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Questions the Skeptics, Media and Government(s) Can’t Answer.

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posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 07:29 AM
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reply to post by Astyanax
 





It is based on the a priori assumption that there is an ongoing, successful conspiracy of powers who run the world and control the media. Can you prove that assumption? Do you have solid evidence for it – evidence that is real and unambiguous, not circumstantial and open to interpretation?


AP and Reuters the two main wire services are owned by the same person who's banking interests are likely the largest on the planet.

The company that built these reactors GE owns a substantial number of broadcast companies and is one of the BIG FIVE owners of them.

What you call circumstantial evidence that frankly shame on you for not having the common sense to research yourself, is actually a conclusive array of a handful of corporations that control most of the broadcast media throughout the world.

The opposite side of the paranoia coin is denial, and that's usually where people who haven't done any research themselves but want someone to provide them a few handy dandy links to critique and attempt to debunk have there head at.

The most famous river in the world De Nile!




posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 07:35 AM
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reply to post by Astyanax
 





Your thread is revolting. It is a vile affront to the thousands who died, and to those who are doing all that is in their power to prevent more lives being lost or ruined.


Ah the emotion card, played in conjunction with the denial card and you have ...no hand.

What's an affront to innocent people dying is rolling over and accepting really rotten answers for why that happened from the very same people who not only put them in harms way but did not die either.

I often wonder why some people are so afraid of the truth. Is it because they would then have to challenge themselves to rise to the occassions it sheds light on and they know that will be dangerous?

Or is it because as long as they can pretend it doesn't effect them they can selfishly go about their own pursuit of self gratification.

By the way on who's authority do you speak for the dead, and how do you communicate with them?



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 07:36 AM
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The President is far from an expert on Nuclear Fallout, he just says what he's told... The sources that give him his information would never tell him the truth. They can easily make up any story feed it to him and he wouldn't know the difference. He would never tell anything even remotely close to radiation threats to Callifornia, as long as people are not expected to immediately drop dead from exposure.



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 07:37 AM
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reply to post by derfreebie
 


Thats exactly what l have been thinking since this whole thing started.The Japanese are not stupid. lt's not just me. l have heard several geologists ask the same question. Who on earth persuaded the Japanese authourities to build nuclear reactors on a " HIGHLY UNSTABLE SUBDUCTION ZONE'".? This whole thing stinks. l wonder how many others there are dotted around the world. "Just waiting". Peace starchild.



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 07:38 AM
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reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 


That is an interesting take on this Proto, because it leaves open the door for the incompetence excuse.

This is so similar to the 911 disaster that it is quite eerie, but on a scale 1000 times larger.

Nuclear Power has always been a disaster waiting to happen. When times are good, and the money trust allows several credits to be distributed to the plebs, then nuclear power seems like such a good idea, but....

Then when something like this happens, people FINALLY realize the absolutely ridiculous nature of our curiosity with manipulating matter through atomic science.
This has been a disaster waiting to happen since someone had the bright idea to use fission as a power source.

My mom works for the US Army Corps of Engineers and I know how extensive their testing is, and it is quite extensive, but she also constantly tells me about the MASSIVE amount of corruption that is prevalent throughout the corps.

If these extremely rich businessmen/government agents did not once ever think about the ridiculous nature of building a nuclear bomb for use as power, over a FN fault line, then they, if anyone in the history of history, deserve to be executed for stupidity.



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 07:42 AM
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Originally posted by star child
reply to post by derfreebie
 


Thats exactly what l have been thinking since this whole thing started.The Japanese are not stupid. lt's not just me. l have heard several geologists ask the same question. Who on earth persuaded the Japanese authourities to build nuclear reactors on a " HIGHLY UNSTABLE SUBDUCTION ZONE'".? This whole thing stinks. l wonder how many others there are dotted around the world. "Just waiting". Peace starchild.


The Americans. Who else did you think.



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 07:43 AM
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reply to post by torqpoc
 





Dear friend,
Again a nice post, although this time I think it was somewhat lacking your usual analytical and studied mind. It was a bit bereft I feel. Good, yes... awesome no. Not your usual calibre Sir!


I would have preferred to do more with the opening piece but honestly was pressed for time. I am in somewhat of a odd and unique position in that if I take the time to foster a dialogue on an important subject it tends to get people talking and considering and sharing research and opinions in a significant way.

