Solutions to assist Japan. FROM OUT OF BOX THINKERS., page 1

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ATS Members have flagged this thread 22 times

Topic started on 17-3-2011 @ 09:12 AM by Ophiuchus 13

Ok ATS I was observing the disaster in Japan-EA and was wondering are there any possible solutions to the nuclear issue there. So this thread is for those with compassion and imagination to bring forth any potential ways to help out using fringe thinking as well as use the debunkers to deny any potential helpful hints with proof that an idea wont work, so you can use mine first and let me know if it can help or cause more harmful outcome. I did a similar thread like this for the G.O.M

So lets see since this issue can become global if not taking care of.

My idea-----

I seen one of the problems with one reactor or more was overheating and water loss. So is it possible to place a freezing agent with neutralizing material embedded within it on inside or cover reactors core with to freeze rods before they melt or catch fire? Like a liquid nitrogen type agent of some kind that will freeze everything preventing air contamination and ground contamination. I see like a freezing ooz or gel type mixture so it leaks into open areas and freezes everything to brittleness then after everything is frozen knock it all down in frozen parts and gather and remove...

OR IS THE ONLY WAY TO SACRIFICE THOSE WILLING TO GO CLOSE ENOUGH TO TRY AND HELP??? I HOPE NOT!

Challenge it let us know if it works or not add solutions. Thanks in advance SMART THINKERS

IDEAS......

edit on 3/17/11 by Ophiuchus 13 because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:16 AM by phishyblankwaters

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13

So is it possible to place a freezing agent with neutralizing material embedded within it on inside or cover reactors core with to freeze rods before they melt or catch fire? Like a liquid nitrogen type agent of some kind that will freeze everything preventing air contamination and ground contamination. I see like a freezing ooz or gel type mixture so it leaks into open areas and freezes everything to brittleness then after everything is frozen knock it all down in frozen parts and gather and remove...

good question, I'm not sure. The cooling required for the rods, either live or i storage, is not just having them underwater, it has to be constantly flowing or it will boil off. I'm not sure how liquid nitrogen would react, actually, doesn't it become explosive under the right conditions? And i'm not sure how fast it would actually cool them, it could be an issue as they would melt the frozen material away as it's static, not moving.

It's harder to heat up a liquid that is in motion.

Actually I'm pretty sure this wouldn't work for the reasons above and also because they haven't done it.

edit on 17-3-2011 by phishyblankwaters because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:20 AM by Ophiuchus 13

reply to post by phishyblankwaters

I see and thank you for evaluating it for me. I considered the liquid nitrogen may be explosive but was using it as an example in case there are any other agents out there or even more powerful that can freeze like it.
Thanks phishyblankwaters for the input and care.

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:20 AM by rubbertramp

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13

i woke up after a dream last night.
my dream was a vision of a huge military helicopter, a hugh block of ice dangling underneath. they dropped it right on the reactor.
i think they flew north and just plucked a small iceberg out of the sea.

i also had a dream about hundreds of military helicopters landing and picking up citizens for evacuation.
not just american military choppers, but seemed like many countries sent in theirs to help.

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:25 AM by Ophiuchus 13

reply to post by rubbertramp

Your dream was a solution I seen this morning when observing the copters flying overhead dropping water. The water was to help cool but it looked like a large part was evaporating before touching down. I was thinking a large piece of ice and that's what made me create the thread related to freezing. Pretty interesting thought rubbertramp

Thanks for the input

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:32 AM by rubbertramp

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13

maybe the weight would cause more damage?
i'm pretty ignorant concerning the scientific side of this whole thing.
in my mind i'm picturing a line of helicopters, each dropping huge chunks of ice, one after another.
a slow, persistent cool down.

edit on 17-3-2011 by rubbertramp because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:38 AM by Sky watcher

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13

Seal off the canal its sitting on and bulldoze the stuff right in there, problem fixed

.

Do I get a Noble for that or do I have to kill millions first?

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:40 AM by vivalarevolution

Trap the whole of Japan inside a giant man made glacier?.. hmm, that's out of the box, but, think outside of one box and you're in yet another larger box, anyone else think the Russians had it right with their little egg in egg toys?.

