Bible Answers to Member Questions

Why do you elevate the scriptures to such a pedestal? Unless those with the authority to do so put the bible together, the bible is just a collection of books anyone can put together and reinterpret. Jesus did not even commission His apostles to write it, which is why not all the apostles wrote it. You somehow accept the authenticity of the bible but deny the Church that compiled it. Why should the books chosen by Catholics to compile together, the doctrine of the trinity, etc, be accepted as true unless they have the authority to do so? You say scripture is of no private interpretation but that is exactly what most protestants do: you read the bible and what you think it says you follow. You do not accept the Church's interpretation.

Originally posted by 547000
Why do you elevate the scriptures to such a pedestal? Unless those with the authority to do so put the bible together, the bible is just a collection of books anyone can put together and reinterpret. Jesus did not even commission His apostles to write it, which is why not all the apostles wrote it. You somehow accept the authenticity of the bible but deny the Church that compiled it. Why should the books chosen by Catholics to compile together, the doctrine of the trinity, etc, be accepted as true unless they have the authority to do so? You say scripture is of no private interpretation but that is exactly what most protestants do: you read the bible and what you think it says you follow. You do not accept the Church's interpretation.

The Apostles commissioned it to be wrote as a written testament to what they saw and experienced the same as the Torah anf Talmud are the written testaments of the Isrealites trials. It has ever been the hebrew way to make record of important events and even more so concerning God and the Messiah. Alot of the books were probably written by the Apostles disciples as a guide for future generations of christians so that we would have a written record of the events. Stories spread by word of mouth have a tendency to change with every telling but books are different. Not to mention the fact that Yah laid a curse on anyone who dared to change the meaning of the words that were written and fear and reverence of God would have been enough to stop this. Keep in mind there were occasions here the Holy Spirit (God) killed people who lied to him. Look up what happened to Ananias and Sapphira in Acts ch.5

Well, then, what do you make of this article?

What the author is saying seems reasonable to me.

reply to post by 547000

Why do you elevate the scriptures to such a pedestal?

Because God the Father thinks more of His words in the Bible, than He does of the Name of His son Jesus Christ. You want to try me on this? You think I just post stuff without being 100% sure of what I am talking about? Because the Bible is the only way God "talks" with us in this Church age verbally.

I could go on, but just know this. There is no end to the heights I could elevate the matchless words of God as found in the King James Bible for my English speaking tongue. To be honest....I am not even worthy to open a Bible....yet through the grace of God...he gave me eternal life through His Son...AND a Bible in my own LANGUAGE so that I can know God personally.

Unless those with the authority to do so put the bible together, the bible is just a collection of books anyone can put together and reinterpret.

I don't have the authoirty.....but a KING does. King James in Fact.
ECCLESIASTES 8:4
"Where THE WORD OF A KING is, there is power: and who may say unto him, What doest thou?" It didn't say "church".... And don't you dare try and throw out Matthew 16:18...you will be in for a surprise if you do. Chew on that for a while.

Jesus did not even commission His apostles to write it, which is why not all the apostles wrote it. You somehow accept the authenticity of the bible but deny the Church that compiled it.

The catholic church complied a bunch of trash ALONG with the accept books in the cannon. This trash was the 14 or so apocrypha books, that King James took out of both testaments. Now answer me this.....where did the catholic church get the books of the Bible from in order to compile them..... They got them from "real" Christians that they were burning at the stake. History proves me correct.

You say scripture is of no private interpretation but that is exactly what most protestants do: you read the bible and what you think it says you follow. You do not accept the Church's interpretation.

To be quite frank....screw the catholic "church". I have had just about enough of their burning, bloodlust, orgies, popes, child molesting, voodoo, Nun abortions, scripture perversion, and ring, foot, arm, head, toe kissing that I can stand. The sooner they burn up in Revelation 17-18 the better. I will be one of the ones rejoicing as they burn.

reply to post by 547000


Agreed.

Legend and tradition alone, dreamed up by the early churches in their bid for legitimacy and authority, provided the uplifting fables of heroics and martyrdom. The plethora of conflicting claims and alternative deaths stand eloquent testimony to wholesale fabrication of the non-existent godman's non-existent companions.

source

The Fabricated Deaths of the Apostles

Deceiving the Unsophisticated by Trickery

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
reply to post by sacgamer25

 

The message of Christ is unlike the message in any other religious book. Each of earth’s religions from Paganism to modern religions teaches us that we must overcome sin. They also teach us that the better we get at overcoming sin the more enlightened or more pleasing to God we become.

You say that as if other religons dont instruct followers to overcome sin.

