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NSA Spying

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posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 02:19 AM
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NSA Spying


www.eff.org

The U.S. government, with assistance from major telecommunications carriers including AT&T, has engaged in a massive program of illegal dragnet surveillance of domestic communications and communications records of millions of ordinary Americans since at least 2001.

News reports in December 2005 first revealed that the National Security Agency (NSA) has been intercepting Americans’ phone calls and Internet communications. Those news reports, plus a USA Today story in May 2006 and the statements of several members of Congress, revealed that the NSA is also receiving wholesale copies of thei
(visit the link for the full news article)




posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 02:19 AM
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AT&T installed a fiberoptic splitter at its facility at 611 Folsom Street in San Francisco that makes copies of all emails, web browsing, and other Internet traffic to and from AT&T customers (including data from iPhones and iPads), and provides those copies to the NSA.

The unconstitutional retroactive law was passed in the summer of 2008 during the presidential primaries. Obama got a lot of praise because he said he would filibuster the bill on the senate floor. When the bill finally came up, he quickly reversed is position and urged all the democrats to support it.

A retroactive law is also called an "ex post facto" law (after the fact).

"No Bill of Attainder or ex post facto Law shall be passed." (Article 1 Section 9)


www.eff.org
(visit the link for the full news article)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 02:21 AM
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Well I hope they enjoy my numerous pizza orders. But in all seriousness I don't like this one bit. I always knew things like this happen but as you say it is against the constitution in so many ways.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 02:26 AM
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The nsa spying...never..the cia involved in covert operations..never..its a figment of your imagination.





posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 02:42 AM
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Originally posted by Alaskan Man


AT&T installed a fiberoptic splitter at its facility at 611 Folsom Street in San Francisco that makes copies of all emails, web browsing, and other Internet traffic to and from AT&T customers (including data from iPhones and iPads), and provides those copies to the NSA.

(visit the link for the full news article)


I don't know much about polotics, but I can tell you that this is not how network traffic management works. They would not need to do this from a technical point of view, Although I think I know what this is trying to say, after 20 years working in corporate IT at the highest level I have never heard of "A fiberoptic splitter". I have run huge networks including systems with fibre optic links between serves and also between nework equipment.

In order for a company to copy emails and "web browsing" (whatever that means?) All they would need to do is put a packet sniffer onto a router somewhere which coppied all SMTP and POP3 trafic to a seperate server. For customers who use that companies own email service they would already have copies of the mail on their servers, and so this would not be requred.

This so called "Web browsing". I can't figure out what this means. Of course I understand what web browsing is, but a cpmpany would need to install specific software which would monitor all HTTP trafic from all of it's customers IP addresses in order to build up a database of web activity for each customer. The alternative, I suppose, would be to keep weblogs on a proxy server. This would be done on the standard network - not by redirecting a network streem.

Ipads and iphones use wireless access points which would be routed over very diferent network paths before being placed in the internet. This would therefore not necesarily travel on that companies fibe optic backbone, as to save bandwidth most companies will break out to the internet at the neerest point of presence, and not route all trafic back to a head office before breakout. This would be an inneficient network topology.

All of these technical facts mean that what was written is technically rubbish, which makes me wonder if the story is not also rubish.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 02:46 AM
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reply to post by Shamatt
 


Very knowledgeably thank you for the info.

I love how ATS has people experienced in most fields.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 02:58 AM
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reply to post by Shamatt
 


Now we know why ATT service is so slow and always drops calls


I would not assume that this is not possible just because we do not know how it is possible with the technology we have available on the consumer market. The military/intelligence agencies routinely have equipment far in advanced of what is commercially available.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 03:00 AM
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Originally posted by Shamatt
Ipads and iphones use wireless access points which would be routed over very diferent network paths before being placed in the internet.


What if and i mean, what if, that random points of access points were supposedly scattered throughout a city, would that not make all incoming and outgoing connections that much easier to decrypt. ? Simply pointing to how its currently set up or should i say, assuming its set up. How else is one able to triangulate ones position without his or her gps enabled but via towers and that means without the use of cell towers but purely via open wifi points.




posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 03:33 AM
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Originally posted by tristar

Originally posted by Shamatt
Ipads and iphones use wireless access points which would be routed over very diferent network paths before being placed in the internet.


What if and i mean, what if, that random points of access points were supposedly scattered throughout a city, would that not make all incoming and outgoing connections that much easier to decrypt. ? Simply pointing to how its currently set up or should i say, assuming its set up. How else is one able to triangulate ones position without his or her gps enabled but via towers and that means without the use of cell towers but purely via open wifi points.



First of all, (Reply to previous post) regardless of ewhat the military may have, network topology and routing technology does not change. To say that there is a fibre optic spliter implies all the trafic for millions of cutomers goes down 1 single fibre link, at that quite franky is proposterous.

