This is what I remember

Originally posted by hooper
reply to post by Yankee451

 

You gonna tell me how your sister saw all this again?

She went down that morning to return a birthday gift at one of the stores in the World Trade Center. She lived in NYC at the time. Why don't you believe anyone in New York saw this happen? Are you that disconnected?

I believe what the evidence can prove, not what the TeeVee tells me.

Dings? Sawing? You really need to get in front of a dictionary.

Yes, dings and dents on the column. You deny their existence, just as you claim the existence of your imaginary sister. Sawing, yes, as would happen with wedge-shaped wings sawing like a two sided guillotine. They would strike the columns at the engines first, and then sequentially out to the wingtips which would strike the columns with the least energy of the wing. The damage is the opposite of that action.

Check out my thread that the OP's theories somewhat mirror.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by routerboy


What could be more productive than trying to help raise awareness to stop a few wars? Or do you like killing brown people while we enrich bankers?

Originally posted by Shadow Herder
Check out my thread that the OP's theories somewhat mirror.

A thread that makes an outrageous claim, and then leaves everybody wanting a SOURCE. You shouldn't even advertise that thread with a missing source in the OP, sorry.

reply to post by routerboy


If you still have a really hard time flushing out the official version of events i got Two words for you

WTC SEVEN

Peace

reply to post by _BoneZ_


Why is everything that doesn't suit your theory outrageous? What are you, clairvoyant? How would you know if the claim has any merit until you investigate it. Actually, it makes perfect sense from an insurance perspective. They may well not have been able to even build something that tall unless they had a way to bring them down in a controlled fashion.

Being the building owner of a nearby building, I'd want to be sure those towers, which FEMA even had in cross hairs, wouldn't wipe out my building if they were attacked or fell. I bet every insurance company that insured any buildings nearby would have a case to demand explosives be built into the towers.

Originally posted by Yankee451
How would you know if the claim has any merit until you investigate it.

You have to understand that there are some of us that have been researching 9/11 for many years. This stuff was brought up years ago. There never has been any proof that explosives are placed in a building during construction.

I will admit that I do see and would understand the possibility, however we need PROOF. No proof, it didn't happen.

reply to post by _BoneZ_


Fair enough, and I too recall discussing it very shortly after the attacks, but again, it would be a top secret bit of information that insurance companies would hide very zealously.

Does anyone know the shelf life of explosives? I can't imagine the stuff lasting indefinitely, wouldn't it get messed up by concrete moisture if it was poured into the slabs? I would think it would be more likely that the buildings would simply be over engineered to satisfy the insurance companies...they'd never be able to live it down if the news ever got out that all sky scrapers are rigged to explode.

I would think it would be more likely that they'd build in easy access to plant demolition charges and just over engineer the thing. Still not good for the OS though.

reply to post by Vio1ion


I have been saying that same thing
until I was blue in the face.

However, I don't believe an insurance company would be allowed to do it or try to get away with it...
The government would do it because, a) they did the math after the first attack with the van. b) they had and knew from other intelligence agencies around the world that the Trade Centers were going to be a target again soon....
they couldn't just say; "ok, people, Trade Center is closed until....well we don't know until when" The wheels of government are slow as hell....but they hedged their bet and closed the place on some weekend and rigged the whole place up....just in case the crazy bastards pulled it off....well they did....and they pulled them too early in a panic...or....if they waited until everyone was out, and then pulled it, they could be found out by people and then they would have to explain what they did and why, and the people would crucify them because the media would spin it into a Nurenburg type thing because thats what they do.

This scenario is the one that I can give that paints the government in the best light.....I am convinced that there are some shadows though.

Originally posted by routerboy
reply to post by OllyP

 

There's no problem discussing historical events as long as you stick to the facts. It is very distasteful to the poor citizens that lost their lives on 9/11 to be going on about conspiracy theories.

Been following this topic and after reading this post i though I would share a post I got from another forum a while back. I don't know who the author is but he makes a heck of a lot of sense and he apparently doesn't like Alex Jones or anyone else at PP. You may not agree with conclusions but you have to agree with what he says about the truth movement running in circles. I cant post a link because I can.t remember where I got this so I'll quote it minus the cussing, this is a direct copy and paste, none of these words are mine.

