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My first issues with the Bible.

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posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 11:40 AM
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Its gods will that no man perish, But im pretty sure peter talked about those who tried to live a righteouss lifestyle and tried to live a life of love and truth, Even though they didnt know god or jesus, That they might get caught up at on the outsides of heaven, Not be sent to hell, But put outside to learn about God first, Before they can enter into his kingdom


Its those who choose not to follow him and accept his teachings, who idol worship and practice witchcraft.
To those who also die without hearing the news of christ, Its also sad but the devil is a roaring lion who devoureth who ever he can, and he comes to steal kill and destroy




posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 11:45 AM
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Originally posted by UndisclosedDesire
My feelings about the Bible summed up so well by this amusing anecdote


Dear Dr. Laura:

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate.

I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some of the other specific laws and how to follow them:1. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odour for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbours. They claim the odour is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness - Lev.15:19- 24. The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.

4. Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighbouring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

5. I have a neighbour who insists on working on the Sabbath.. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?

6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination - Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this?

7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?

8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?

9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? - Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.Your devoted fan, Jim.

edit on 21-3-2011 by UndisclosedDesire because: (no reason given)



Yeah we live in the New Testament, under laws of grace.

Jesus is god of the sabbath, God showed paul a vision of a net lowered down with a crate of all the animals that were considered unclean, and told him to eat them cause they were now clean.

Were not under the old covenant, But the net, The OT conceals, The NT reveals


As for doing the dirty with woman in thier menstral cycles, I too have made that mistake and i didnt even know she was on it, But lucky for me were under the law of grace.

As goes with all your other question's jimmy



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 11:45 AM
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Originally posted by texasoutlaw
So what happens if you believe in god and you die and nothing happens?


Oblivion! Hooray! Who cares. I don't have to feel stupid. I won't feel anything.


Originally posted by texasoutlaw What if one day the world finds out the bible was just a story made up?


Plenty of people believe that already, myself included, up to a point anyway. What's your point?


Originally posted by texasoutlaw what if one day a being of some type show sup and leaves the world knowledge of what we are suppose to do with our lives. Would you feel dumb knowing you wasted your time in a belief that dose not exist


Well yeah. A little silly, and then I would move on with the new paradigm. "Repent And Be Saved" is multi-applicable after all.


On the other hand I will feel equally silly if I end up at the pearly gates and St. Peter wops me on the back of the head and says "You had it wrong dummy. Now look down."



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 11:50 AM
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Originally posted by Akragon
skip ahead and read about jesus man, the rest of the book matters very little...



I think it does matter, because if Jesus landed here again, the same apes who pound square pegs in to round holes by twisting the Bible to fit their understanding, would crucify him again. And again. And again.

201 we have a solicitor complaint....caller says dirty hippie offered to do repairs on house at blah blah...



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 11:52 AM
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reply to post by starless and bible black
 


Im afraid it doesn't my friend, if you don't understand that mans words, you will not understand the rest of the stories in the bible....you might as well be reading a comic book



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 11:53 AM
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reply to post by ChaosComplex
 


Most believing Christians do not realize this, but theologians and Christian scholars do not believe that the first 5 books of the bible were written by Moses.

Here is a link to what is called the "Documentary Hypothesis"

What you noticed in your OP is not lost on Biblical scholars. It is called a doublet.

A doublet is a part of textual criticism, and it refers to two different narrations of the same storyline.

Apologies to anyone who posted this already. I only read the OP and had to chime in.

I am not a Christian BTW....

ETA:

Here is a BBC TV special called "Who wrote the Bible". You might find it interesting.


Google Video Link

edit on 3/21/2011 by Josephus23 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 11:54 AM
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Originally posted by texasoutlaw
So what happens if you believe in god and you die and nothing happens? What if one day the world finds out the bible was just a story made up? what if one day a being of some type show sup and leaves the world knowledge of what we are suppose to do with our lives. Would you feel dumb knowing you wasted your time in a belief that dose not exist


I don't think that'll happen.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 11:55 AM
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reply to post by autowrench
 
Questioning God isn’t a sin as even the prophets questioned Him and persuaded Him to spare certain people. Biblically, God’s a personal figure whom enjoyed speaking to Adam and Eve in the evenings. He ‘enjoys’ conversation. If you’re asking with honest desire to understand, that’s far from a sin.

reply to post by H1ght3chHippie
 
You're only saying 'get over it' to a specific group of people. I'll explain that in a later post, but Christians would do so much better to listen to Luke 9:5.