You are correct all other religions tell you to stop sinning by your own power. Christ said this is impossible which is why you need to understand the will of God and the Holy Spirit as your guide.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


I am going to try to explain this without bible quotes and as simple as possible.

Hopefully I can help you understand who has been given the gift of interpretation by the Holy Spirit. Although I do believe that all who proclaim Christ is their Lord and savior and believes the word of God through faith have the Holy Spirit, I do not sense that all my brothers have the gift of interpretation. As well meaning as they are I still see many of my brothers passing judgment on others and causing separation.

ANYONE who proclaims that that JESUS CHRIST THE NAZARENE is there lord, and believes the bible in its entirety is my brother. Anyone who does not is an unbeliever.

So for my brothers I am told to rebuke them when they are in error. Usually my brothers are in error when they pass judgment on non believers. We are very strictly told not to pass judgment in any way on non believers. We are to walk away from conversations with these people and let God be there judge. As a matter of fact we are even instructed to love our enemies.

So you see if I say a harsh word, or even have a harsh thought, towards my enemies I have not loved them. It is only through showing you this kind of love that you will know that I have faith in a living God. If I am harsh to you I am no better than anyone else, therefore you see my God appears the same as all other Gods. But since I only show you love you know that my faith is true.

With the invention of the internet it is much easier for believers and unbelievers to mingle. So if you notice me rebuking anyone it will be someone who I believe based upon their testimony that they are my brother in Christ. To me it matters not what denomination they call themselves only that they believe Jesus is the son of the living God and have faith in the word in the bible. Even with that said when I rebuke I do this out of love. Always pointing them to the scripture that corrects what they have to say.

If anyone says anything to you that appears like an attack on you, or judges you in any way, or tells you that anyone is going to hell for anything they did”, or even shows that they separate themselves as superior to any of their brothers, other denominations, I promise they have not understood the message.

I can be certain of this because I never tried to interpret the bible. Several months ago I simply prayed that God would grant me the gift of interpretation. After praying for this gift it was as if my eyes began to see and my ears began to hear. I know the Holy Spirit has given me this gift because prior to this I did not hear what I hear today. If you read the posts that I have posted over the past month you will know that my faith is complete.

On a side note, now that I know the Holy Spirit has interpreted the bible for me, I do not believe that the translation matters much. I believe God is bigger than man and preserves his message. So I urge you and everyone to read whatever translation is easiest for you to understand.

Originally posted by 547000
Well, then, what do you make of this article?

What the author is saying seems reasonable to me.

This author is both correct and incorrect.

The place where he is correct is that no man can interpret the scripture.
Where he is incorrect is that no man can interpret the scripture.

This is not as confusing as it sounds. The article you posted is man arguing against man. So if I call myself a pastor somehow magically I can interpret the scripture. Isn’t a pastor still a man? For that matter isn’t the Pope still a man? So we are left with two groups of men who both claim the faith that Jesus is the son of God and believe in every word of the bible. So you see what man does when he doesn’t understand is cause separation. As brothers we are not to cause separations so if we disagree on an interpretation it still should not cause separation but it has.

So if man cannot interpret the scripture who can? Only the Holy Spirit who was responsible for the scripture can interpret the scripture for man. So you see as a man having the power given to you by the Holy Spirit it is possible to interpret the bible. This was God’s plan. You see you have to have faith first then you are given the ability to understand.

Most of my brothers grew up with an understanding from the Church or have tried to interpret the bible by man’s understanding both of which will fall short of complete understanding. Here are some bible quotes that explain what I am saying.

26 I am writing these things to you about those who are trying to lead you astray. 27 As for you, the anointing you received from him remains in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as his anointing teaches you about all things and as that anointing is real, not counterfeit—just as it has taught you, remain in him. 1 John 2:26-27

"But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God." (1 Corinthians 2:10)

"But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, HE WILL TEACH YOU ALL THINGS, and bring to your remembrance all things that I have said to you." (John 14:26)

"However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, HE WILL GUIDE YOU INTO ALL TRUTH ..." (JOHN 16:13)
2 Cor. 13:14, "The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all."

Just as a side note, I can claim no responsibility for my understanding. I am a sinner no more righteous than any believer or non believer. The gift of interpretation was given to me as a gift. And what I was given freely I will share freely.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
reply to post by jmdewey60

 

Sin is not just doing something wrong according to a predetermined set of rules but a disassociation from God's spirit.

But the sins that people commit result in that "disassociation from God's spirit"... or God, in whatever way people understand God.