Now, on to the above. What you say makes no sence. Ther is no correlation at all between access points and encryption. These are two different subjects. Triangulation works by 3 or more masts receiving the signal from your phone, and then measuring the time difference between when the signal arrived at each mast. Knowing the speed at which the signal travels you can calculate how far from each of the 3 masts you are, and therefore triangulate an approximate possition of the mobile phone.

Wifi is a completely different subject yet again, and is not involved in either triangulation, or voice communication. It is a network connection usually using 802.11 protocol. It is not possible to triangulate using this. It is used for connection to the internet via an internet 'hotspot'. This is a netowrk router which uses the 802.11 wireless protocol.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 03:47 AM
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Originally posted by Shamatt

Originally posted by tristar

Originally posted by Shamatt
Ipads and iphones use wireless access points which would be routed over very diferent network paths before being placed in the internet.


What if and i mean, what if, that random points of access points were supposedly scattered throughout a city, would that not make all incoming and outgoing connections that much easier to decrypt. ? Simply pointing to how its currently set up or should i say, assuming its set up. How else is one able to triangulate ones position without his or her gps enabled but via towers and that means without the use of cell towers but purely via open wifi points.



First of all, (Reply to previous post) regardless of ewhat the military may have, network topology and routing technology does not change. To say that there is a fibre optic spliter implies all the trafic for millions of cutomers goes down 1 single fibre link, at that quite franky is proposterous.

Now, on to the above. What you say makes no sence. Ther is no correlation at all between access points and encryption. These are two different subjects. Triangulation works by 3 or more masts receiving the signal from your phone, and then measuring the time difference between when the signal arrived at each mast. Knowing the speed at which the signal travels you can calculate how far from each of the 3 masts you are, and therefore triangulate an approximate possition of the mobile phone.

Wifi is a completely different subject yet again, and is not involved in either triangulation, or voice communication. It is a network connection usually using 802.11 protocol. It is not possible to triangulate using this. It is used for connection to the internet via an internet 'hotspot'. This is a netowrk router which uses the 802.11 wireless protocol.



In respect to wifi hot spots, well lets say they are simply like taking candy from a child. Sure they use 80211 but that has no bearing when one decides to click and connect and factoring in the continues connection if one is mobile or not. The moment "he/she" is in, it truly doesn't need some wiz kid or super computer to locate the whereabouts. Now for the cell phone, well thats another ball park, one can place slave units at any point and have multiple points of connection thus making triangulation a difficult task as active points are enabled and diverted within an embedded code within the cell (switching on and off, roaming for sat connections or local, visa versa). Simply and obviously pointing out the obvious without getting into detail. Lets not forget jacking open cell/vehicle connections via blue tooth or gps, thats another ball park that i wont get into.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 04:08 AM
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reply to post by tristar
 


You are not making any sence. The only thing in your mail which is almost correct is that when you are connected to a wifi hotspot it is easy for the owner of that hotspot to know where you are. It is not easy for anyone else to know where you are because hotspots use NAT'ing which hides your actuall IP Address behind the router.

The rest of your post is drivel. Nothing you say is founded in fact. You clearly do not understand what GPS, roaming, bluetooth or PSTN actually are or how they work. It is probably best you don't talk about them untill you know what these things are, and understand the technology behind them.




one can place slave units at any point and have multiple points of connection thus making triangulation a difficult task as active points are enabled and diverted within an embedded code within the cell



WTF? On what planet is this real?




Simply and obviously pointing out the obvious without getting into detail.



This is not even a sentance!




Lets not forget jacking open cell/vehicle connections via blue tooth or gps, thats another ball park that i wont get into.



Not technically possible. you opbvously don't know what these technologies are or how they work. You are talking rubbish. Don't try and convince someone with over 20 years of experience in these technologies otherwise, you are wasting your time. (And mine)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 05:40 AM
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reply to post by Alaskan Man
 


First - Why are you posting this? This is not new, and has actually made its rounds through the court system, where the Telcom companies were found immune because of FISA


In June of 2009, a federal judge dismissed Hepting and dozens of other lawsuits against telecoms, ruling that the companies had immunity from liability under the controversial FISA Amendments Act (FISAAA), which was enacted in response to our court victories in Hepting. Signed by President Bush in 2008, the FISAAA allows the Attorney General to require the dismissal of the lawsuits over the telecoms' participation in the warrantless surveillance program if the government secretly certifies to the court that the surveillance did not occur, was legal, or was authorized by the president -- certification that was filed in September of 2008. EFF is planning to appeal the decision to the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, primarily arguing that FISAAA is unconstitutional in granting to the president broad discretion to block the courts from considering the core constitutional privacy claims of millions of Americans.