As for those not believing in God as a whole, it’s only the non-believers that have to worry, and that’s strictly from a logical standpoint. Hypothetically, if believers ‘believe’ and nothing happens, no harm no foul. If something does happen, then they are given the benefit of the doubt while non-believers perish/ar punished, etc. Simple right? But in the end, no one but God actually cares where your soul goes (except the money-hungry that want your money seeds lol). True human believers are too worried about the state of their own souls and the journey it takes to get closer to God to come anywhere close to even thinking about (let alone arguing with) your opinion on the matter.

Whether you deserve to be rebuked or the devil really DOES speak out of your mouth is neither here nor there as no one but misguided sheep cares. As was said above, if a person didn’t get it the first time, even Jesus wouldn’t have wasted his time on them (he was very smart, that one).



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 11:55 AM
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reply to post by ChaosComplex
 


He says let us make man in our image, because to understand the bible you have to understand there was an age before this and an age to come after this. The first and last ages are in a spiritual body. This age is flesh and a testing ground to see if we choose God or Satan. We look the same in this age as we did in the last and in the next, "let us make man in our image".



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 11:55 AM
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reply to post by ChaosComplex
 


All i have to say is; take the bible with a grain of salt...... never forget it was written by humans, claiming to hear the voice of God... has there been any recent editions to the bible that you know off?

These days when someone claims to be seriously hearing '' the voice of God '' they are sent somewhere..... away from civilised humans... Mental homes




Although - dont get me wring, i was raised a Catholic, i have been baptised, had my first communion and first reconciliation in primary school. After primary i had my first Confirmation etc etc.

I was raised Catholic and even went to a Catholic Primary school! St Anthony's...


Looking at scientific discoveries what can you beleive? Creationism ( Religion ) or Evolution (Science and Evolution? ) Perhaps on the fringe there may have even been some Alien or Extra- terrestrial intervention..? It MAY be possoble??

But seriously if we have learnt anything from the history of Human beings... - - it is that we are so far, born liars in many ways. Not all though and there are exceptions of course. However it seems that for any Human to take power and become a so-called '' leader '' or advantage of the majority of the population is that there was at one point or another lie's and deception involved.

So yet we take a book written by humans, that is OVER 2 thousand years old and i have emphasised the word '' over '' becuae it was actually written by various people and story teller's over the course of 2 thousand years. Adding on, prmoting and perhaps even propagating stories to influence '' the masses ''


We all still remember that the moment scinece tries to argu or go against religion, they were persucuted by supposed peaceful and religious men or representatives.


Over the past 5000 yrs, what has been the biggest cause of conflict, war, anger or disagreement?
.
.
.
.


Religion.....

Do you see the irony?
edit on 21-3-2011 by Havick007 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 11:56 AM
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Long post ahead. I read through everything since my last reply, I responded (and quoted...
) accordingly.

Originally posted by Agree2Disagree
reply to post by Disillusioned_Youth
 


You know...this whole "too many options to choose from so I won't pick one" has never made sense to me...

That's like my doctor telling me there are too many medicines to choose from so he's not going to prescribe anything.
or maybe you like this one...

2 + 2 = impossible to know because there are sooooo many different numbers....

A large....WTF?


A2D


Not even close.

The doctor DOES have too many prescriptions to choose from. He/she will have to choose the medication that provides the highest pro:con ratio. Similarly, I have not found a single person who shares my exact beliefs. In turn I have been forced to find truth where it lies...whether it be in the Bible or elsewhere.

