Spent fuel Rod fire could be worse than Chernobyl

reply to post by Electronegativity


You are right... we are all ignorant populace... the experts have got everything under control...


from www.businessinsider.com...

7:35 ET: According to a new headline from Kyodo Wire, radiation levels jumped AFTER the latest water shot.

6:36 ET: According to NHK, via Reuters, radiation has surged again and the helicopter water spraying has come to a temporary halt.

5:57 ET: The freakout abroad continues. There are reports of South Koreans arriving in Seoul from Japan with unusually high radiation levels. And the Hong Kong government urges citizens to leave the country.

5:43 ET: Hong Kong tells its citizens to leave Tokyo as soon as possible, according to Reuters. Can we expect a similar statement from China?

5:05 ET: Japan's nuclear agency cannot confirm whether water is covering spent fuel rods at No. 4.

4:31 ET: Reuters: US urges citizens to flee Japan.

4:16 ET: According to Kyodo Wire, the government is set to hold more emergency meetings soon, followed by another Yukio Edano press conference.

4:11 ET 3/17: It's all going to come down to this plan to reconnect the plant to the power grid. That's expected "within hours."

Read more: www.businessinsider.com...

reply to post by skepticaluser


Wow, that is almost like the one Tepco released when the second explosion went off and they had to scramble to say the explosion was planned and "safe".

NHK has been a great source throughout this disaster. Here, they say that the cannon tactic did not work- the hoses were not long enough.

www3.nhk.or.jp...

And here, the helicopters missed their targets:

www3.nhk.or.jp...

There has been no news updates since they claimed to have restored power. I guess when all else fails, lie through your teeth and hope no one notices?

Oh, and I almost forgot. Radiation is being detected a fair distance away.

www3.nhk.or.jp...

Let's see what barrel of lies they crack open tomorrow.

reply to post by mike_trivisonno


I couldn't agree with you more... I'm not sure how long a set of "rods" will generate energy, but I do know that these spent rods take tens of thousands of years to become inert. The short sightedness of the human race is mind boggling. Energy for months or years is not worth thousands of years of storage or disposal. Hopefully this is a wake up call to the nuclear countries around the world. The problem is now we are addicted to this seemingly inexhaustable energy source to power our increasingly electronic world. I live about an hour south east of a nuclear plant, and guess which direction the wind usually comes from....

reply to post by skepticaluser


www.youtube.com...

Just saw this, I dont think dumping 7.5 tons of water by helicopter (on what now??? 4 separate reactors???) is going to have much, if all, of an effect.Ditto for the water cannons... sending those people to die. Just more grist for the mill. So so so sad AND preventable deaths. The water is too spread out to have a discernable effect on the heat...except for making sure more radiation is lifted up and out by the steam. Right?

Furthermore...now that they started blacking out the radiation readings, we can assume TPTB have realized the SHHTF. Didn't the U.S. send a spy plane over the site, utilizing infrared sensors, yesterday??? Where are the disclosures letting us know the temperatures inside the vessels??? Wouldn't that go a helluva long way towards determining how 'critical' the situation is becoming???

reply to post by Ciora


I don't think they have claimed to have already restored power, from all the news I've seen they are just in the process of attempting to do this.

Ok to all of you fear mongerers.

I spoke to close friends of mine who live in Tokyo. They are totally outraged by what the commercial AND alternative media is spreading. In fact they and other japanese people call it criminal!
THERE IS NO SERIOUS THREAT! Yall keep talking about disaster this and disaster that. The radiaton is NOT deadly. The fires at the plants are ALL gone!
Japan is not a 3rd world country, in fact its atleast ten years ahead of us in terms of technology. Japanese people are really calm by nature and so they are now too. There's no panic at all. The government has everything under control!! Japanese people are still shopping and living their lives. Ofcourse they feel bad for what happened but it is nothing they cant and wont overcome!

The thing yall should worry about in the USA is the fact Fema is planning an "exercise" starting 24th till 27th of march. All government officials are ordered to be there. The camps and trains are made ready. Alot of coffins are beeing brought to these camps as we speak. Now worry about what your government is doing instead of spreading bull# and believing bull# about japan!