Secondly - Why are you posting this? This is not new, and has actually made its rounds through the court system.....

Unless you have new information or something paralell and are using this as an example...



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 08:07 AM
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Originally posted by Shamatt

Originally posted by Alaskan Man


AT&T installed a fiberoptic splitter at its facility at 611 Folsom Street in San Francisco that makes copies of all emails, web browsing, and other Internet traffic to and from AT&T customers (including data from iPhones and iPads), and provides those copies to the NSA.

(visit the link for the full news article)


I don't know much about polotics, but I can tell you that this is not how network traffic management works. They would not need to do this from a technical point of view, Although I think I know what this is trying to say, after 20 years working in corporate IT at the highest level I have never heard of "A fiberoptic splitter". I have run huge networks including systems with fibre optic links between serves and also between nework equipment.

In order for a company to copy emails and "web browsing" (whatever that means?) All they would need to do is put a packet sniffer onto a router somewhere which coppied all SMTP and POP3 trafic to a seperate server. For customers who use that companies own email service they would already have copies of the mail on their servers, and so this would not be requred.

This so called "Web browsing". I can't figure out what this means. Of course I understand what web browsing is, but a cpmpany would need to install specific software which would monitor all HTTP trafic from all of it's customers IP addresses in order to build up a database of web activity for each customer. The alternative, I suppose, would be to keep weblogs on a proxy server. This would be done on the standard network - not by redirecting a network streem.

Ipads and iphones use wireless access points which would be routed over very diferent network paths before being placed in the internet. This would therefore not necesarily travel on that companies fibe optic backbone, as to save bandwidth most companies will break out to the internet at the neerest point of presence, and not route all trafic back to a head office before breakout. This would be an inneficient network topology.

All of these technical facts mean that what was written is technically rubbish, which makes me wonder if the story is not also rubish.


Read "The Shadow Factory" by James Bamford. It goes into detail about the creation of "fiber optic splitter's" by AT&T and their placement by NSA at AT&T facilities around the country, not just in San Francisco.

Check it out and see what you think.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 09:09 AM
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Originally posted by Shamatt

Originally posted by Alaskan Man


AT&T installed a fiberoptic splitter at its facility at 611 Folsom Street in San Francisco that makes copies of all emails, web browsing, and other Internet traffic to and from AT&T customers (including data from iPhones and iPads), and provides those copies to the NSA.

(visit the link for the full news article)


I don't know much about polotics, but I can tell you that this is not how network traffic management works. They would not need to do this from a technical point of view, Although I think I know what this is trying to say, after 20 years working in corporate IT at the highest level I have never heard of "A fiberoptic splitter". I have run huge networks including systems with fibre optic links between serves and also between nework equipment.

In order for a company to copy emails and "web browsing" (whatever that means?) All they would need to do is put a packet sniffer onto a router somewhere which coppied all SMTP and POP3 trafic to a seperate server. For customers who use that companies own email service they would already have copies of the mail on their servers, and so this would not be requred.

This so called "Web browsing". I can't figure out what this means. Of course I understand what web browsing is, but a cpmpany would need to install specific software which would monitor all HTTP trafic from all of it's customers IP addresses in order to build up a database of web activity for each customer. The alternative, I suppose, would be to keep weblogs on a proxy server. This would be done on the standard network - not by redirecting a network streem.

Ipads and iphones use wireless access points which would be routed over very diferent network paths before being placed in the internet. This would therefore not necesarily travel on that companies fibe optic backbone, as to save bandwidth most companies will break out to the internet at the neerest point of presence, and not route all trafic back to a head office before breakout. This would be an inneficient network topology.

All of these technical facts mean that what was written is technically rubbish, which makes me wonder if the story is not also rubish.


Is the patriot act(s) rubbish? Is thought/opinion crime rubbish.

They already have special keyword detection software on google now why can't you do that for ALL internet traffic.

You just explained that they can easily spy on us by logging/monitor our traffic history. They already have laws in place to spy on people. Why wouldn't they spy on people on the internet?
Just because the op has inaccuracies doesn't make the patriot act(s) and laws like it not exist.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 09:19 AM
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So now you know what all those mysterious cable breaks on the ocean floor were all about. And team America had the technology to fix them. What great country America is fixing the cable breaks n the ocean floor even though they only supply internet communication to other countries. And no we can't tap into those lines for spying its impossible to split fiber optics.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 09:22 AM
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A good overview of this can be found here. I am not seeking to "pimp" my own thread - I am simply hoping the work I did on it can add to this conversation. And, yes, the US Government is spying on us in Cyberspace. Not just the NSA.

Moreover, the government that spends the most time and money, IMO, moving into this field is not the US at all. My research leads me to believe that, as we surf, we are more likely to be data mined by China than the US currently.