No religious jew, muslim, hindu, whatever can claim he can live a life of sin and still be obedient to God, (though many are deluded so)

Here is the difference, we are all born sinners. As such we are all born separated from our God. Jesus died on the cross to bring us back to our father. He did this by providing a way, living a sin free life. Jesus lived on earth completely a man. He had but 2 weapons the word, bible, and the Holy Spirit. Through the power of the word and the Holy Spirit he was able to perform miracles and live sin free.

The only advantage he had over you and me was he was born with complete knowledge of heaven so his faith was unshakable. Now you see this is not really much of an advantage because God has made it plain that there is a creator so it should not be difficult for us to have faith in God. So we are really left with this question; does God love us enough to give us a book that explains how and why we are here and show us the path to return to him. If you have faith in Christ and the Bible you will be clearly shown the path to God.

Once you can see the path, through faith, you are granted the Holy Spirit. By the power of the Holy Spirit it is possible for man to overcome his sinful nature and become like Christ. This is what Jesus wanted, for us to follow him.

reply to post by sacgamer25

Christ said this is impossible which is why you need to understand the will of God and the Holy Spirit as your guide.

So, I take it Christ told you this personally? Not on word was written about what Christ said for years after he died. So how can you say "Christ said," when you do not know, and have no idea whatsoever, about what the man said?

Christianity IS Mind Control

Hearing Voices - Schizophrenia

Before you take offence, every schizophrenic I have ever spoken to "hears" either Angels talking to them, or Jesus talking to them. And the funny thing, I would bet is someone said you you that they hear ETs talking to them, you would say they are hearing demons. am I right? Let's face it, no body really knows what Christ "said."
The True Authorship of the New Testament

Spoken like a true Fundamentalist, friend. What is it you think you know everything about it? Did Jesus tell you that? From reading you, it seem that Jesus is constantly talking to you, telling you this and that. Where did you get the authority to speak for Christ, friend? Don't you think perhaps he may get a little angry at you tell people what he supposedly said?
Take a look here:
Spurious changes to the Bible BIBLE TEXT SPURIOUS ADDITIONS, FALSIFICATIONS, MISTRANSLATIONS
and here:
Debunking the Arguments of Christian Fundamentalists and Evangelists

As you can see, the book you preach from was not only written by men with an agenda, but has been changed, a lot through the years.
So how can it be called the actual, literal words of Christ?
Not attacking you, just showing you what you look like to us secular folk.

reply to post by autowrench


If the message that Christ taught in the bible was actually being used as mind control and let’s assume it worked. Then at least one half of the world would be living without sin and contributing to ensure that all of mankind had the basic necessities.

Since none of this is true I guess the mind control is not very good. But you see Jesus didn't teach to control your mind but to actually give up your mind and peruse the mind of God, which is in all thoughts and actions choose love.

Since it is impossible for me to sway your opinion through a loving message, I will pray for you that someday you may find the peace that knowing you have a loving father, God, can bring to your heart. May God’s will be done.

Originally posted by autowrench
Spoken like a true Fundamentalist, friend. What is it you think you know everything about it? Did Jesus tell you that? From reading you, it seem that Jesus is constantly talking to you, telling you this and that. Where did you get the authority to speak for Christ, friend? Don't you think perhaps he may get a little angry at you tell people what he supposedly said?
Take a look here:
Spurious changes to the Bible BIBLE TEXT SPURIOUS ADDITIONS, FALSIFICATIONS, MISTRANSLATIONS
and here:
Debunking the Arguments of Christian Fundamentalists and Evangelists

As you can see, the book you preach from was not only written by men with an agenda, but has been changed, a lot through the years.
So how can it be called the actual, literal words of Christ?
Not attacking you, just showing you what you look like to us secular folk.

edit on 12/23/11 by autowrench because: (no reason given)

The word of Christ is living, which means that it speaks to us yesterday, today, and tomorrow. If I claim to have faith in what I say and the word of God, why do you find it so hard to believe that I have also been given the gifts that my faith promises me? If I said anything other than what I said than I would be proving that I had no faith. Without faith one cannot receive the meaning in the bible.

But you see that I have faith, and all things that I proclaim can be testified to in the bible. So you see now you have the testimony of 2 or more witnesses. If I am witnessing to the truth of the bible and the bible is the other witness, then I am proving only that I have faith.

So what you are doing is questioning my faith, which cannot be shaken because I have faith in a living God.

And you may also notice that I am not saying anything that you can consider judgmental, nor do I claim any righteousness, because it is clear that through my faith I proclaim that all things that I have received I have been given freely from God. The only thing that is left is for me to pray for you, because I have love for you as I have been guided by the Holy Spirit to do.