Originally posted by SuperiorEd
Aside from the obvious reasons from nature that there is a God, consider prophecy. The Bible predicts that Israel will become a nation again, be the center of world attention, be a strong military force for such a tiny nation, and that the Arab nations would seek a peace treaty with Her that would be broken in the end days, which ushers in a time of tribulation such as the world has never seen. It further predicts the events of the end days to the letter of what we see happening all around us. All these events are novelty events. Daniel ch 12 predicts that men will run to and fro and that knowledge will multiply at the time of the end. The Bible gives us information regarding our nature of duality, where light is both a particle and wave. Genesis and the rest of the Bible uses light as the mechanism to create reality and to enlighten consciousness. John 1 tells us that the word (wave) created the universe. I could keep going and going and going here but it's rather obvious that we are incapable of scraping even an edge off the beauty and truth found in the Bible. Only a fool says there is no God. All of nature and reality is one big metaphorical mirror pointing you right toward God. It really doesn't matter where you look. Wake up!!


Scary...

Originally posted by nmyfthst
The Bible was written with vowels (A,E,I,O,U) in it. This makes it a tool of the time travellers that controll Earth.

If you would like to know more go to my explanation in the time travel forum.

Sorry to rain on your parade but it's good to get closure.


Care to elaborate on that a bit?


Honestly, this is probablly not the best forum to be asking these types of questions. There are many who are hostile toward any religion, many towards Christianity, and many Christians who have defended their faith on here so long that they have developed a not so nice attitude waiting for the next person to jump on them. These questions might be better asked on an actual forum that is geared towards Christianity. They are more willing to help someone understand things about the Bible.



This is the perfect place to ask this, IMO. There are many types of people here. Some are intelligent, some are out of their mind, but knowledge is abundant. I am fully prepared for the classic internet forum behavior, and so should everyone else.

Originally posted by redhorse

I will concur that the bible is referencing "his kind" as species or at least categories of animals. The Bible tends to substitute the male pronoun whenever possible however, which adds to confusion to an already confusing text....

I still can't get anything from it except for "God made the animals here similar to the animals present in his domain, or his planet"


Originally posted by redhorse
...Once more, I think you manifest an outstanding approach in asking your questions; and whether you are seeking God, or simply seeking truth (although many of us would say they are one and the same in the end), good luck on your journey.


Patience is a virtue.

Originally posted by InnerstellarOne
reply to post by ChaosComplex
 


Exactly man, Its divine mathematics, That does not defy or degrade anything to do with God, because he made it all, so who are we to judge the works of his hands?
Its mans knowledge of science that denys gods work


I'm not defying, degrading, or judging. I am seeking.
If someone is obsessed with a hollywood star, they learn all they can about the person.
Wouldn't it be safe to say that God may appreciate our interest in his mechanics?

Originally posted by InnerstellarOne
reply to post by Akragon
 


If your refering to the sacred geometry used in prayer thing, I said thats not a valid statement i said that i dont believe it, but only God knows what its used for.

But i believe when we pray and ask god, Our prayers are transformed as they leave our mouth and instantly burn like inscence before the lords throne
, Its written in the word

...
Man oh man...

Originally posted by InnerstellarOne
Im sorry man but yeah. only those scientists that know God, or those who have a understanding of him could declare his work.

But its the physicists that use equations and are running Super Particle Accelerators to try to disprove god?

That is absurd!
If anything we can PROVE God.

Originally posted by InnerstellarOne
I love science and knowledge, Wisdom is awesome!.

but dedicating theories about evolution in schools, And trying to disclose religion with science is disgusting man.

Why is it that people refuse to acknowledge the possibility that "God" created a life form that began as nothing more than a single cell, and was intended to **FREELY** adapt to its surroundings, and develop methods (and eventually tools) to survive, and eventually thrive?

Originally posted by Disillusioned_Youth

Been following your replies and appreciate your open-mindedness and lack of inflammatory remarks. More members need to take note on how you handle your business here.

But yes, I'm in the same boat. There are too many possibilities for me to feel right subscribing to one.

Humans have so many unanswered questions. I feel like our history has been erased in a lot of ways, and we take what little historical knowledge we have and try to "fill" in the gaps - Often resulting in erroneous conclusions. It's like we have 25 pieces of a 200-piece puzzle (realistically a 10000000-piece puzzle), and instead of looking for the rest of the pieces, we shave off corners of the ones we have in an attempt to MAKE them fit together..

