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A Christian's Apology to Everyone

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posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 04:46 PM
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I’m a Christian. Are you? Do you claim to be? I’m not sure all of you that claim to be “Christians” truly grasp the brevity of your “titles”.

A Christian is defined as follows: relating to or characteristic of Christianity; a religious person who believes Jesus is the Christ and who is a member of a Christian denomination; following the teachings or manifesting the qualities or spirit of Jesus Christ
So I must ask again, are you truly a Christian?

Let me clarify that I am NOT sitting here casting my judgment on all Christians that post on these forums and this is in NO WAY an attack on all Christians on these boards. Not everyone makes these mistakes and I have seen a small group of Christians that try their hardest to be a direct reflection of His image.

I will admit that I make mistakes, have lapses of character, and do not have all the answers. But please, just hear me out.

God is love. Why are we so defensive? Why do we attack all of the people around here that question our beliefs, the Bible, and God? As a Christian, you are called to be Christ-like. Jesus wouldn’t respond to people in the way that I see Christians speaking to others on these boards. I have to admit that I am ashamed to be categorized with some of the “Christians” that I see post on these boards. We represent Christ and it’s an embarrassment at how well we are doing that. Honestly, if I was basing anything about God, Jesus, the Bible, etc off the people that speak here and talk “religion” then I wouldn’t care for the idea all too much either. Relationship > Religion.

How do we ever expect anyone of a different belief to listen to anything we have to say? What would make someone that doesn’t believe in God, Jesus, or the Bible want to have anything to do with us? We should know better than this!

Building relationships and living live with love goes for anyone. You don’t have to be a Christian to do that. Something I’ve learned in my life is that you have to make someone care or at least respect you before most people will listen and speak with you. The same goes for someone speaking on any topic. First, you just have to be kind, respectful, and gracious. And patient!!

Guys and girls, we’re all going to get upset sometimes here. In the name of conversation, things get heated, we disagree, and honestly, sometimes there’s not much common ground to stand on. I know I’ve gotten frustrated in a few instances, but we have to keep our cool and speak like adults. Sometimes it’s just wise to agree to disagree. We need to know when to swallow our pride, embrace humility, and admit when we're wrong.

I would like to personally apologize to anyone that has ever received a response from a Christian with hate or obvious personal attacks. That’s not what I stand for and it isn’t what Christianity is all about.

I want to leave you with this: Very few people in this world actually act like Christians and act out of love for a fellow brother and sister. I want all that do not believe in Christianity, God, the Bible, etc to understand that the people that act in this unwise manner do not truly understand the commitment and what it means to be a follower of Christ. All I ask is that you guys don’t judge me personally for the mass majority of “Christians” that represent something that is SO FAR off of what God is and the Bible speaks about.

I whole-heartedly urge ANYONE to seek for Truth. I’ve seen “Christians” on here say things like don’t question the Word of God, etc. Listen, I’m confident in the God I serve and the Bible. To tell others not to question it is to say that you aren’t confident in what you believe and can’t defend it. Truth can stand the tests of ANYONE. So if you’re a Christian, welcome questions with open arms. After all, no one should ever be urged to believe something just for the sake of doing it.

P.S. I did not create this thread to debate any issues. There's a time and place for that, but this simply a statement being put forward by a Christian to everyone. Feel free to discuss anything 've said in this thread, but please guys, let's stay on topic.

Thanks for your time in readings guy and I hope you all have a great day.
edit on 21-3-2011 by PronoEast because: (no reason given)




posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 04:48 PM
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well said...




posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 04:50 PM
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I tend to agree with Gandhi:

"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."



edit on 21-3-2011 by IamAbeliever because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 04:51 PM
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Originally posted by IamAbeliever
I tend to agree with Gandhi:

"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."


edit on 21-3-2011 by IamAbeliever because: (no reason given)


In many instances, you are dead on man.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 04:52 PM
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I think you're referring to HypoChristians, we've all had to deal with this kind of mentality at some point. Defensiveness usually indicates a lack of faith in their facts about their faith.
If we could some day get past all the titles and compartmentalization of personalities & belief systems, we will stop being divided & conquered by the elite.
edit on 21-3-2011 by JibbyJedi because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 04:55 PM
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Originally posted by IamAbeliever
I tend to agree with Gandhi:

"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."



edit on 21-3-2011 by IamAbeliever because: (no reason given)


I love this quote. Gandhi was awesome and this is so sadly very true. I'd like to top off with a few bible verses:

Mat 7:12 "So whatever you wish that others would do to you, do also to them, for this is the Law and the Prophets.
Mat 7:13 "Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many.
Mat 7:14 For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few.
Mat 7:15 "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves.
Mat 7:16 You will recognize them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?
Mat 7:17 So, every healthy tree bears good fruit, but the diseased tree bears bad fruit.
Mat 7:18 A healthy tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a diseased tree bear good fruit.
Mat 7:19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
Mat 7:20 Thus you will recognize them by their fruits.
Mat 7:21 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 On that day many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?'
Mat 7:23 And then will I declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.'
(E-sword program, English Standard version of the bible)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 05:02 PM
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reply to post by PronoEast
 





God is love. Why are we so defensive?


Maybe because it has been proven science that life existed long before the alleged story of creation. Do the math, the story of Jesus, is what? 2k years old, now add roughly 3k for the story of creation. A total of 5k years total. And yet science has proven life existed, ( through DNA testing ) 11k years ago.




Why do we attack all of the people around here that question our beliefs, the Bible, and God?
\

Because any belief in a mythical character known to cause more famine, plagues, and war... more than anything else in history is laughable at best.




As a Christian, you are called to be Christ-like


I guess for some, the act just doesn't suit them?




How do we ever expect anyone of a different belief to listen to anything we have to say?


Because those with other belief systems are crazy nut jobs as well perhaps?



What would make someone that doesn’t believe in God, Jesus, or the Bible want to have anything to do with us? We should know better than this!



Most free thinking individuals with a lick of common sense already do know better!





First, you just have to be kind, respectful, and gracious. And patient!!


That I will agree with, but good luck with that happening on these forums.




Guys and girls, we’re all going to get upset sometimes here. In the name of conversation, things get heated, we disagree, and honestly, sometimes there’s not much common ground to stand on. I know I’ve gotten frustrated in a few instances, but we have to keep our cool and speak like adults. Sometimes it’s just wise to agree to disagree. We need to know when to swallow our pride, embrace humility, and admit when we're wrong.



Gotta love the First Amendment!




I’m confident in the God I serve and the Bible.


Even though the story has been re-written by man how many times and re-published by man over the past how many centuries?

I commend you on your efforts, but as of late, with all the nut jobs in the name of Jesus, religion has only shown its true colors.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 05:02 PM
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reply to post by PronoEast
 


Spot on!

We have to challenge our beliefs, just have to.

It is foolish and not very mature to think you know everything, even down to interpretation of scripture. If you don't question, you don't learn.

To paraphrase some 1st century thought: Christianity is the "way", not the destination.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 05:05 PM
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Very well done op....

Many needed to hear that....

Still the ones who are doing these things that you are mentioning are playing their part in the big picture as well and balancing out the equation. It is people like you that show the open hearts what jesus was really trying to say. Now I am not one to announce allegence to a religous group because in my opinion by doing that right away is seperating us from eachother. No matter where we learn how to live on earth during this lifetime we need an example of what not to do and eventually even those lost souls will be shown the light.

Care for all, even if it means you must sacrifice yourself for those that you never even met, because one day you might see them as your brothers and sisters and wish that you could have done more...

Great thread and I hope everyone can see why you posted it.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 05:07 PM
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Reply to post by PronoEast
 


It's a nice gesture
, but you don't have to apologise to anyone here. I know there are always the minority in any group who ruin it for everyone else, so to speak...


 
Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com
 



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 05:11 PM
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reply to post by PronoEast
 


A Christian's Apology to Everyone,


Despite your OP coming off as genuine, this really is a waste of time...


Your apology, unfortunately, means very little...the members here may appreciate your take on this just as I do, but let's be honest - the same close minded, double standard christians you are apologizing for well take nothing from this...they may even thrive off of it.


While you have may have climbed most of the way out of the cesspool that makes up that particular religion, the majority of everyone else will remain the same as they float through life on a mattress of ignorance...


With that said - thanks for the words...





posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 05:13 PM
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Great applause.

Though I personally still will react very critically to 'invasive', missionary, monopoly-seeking christians. Not because of a will to eliminate christianity or as thought-police, but because these extremists often interfere directly or indirectly in other peoples lives. Some verbal resistance to this is unfortunately still necessary.

(I would do similarly to any other kind of ideological extremists also. I do not single out christianity).

On my part I would like to return the courtesy. Any non-invasive christian can count on my support (for what it's worth) for his/her rights as an egalitarian member of liberal society, protected against elitist claims from competing ideologies.
edit on 21-3-2011 by bogomil because: syntax



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 05:23 PM
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reply to post by Whereweheaded
 


Quick point of disagreement here.