“...You ought to go look at Britannia, and there were hijackers, and they were Israeli. The Israelis stole the passports, and planted others after the event. One of them turned out to be the first cousin of an Israeli spy who was later busted in Lebanon. And within 4 months Israel was busted in 2002 with a fake Al qaeda cell in Palestine. The fake tape about Bin Laden came from Israel and Zionist Jews within the US. The anthrax notes said death to America and Israel. It was ISREAL who lied about the witnessing the meeting in Prague and wrongly connected Iraq to Al Qaeda and Al Qaeda with the anthrax. It was the Israelis who spoon fed the bull# about Iraq's WMDs to the press via PNAC and the Weekly Standard. Each prewar lie was a PNAC talking point and every one of those papers were written by American Jews with dual citizenship to Israel. Two who live there and one was an arms dealer for Israel. It wasn't just "some guys" either these men work in the defense and state departments. Grossman was later busted selling nuclear secrets on the black market via Turkish and Israeli middle men. Fieth's office was busted spying for Israel through AIPAC. His firm is partners with an Israeli settler and got Iraq reconstruction contracts. Perle is an arms adviser for Israel and was gathering blackmail on politicians. Go look up the Kushner affair. Or "miss piggy" and Gannon.

Don't even argue with me. You're zeroing in on "phone calls" from the flights. That is minutia. All four airports had Israeli security none of them have footage of the alleged hijackers getting on the planes. Atta conveniently had a list in his bag which miraculously was left unchecked at the airport. The buildings destroyed were owned by American Jewish billionaires with strong ties to Israel. On the day of 911, a tape of dancing Palestinians was played on the air, (the tape was orchestrated they even had kids conveniently with little flags) yet the dancing Israelis who were filming the event before it happened and the subsequent spy-ring was yanked from the air and classified. And to top all of THAT off the Israelis in a moving van, for Israeli intelligence that was LIVING NEXT DOOR to the said lead hijacker, was busted on the George Washington bridge on 911 packed with explosives. That's exactly how the FBI and Mossad tried to do it in 1993, you've probably never heard of Josy Hadas. Because no one made a music video about it yet.

Of course because this is what prison planet white wash does:
They take specifics known about the WMDs lies and turn it into a generality "they lied about WMDs" that's called a path to no where.

Who lied about WMDs? Where did those lies come from? We know exactly where they came from. Even more specific the lies about Anthrax which the whole world knows now wasn't from Al qaeda, are just shoved into a generality rather than tracing back to Israeli security, Woolsey, Barns, Schmit and Kagan. Hell no Prison Planet fans have no clue who those people even are. But they can quote the loose change disinfo backwards and forwards like tape recorders.

And rather than specifics on 911 like, oh I don't know maybe the people caught with truck bombs, Prison planet again tosses into a generality saying "inside job" but again not saying who other than a list of vague general terms like, NWO, criminal elements, "compartmentalized" the Bush Admin, etc or even goofier, the Illuminati, the CFR/TLC/Bilderberg/queen of England anything but the people caught with the bombs and spy ring and busted lying about everything else.

The Israelis didn't get on the planes, the planes were controlled via remote, the Israeli moles were to create a paper trail to the flight schools etc, come on they left a Qurran and ID at a bar, they're on gambling ships with Abramoff, they live next to the Mossad, it was the Mossad. It worked like the OKC bombing where there was more co-intell pro than terrorists, it was Israeli "movers" who placed the bombs in the building and had access to it, 4 broken elevators my ass, that was transportation, and we KNOW the moving company was a front. And the owner was placed on the FBI's list as a 911 suspect thanks to cyptome (not wikipeepeeleaks) we have those documents, and the translations in Italian and Polish but along comes DHS head Michael Chertoff son of a rabbi whose Zionist cousin wrote the 911 white wash piece for Popular Mechanics, and suddenly the English version is gone (classified).

