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Chemtrail Debunkers....

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posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 06:44 PM
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reply to post by pianopraze
 

Did you read the briefing notes?
No, you just read and misinterpreted the titles. Out of context nonsense.
edit on 3/24/2011 by Phage because: (no reason given)




posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 06:44 PM
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reply to post by Soylent Green Is People
 


You are good... Just nailed it down.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 06:51 PM
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reply to post by pianopraze
 


I'm sorry but......


....a weekend long workshop....


A "workshop"?? Basically, a conference???

For what? To "plan" a "total world domination via 'chem'-trails, and 'geoengineering'"??? (No hyphen, per your request!)


This totally PUBLIC "weekend" conference???

OK....step away from the cliff, and back into the safety of rationality, please......
edit on 24 March 2011 by weedwhacker because: can't tell you.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 07:14 PM
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Originally posted by MathiasAndrew
Videos speak for themself





Yes, they do. And I am seriously thinking you are just trying to have fun and pull peoples legs. First you had the videos of disassembled airplanes at an Arizona aircraft storage and scrapping facility at an airport, and when I would ask you about it, you would never address any questions.

Then you bring up a video that has the same photos that have been debunked on ATS for years, that it would be impossible to not know about. Forward facing air tubes, a Navy E-6A, a 777 equipped for certification testing, an Emirates 777, KC-135 refuelling pod for Navy aircraft, etc.

Yes, it does speak for itself. Either you are entirely ignorant of what you are posting, or you are just trying to jerk people around with the same stuff that has been brought out for years and years and years. No one seriously brings up skywriting aircraft and air force reserve planes that can do mosquito control when needed, and seriously is trying to connect them to chemtrails. You are just trying to have some fun I think
edit on 24-3-2011 by firepilot because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 07:15 PM
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Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by pianopraze
 

Boy did you twist that around. The CFR workshop was to examine ways to prevent unilateral application of geoengineering.




it's really quite impressive how hopeless this hoax is, and yet how it continues to keep trucking along....quiet amazing!!



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 07:37 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by pianopraze
 

Boy did you twist that around. The CFR workshop was to examine ways to prevent unilateral application of geoengineering.




it's really quite impressive how hopeless this hoax is, and yet how it continues to keep trucking along....quiet amazing!!

It is, isnt it. And funny how when someone read a chemmie website, they think wow, the contrails must have just changed (past couple of months, years, etc) and they will say the skies sure have changed since 2005, or in djcardosas mind, the past couple months.

But you can go back and see people saying the same thing in 1999, after seeing chemtrail sites. And it was some of the the same promoters of it then too.

I have been doing a lot of online research on some of the old hands in the chemtrail hoax, and some of the present ones involved in it. There is a lot of interesting stuff I have found, and its wierd how some of the old hands in the hoax seemed to have all turned on one another, over money of course. I think one could write a book about how the chemtrail hoax came about and how it evolved.

Will Thomas is not very active, except for trying to sell more books and videos. He, Carnicom and Horowitz used to do a lot together, but hard to find much of a connection anymore.

And like I posted previously, Horowitz has turned on his old friend Alex Jones, and also turned on Anthony Hiller, and Ted Gunderson too. And then in a video from Hiller on aircrap, he outs Horowitz over having an affair with the woman who now helps to run his Multi Level Marketing scheme, and she accuses Gunderson of murder and satanic activity.

The same person who was webmaster for Conscious Life News, got hired by Hiller to come up with Aircrap website, and gets paid to write lots of ridiculous articles to drive traffic for Hiller. Hiller and Gunderson have been making videos together for a long time too, Hiller did not just find him last week and ask him to talk about chemtrails.

And thats just a part of all of their shenanigans. Carnicom and Chemtrail Central seem to have gotten left behind in it all. Carnicom does some webcasts that get watched by a few people, his website has about 3 posters on it now, and he has his Carnicom Institute that seems to be good for little else than asking for donations. Chemtrail Central is a ghost town too with barely anyone left to post and even the owner (Thermit) left the chemtrail conspiracy behind.


edit on 24-3-2011 by firepilot because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 09:16 PM
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Personally, I would like to continue discussing chemtrails here. You're all welcome to join.

www.abovetopsecret.com...


I think I might have a feeling what you're thinking right now........ "Oh no not another chemtrail thread."..... Right ?



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 09:26 PM
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Originally posted by MathiasAndrew
Personally, I would like to continue discussing chemtrails here. You're all welcome to join.

www.abovetopsecret.com...


I think I might have a feeling what you're thinking right now........ "Oh no not another chemtrail thread."..... Right ?


And yes, par for the course. Had enough of getting it handed to you when it comes to facts and specifics, or done enough hoaxing for a while? You arent the first chemmie to then go off and start another chemtrail thread after getting rolled over. And I see this one is now about ones personal thoughts and feelings. awwwwww



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 09:58 PM
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reply to post by pianopraze
 

But If i used any spurrius terms for anyone who believes geoengineering is just contrails... well.. My post would be removed... or I would be banned like many of my friends... they are dropping like flies! Why?


