My first issues with the Bible.

Originally posted by kallisti36
reply to post by ellieN

 

God doesn't punish because he demands satisfaction for crimes. This is Roman Catholic juridical thinking that has plagued Western Christianity for a millenia. The whole point of God's actions in the OT from the giving of the Law to the destruction of his peoples' would-be destroyers to his chastisement of his wayward people was to repair the gap between Man and God. Why wouldn't he punish the people who keep sabotaging the bridge? Now the Messiah has come and established a Way to return to the Father. The Gates of Hades cannot prevail against this bridge now and punishment is no longer necessary. We are now called to return to the Father or to turn from him and be consumed in the flames of his glory (Heaven and Hell are the same place with two different mindsets).

Well said..kallisti..

IN THE NAME OF RELIGION


This is what religion does for mankind its all self-fulfilling prophecys of fundamentalist desperate to prove there god is the only god,its been a sickness of man for to long,and if we are to survive as a species in the age of nuclear weapons,we need to lose all religion,and grow up to a new understanding of whats beyound our tiny little blue planet out in the deep far side of this unimaginable in size universe.

No one coming to save us,we have to save ourselfs,and we need to start by loseing religion in our little unstable planet.

reply to post by Akragon


If you are to believe in the teachings of Jesus, or to believe he even existed, yes, the rest of the book does matter..."skipping around" and ignoring the whole beginning of who God is as a creator would not allow for full understanding of who Jesus is or why God placed him here to begin with, which lessens what you should get out of the whole book. The whole book matters, every little part. It defines the credibility of the writings. If I wrote wrote a book about you and your life, and at the beginning mentioned that I was a powerful wizard who could travel in time, my book becomes less credible, and likely to not be believed. Also, this is what happens to terrorist groups as well...There are many mentions in the Quran about rising up against the west, and destruction of the west or western beliefs. But there is a lot of places in the Quran where it say how, and when, and where a Jihad should take place, but this part was ignored by those terrorist groups. Maybe they "skipped ahead".

The Bible is hard to understand unless you become born again as Jesus said. I tried to read the Bible before I became born again and all I did was mainly stumble through it. It seemed to contradict itself and just blather.
Once I became born again I suddenly had an insatiable desire to read it and I found things within it starting to jump out at me in a way they never did before and make sense. Read the book of John it is full of little morsels of truth.
As far as other religions go, thats all they are other religions. Jesus is the only one I know of who claimed to be the way the truth and the life and that no one come come unto the Father (meaning God) but by me. Other religions claim that there are many paths to God but Jesus says sorry I am the only way. It all begain with Eve (which by the way) means mother of all living (meaning us humans) in the garden having that conversation with the serpant (satan which means adversary in Hebrew). The serpent asked right off "Hath God said?" to place a doubt in Eve's mind. And so it has gone through out history. A good book to read is Foxes book of Martyrs. These people were so sure that what the Bible says is true and of their faith in God that they were willing to die for it in the most horrendous ways. You question turning the other cheek but this is exactly what Jesus did when He allowed Himself to be crucified which was the most horrible of deaths to ever be devised at the time. He died for all mankind once and for all. It was the ultimate love sacrifice. You see it doesn't matter what you think or believe to be the truth, all that matters is the Bible and what it says and what it does to a persons life namely exposes sin or evil. You can believe whatever you want until 10 years from next June but the Bible still remains the truth and its tough if you don't like or believe in it. It is what it is and God is who He is. I am sure this will make people angry but I can't help that I am only the messanger and if you have an issue with these truths then you must take them up with God Himself. He is the one you will be answering to eventually for everything you have done or said anyway.

reply to post by kallisti36


I CAN SEE IT SOUNDING LIKE A BUNCH OF CRAP BUT THE 'THE HIRAM KEY' THEORY MAKES MORE SENSE THAN ANYTHING ELSE WE WERE TAUGHT IN SCHOOL,MEDIA AND ALL HOLY BOOKS. IF YOU WANT TO BET ALL YOUR MARBLES ON THE BIBLE GO RIGHT AHEAD...DO YOU EVEN KNOW HOW AND WHY THE BIBLE WAS ASSEMBLED? JUST WITH THAT ,I CANNOT BELEIVE ONE WOULD TAKE THE BIBLE SERIOUSLY.....

reply to post by kallisti36

Errr... What about Job? Satan definately had a hand in that one.

