EPA approves E15 use

This is a topic I have mixed reactions about and interested to hear your opinions on. Of course I care about the environment but ethanol has yet to be proven to deliver on it's clean air promise and cost efficiency of production. As some of you may be aware, despite lengthy testing and auto industry outcry the EPA recently approved production, sale and use of E15 (15% Ethanol / 85% gas) for 2001 and newer models.

www.epa.gov...

Further, use of E15 voids some facory warranties.

www.toyotanation.com...

Research has proven that ethanol drastically reduces fuel mileage. (up to 5% for E10 and up to 20% for E15 and E20) Aside from the subsidies the US pays farmers we are utilizing a potentially valuable food crop in the face of worldwide shortages. Not to mention affecting performamce although I believe NASCAR is now mandating it's use. Anybody with info on that aspect?

This is a complex issue on so many levels and it might seem petty to consider that in the not too distant future there will be no safe gasoline to fuel muscle/collector cars. (I had a 71 MG Midget that required leaded gasoline. I used to purchase a lead additive just to run that car.)

Thoughts?

reply to post by kinda kurious


Hello Kurious...

We've tried it for a few months after accidentally filling the tank with a blend, here in Australia. The car wroomed and zoomed the first time. Eventually the engine started knocking and we sussed the "some cars can and some cars can't" side of the issue. We stopped using it. Flat out stopped. There are also studies on health issues with it.

After some research we figured "ethanol" = what is now "unleaded" petrol/fuel ( which is costlier and more refined in production.) This is to maintain that model. Now Diesel is another story. Bio-diesel and diesel engines provides completely different issues, as bio-diesel "can" technically be produced at home/community etc. ( i.e. oil grows on trees ).

The French Peugeot company has been producing the Peugeot 307 and 407 diesel models for years. Average is 82 mpg ( miles per gallon ). The emissions are very low. Not just low.... very low. One wonders that such tech and standards isn't made The Standard and base benchmark for the whole industry. Within reason of course.

Through our research, or at the same time, we came across an Australian inventor who came up with a "Biocube"

link: biocube

You might be interested in it. A hundred acres ( 1,000? ) of hemp or sunflowers ( any oil plant ) can keep a small community fueled with bio-diesel. We figure diesel and bio-diesel as a model, gives independence AND cost effectiveness/economic sense.

I hear you on the antique and older cars deal... not sure what "alternative" models are dealing with the issue of fuel there. I do remember the additives we used for an old Jalopy we once had. All the more power to you man, and your Dogs.... and.... The open windows with dogs hanging half out while crusin' down the road of roses!

Sorry for the poetry.

reply to post by kinda kurious


The problem with the E85 is that alcohol stores less energy than gasoline does per volume. Also as to why it doesn't run as efficiently in modern automobiles. You end up using more of it to gain the same amount of Work.
Work = Force x Distance

Alcohol has been used in Drag racers for decades now due to it's lower flash point allowing them to run in very high performance forced induction (super/turbo charged) engines.

Lead was an inexpensive octane booster from the aviation industry, and was further utilized by the older cars as a valve seat and valve seal. Modern heads and valves no longer require this because they use different alloys.

But we were also inhaling lead from our auto exhaust which wasn't the best thing for our health.

What I'd recommend is the possibility of porting the heads for better flow and replacing the valves with more modern chromium plated valves that do not require the lead valve seat.

Or

even an engine swap with a more current British Leyland compatible engine or other more modern/current fuel injected compatible engine.


This is what many are doing with classic cars for it is makes it considerably more economical, drivable and with better performance. No points or Carburetors to fool with or of course the requirement for a fuel additive.

Or learn how to make your own lead additive.....going back to Chemistry 101.
What do lead pellets and acetone cost ?