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Stigmata's created from the mind?

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posted on Jul, 21 2004 @ 03:34 PM
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I was wondering...

I've read about how people can heal/harm themselves with the mind. Now take a Stigmata for instance, could their belief in Jesus be so strong that the persons mind is causing the wounds?


I also noticed that when someone is feeling down or depressed they tend to get sick much easyer, but when they feel great (emotionaly) are less likely to.




posted on Jul, 21 2004 @ 03:35 PM
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It could also be made with a nail to their own hands, if they wanted to convince people enough.


Though I guess it would be possible for them to think it up and happen, I have a feeling it's more of something they do to themselves for attention.



posted on Jul, 21 2004 @ 03:38 PM
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I am not a religious person. So yes i agree that a nail would work.


But i am refering to the cases that have other people seeing them form on another body.



posted on Jul, 21 2004 @ 03:47 PM
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Well, wasn't the real way they crucified people was through their wrists, not their palms? Because if it was through their palms, it wasn't enough to hold them up & they'd rip right off the cross? Yet the most common form of stigmata is through the palms--which is also how the crucifixion is depicted on any cross or piece of art. So the mind, through the intense power of belief, might be creating the stigmata based on a previous image it has seen.



posted on Jul, 21 2004 @ 03:48 PM
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I have no idea if it's real, but there was a documentary a few years ago where they covered the hands of nuns who suffered stigmata with sealed-on gloves or glass cases. The nuns in the gloves had a new stigmata, but the glove seals showed that they had been tampered with. The nuns with the glass cases, which weren't tampered with didn't have stigmata.

So, I'm guessing it's all delusional.

I've never heard of them appearing while people watch them.



[edit on 21-7-2004 by Zzub]



posted on Jul, 21 2004 @ 03:51 PM
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I don't buy it, myself. And I'm a Christian. My pit bull speaks in tongues, tho.



posted on Jul, 21 2004 @ 04:24 PM
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As far as how ancient crucifixions were performed, it's important to remember that there was a wide range of activities translated as 'crucify.' (staurazeow)

Sometimes this was merely impaling people on poles, a la vlad tsepecs.

Sometimes it was done in the highly stylized form seen in most catholic iconography (they did it with professional crucifixion teams when they Spartacus revolt was put down. They lined the Appian Way, a 90-mile highway, with the crosses of dying slaves . . .)

sometimes they'd nail a person's hands and feet to a tree. (typically for violating a sacred grove, or desecrating temples, etc.) They might use ropes to hold the victim in place, so he didn't "rip free."

The Greek word Chieros means the arm from the elbow to the fingertips. So piercing the hands cold also include the wrists, or not.

We have intact ankle-bones from crucifixion victims, with the nails still wedged between them; but the hand and wrist bones don't articulate in such a specific fashion. A nail generally just forces the bones apart.

But most archaeologists assume in a general way that Jesus was probably pierced between the radius and ulna of the forearm. Again, there's no specific record in the gospel accounts.

* * * * * * * * *
Stigmata is a separate question, of course.

I suppose that if a person can upset themselves so much that they have a heart-attack, then I can accept the idea that they could also have a detrimental affect on their own anatomy.

I've read a number of articles on stigmata; generally it is associated with specifically meditating on Christ's wounds and his suffering, prayed about over a period of months. The movie of the name "Stigmata" was so atrocious because the victim doesn't welcome the suffering, whereas most stigmatics do.

I think a person really could make themselves sick by focusing on it.

St. Francis of Asisi is the first stigmatic on record, in the late middle ages. His case was totally unique in that the flesh itself began to take on the shape of nails imbedded through his hands and feet.

Yeah. look it up. Here's one quote:

When the vision disappeared, St. Francis felt sharp pains in various places on his body. Looking to find the source, he saw that he had five marks like those on Jesus' hands, feet, and sides. Observers described them as "fleshy" and "nail-like ... "round and black, standing clear of his flesh." His side appeared to have been lanced; his companions actually saw that wound appear, as though his skin had been slashed. During the days that followed, St. Francis' trousers and tunic were often soaked in blood. The marks remained until his death and reportedly caused him much pain.

That came from this site: www.workersforjesus.com...

This one is about Francis generally: www.cin.org...


Here's a list of famous stigmatics:

www.catholic-forum.com...

And finally, a pretty good article from "The Skeptical Inquirer" with a discussion of fraud issues:

www.findarticles.com...





posted on Jul, 21 2004 @ 06:06 PM
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the question also raises the point that if you believe so strongly that you create the stigmata, does that make religion an illusion that the mid creates, because if you can imagine the stigmata and it becomes physically evident then you could imagine jesus and you could see him or you could see signs of him.

i guess it's the relgious-placebo effect

and i read somewhere then when you do your religious practices, all be it meditation/praying and so forth because you are so emotionally charged you use a larger percentage of your brain at that moment, so it may be possible to create a stigmata while deep in prayer.

and with the nuns maybe they just wanted the stigmata soo badly that they did it with out knowing, like subconciously pushing a oujia board



posted on Jul, 22 2004 @ 07:48 AM
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I found the above answers amusing.


Padre Pio, the most recent stigmatist that the Catholic church has investigated was once asked the question if his stigmata could be
produced from his own mind. If he 'thought' it into exhistence through
intense meditation or something.

He gave the questioner a look like 'you've got to be kidding' and then
told the man to go meditate on a cow for a long time and come back and
let him know if he grew horns, a tail and started producing milk.

In other words .. NOT POSSIBLE.

It's from God. It has to do with sharing the suffering of the One you
love ... Christ.

You'll have to look into basic theology to understand the 'why' about
the sharing in the suffering of Christ. Google it up, or go to Tan Books
for more (accurate) information on stigmata.



posted on Jul, 22 2004 @ 11:34 AM
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