~Heff



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 09:39 AM
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en.wikipedia.org...



January and February 2008See also: 2008 submarine cable disruption
On January 30, 2008, internet services were widely disrupted in the Middle East and in the Indian subcontinent following damage to the SEA-ME-WE 4 and FLAG cables in the Mediterranean Sea.[4] BBC News Online reported 70% disruption in Egypt and 60% disruption in India[5] Problems were reported in Bahrain, Bangladesh, Kuwait, Pakistan, Qatar, Saudi Arabia and United Arab Emirates.[6] The respective contributions of the two cable systems to this blackout is unclear. Network outage graphs suggest that the two breaks occurred at 0430 and 0800 UTC.[7]

The cause of the damage has not been declared by either cable operator, but a number of news sources speculate that the damage was caused by a ship's anchor near Alexandria.[5][8] According to the AFP, the Kuwaiti government attributes the breaks to "weather conditions and maritime traffic."[9] The New York Times reported that the damage occurred to the two systems separately near Alexandria and near Marseilles.[10] Egypt knew of "no passing ships" near Alexandria which has restricted waters.[11]

One day later, on February 1, 2008, the FALCON cable was also reported cut 56 km off Dubai.[12][13]

[edit] December 2008On December 19, 2008 internet services were widely disrupted in the Middle East and in the Indian subcontinent following damage to the SEA-ME-WE 4, SEA-ME-WE 3 and FLAG FEA cables in the Mediterranean Sea.[14]

It is not known what has caused these multiple breaks, however there was seismic activity in the Malta area shortly before the breaks were identified,[14] although it is thought that the damage may be due to a ship's anchor or trawler net.[15]

According to FEA Cable System of Reliance Globalcom, the failure lay between Alexandria and Palermo. Reliance Globalcom completed the repair on the FLAG EUROPE ASIA (FEA) cable on December 29, 2008, at 14:15 GMT. Customer services that were affected due to the cable cut have been restored back normal with the completion of repairs.[16]

[edit] August 2009Damage to FNAL caused by Typhoon Morakot was reported as affecting internet traffic to China on 18 August 2009.[17]





posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 06:02 PM
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Originally posted by Shamatt
reply to post by tristar
 


You are not making any sence. The only thing in your mail which is almost correct is that when you are connected to a wifi hotspot it is easy for the owner of that hotspot to know where you are. It is not easy for anyone else to know where you are because hotspots use NAT'ing which hides your actuall IP Address behind the router.

The rest of your post is drivel. Nothing you say is founded in fact. You clearly do not understand what GPS, roaming, bluetooth or PSTN actually are or how they work. It is probably best you don't talk about them untill you know what these things are, and understand the technology behind them.




one can place slave units at any point and have multiple points of connection thus making triangulation a difficult task as active points are enabled and diverted within an embedded code within the cell



WTF? On what planet is this real?


Umm..Earth. you aware that cell phones can work either switched on or off unless one physically removes the battery right ? and one can simply embed code via sms if need be. This isnt breaking news or theoretical news.




Simply and obviously pointing out the obvious without getting into detail.



This is not even a sentance!




Lets not forget jacking open cell/vehicle connections via blue tooth or gps, thats another ball park that i wont get into.



Not technically possible. you obviously don't know what these technologies are or how they work. You are talking rubbish. Don't try and convince someone with over 20 years of experience in these technologies otherwise, you are wasting your time. (And mine)



I beg to differ, now since we both have a difference in opinion and regardless of what you may think, vehicle gps systems are not only used to guide you through potential traffic jams right ?, or help locate lost vehicles regardless if they have a lo jack system. Now as you mentioned, i rarely waste my time unless i choose to do so.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 03:21 AM
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reply to post by tristar
 


Give up mate. None of what you say make any technical sence. If you would like me to explain the technicalities in minute datail, too bad. Google it. Learn about it, and then I will discuss it with you.To be honest it seems pretty dumb to continually argue your point against a technical professional with 20 years of experience.



posted on Mar, 22 2011 @ 03:28 AM
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reply to post by bg_socalif
 


I googled this so as to be very sure I was correct:




Fiber Optic Splitter

A passive Fiber optic Coupler that divides Light from a single fiber into two or more fiber channels. Timbercon Splitters utilize precision technology to combine or distribute light from single/multiple inputs to single/multiple outputs. Most Splitters are designed bi-directionally, enabling the same product to be used as a coupler or a splitter.



Now, I refer to my previous mail. It would not be required to install this in order to do what you say they are doing.

I am happy to admit that just because what the op says is technically rubish that the story behind it is not, and I have no doubt that the laws you speak of are real. If you remember I said "It makes me wonder if....."

Any how, I'm not sure I care any more.




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