Sometimes this really, really interfers with business and personal life (well most of the time) but if it's an important issue I try to find the time, often on the spur of the moment.

So I do appologize I didn't have more time to put this together with more of the annalysis and close attention to detail you would have enjoyed.

I appreciate you and everyone else who has joined in to consider better what the governments and media aren't telling us as well as to better consider what they are.

Thanks.



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 07:52 AM
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I gave you a flag, but no star. I think you bring up some alarming points, and some well laid out criticisms, but you offer no alternative truths and/or solutions.

So essentially I'm telling you I want you to continue your thoughts here and follow that rabbit all the way down the hole.
edit on 18-3-2011 by gncnew because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 07:52 AM
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reply to post by Josephus23
 





That is an interesting take on this Proto, because it leaves open the door for the incompetence excuse.

This is so similar to the 911 disaster that it is quite eerie, but on a scale 1000 times larger.

Nuclear Power has always been a disaster waiting to happen. When times are good, and the money trust allows several credits to be distributed to the plebs, then nuclear power seems like such a good idea, but....

Then when something like this happens, people FINALLY realize the absolutely ridiculous nature of our curiosity with manipulating matter through atomic science.

This has been a disaster waiting to happen since someone had the bright idea to use fission as a power source.


In many ways it's like kids building sand castles at the beach. Sure they look pretty good, and are fun to play with, but all it takes is a wave or some giant walking about to topple them over.

One of the problems with capitilism is it involves a lot of salespeople who earn money by selling people on the pros and ignorning or down playing the cons.

The Pharmacutical industry is another great example where very often glamarous and well dressed and educated women salesreps go in and flirt with the doctors to start perscribing their drugs.

Often drugs that the FDA hastily approved that need another 10 years of study, where the owners of the company literally operate on a business plan of well if we make 5 billion off of it, and have to pay out 1 billion in lawsuits for the people it kills 10 years down the road, we still came out 4 billion ahead.

The truth is that even though all these things are supposed to be for the betterment of the people, the people are never really too well considered and never as much as the dollars and cents involved.

One of the big problems with our big corporate big government culture is no one is quite human to these people that own and run it, they are all just a series of numbers on a ledger or roll.

Whether it's dollars, people or widgets too much of what they do is all based simply on juggling numbers.




edit on 18/3/11 by ProtoplasmicTraveler because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 07:57 AM
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Originally posted by gncnew
I gave you a flag, but no star. I think you bring up some alarming points, and some well laid out criticisms, but you offer no alternative truths and/or solutions.

So essentially I'm telling you I want you to continue your thoughts here and follow that rabbit all the way down the hole.
edit on 18-3-2011 by gncnew because: (no reason given)


I wish I had the alternative truths and solutions as I would gladly give them away for nothing, no stars, flags or even a cup of lemonade on a hot summer day required.

It sounds cliche but why would anyone give the people the truth if the people are not going to demand it and accept lies?

In a lot of ways the thread is much more about that than it is the actual events in Japan.

Here we are again folks with a huge disaster on our hands that likely will effect us all in some way and not one person who we rely on to give us real information or find out for us is doing so.

I would like to believe out there somewhere is a straw that literally will break that camels back.

I empathize with your frustrations my friend.

Thanks for joining in.



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 08:03 AM
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Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
It’s a real tragedy what has happened in Japan but perhaps the bigger tragedy if there could be one is the level of disdain the Japanese Government and the Press and many of the so called ‘think tanks’ and experts have been showing for people with common sense in how badly they are reporting and distorting events from the scenes.

#1: How can they say there is no serious breach of containment at the plants?



#2: They plan to restore power to the cooling systems by running outside lines to the main plant junctions?



#3: They should be called heroes as they may ultimately have to sacrifice their lives?



#4: If no significant radiation has been released why is even the New York Times now reporting Radio Active Clouds that pose minimal health hazards will reach the California Coast by tomorrow?


#5: Clearly these plants are beyond repair, why aren’t they actively entombing them?



edit on 17/3/11 by ProtoplasmicTraveler because: (no reason given)


I'll take a stab at the questions.
1. I don't think they are suggesting that there is not a serious problem going on here...simply that their is no 'breach of containment' of a serious level.....Yet. Containment simply means how much of the radiation is being contained....and if you choose to bealive them, then it has not yet reached a serious level.

2. Yeah...I agree with you. That seems like an unlikely to succeed option. Perhaps they simply want to try it, just in case, on a slim chance that it works? I really don't know.