But no no we'll just keep on having a million films about B7 and a bunch of disinfo like a missile hit the pentagon and 93 was faked etc. 911 truth is just running in circles because the mouth piece is a whitewash who ripped off William Cooper, who was killed, and refuses to say a word about Israel in any meaningful way.

I feel like I am beating my head against the wall. I have made films about this # and they routinely get censored. I have written about it and about 1.5 hundred thousand people did read about it, but that isn't enough. I dont get paid for this crap, I don't have a radio show, though I was offered recently, it's not my job to put this info out, but I can tell you where the resistance to it is and it's not from the general public. I do well with the public since I don't speak of secret society handshakes, and Bavarian death cults, my info is grounded and clear and makes a whole picture. The people I have trouble with are the 911 kook movement. That is what is killing 911 truth, 911 troofers.

-Ryan Dawson (banned from all Jonestown related forums as have been anyone else to post my work there)

Two forms of deception are the "avoid everything about Israel" or "blaming everything wrong in all of history on Israel/the jews." Both are nonsense and the second is a bogus defense for the first.

I am not calling everyone associated with prison planet a kook. There is real work done there. But it has been subverted by disinformation, chicken-#tery, censorship and attracting the lowest common denominator. I implore those who dive into it there and continue to argue and try to educate the kooks. You are real info warriors”

Again, not my words, but I thought it pertinent here.

Originally posted by _BoneZ_

Originally posted by lambros56
The video tells me it turns to dust.

The video is not telling anyone anything. YOU are telling yourself that the steel is turning into dust, all without showing any proof of any such technology that can do such a thing.


Come on. Read your posts and then ask yourself: Did I REALLY say that?


I didn1t say i had proof at all.
To me, it looks like it turns to dust.
I dont know how it was done but it was you who said that it had been debunked years ago and i asked you to show me how it was debunked.
YOU read my posts.
Show me and you might change my mind.
You accused me of siding with Judy Wood when i never mentioned her name.
I`m a member of AE911truth so i`m far from the Judy Wood theory.
Something brought those buildings down and it was a technology that none of us understand.
The Government knows who done it but what can they do when the ones who done it run them.

If you disagree with my opinion, that`s fine by me but dont point the finger and make up falsities.
I`m sick to death of the way some of you on here come across to people you dont even know.

We`ve all done our research and we all have different opinions.

reply to post by Yankee451

I believe what the evidence can prove, not what the TeeVee tells me.

Oh, aren't you just soooooo special. You're obviously way above the rest of us because you don't believe the TeeeeVeeeee, but I do notice you seem to believe any piece of crap someone posts on the internet. Thats is soooo much more intellectually discerning.

Yes, dings and dents on the column. You deny their existence, just as you claim the existence of your imaginary sister. Sawing, yes, as would happen with wedge-shaped wings sawing like a two sided guillotine. They would strike the columns at the engines first, and then sequentially out to the wingtips which would strike the columns with the least energy of the wing. The damage is the opposite of that action.

I can see the investigation now - "The Ding and Dent" inquiry.

I picture you in the basement of Langley. Desk strewn with full ashtrays and empty Dr. Pepper cans and spent candy wrappers...taking your breaks holding up a picture of Janet Napolitano with one hand.

I can see your fanatasy - that someone at Langely cares what you think or say.

Originally posted by lambros56
i asked you to show me how it was debunked.

Use Google. That's what it's there for. I don't have the time to dig up years-old stuff when you can do it yourself.

Originally posted by lambros56
You accused me of siding with Judy Wood when i never mentioned her name.

You didn't need to say her name to show you side with her. Just peddling her disinformation, along with correcting me by adding "DR" to her name in all-caps is proof enough.

Originally posted by lambros56
I`m a member of AE911truth so i`m far from the Judy Wood theory.

And then you say that the steel turned to dust and that there was some magical unknown technology that we don't yet understand that was used to bring the towers down; which goes 180-degrees totally against the grain of what AE911T's research is based on.

Far from her theories? You are peddling her exact theories!