First off, according to our current accepted science, life is much older than 11k years - some up to billions. Humans life on the scale (accepted, that is) of hundreds of thousands.

Sorry for the quibble - I just wanted to throw in that the bible doesn't limit things to the 5/6 thousand years young-earth creations like to mention frequently.

This all figures in to ancient astronaut theory, the fact that we are "a species with amnesia", and various other indicators - the beginning of the book of Genesis allows for the usual starting point of history to actually be a RE-creation: 'Gen 1:1 In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. Gen 1:2 The earth WAS without form and void, and darkness was over the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters.'

The word translated "was" in verse two (capitalized above) is 'hâyâh' in hebrew, and can also mean "became". This allows for all the lost pre-histories to come into play, as well as beliefs in prior galactic colonization by inter-dimensional beings usually called angels.

Just wanted to toss that out, thanks.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 05:26 PM
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Originally posted by IamAbeliever
I tend to agree with Gandhi:

"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."



edit on 21-3-2011 by IamAbeliever because: (no reason given)

I could'nt agree with you more IamAbeliever. Top quote.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 05:29 PM
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I'm probably the worst Christian there is ,I truly love God an accept Jesus Christ as my lord and savior but I fall way short of his great glory , I would never push my beliefs on anyone , I guess that would make me a Deist , and I would never do that stupid crap WBBC does , they are christian extremist , that kind of behavior can turn anyone into an Atheist , I'm not saying being an Atheist is bad , I have a lot of friends that are Atheist and I respect their belief , I respect everyone's belief as long as it doesn't involve killing , suffering , bible bashing , finger pointing , ect......I truly believe that no being can comprehend God , I guess I will know more about him/her when I pass from this world to the next.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 05:35 PM
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reply to post by facelift
 


I'm not so pessimistic as you are. Maybe you ARE right, but any genuine gesture of diplomacy and dialogue is worth a try.

Usually I manifest as an annoying extremist-christian 'basher' here, but I enjoy it, when I can have a peaceful and meaningful dialogue with moderate christians. Besides it's a bit unfair, if the christianities solely are represented by their worst factions.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 05:42 PM
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reply to post by JibbyJedi
 



Defensiveness usually indicates a lack of faith in their faith.


We're all at different stages of our lives, and are learning different lessons. Those lessons probably won't match yours on any given day, although all the better if you share some similarities with someone you normally care about, but the particulars will vary and people tend to change "experimentally", then adopt the change if it seems advantageous. When inquiring about each other, or questioning anothers behaviour, it's only polite to not inquire or question too deeply, or else it becomes a probe into their privacies and intimacies. It's polite at that point to stand back and adopt a defensive pov until behaviour we might not like the look of becomes a matter of self-evident facts to draw upon. And that's only one standard reason to become defensive. So I agree, a lack of faith, but I disagree it's a lack of faith in ones religion, it's a lack of faith in another's decisions who act or behave in an "unbecoming" manner.

There are other reasons, and they run deep. It will restore some faith in humanity once recognized ...

Umbrella labels, and guilt by association. For example, friends insist you take up a trip to visit friends in a neighbouring town. You're drafted, nothing seems so bad about the idea, until you are in the car and someone's
mayhem switch flips as conversation takes any wild, chaotic term they want on a whim. The atmosphere becomes loud and obnoxious, but you're used to it, so what? Right? Frequencies, overall mood, and awareness of boundaries are immediately upset. Souls crowd each other, hopefully on a friendly basis, and comments are shot that sear at consciences. The favourite game to play against someone with a known strong conscience on matters is to break that unspoken strong stance down until the low bar of mediocrity makes "allowance" for subsequent actions to be partaken, based on the pain of peer rejection or ostricization, since planning an evil act is every bit a part of evil agenda as the act itself.

I won't suggest that the beach or a nightclub are off-limits to Christians, but if you're not prepared for the state of opposition, spiritually, it isn't always a good idea.