3. I'm not sure what you are asking here....Yes of course they should be called heroes. Within the body of the question you speculate on if they have already died. I find this unlikely. Its far more likely that they are suffering the first stages of radiation sickness....often at this stage their is little difference of the symptoms of a high dose or a low dose. Its possible they will all die withing a few weeks....however I think the most likely scenario from what I have read about such cases, is that they will just live out their lives till Cancer takes them.....They probably have about 10 years at least, I'd say before it develops. Of course I'm sure one or two of them, may survive to an old age. I heard a similar incident on NPR recently where a guy was interviewed who was involved in a highly radioactive situation, with a small number of other people...very similar to what is happening now. Everyone else had died eventually from Cancer except the guy being interviewed. He wasn't immune to it or anything.....just lucky. He had battled bouts with many different forms of Cancer since the incident....He was just lucky enough to survive each one.

4. Seems like contradictions doesn't it? I guess we will have to wait and see what the truth is.

5. I think you answer this one yourself....they just don't have the logistics to do it. I know they build reactors close to bodies of water in order to have a supply of cooling water in case of a meltdown...Made me think of a possible way to do it which might even be better. Just speculation on my part, but why not stick Reactors under the water period? If there is a big explosion then water rushes in and cools the rods immediately . I dunno....it doesn't seem beyond our current tech. Perhaps a good Idea....Perhaps I'm missing something obvious that makes it a bad one. If anything such plants should have a plan ready to implement in such a disaster. The scary thing is, I've heard Japan has more planning in place for such an event than America does for its nuke plants!!



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 08:04 AM
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Originally posted by univac500
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 


ProtoplasmicTraveler, I think you have really summed up the feelings of a great many ATS members with this one. Good work.

I live in Beijing and when I am watching the talking drones and the obligatory experts yakking, yakking, endlessly yakking (but saying nothing) I literally want to hurl blunt objects at my TV screen.

I'm sure you will recall that famous end scene from Planet Of The Apes: Chuck Heston dismounts his horse, crumbles to the beach and mutters (as only Chuck could do) "You blew it all up...you really did it...damn you.......!"

Well, I think this is Japan's Planet Of The Apes moment.

Yes, Japan and the people of Japan will bounce back.

But there will be something about Japan, about the "idea" of Japan, that will never bounce back.


This is the Age of Innocense it would seem, a Age that as you point out is likely going to come to an end very soon the hard way.

Innocent people who don't take much time to study history or learn the nature of the world we live in or human nature itself very well.

Innocent people who often have a very hard time imagining and or believing that the authority figures that they have empowered and entrusted are not so innocent as presumed to be.

Innocense that comes with an arrogance, much like the young teenage Brit on another thread who angrily proclaimed the youth of today could not possibly become like the youth of Nazi Germany because they have cell phones and Ipods now that would prevent that, while never giving a thought to how all the electronics in his life have programmed him.

One day hopefully humankind will learn from its endless series of the same mistakes dressed up in different costumes with different technologies that always end up a rose by which ever name you want to call them.

I am thinking that might be a good thing, though coming of age is never the gay and happy thing those who haven't imagine it might be.

Great post, thanks for sharing.



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 08:14 AM
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reply to post by bhornbuckle75
 


That's an interesting suggestion to build the reactors under water, we certainly have the technology, though I can see that as possibly a disaster that could damage one of the world's food sources.

I would think maybe the best alternative is having the core material built on top of a rocket capable of being fired into space would be the 'safest' way to get rid of this stuff if that kind of technology could be developed.

Hurdling the stuff up into outerspace well past the limit where it could effect the earth would probably be the safest thing.

Of course that would cost money, and if the rocket didn't clear the atmosphere and came crashing back down could get real messy.

The whole thing is kind of like cliff diving in Acupolco it looks really good when you can pull it off, but gets pretty ugly and messy when you can't.

Some things are probably lefter better enough alone and that's a lesson we as humans might need to start better learning.

Great reply, thanks for sharing.



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 08:17 AM
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Originally posted by AllIsOne
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 


Don't worry. Ann Coulter says radiation is good for you ... Why are insane people allowed on national TV?

www.alan.com...


Because there is not enough room for them all here on the Internet?

Oddly enough some Vitatmin D from the sun is good for you and this has probably confused Ann. She didn't mention by chance that it's the suntan oil that really does the harm?




posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 08:18 AM
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This is from the LA Times.

