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Is being gay a choice/lifestyle?

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posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 03:50 AM
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Originally posted by esther
Your convoluted squirming is a nice tasty treat. You still did not answer the question.

esther.


I dont understand, I did not use any religious words, I made a statement which i guess is my case, and now someoen has to disprove this statement. Am I understanding this correclty?




posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 03:54 AM
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[edit on 10/2/2004 by esther]



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 04:08 AM
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Originally posted by Jakko
what if gay people are born like this? What if it would be proven?
Should such discoveries lead to changes in law? Should such knowledge be taught to children at school?









I for one beleive that a "true" gay person is born that way, they just don't know they are gay until they are in their teens and find that they are attracted to their own sex. Bisexual is a different story,... I beleive they choose that life because they are attracted to both sex's equally.
I do not beleive the laws will change just because of someone's sexual prefferences , that's why it's important that there are equal rights laws in place to protect everyone's civil rights,... no matter what they are/or sexual desire for they same sex.
I feel that all gays men/women are intitled to everything that a straight person is and no one has the right to deny gays that.
Oh and for the record, I am not gay, nor bisexual,....... I love the male race.
I do not think that gay/bisexual behavior information should be taught in the schools, without parent consent, that's the parent's place to talk to their children about sex/gays and bisexuals, and tell them that if they ever had questions about anything sexual they can always come to their parent for answers.

As far as gays and bisexuals, thats their business and right, as long as they don't try it with me, I don't have a problem with them.



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 04:10 AM
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Ok i think i understand your game.

Homosexuality is wrong according to the texts and must therefore be a choice, a willful act commited by a human being(Homo Simponsus). The reason for it being a choice is that there have not been an instances of observed homosexuality where the person who is gay appears to have contracted the abnormality naturally. It seems to be acquired by factors within control of the individual.

OK please tell me im closer to what you are asking for. It is 5 am and im very tired.



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 04:12 AM
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[edit on 10/2/2004 by esther]



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 04:12 AM
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Originally posted by nanna_of_6

Originally posted by Jakko
what if gay people are born like this? What if it would be proven?
Should such discoveries lead to changes in law? Should such knowledge be taught to children at school?









I for one beleive that a "true" gay person is born that way, they just don't know they are gay until they are in their teens and find that they are attracted to their own sex. Bisexual is a different story,... I beleive they choose that life because they are attracted to both sex's equally.
I do not beleive the laws will change just because of someone's sexual prefferences , that's why it's important that there are equal rights laws in place to protect everyone's civil rights,... no matter what they are/or sexual desire for they same sex.
I feel that all gays men/women are intitled to everything that a straight person is and no one has the right to deny gays that.
Oh and for the record, I am not gay, nor bisexual,....... I love the male race.
I do not think that gay/bisexual behavior information should be taught in the schools, without parent consent, that's the parent's place to talk to their children about sex/gays and bisexuals, and tell them that if they ever had questions about anything sexual they can always come to their parent for answers.

As far as gays and bisexuals, thats their business and right, as long as they don't try it with me, I don't have a problem with them.



But how can you be sure they are "true," infants are far to young to convey that message.



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 08:13 AM
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There is a whole lot more in the bible about NOT lusting after others, not lying, stealing, etc...than there is about homosexuality...but I bet you still do it don't you? What about looking at porn on your computer? How many in this thread do that? How many of you watch adult movies, fantasize about two woman together....make remarks about actresses or movie stars, how many have had an affair?...cut the crap....if your gonna spout bible to condemn a set of people...then hold those same holier than thou standards to yourself...



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 09:37 AM
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Originally posted by jrod
Wow, another gay related thread that gets a huge response. Who cares, if your not gay dont try to figure out someone else's way of life. Just let it be.


Do you know, what's the real problem with gays? There is no problem with someone, who keeps his sexual life private. Do it, unless nobody knows about that. Homosexuality is against the normal way of life, and most people are aware of that, as a lifestyle. Genetics prove nothing so far, it is only the personal opinion of some scientists, not proof.

Homophilia is treated as the sexual desire of some people, who lack the sexual education, and gone the wrong way.

It is criticised simply because it is known to be the choice of a person who's only fault of becoming gay. Even at this stage, gays are looking forward to give way to homosexuality, and are looking for "gay rights" at the law, which is really awful thing to do.



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 09:42 AM
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ISTVAN, I respect your opinion,...but in my eye's you are sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo wrong...



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 09:42 AM
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Originally posted by esther
I didn't read this entire thread because of its monstrous length, but I did go back a couple days to get the flavor of what was going on.

One thing has struck me as odd: I haven't seen one openly-gay member comment on this thread. It seems like only straight people sharing stories about gay friends or hypothetical children they might have in the future, but I have yet to see a post from anyone actually IN the gay community.

Did I miss anyone or would most of you agree that my observation is correct?

(And Glinda sings: "Come out, come out, wherever you are and meet the young lady who fell from a star...")


esther.


I was just about to make such a comment... you won't see open gays writing here, only maybe some gays who claim themselves as straight. They are hiding well, only show up to demonstrate at the White House for legal rights. Anyway, I get to know, that gays are here, and posting comments, but do not dare to clain the thruth. I just wonder, why?