You won't be a member of AE911T very long if any of them gets wind that you're peddling Judy's theories. I already know of others that have been booted because they have mentioned her "theories".

Originally posted by lambros56
We`ve all done our research and we all have different opinions.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinions. But don't claim to be a member of AE911T and then start talking about Judy's crackpot disinfo "theories" because those "theories" and AE911T don't mix. That's not what AE911T's findings and research are based on, nor does the evidence agree.

reply to post by hooper


What, do the dings prove your sis is wrong?

Can you explain the dings better?

Originally posted by Yankee451
reply to post by hooper

 

What, do the dings prove your sis is wrong?

Can you explain the dings better?

Here's the funny part - I don't even know what you're talking about. Dings? Good Lord. Yes, those dings prove that my sister is so stupid she doesn't know what a plane looks like.

Originally posted by hooper



Here's the funny part - I don't even know what you're talking about. Dings? Good Lord. Yes, those dings prove that my sister is so stupid she doesn't know what a plane looks like.

The reason I am so certain your alleged sister didn't see a jet, and that FDNY343 was lying when he claimed he saw a jet is because the damage indicates two missiles from opposite sides, NOT a jet. Regardless of what you say your sister said, or what the TV showed, the DAMAGE SAYS OTHERWISE.

And aside from that, and aside from what I keep being told on this board, I would be crazy to think a jet wing tip could cut the steel like that anyway. I do know however that video can be faked and that Governments lie. This is a better explanation:

Try to look at what the evidence indicates. It is clearly not a wing tip slicing at a 35 degree right to left motion. So what CAN explain the evidence of left right damage?

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/badcb96f8e3e.jpg[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/24e4da0adf94.jpg[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/55d6f5b2799a.jpg[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/4ba11e79e759.jpg[/atsimg]

Originally posted by Yankee451
I do know however that video can be faked and that Governments lie.

Except home videos cannot be faked. Unless you think every single home video in the world was turned in to some magical studio to have a plane inserted.

Here's a home video, and he even says "What's this other JET doing?":




Nothing you say or do will ever convince anyone that no planes hit those towers. You really are wasting your time. Never going to happen.

reply to post by _BoneZ_


Yes, staged. All the alleged amateur video cancel each other out. That one was Tina Cart I believe...she has the same images as Wolfgang Staehl and Robert Clark.

Look, people...I'm not making this stuff up, however improbable it sounds faking video isn't that hard, and this is a classic example of the Big Lie. I was just as skeptical as you are at one time.

No one has a real image of a plane because there wasn't one.

Please check this link and just look at the three examples I listed above.
Enter the site, and then click the "Amateur Imagery" link under the FAQ on the right side.

www.septemberclues.info...

reply to post by _BoneZ_


Look at it this way...

Everyone would have cameras going, right?

But what would they get? Smoking buildings and no planes.

No one was expecting another plane, so no one would be able to catch a picture of it at 500 MPH unless they were expecting it. If someone got video of the explosion with no jet, they'd figure they weren't at the right angle. So there are plenty of private video and pictures of smoking buildings, but all the images with a jet are fake. They also didn't come into the public domain immediately if you recall. Plenty of time to trickle them out as more propaganda to "keep the dream alive".

The media are not your friends.

If someone caught a missile, would they report it? If they reported it, would they ever see their video again?

Originally posted by Yankee451
Yes, staged. All the alleged amateur video cancel each other out. That one was Tina Cart I believe...she has the same images as Wolfgang Staehl and Robert Clark.

See, what I did was posted an actual video of the second plane. The people behind the camera even acknowledged that it was a plane.

What you did, was (as usual) type a bunch of meaningless text onto your screen without showing any proof of your claims.

Originally posted by Yankee451
www.septemberclues.info...

September Clueless is years old, debunked disinformation. Everything is thoroughly debunked in my thread here:

DEW/Energy Weapons? Holograms? TV Fakery? No Planes at the WTC? -- A 9/11 Disinfo Campaign


Any time you think you have enough "evidence" for the no-plane disinformation, I'll gladly debate you in the debate forum, or on the ATS Live radio show. Take your pic.