U.S. nuclear officials suspect Japanese plant has a dire breach


Reporting from Los Angeles, Kesennuma and Tokyo—
U.S. government nuclear experts believe a spent fuel pool at Japan's crippled Fukushima reactor complex has a breach in the wall or floor, a situation that creates a major obstacle to refilling the pool with cooling water and keeping dangerous levels of radiation from escaping.
That assessment by U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission officials is based on the sequence of events since the earthquake and information provided by key American contractors who were in the plant at the time, said government officials familiar with the evaluation. It was compelling evidence, they said, that the wall of the No. 4 reactor pool has a significant hole or crack.


Link to source

If you don't see the FNORDS then they won't eat you.



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 08:23 AM
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reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 


...It's all about money, controlling money and thereby, controlling populations. And TPTB have put BIG money into nuclear power - everywhere, not just in Japan. They can't afford to have their wisdom questioned.

TPTB do not need our help to collect information OR determine what to do with the information - and they don't want us to get in the way, or interfere with their strategies. Which means we can't be informed. ...To them, democracy is just cumbersome and inefficient.

This video posted by a member of anonymous (or anonymous wannabe) goes straight to the heart of the matter:


On RAWSTORY: Anonymous’ puts central banks on notice, demands Bernanke resign

On ATS: Hacker group Anonymous declares war on 'global banking cartel'


Ed. to add: And oh yeah, the real problem here: Japan Crisis Puts Spotlight on Reactors in U.S.








edit on 18/3/11 by soficrow because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 08:28 AM
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reply to post by ProjectJimmy
 





It is maddening not to be able to get answers, especially when billions of people are counting on us in the media to relay them.


I am sure its no easy thing to be an honest reporter and having to walk a fine line with your sources to the extent if you press them to hard they shut down the information exchange, and then with your editors if the story doesn't have solid enough sources then the media outlet could get royally sued for defemation.

Its got to be tough, but honestly when I see someone like Anderson Cooper pull his "I am angry" stunt it's hard to know whether that too is just another sales job. In other words they gave you a real turkey to have to run with, so how do you run with the turkey and make it still look like you are credible. Get angry? Call it a Turkey? But broadcast it anyway?

Too often people like Cooper save their anger for the viewers consumption but don't risk their credentials on it.

US Government being a classic example, since the War on Terror more and more facts are shrouded in "National Security" Court Judges can't even try some cases now days because they can't fairly get the Government to disclose information that they claim is National Security even though everyone from the Judge to the Defendant to the Prosecutor knows the information really has nothing to do with National Security in that super sensitive way they are basing their withholding of it on.

Yet how many reporters will risk their White House Press Credentials and say "Bull crap Mr. President, the people want answers and you can leave that podium without giving them but rest assured the Press is not leaving the Press Room until we are satisfied we have them."

Like everything else in our society it's all part of a ritualized dance with rules that everyone follows to the point that the very systems themselves don't actually function productively anymore because they have all been corrupted with rules to make sure that they can't function except to favor a very few powerful government and corporate interests.

Yeah Anderson it's great that you can get angry, not so great you really won't put it all on the line to get us the truth.

Not that CNN would let you broadcast it anyway!



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 08:32 AM
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When they built such a plant they reassure the public there is nothing to worry about and that all possible scenarios and disasters have been thought of. And that it's completely safe.Are those the same people who are telling us there is nothing to worry about now?



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 08:36 AM
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Originally posted by enament
When they built such a plant they reassure the public there is nothing to worry about and that all possible scenarios and disasters have been thought of. And that it's completely safe.Are those the same people who are telling us there is nothing to worry about now?


I DOUBLEPLUSGOOD the above.

They (media, etc) put great effort into whitewashing suggestions, like "let's build a nuke factory", and it's the same people who, despite ALL evidence to the contrary, are still telling us the same lies.

Time to get some justice, an accessory is also 100% guilty.



posted on Mar, 18 2011 @ 08:39 AM
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reply to post by harryhaller
 


It's funny though the dual set of standards that they use when assigning personal guilt and corporate guilt.

It's almost like the human being can do no right, and the corporate body can do no wrong when you get right down to it.

At worst the human being is sentenced to death, at worst the corporation is fined some of it's customers money!

The corporations aren't being held to account because they have corrupted the political body to make sure that they are not held to account.

Somehow that desperately needs to change.



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