I believe, if you study the text, you will see that all Satan did, was bet god that Job would renounce his faith is this or that happened. Satan didn't bring down the bad stuff, God did.

Originally posted by LambLion58
The Bible is hard to understand unless you become born again ...

And what does becoming born again entail?

Originally posted by ChaosComplex

Originally posted by LambLion58
The Bible is hard to understand unless you become born again ...

And what does becoming born again entail?

Being Christ like....learning to love everyone as you love yourself... Living without greed or hatred in your life....

Read the mans words and understand...

I can't believe this slipped under the radar.

Gorman91 wrote:
A: Aliens would not be human nor humanoid. Nor would they communicate so easily with humans. If they even could communicate with us in any sensible manner to begin with. In fact, in realistic terms, we would only be able to communicate with trade and emotion. Again that assumes they even know about trade, or even have emotions.And the language would not be mathematical. Math would just prove you are intelligent. It would be chemical, with each molecule and its unique properties being an emotion or feeling. Hydrogen being stable but explosive when heated up, noble gases being apathy and not caring, indifferent. Carbon being agreeable and bond able. Floride being reactive and hot


and
Indeed what is more likely is that aliens are not as intelligent as humans. They've just been here so long that they advanced linear through trial and error. Eventually one of them found Earth, documented it, took note of its strangeness, and left.

and
Aliens would not make people. They would make robots. Why on Earth would they give a damn about their workers complaining and then just make more of them to complain. Again, dumb. You would make robots that don't complain, do work, and get out of the way.

You know everything there is to know about the bible and you have superior knowledge about aliens? Where did you learn this? What alien gave you this information? We'd all like to know where you got this information from.

I don't normally do this, but these words were so 'out there' that I'm really wondering how he acquired this information.

reply to post by ButterCookie


You don't. More accurately, you come from the star's embryonic waste produce. What you are made of was never in a star. It was what did not make it into the star during its development.

IE. We are, all of us, the excrement of star fetuses.

reply to post by TKDRL


Oh it's been proven. We have indirect observation for that very matter. indeed we cannot observe it. For all we know it's not actually atom based, or even a single element. hence the phrase dark matter and energy. We are not calling it dark molecules, nor dark hydrogen. We don't know yet. We are not making anything up. You look up into the stars, and there is a non direct visible force causing more gravity, or the opposite there of, when it should not.

See religions make stuff up. Why does the Earth turn? erm, err..... Some dude it holding it up. That is ignorant.

reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus



yea, no. See Elijah never died. So how could he be reincarnated. Nay. He was to physically return as himself. There is another too. Enoch. lo and behold, Revelation speaks of two men who did not die who will and return. Lo and behold the Old Testament only has two people who could be those two. No reincarnation. Thanks for trying though. Jesus never called him Elijah. The people did. Thanks for saying he did, showing clear ignorance of who's actually talking.

But I won't end there. let's go onward. If in fact what you say is true, why then does Jesus say Elijah WAS a human in James 5 17? Why then does he not call him to currently be again? Why then does he not say he was a human multiple times. Nay, he says Elijah was, now he is in heaven. he will come again possibly at the end as a man once again with Enoch perhaps.

Indeed again in Matthew 11 Jesus calls John the Baptist THE Elijah, as a title, not a person. Not only that, but John himself denies being Elijah in John 1. And in other narratives, an angel says he will be in the spirit of Elijah, not him. And after all, what on Earth then was with Jesus at his transfiguration then? Elijah and Moses. So let me get this right. Elijah was John, but he was also with Jesus at that time? How is this so? Well it's actually pretty clear. People act in the spirit of those whom came before. This is also why Jesus is called the New Adam. he is not actually Adam.

Now I'm going to flat out once again tell you to do your own work for direct quotes. Go ahead, go to a bible website, and search life or death and read up the innumerable parts about reincarnation not being true.

And you use not bible sources, so I don't even care about those.