I feel this is what has spawned the foundation for many religions.. (and definitely scientific foundations as well) including modern Christianity. Christianity has a lot of great principles and teachings, and if everyone embraced many of Jesus teachings, the world would be a better place. Does that make the Bible an authority on an entity we can't come close to comprehending? Not really IMO.. but it has a lot of common sense solutions to social issues.

ONE A SIDE NOT: A lot of members fall into the habit of using the "fringe" element of a religion/organization to define the ENTIRE RELIGION - This is wrong. Just because there's a plethora of "crazies" doesn't mean ALL Christians are like this. Most Christians I know are good people - they find fulfillment in their faith and wish to share the thing that gives them so much hope and security. The "fringe" element uses flawed interpretations of the Bible as a means to create control structures, financial opportunities, and/or as a means of power-tripping. Forget these idiots and listen to the more rational ones if you truly seek answers.

Personally, I refuse to commit to a belief system - I develop my own belief system based on personal EXPERIENCE, not the experience of others - therefore, my belief system is constantly evolving and changing as I grow in my understanding of my environment (the planet). Lately, my main issue with the Christian God is this:
If he created us, then he must understand we are creatures of sensory perception - why then would he allow himself to be so elusive to us? I feel like it's a Divine mind-game he's playing, because he expects us to embrace an intangible concept when WE ARE CREATURES OF SENSORY PERCEPTION! We have our senses for a reason, and if he can't interact with us on our level, then I feel no need to give him any attention. Some could argue that Jesus was God in a tangible form, but I haven't met Jesus, spoken to Jesus, or even SEEN a photograph of Jesus - so because I haven't EXPERIENCED JESUS in a tangible form (i.e. any evidence other than the written-word), I cannot accept he is God, or know for a fact he even existed.



Excellent post. Period.

Originally posted by Disillusioned_Youth

Originally posted by InnerstellarOne
reply to post by Akragon
 


Im sorry what original texts? carbon dating or the bible?

I never said the bible was rubbish if thats what your subliminally producing?
No one can trust carbon dating, Cause its based on estimates in layers.


My friend, your intentions are good. But you are too arrogant in your approach. Humility, dude. You seem SO certain that you have ALL the answers when really your logic falls short 60% of the time - recognize you don't know as much as you think you do, and then make it a goal to learn AS MUCH as possible so that you seem more credible when defending/explaining your faith.

Science doesn't deny God - science is a means for understanding his creation. Individual SCIENTISTS can deny God, but that has no reflection on the scientific process or advancements in knowledge. And if anything, most scientists aren't out to disprove God - they may use science to elaborate on/update archaic understandings of God and the universe, but you can't scientifically disprove something that can't be physically proven in the first place (as far as we know, God cannot be defined physically).

Science and religion are perfectly compatible, as I see it.

Again...Excellent post.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 12:00 PM
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Originally posted by texastig

Originally posted by texasoutlaw
So what happens if you believe in god and you die and nothing happens? What if one day the world finds out the bible was just a story made up? what if one day a being of some type show sup and leaves the world knowledge of what we are suppose to do with our lives. Would you feel dumb knowing you wasted your time in a belief that dose not exist


I don't think that'll happen.

Because every time somebody comes up with some possible explanation or theory on why he couldnt exist, the reply is"God is everything and always has been". I wouldnt mind if religious people were using the word God as a metaphore for the whole universe and everything in it and beyond it, but the truth is, most peoples beliefs are based on a book that almost everybody agrees is flawed or false in some way... In my eyes its no different to the people who have taken Jedi on as their religion, after all it IS based on a book.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 12:03 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 


Right...so you're saying that hardcore Christians don't snarl with disgust at a guy who has shoulder length hair?

Even the HINT of God's true power sends them in to a rage, but they'll stoop to pick up crystals someone dusted the ground with after a church meeting...