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 09:47 AM
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Originally posted by Italiano
ISTVAN, I respect your opinion,...but in my eye's you are sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo wrong...


You know, I had no problem with gays at all, because I rarely saw them and there was no great news about them. But now gays just go too far, just very far. Gay marrige, which is just nonsense, could somehow accepted. But gay child adoptation is not. And I really hate to see children getting into abusive families... Still, we don't know, what to come next.

With such steps, gays are looking forward to recieve great hate and threat from the entire human community. It is better to think about that.



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 12:17 PM
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[edit on 10/2/2004 by esther]



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 12:22 PM
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[edit on 10/2/2004 by esther]



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 12:57 PM
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Istavan does not speak English as a first language and therefore speaks an ancient patois called bollocks.



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 01:01 PM
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[edit on 10/2/2004 by esther]



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 01:18 PM
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Originally posted by TACHYON
It may have well been a choice for him. He was probably scarred with past relationships and he had had enough. Just out of curiousty, are you assuming "it defintely wasn't a choice for him" or did he explicity state it and honestly believe it?


He told me that he really tried to fight it but that he couldn't help those feelings anymore. And he said it started in 6th grade- most likely before he would have been able to be "scarred with past relationships". So yes, he pretty much did state that it wasn't a choice.



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 01:30 PM
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Of course he couldn't fight it.
It would be like straight men trying to be turned on by their own gender, and stop liking girls. It's not a fight you can win.

What ccertainly is a choice, is the total ignorance showed by Istvan and TACHYON who is making a fool out of himself, and further damaging the general opinion on muslims.



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 01:32 PM
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[edit on 10/2/2004 by esther]



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 01:48 PM
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That's a very brave offer esther.

I'm not sure wether there is any point in talking to TACHYON, since he seems to have a direct channel to Allah, supplying him with the "wisdom" he needs, and I don't think Istvan is mentally 100% if you know what I mean.

Anyways, let me start off with the first question.
When you first found out you were attracted to your own gender, did you want to change? Did you search for ways to become straight?



posted on Aug, 15 2004 @ 01:53 PM
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The whole argument about gay rights is completely moot unless it is generally accepted that being gay is NOT a choice and that homosexuals are genetically predisposed to being attracted to people of the same sex. I offer this question: When (how old were you) did you consciously choose to be attracted to the opposite sex? Or did it just come natural for you? If you're honest with yourself than the answer should be that it just came naturally. Why is it such a leap for some to accept that for homosexuals it comes naturally as well. For those who still aren't convinced then I offer this link which shows what MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS say about homosexuality:

www.apa.org...

For those who are still unconvinced and choose to be ignorant then there's no point in continuing this discussion as you're probably so wrapped around some religious dogmatism that you're unable to see the truth even if it slapped you in the face.

For those who are willing to accept that gays/lesbians are born this way but still don't believe that they should be afforded the same rights/liberties (such as marriage, adoption etc) as heteros then please allow me to entertain this discussion further:

First, I am a happily married hetero-sexual male. As a political independent I generally believe that what people do should be their business (and it should be legal) as long as what they do doesn't negatively impact or otherwise adversely affect the rights or civil liberties of others.

I've heard many on the "right" argue that allowing gays the right to marry will destroy the "sanctity" of marriage. What sanctity exactly? I can tell you that the success or failure of my marriage has nothing to do with whether or not gays marry. It is completely and solely dependent on what my wife and I make of it; nothing else. Besides, whatever "sanctity" exists in marriage was diminished long ago when the government provided financial benefits to married couples through reduced taxes.

"But marriage is all about being able to support our society with procreation!! Gays/lesbians are unable to contribute through procreation and therefore should not be allowed to marry."

If this is your argument than the same restrictions should be applied to infertile couples or those who are too old to have children since they too are unable to "contribute".

"This issue is, relatively speaking, so small, and it affects so few, that we shouldn't even be discussing it; especially with issues such as terrorism on the table which have a much wider effect".

I would tend to agree were it not for one simple fact: The Christian right, including President Bush, would love to amend the constitution to prevent gays/lesbians in sharing in their fundamental right to express their love for each other through marriage. If this doesn't scare you it should! It scares the hell out of me!. The last thing I want is for the government to make any amendments to the constitution further restricting citizen's rights; especially if those amendments have origins stemming from the Bible. If we use religion or the Bible as a guide for changing laws or amending our constitution then I and those like me are in a lot of trouble. After all, I like to occasionally go to strip clubs (covet), I tend to eat and drink a lot (glutton), and my goal is too make a lot of money for retirement (greed); just to mention a few of my indiscretions against the 7 deadly sins. And these are by CHOICE!! So if a group of people are being deprived rights because of a "condition" that they otherwise have no control of what could happen to MY rights if some religious nuts get their hands on the Constitution.

When Thomas Jefferson wrote the Declaration of Independence he included a section that protected slaves who were born in this country. But Congress removed that section and in deference to the south protected the institution of slavery within the body of the Constitution. Clearly all men are created equal (unless your black) and placed in context of today, we know that this was wrong. But from where I sit there is little difference between what slaves endured politically years ago and what gays are enduring today. The only difference I see is that restricting the rights of slaves was purely economic and restricting the rights of gays is primarily religious.

I apologize for the long diatribe and I'll climb from down from my soapbox now.



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