed. This, unfortunately won't be soon. This will only happen when we realise we have killed every fish in the sea, every animal that we would have hunted for food, every bird that flies in the sky,our water and crops will be contaminated with radiation and the people we love are dying. Then, and only then, will the blinkers of our blind ignorance fall from our eyes. Then Man will look to their God and ask Why? lf you think l am wrong, Just stop and think. Japan has just had a nuclear incident, radiation is contaminating the sea and the air, people all over the world are worried about radiation Yet lsrael is still determined to blow up lrans nuclear reactors and cause more radiation to enter our atmosphere. BP, is about to start deep water drilling off the coast of libya, even though they have killed off the GOM,. People are dying there and the GOM is a dead zone and oil is still leaking from the seabed. Pease and very little hope starchild.



posted on Mar, 23 2011 @ 05:30 AM
link   
Great post, l find it very refreshing that lt is the third world countries that are speaking the most sense. lt seems to me that the countries that have suffered through wars and great injustices for so many years while we in the west have been living off the fat of their lands want talks instead of war. Maybe there is hope for humanity after all. Peace starchild.







 
8

log in

join