Originally posted by autowrench
Spoken like a true Fundamentalist, friend. What is it you think you know everything about it? Did Jesus tell you that? From reading you, it seem that Jesus is constantly talking to you, telling you this and that. Where did you get the authority to speak for Christ, friend? Don't you think perhaps he may get a little angry at you tell people what he supposedly said?
Take a look here:
Spurious changes to the Bible BIBLE TEXT SPURIOUS ADDITIONS, FALSIFICATIONS, MISTRANSLATIONS
and here:
Debunking the Arguments of Christian Fundamentalists and Evangelists

As you can see, the book you preach from was not only written by men with an agenda, but has been changed, a lot through the years.
So how can it be called the actual, literal words of Christ?
Not attacking you, just showing you what you look like to us secular folk.

edit on 12/23/11 by autowrench because: (no reason given)

Yes I pray to God through the Holy Spirit regularly. And since I only pray for those things that are the will of my father I receive what I have prayed for. You have simply attacked what I say as truth but you have yet to show me where something that I said does not bear good fruit. I say that I follow the will of my father, and that my father’s will is love. My father’s will is love to the point of crucifixion. I do not know if my faith is strong enough to withstand that test but I believe that if need be God would increase my faith to the point of enduring suffering for what I believe.

The websites you present are presented by those without faith.
Since without faith one cannot understand the bible then your argument is circular just as you claim mine to be.

Since through faith I have been given the ability to interpret the bible, it is through faith that I can make the claim that God’s message is indeed intact. I have looked through all the various translations and I have found that indeed God’s message appears to be intact in each translation.

So if you want to continue a debate with me, show me where I failed to do the will of my father in my posts.

Originally posted by autowrench
Debunking the Arguments of Christian Fundamentalists and Evangelists

As for this website, I did not come to my father out of fear of hell. I came to my father because I knew that my actions were keeping me from him. I knew that God loved me and I knew that God had to have provided me a better way than what I was living. I was tired of being irritated, raising my voice, feeling frustrated by the daily routine. So I decided to give God a chance. I did do some study on other religions but my main focus was the bible.

It took me two years to even come to the conclusion that the bible was indeed completely accurate. It was not until I had looked at every scientific argument or every so called contradiction for myself did I realize that man was teaching something that man could not prove. I knew and know that a loving God was real so if man without proof said one thing and the bible another I simply choose to have faith that God told the truth.

It wasn’t until this point my faith grew and even then I still had a difficult time understanding the bible. It was not until I prayed to understand the bible that I became able to understand it. So you see my faith is complete, and since my faith is complete, God has given me what he promised.

And for who is going to heaven or hell, I do not know, I do not claim to understand all the ways of God or the secret lives of men. I can only be assured of my salvation, and in this assurance I will continue to do the will of my father.

I don't understand how can claim the Holy Spirit is guiding you when 30000+ (I think) denominations each think they are being guided by it too. What makes you so special that the real thing is guiding you? Everyone suspects they are being guided by the Holy Spirit but everyone comes to different interpretations. Isn't that evidence enough that the Holy Spirit is not guiding individuals too but that people are attributing their interpretations to the Holy Spirit? Then that is a lot of evidence that the promises that the Holy Spirit might mean guidance of the successors of the apostles.

Even scriptures say they cannot be of private interpretation but you've just hardened your heart against them because that would mean *GASP* the Catholic Church is correct when they call Protestantism a heresy.

Originally posted by 547000
I don't understand how can claim the Holy Spirit is guiding you when 30000+ (I think) denominations each think they are being guided by it too. What makes you so special that the real thing is guiding you? Everyone suspects they are being guided by the Holy Spirit but everyone comes to different interpretations. Isn't that evidence enough that the Holy Spirit is not guiding individuals too but that people are attributing their interpretations to the Holy Spirit? Then that is a lot of evidence that the promises that the Holy Spirit might mean guidance of the successors of the apostles.

Even scriptures say they cannot be of private interpretation but you've just hardened your heart against them because that would mean *GASP* the Catholic Church is correct when they call Protestantism a heresy.

The fact that anyone would separate themselves from other believers is all the proof you need that they are not being guided by the Holy Spirit.

If any church, or denomination teaches anything that is not written in the bible they are not guided by the Holy Spirit.

If any denomination teaches judgment of others, especially of non-believers, they are not guided by the Holy Spirit.

Look at the fruit of the believers. If they are quick to judgment they must not be guided by the Holy Spirit. Again look at a church, if it is full of greedy, sinful members the pastors are not being guided by the Holy Spirit.
This list could go on and on and on.