If the strong conscience is overcome, the carload might re-decide destinations and reroute to Rama for a night at the casino, or to the beach, or to the nightclub. Whatever happens at those destinations becomes a shared guilt trip if it goes awry, and if it's against the better judgement of the Holy Spirit, or the angels protecting the individuals, such standard and reliable protections are forfeited automatically besides any mercy that might be found on the field. Unless you're the poster Taliesin, spiritual people encounter evil spirits, demons, and dark influences bordering from temptations to miasma's on a daily basis, depending on their spiritual progress and conscious desire to foresee slippery slopes and avoid them before they happen. To be defensive on these grounds is very much in keeping with faith. To not encounter their evil is to be either so pure that you look entirely the other way, or untruthful about spiritual realities, because you can be certain the clown who brags about what he's going to do with his thousands of Rama winnings and is recommending the hotel, hot women, and all the other frills isn't in the same soul places you are.

How much of life is cultivating defenses, keeping silent or aloof to ideas we don't agree with, speaking out against the cyclic nonsense and recursive strategies of evil desire (I will personally say In Others for most part), and staying intact with grace under pressure when we succeed? Again and again, and again and again they provoke in me a sense of something that can only be described as "heavenly belaborement" - people know better, but in determined obstinacy, insist upon the bent down to hell, the wrong turn that leads to misery, the foolish and loud voice over the quiet inner voice that guides. Don't blame our faith, or lack of, for rejecting 90% of what we hear at times. Nor should we, at times of emotional overwash from someone else who is insistant enough to compulse us, expect a sound Christian or spiritual person to cast down their inner defenses for your idle pleasure.

Furthermore, anger, and righteous indignation, is not the sole possession of religious zealotry, however swift people are draw the catechism. If angry for a good reason amounts to "defensive over your faith" then you should not only check your labels, but check your logic. The actions you or another took to provoke such a reaction reflect on the originator, not the recipient. Having strong faith makes you more human, not less.




edit on 21-3-2011 by Northwarden because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 05:43 PM
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Originally posted by Praetorius
reply to post by Whereweheaded
 


Quick point of disagreement here.

First off, according to our current accepted science, life is much older than 11k years - some up to billions. Humans life on the scale (accepted, that is) of hundreds of thousands.

Sorry for the quibble - I just wanted to throw in that the bible doesn't limit things to the 5/6 thousand years young-earth creations like to mention frequently.

This all figures in to ancient astronaut theory, the fact that we are "a species with amnesia", and various other indicators - the beginning of the book of Genesis allows for the usual starting point of history to actually be a RE-creation: 'Gen 1:1 In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. Gen 1:2 The earth WAS without form and void, and darkness was over the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters.'

The word translated "was" in verse two (capitalized above) is 'hâyâh' in hebrew, and can also mean "became". This allows for all the lost pre-histories to come into play, as well as beliefs in prior galactic colonization by inter-dimensional beings usually called angels.

Just wanted to toss that out, thanks.



Um actually, from what I gathered, we have the most recent remains of a young girl rated at 11,000 years ago, and a domesticated dog, 14,000 years ago.

www.redorbit.com...
news.yahoo.com...


Sorry, but the story as told of jesus and the creation, was roughly 5-6 thousand years ago. But, scientific proof always tends to fall on deaf ears....gotta keep embracing the one thing in factual history that has been the cause of more famine, wars, and plagues....



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 06:05 PM
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If defense leads to attacking another, if can be to drive an oppressor back. How do you know it is not to defend another person or important point of ideology that could help another. We are exhorted to help each other, and is self-defense off the table of options once you become a "True" Christian? Yes, God is love, but wisdom should rule over foolish behaviours as surely as light outshines darkness.

Love is many things.

On being defensive over associations : How many posts have you read through, yet with-held a star because, meh, most sounded good but you strongly Dis-agreed with one idea or train of thought? It's understandable, and realistic, and healthy follow-up, in truth with your stance. That person didn't well-represent your ideals, (etc) and didn't earn your point of recognition (regardless of the value you imply at this point). Contrast that to posts you have starred just because you really, really enjoyed one stunning point. It has happened, yes? That's how vulnerable we are to umbrella strategies, that mesh good and evil into one ugly acceptance. It also reminds me why I enjoy posts from Proto, Unity 99, Muzzleflash and others so much. Some people make every effort for the noble outlooks, and leave the low-bars alone for the people who won't step too high!
edit on 21-3-2011 by Northwarden because: (no reason given)

edit on 21-3-2011 by Northwarden because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 06:16 PM
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Originally posted by Northwarden
We are exhorted to help each other, and is self-defense off the table of options once you become a "True" Christian? Yes, God is love, but wisdom should rule over foolish behaviours as surely as light outshines darkness.


No, I agree that we have every right to defend ourselves and stand up for what we believe in, but I think there's a certain way to do that. We can still be respectful in that manner and not have to be ugly about it, you know?




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