Because, unable to find objective support for their fears, they lash out at those who have provided clear, reproducible analysis of the gobbledygook they call "science," and seeing the foundations of their faith shaken to the core, have nothing with which to respond but reflexive attacks that violate the T&Cs.

When even the title of the thread itself is chopped-down due to deliberate rejection of the basic rules for debate on this forum, what else would you expect but histrionics and name calling? That's all the faithful have left.


By the way, geoengineering does not have a hyphen in it...


By the way, the author of this thread used that term spelled that way in the title to this thread before it was chopped down by the mods. Same as he used it in his previous thread: "Stratospheric Aerosol Geo-engineering aka "Chemtrails" DEBUNK THIS !!!!" (Which I did, as he requested.)


here's the CFR extraveganza on geoengineering in case you want to know how they globalists spell it and how people with an open mind can find papers on it.


By the way "parinoid," "openmindedness," "implimemting," "autorize," "believeing," "spurrius," "baloon," "ballon," and "extraveganza" are spelled otherwise by globalists and most ordinary people.

As for the "extravaganza", have you succumbed to the "cut & paste" disease like the OP? Google a key word, then post anything that uses it and maybe even has pictures; that seems the be the norm for "research" in the "chemtrail" religion.

Geoengineering has been discussed for decades in scientific, political and popular literature -- that doesn't make it a present-day reality, nor evidence of the existence of "chemtrails." The failure to discern such differences and the proclivity for incoherent assemblages of factoids into a theory are what separate "chemtrail" believers from legitimate researchers.

So what if the Council on Foreign Relations studied the concept? If you took the time to actually read the papers, you'd see that they oppose unregulated implementation of any such programs.

Unfortunately, the president of the U.S. and many of his closest advisers have long believed that the path to greater equality and a healthier environment requires the de-industrialization of developed nations by any means available. Even so, even these idiots have never supported, discussed or studied the use of "chemtrails".

So, when you take two of the basic tenets of the "chemtrail" faith; that is, population reduction and global control, even the staunchest advocates of such goals have never resorted to the lunacy of "chemtrails" as the means to achieve the ends the "chemtrail" believers fear so deeply.

Try to read and think through the articles you post before you just adopt some snippet as "proof."

deny ignorance

jw
edit on 24-3-2011 by jdub297 because: quotes



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 10:20 PM
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reply to post by jdub297
 

This is a "highly speculative conspiracy topic", and AS SUCH, invites speculation.
So, I gather that you speculate that there is absolutely nothing being sprayed into the atmosphere for any reason. You see no reason why anyone that potentially has the capability to do so, would do so. You may believe that no one has the capability to spray anything on a grand scale like chemtrails are alleged to being sprayed. It appears you reject the notion that the many thousands of people that believe chemtrail spraying exists have any merit for believing so. Furthermore, you reject outright all websites and any organizations and individuals that report on chemtrails that have been brought to your attention, and proclaim that they are not worthy of any serious consideration.
Is that fair?



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 10:32 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
it's really quite impressive how hopeless this hoax is, and yet how it continues to keep trucking along....quiet amazing!!


Sir,

as I just posted in a different thread, a few topics are of "revenant" nature here on ATS, and let me expand on this:

a) impending perpetual motion machine
b) chemtrails
c) impending alien contact disclosure (any time now)
d) end of the world on any given day
e) new physics that only involves math at 2nd grade level, which yet manages to explain everything, even what would leave Feynman puzzled.
f) I'm a vampire. What would you recommend?
g) orbs. I have adverse lighting conditions when I take a picture, but still I'm convinced what I see is a ghost. Help.
h) Nibiru. Nobody really saw it once, but I'm quite certain it's nigh.
i) Electric Universe. There are humongous currents flowing through space. We don't observe them, but I'm damn sure they do exist.

God bless the ignorami.
They need all the help they can get.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 10:35 PM
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**ATTENTION**

There has been enough bickering in this thread towards members. Refrain from talking about each other and discuss the topic.

Further violations will incur post bans of 72 hours minimum.

Thank You.

~Keeper
ATS Moderator



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 10:38 PM
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Originally posted by Stewie
reply to post by jdub297
 

This is a "highly speculative conspiracy topic", and AS SUCH, invites speculation.


Indeed - I'm having a ball over there speculating why people are so gullible and why the hoaxers would believe their own rubbiosh.

.

So, I gather that you speculate that there is absolutely nothing being sprayed into the atmosphere for any reason.


you gather wrong.


You see no reason why anyone that potentially has the capability to do so, would do so.


Of course peole are spraying in the atmosphere - for all sorts of reasons. None of them to do with the "chemtrail hoax", and this argument ad ansurdium is just as absurdikum as all the theories for chemtrails in the first place




You may believe that no one has the capability to spray anything on a grand scale like chemtrails are alleged to being sprayed.