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 12:04 PM
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the talk about bible start wrong when people put it in some kind of superior instance and the need to fight its words like the demons it says existing in our world, it just a book with several flawed logic statements.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 12:05 PM
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They're an older book then the bible, there's mere accounts of the bible being written by an extraterrestrial (there's a reference about ship engines and not letting the.. 'humans'.. get to close) and well, lots of other contradicting evidence. Most Christians do not want to see that nor recognize that because it would mean a complete waste of years in their beliefs and the end result being feeling rather.. wasted.. because they were so played. They like their comfort zone.

My take? 'Enlil' wanted us as mere slaves for control while Enki and.. 'higher up' entities (specifically the parts of the brain we have, mammalian (ape), reptilian (from the genetic engineers..), and avian (from the higher up entities..) There could be a few more but not fully certain upon that.

Enlil is the God of the bible, the 'bad' in duality, the service to self in the Ra material, the side of the government prying for control.. Enki would be Lucifier (because he's the 'big bad guy' who gave us the realization we were living.. But of course that's Satan tempting Adam and Eve with taking an apple. I wouldn't mind to become mindless. :@@
and the one who wants us to be free, of our own, to enjoy life for what it is.

I just think Christians want to be mindless slaves because they want to serve. And that's where the mindsets differ. They look at the serpent as Satan tempting man but really.. It gave us the realization of us.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 12:08 PM
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Originally posted by starless and bible black
reply to post by Akragon
 


Right...so you're saying that hardcore Christians don't snarl with disgust at a guy who has shoulder length hair?

Even the HINT of God's true power sends them in to a rage, but they'll stoop to pick up crystals someone dusted the ground with after a church meeting...


Did i say that? I have no idea what Hardcore christians say or believe... other then people here i guess




edit on 21-3-2011 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 12:10 PM
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posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 12:13 PM
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Originally posted by MamaJ
 


Thats what Im talking about!!! Love this!! ;-)

What are humans made of? We are made of ......ENERGY! What is everything else derived from???? ENERGY again! Its such a mystical place we live in. WE ARE ON A PLANET IN A UNIVERSE! I mean if you really want to get down to the minute of a cell.....what do you have?

Why would anyone think God is of a human form? Why would anyone think we are alone in the Universe and there are not other beings?

If it is a thought....its manifested so says the Good Book. That tells me that if a thought can be manifested then every thought of creation has a "place".

With all of that said....know this is of course MY OPINION as I began researching A LOT after losing my step son to Leukemia. The church told me where he was is a mystery. I did what God told me to do (in the Bible) and began seeking HIM. I read about 10 books a week for five years. Losing a 15 yr old to cancer changed me forever, but our Energy force of Love kept me sain by leading me to books that helped me understand WHERE this poor baby went, and helped my relationship by simply mixing science with religion......


Here is some more science mixed with religion, and really answers if you get down to the minute cell what do you have? Quantum physicists have found when you get down to the tiniest particles beyond the cell, the proton, neutron, electron, the atom, those tiniest particles are held together by light. The Bible says God is light. We are really held together by God. How awesome is that?
edit on 21-3-2011 by Mystery_Lady because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 12:25 PM
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Originally posted by texasoutlaw
So what happens if you believe in god and you die and nothing happens? What if one day the world finds out the bible was just a story made up? what if one day a being of some type show sup and leaves the world knowledge of what we are suppose to do with our lives. Would you feel dumb knowing you wasted your time in a belief that dose not exist


No, I would know I lived the best way I could have. I would know I tried to help and uplift people.

If we die and nothing happens, we won't know will we? We will cease to exist. If the world finds out the Bible is made up, There will more than likely be a mass exodus to a new religion or non-religion that hopefully won't enslave the people, but probablly will. If other beings showed up, I would seriously be questioning who they really are, and why they are really here. No I would not feel dumb, since I know I lived my life the best way I could, and tried to help and uplift others as much as I could.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 12:25 PM
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reply to post by Mystery_Lady
 


Mass is compressed light. Light and mass are the same stuff. Sorry, we're not all God.

God is distinctly separate from the universe. There is nothing in the universe that can prove God from a pure objective stance and that is where faith comes in. You can never proof without a doubt that God exists nor does not exist. He simply is. God is said to be light because it is the most basic instinctive understanding of light and darkness. Nothing more than a parallel.




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