Originally posted by restlessbrainsyndrome
reply to post by Akragon

 

If you are to believe in the teachings of Jesus, or to believe he even existed, yes, the rest of the book does matter..."skipping around" and ignoring the whole beginning of who God is as a creator would not allow for full understanding of who Jesus is or why God placed him here to begin with, which lessens what you should get out of the whole book. The whole book matters, every little part. It defines the credibility of the writings. If I wrote wrote a book about you and your life, and at the beginning mentioned that I was a powerful wizard who could travel in time, my book becomes less credible, and likely to not be believed. Also, this is what happens to terrorist groups as well...There are many mentions in the Quran about rising up against the west, and destruction of the west or western beliefs. But there is a lot of places in the Quran where it say how, and when, and where a Jihad should take place, but this part was ignored by those terrorist groups. Maybe they "skipped ahead".

Perhaps i didn't make myself clear....

If you read Christs teachings the rest of the bible becomes clear... you can see the agendas in men. I didn't take my own advice when i started reading it, but once i understood christs words believe me i started over and read it again...and as i've said....it becomes very clear.

Im not one to skip from part to part in any book i read, but it is definately my suggestion to read Christs words first and understand them! ....then read the rest of the bible. Why do you think they make red letter bibles

reply to post by Gorman91

yea, no. See Elijah never died. So how could he be reincarnated. Nay. He was to physically return as himself.

"The disciples all felt that Jesus was the Messiah but they were puzzled. Where is Elijah? The disciples asked the Master about this and he told them that Elijah had already returned as John the Baptist. The first discussion of this is in Matthew, chapter 11.
I tell you the truth: Among those born of women there has not risen anyone greater than John the Baptist; yet he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he. From the days of John the Baptist until now, the kingdom of heaven has been forcefully advancing, and forceful men lay hold of it. For all the Prophets and the Law prophesied until John. And if you are willing to accept it, he is the Elijah who was to come. He who has ears, let him hear. Matthew 11:11-15, NIV

The disciples asked him, "Why then do the teachers of the law say that Elijah must come first?" Jesus replied, "To be sure, Elijah comes and will restore all things. But I tell you, Elijah has already come, and they did not recognize him, but have done to him everything they wished. In the same way the Son of Man is going to suffer at their hands." Then the disciples understood that he was talking to them about John the Baptist. Matthew 17:10-13, NIV
The above scripture indicates that the disciples and Jesus believed in reincarnation. John the Baptist was the reincarnation of Elijah. In an attempt to fit these scriptures into the orthodox view of one-life-only, some believe that Elijah never died as we know it because he went up in a chariot of fire, thus discounting John the Baptist as an instance of reincarnation. Their thinking is that Elijah did inhabit John the Baptist but it was not rebirth because Elijah had never died. For this "discounting" to really work, the Baptist would need to have returned in the same fiery chariot as a grown man. However, he was clearly placed in the womb of a human mother after which he had a very mortal and common birth. Jesus said he was "born of woman" and in Luke 1:13-17, an angel tells John's father, Zacharias, that John will be born to his wife Elizabeth... "And he will go before him in the spirit and power of Elijah." Others use this last line to say that John the Baptist was under the power of Elijah but was not the incarnation of Elijah. However, Jesus says in no uncertain terms that John is Elijah and not simply an ambassador of Elijah's power, "This is Elijah... He who has ears to hear let him hear" (Matthew 11:14-15). Also, Malachi does not say that Elijah will appear by proxy but that Elijah himself will return. "

source: www.reincarnation.ws...

reply to post by Gorman91


When you come up with that many things, that are there, but shouldn't be, that tells me the model is wrong. I am by no means an expert, but it does seem to me like the electric universe model is more accurate than the status quo one.

Actually the bible is true, And so are the words in it

As for primapes. There DNA is nothing like us niether is thier chromosones

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus

 

You've got to be joking if you're asking that question. John 3:36 comes to mind, along with dozens of others.

I tell you what, do your own research. here, go and search simply the word life here and read it yourself.

www.biblegateway.com...


Better yet, where does Christ teach in multiple lives besides the one you have now and the eternal one after?

edit on 22-3-2011 by Gorman91 because: (no reason given)

That is not good enough. What BS Gorman, it's the same silly tactics you tried on the Kunalini thread. You throw out some illogical piece of nonsense that everyones bs meter can detect, and when you cannot defend your position you expect others to do the research. No, I asked you to defend your position that Jesus taught there is only one life. Now you do your own research to back it up.
And you know what? There's more biblical evidence for Jesus believing in reincarnation than there is in him teaching you only live once. The whole living once and then going to heaven or hell is just fabrication. You can thank the Emperor of Rome for anathematizing Origen.
"Reincarnation and the Secret Teachings of Jesus

There are many Bible verses that affirm the reality of reincarnation. We will examine some of them here.