Ah - something supportable - yes I do believe that - yes I know you weren't asking me specifically, but I'm answering anyway.



It appears you reject the notion that the many thousands of people that believe chemtrail spraying exists have any merit for believing so.


spot on.


Furthermore, you reject outright all websites and any organizations and individuals that report on chemtrails that have been brought to your attention, and proclaim that they are not worthy of any serious consideration.


I think new "evidence" always worthy of reasonable examination - but most merely repeat stuff that is already discredited so are easy to dismiss quickly.

For example the various "samples" that showed high levels of aluminium, etc. had to be actually examined and investigated - and such an investigation can justify labelling them as bad science only when it actually shows that to be the case.



Is that fair?


Some of it is - but that's better than par for chemtrails.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 10:42 PM
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reply to post by weedwhacker
 


I'm sure you could throw paranoid in that posts a few more times


Still waiting for anyone to tell me how contrails could form when the conditions for contrails did not exist


And I've been checked out by my shrink - while I do have an anxiety disorder, I do not have any paranoia or paranoid delusions. Let's leave the diagnosing of ATSers with their mental health professionals.

Several of you are repeatedly suggesting anyone who believes in geoengineering is paranoid, or has a mental disorder. To me it seems a T&C violation and I will be reporting all further cases. I'm entitled to my studied, honest opinion until the change the constitution.

Calling someone insane is a very low tactic indeed.

BTW I came to after reading all the evidence on both sides after starting thinking it was a hoax. I originally invited you and phage to help me debunk a video when a friend invited me to a thread. I have read every single argument you've made and every link and video you've presented. I came to a rational decision based on evidence and arguments presented. I'm still open to reevaluation, but your side has proven the weaker in my honest opinion.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 10:42 PM
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Originally posted by firepilot

Originally posted by MathiasAndrew
Personally, I would like to continue discussing chemtrails here. You're all welcome to join.

www.abovetopsecret.com...


I think I might have a feeling what you're thinking right now........ "Oh no not another chemtrail thread."..... Right ?


And yes, par for the course. Had enough of getting it handed to you when it comes to facts and specifics, or done enough hoaxing for a while? You arent the first chemmie to then go off and start another chemtrail thread after getting rolled over. And I see this one is now about ones personal thoughts and feelings. awwwwww



No I just think that there has been plenty of discussion about all the evidence in this thread. Trying to introduce any other evidence would be in a sense re-hashing what we have already gone over. This thread is quite large and I think that maybe it's time to take a different approach at this topic. Maybe introduce some more speculative aspects of this whole subject.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 10:43 PM
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Originally posted by pianopraze
reply to post by weedwhacker
Still waiting for anyone to tell me how contrails could form when the conditions for contrails did not exist


why would anyone tell you that?



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 10:48 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

Originally posted by pianopraze
reply to post by weedwhacker
Still waiting for anyone to tell me how contrails could form when the conditions for contrails did not exist


why would anyone tell you that?



Typical procedure from the debunkers perspective. Avoid answering the valid questions that are asked of you.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 10:52 PM
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Originally posted by MathiasAndrew

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

Originally posted by pianopraze
reply to post by weedwhacker
Still waiting for anyone to tell me how contrails could form when the conditions for contrails did not exist


why would anyone tell you that?



Typical procedure from the debunkers perspective. Avoid answering the valid questions that are asked of you.


It's not avoiding anything.

It is axiomatic - contrails do nto exist where conditions do not exist for them - perhaps, if they formed and then conditions change they will disappear over some period of time.

so why bother asking a such a question in the first place??

somehow I just know there's going to be some really weird comeback here.....



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 10:56 PM
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reply to post by MathiasAndrew
 

I'm sorry to be so late. With so many threads it's hard to keep track of where I am.

I put in the comment about night time because you agreed that "chemtrailing" occurs at night but the same principle applies.

Yes, the color white indicates that reflection is occurring. At night (as well as during the day) the white underside of clouds (and contrails) reflects heat back toward the surface, preventing it from escaping into space. Models as well as real life data demonstrates this. Contrails and the cirrus clouds they turn into increase warming, they do not decrease it.

You say that you suspect that the purpose of "chemtrails" is geoengineering. If global warming is a myth, why would geoengineering be done? Are you backpedaling now? I thought "chemtrails" were seen everywhere, not just over the poles.

My question was quite specific. I asked how a reflective cloud could help with geoengineering. It was your "answer" which was vague. You gloss over the importance of radiative forcing and start babbling about "Earth's vibrations", and warming on other planets.



posted on Mar, 24 2011 @ 10:56 PM
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Originally posted by pianopraze


Still waiting for anyone to tell me how contrails could form when the conditions for contrails did not exist




This is either time #4 or #5, where I have asked to please state how it was that contrails could not have formed, and how that was scientifically determined. You keep saying over and over they could not have formed, but you choose to not give an explanation on this.




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