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:41 AM by Sky watcher

Don't bring water to it since its useless anyway. Take it to the water the easy way. Put some remote control bulldozers into action and the stuff will then be sitting in nice cool water.

www.hitachi-cat.com...

These will get the job done and they are already over there!!!! Dam im a genius.

edit on 17-3-2011 by Sky watcher because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:41 AM by MischeviousElf

Without being sarcastic or taking the mickey:

RUN AWAY!

Is imho the best solution if you are japanese or living there. If in Japan I would leae ASAP until this reactor situation is fixed or goes bang.

To be honest they are thinking out of the box already as no "in the box" experience or planning exists for this. Te use of helicoptors dropping watre, using fire engines and riot cannons to cool it down is very out of the box.

Personally I dont understand why nearly every fie engine in japan is not lined up by the sea with hoses going to the sea, and pumping it straight to the reactor. the engines could be left, and just revisited to refuel as they run out.

Just blanket the entire area with as much water as possible, surely hundreds of fire engines could help somewhat as its last ditch events, plug them in to the sea turn them on, get all the fire hoses possible and get them as clsoe as able set them up and leave. Refuel a few hours later leave again.

Kind Regards

Elf

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:42 AM by Ophiuchus 13

reply to post by rubbertramp

I can see there possible being a structural issue with the weight of icebergs. But the cooling aspect I feel would out weigh the structural loss as long as the damage doesent open more rad. air exits. I e\was thinking like a cement gel that will cool more when in contact with the radiation. I know the scientist can make it.
thanks

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:44 AM by Ophiuchus 13

reply to post by Sky watcher

Sounds like a good idea. My main concern was trying to prevent a Chernobyl type closure because I think that is still harmful to EA inhabitants as of now.
Thank you Sky watcher for the care and input.

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:47 AM by Ophiuchus 13

reply to post by vivalarevolution

If and I do mean If there was a weather device present that can do it

that would be the best solution to me and the Russian toy one inside another concept with ice layers prevents air contamination as well.
Very good idea ivalarevolution. THANKS!

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:49 AM by Ophiuchus 13

reply to post by Sky watcher

Another good idea so we will end up with a lake surrounding and submerging the total site. Take it a little further and freeze the lake and we may be on to something..
Thanks

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:52 AM by Ophiuchus 13

reply to post by MischeviousElf

MischeviousElf, great idea with a massive amount of fire trucks surrounding the area and pumping continuously. Now of course those would come as a loss and would all need replaced but it sounds like a great idea.

Thanks

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:53 AM by rubbertramp

what would happen if we just evacuated and then exploded a small nuke?
maybe it would disperse everything enough to lower the levels?

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:54 AM by Ophiuchus 13

So far the ideas are comming in great. Please feel free to add more.

My way of thinking. I see STARZ STARZ ATARZ in space, cold space keeps them Stars sustained. Nuclear activity can be compared to little star behavior so hence the freeze.

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:55 AM by Leemo

Why not get a big FIRE EXTINGUISHER TYPE OF MATERIAL and freeze the # out of it! I'm not a physicist but salt water isn't going to cool down radioactive material. As my logic tells me, you can only cool radiation with other types of elements.

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:56 AM by Ophiuchus 13

Originally posted by rubbertramp
what would happen if we just evacuated and then exploded a small nuke?
maybe it would disperse everything enough to lower the levels?

I thought of that but it sounds messy. Now a neutron type bomb may eliminate some of the radiation but I am not sure. I hope they dont have to nuke it it just seems like adding oxygen to fire. There has got to be a way.
thanks

reply posted on 17-3-2011 @ 09:56 AM by MischeviousElf

reply to post by rubbertramp

What would happen is that you would put huge amounts of radiation high into the atmosphere from the nuke, like in hiroshima many years later people being born deformed genetic problems. And to that you add hundreds of tons of spent fuel that would mix with the dust in the mushroom cloud or even go into fission itself.

It would the worst possible thing you could do in this situation worse that hrowing petrol inside the reactors.

Elf

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