I know that the Holy Spirit is guiding me because I am using scripture to ensure that what I have understood is what is correct. If you can find anything that I say against scripture than I must also admit that I am not being led by the Holy Spirit.

The problem is man want desperately to interpret the bible, but they want this for their own gain. The gift I have been given I must give freely just as Jesus and the Apostles did.

I may offend many but I promise anyone who has been given the gift of interpretation from the Holy Spirit, would not charge anyone for it. They would follow in the footsteps of Jesus and Paul and they would work with their hands as to not be a burden to the church. I have no right to sell a gift that was given to me freely by God. I am not special; I don’t even find myself worthy of the knowledge. I realize that God choose me to give this gift too. I do not find myself close enough to Christ to begin spreading the word as an evangelist but I use this website to help me learn how to control myself.

I am working on remembering that I am no better than anyone else, I still see righteousness coming across in my message and this is unacceptable. I also am working on remaining humble always loving both my brothers and non-believers. I believe a time is coming soon, where the church that is described in the New Testament will start to spread. I do not know if somehow I am a catalyst to this or if many will be given this gift but I patiently wait for God to teach me and show me what I must do.

Believe me or not, I ask anyone who believes in God to pray for me, as I continuously pray for myself and all of you.

Originally posted by sacgamer25=

The fact that anyone would separate themselves from other believers is all the proof you need that they are not being guided by the Holy Spirit.

So what does that mean about all the denominations? Why did protestants separate themselves from the universal church and call Catholics non-Christians?

If any church, or denomination teaches anything that is not written in the bible they are not guided by the Holy Spirit.

Where in the bible does it say that?

If any denomination teaches judgment of others, especially of non-believers, they are not guided by the Holy Spirit.

Where in the bible does it say that? Define judgement please, because scriptures even tell you to dissociate yourself from heretics. I think you have to know what is true and what is false, but when you tell people the truth they defensively say "Don't judge me".

Look at the fruit of the believers. If they are quick to judgment they must not be guided by the Holy Spirit. Again look at a church, if it is full of greedy, sinful members the pastors are not being guided by the Holy Spirit.
This list could go on and on and on.

What about the people who provide brush aside the calls to repentance to fit in with modern philosophies? What about people who say you can live your life any way you please and Christ will still bring you to heaven when He said that not all who call Him lord will go to heaven. Is it judgement to state the truth?

I know that the Holy Spirit is guiding me because I am using scripture to ensure that what I have understood is what is correct. If you can find anything that I say against scripture than I must also admit that I am not being led by the Holy Spirit.

I can't find scripture-alone in any scripture. Some books like James' contradict faith-alone.

Even the devil can quote scripture.

The problem is man want desperately to interpret the bible, but they want this for their own gain. The gift I have been given I must give freely just as Jesus and the Apostles did.

They rebel against authority because of pride.

I may offend many but I promise anyone who has been given the gift of interpretation from the Holy Spirit, would not charge anyone for it. They would follow in the footsteps of Jesus and Paul and they would work with their hands as to not be a burden to the church. I have no right to sell a gift that was given to me freely by God. I am not special; I don’t even find myself worthy of the knowledge. I realize that God choose me to give this gift too. I do not find myself close enough to Christ to begin spreading the word as an evangelist but I use this website to help me learn how to control myself.

Where in the bible does it say all Christians will be given the gift of prophecy? Why do you suppose because you understand the scriptures in your own way that you have the gift?

I am working on remembering that I am no better than anyone else, I still see righteousness coming across in my message and this is unacceptable. I also am working on remaining humble always loving both my brothers and non-believers. I believe a time is coming soon, where the church that is described in the New Testament will start to spread. I do not know if somehow I am a catalyst to this or if many will be given this gift but I patiently wait for God to teach me and show me what I must do.

That is good but if you keep seeking the truth you will find it. The truth might not be comfortable and cause strife. If you keep seeking you might be able to overcome all the lies about the Catholic Church.

Believe me or not, I ask anyone who believes in God to pray for me, as I continuously pray for myself and all of you.

That is good.

Soooooooooo....any more Bible questions to get us back on topic? I'm sure some of you have something your curious about that you have found in the Bible. Lord knows I have....

reply to post by KJV1611

If any church, or denomination teaches anything that is not written in the bible they are not guided by the Holy Spirit.

Where in the bible does it say that?

I would like you point out where in the bible it says that. Otherwise I have to conclude Sola Scriptura is a tradition of man.

edit on 24-12-2011 by 547000 because: (no reason given)