The episode in the Bible where Jesus identified John the Baptist as the reincarnation of Elijah the prophet is one of the clearest statements which Jesus made concerning reincarnation.


For all the prophets and the law have prophesied until John. And if you are willing to receive it, he is Elijah who was to come. (Matt. 11:13-14)"
"

In the above passage, Jesus clearly identifies John the Baptist as the reincarnation of Elijah the prophet. Later in Matthew's gospel Jesus reiterates it.


And the disciples asked him, saying, "Why then do the scribes say that Elijah must come first?"


But he answered them and said, "Elijah indeed is to come and will restore all things. But I say to you that Elijah has come already, and they did not know him, but did to him whatever they wished. So also shall the Son of Man suffer at their hand."


Then the disciples understood that he had spoken of John the Baptist." (Matt. 17:10-13) "

"In very explicit language, Jesus identified John the Baptist as the reincarnation of Elijah. Even the disciples of Jesus understood what Jesus was saying. This identification of John to be the reincarnation of Elijah is very important when it comes to Bible prophecy. By identifying the John with Elijah, Jesus identified himself as the Messiah. The Hebrew scriptures mentions specific signs that would precede the coming of the Messiah. One of them is that Elijah will return first.


Behold I will send you Elijah the prophet, before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord. (Mal. 4:5)"
www.near-death.com...

I can find tons of other blogs and books where people agree with this viewpoint.
OK Gorman, your turn to prove your point.

John 3:36 this passage? John 3:36 (King James Version)

36He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him."
Tell me exactly how this is a statement of one life only? It is a statement of everlasting life indeed. There is no indication of One Life however. Perhaps its closer to Revelation in that the seed of the wicked are judged in the final days. It is no indication whatsoever that this was their only incarnation.



]

edit on 22-3-2011 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

edit on 22-3-2011 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

edit on 22-3-2011 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

Of course man lives with God for ever? we have his spirit, As for reincarnation that is such trollop!!!!, the bible does not talk or explain it.

Im sorry mate but when you die, Its either heaven or hell, That is the shocking truth.

Too many people are afraid that hell exists so they refuse them self from believing the Bible to save thier heart seared with a hot iron

reply to post by InnerstellarOne


You know, its not often I do this, but stop thinking like an idiot.... People don't believe the bible because they are scared of hell, stupidest thing I have ever heard. A whole boatload of people don't believe the bible, because they were raised to believe in one of the many other religions out there....

reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus


No, Elijah never was born a 2nd time. Perhaps I shall remind you of the story of the man who asked the same question of how a man could be born again? Jesus answered him that the soul is born again in Christ. Not returning from some other life to be born a 2nd time through a mother. No, the return as one with the father in Christ.

Now if you claim I am refuting Jesus, explain. You just made a quote and a statement, but did not prove your claims.

Manifestation yes. In the same way Jesus is the manifestation of the father in human form. But not the father, yet of the father. Not comprehensible in many ways. But a cheap answer of reincarnation is nothing short of ignorant.

Jesus Said John is Elijah as a title. In as much as Jesus, was actually called Joshua. Some could take it to mean like Joshua who took Moses' people into a new land.

Truth is no one knows exactly what he meant by it. He did not, however, mean reincarnation. because quite clearly, the spirit of Elijah was with Jesus why John was nice and dandy and alive.

Some even called Jesus both John the Baptist and Elijah. Fact is that he nor John were Elijah. Elijah is a title. It means "My God is Yahweh". John the baptist was bringing God's spirit baptism into new life. Jesus's time had come. For as the angel said "And he will go on before the Lord, in the spirit and power of Elijah". Now if he was Elijah, it would be invalid, for Jesus was before Elijah, and yet here it says Elijah will come before Jesus. Jesus was always. Inf act it is a title. In the same way as Elijah, the last prophet, did, John went out before the Lord came, to call him to his mission.

reply to post by TKDRL


Electric universe is invalidated because it does not work. Electrical power and gravity are similar enough to be confused however. They are, in the end, the same transitions of some sorts. But I think I'll trust the people with a multi billion dollar particle accelerator more than a few theories and a college electrical degree.