Why are all the officials from every state at the exercise? Well maybe they planned this all along??
Maybe they go underground in one of their bunkers/underground cities? And they are now scaring the american people into buying anti radiation pills to help their grand scheme? Americans are falling for every lie they are spreading atm!! A so called radiation threat... C'mon it's not even deadly to Japanese people, why would it be to yall after 1000s of miles traveling thru the sky?? Wake up!!!

There is no cover up, japan is not going anywhere. The island will stay it wont sink, no radiation or other bull# will cause a serious problem!!

These are the words of friends who LIVE in tokyo and KNOW whats going on. Either believe me or don't. I really don't care. But stop spreading this fear around, the only thing yall is doing is making the situation even worse and helping the government you want to expose!!!!

Originally posted by Ciora
reply to post by skepticaluser

 

Wow, that is almost like the one Tepco released when the second explosion went off and they had to scramble to say the explosion was planned and "safe".

NHK has been a great source throughout this disaster. Here, they say that the cannon tactic did not work- the hoses were not long enough.

www3.nhk.or.jp...

And here, the helicopters missed their targets:

www3.nhk.or.jp...

There has been no news updates since they claimed to have restored power. I guess when all else fails, lie through your teeth and hope no one notices?

Oh, and I almost forgot. Radiation is being detected a fair distance away.

www3.nhk.or.jp...

Let's see what barrel of lies they crack open tomorrow.

They didn't claim anything they actually did restore power. No lies, no fails it worked.
The radiation your so affraid of IS NOT DEADLY. Not even to japanese people so it sure as hell wont be to you!

Seriously stop this nonsense...

Instead of hanging around on ATS believing all these claims by people who dont know anything, how about actually talk to some japanese people? They live there, they know whats going on and they will gladly tell you because they are sick of the rumors and nonsense the media is spreading! It's not hard, add a japanese person to skype or msn or aim or facebook or whatever and speak to them!

Originally posted by SecretsUnfold
Instead of hanging around on ATS believing all these claims by people who dont know anything, how about actually talk to some japanese people? They live there, they know whats going on and they will gladly tell you because they are sick of the rumors and nonsense the media is spreading! It's not hard, add a japanese person to skype or msn or aim or facebook or whatever and speak to them!

Dear SecretsUnfold,
With all due respect, I can understand your comments and tone, however neither are warranted. Talking to Japanese people is somewhat comical, in a very sad and ironic sense I will add. I am really sorry to say this, but it needs to be said, unless the people you are talking to are in the governement, or working at the nuclear plant then your information isn't worth the medium in which it came to you, because simply put the people could very well be lied to.

They live there, yes.. they know what is going on, no. They know what they are told is going on and I myself have heard accounts of Japanese people being furious that they are NOT given factual, true information. Adding Japanese people to skype or whatnot, other than to console them, is totally futile Sir.

Surely you can see that yourself, right? People = sheeple.

If countries are urging their people to leave Japan, it isn't for a laugh.. it's serious.

Edit - Furthermore, from what I have read here, noone is believing things, they are quoting and linking news agency reports.. ones which totally contradict it would seem what your Japanese friends are being told. So who's right?

Regards,
T

Originally posted by torqpoc

Originally posted by SecretsUnfold
Instead of hanging around on ATS believing all these claims by people who dont know anything, how about actually talk to some japanese people? They live there, they know whats going on and they will gladly tell you because they are sick of the rumors and nonsense the media is spreading! It's not hard, add a japanese person to skype or msn or aim or facebook or whatever and speak to them!

Dear SecretsUnfold,
With all due respect, I can understand your comments and tone, however neither are warranted. Talking to Japanese people is somewhat comical, in a very sad and ironic sense I will add. I am really sorry to say this, but it needs to be said, unless the people you are talking to are in the governement, or working at the nuclear plant then your information isn't worth the medium in which it came to you, because simply put the people could very well be lied to.

They live there, yes.. they know what is going on, no. They know what they are told is going on and I myself have heard accounts of Japanese people being furious that they are NOT given factual, true information. Adding Japanese people to skype or whatnot, other than to console them, is totally futile Sir.

Surely you can see that yourself, right? People = sheeple.

If countries are urging their people to leave Japan, it isn't for a laugh.. it's serious.

Edit - Furthermore, from what I have read here, noone is believing things, they are quoting and linking news agency reports.. ones which totally contradict it would seem what your Japanese friends are being told. So who's right?

Regards,
T

edit on 17-3-2011 by torqpoc because: (no reason given)

My "japanese" friend is married to a japanese army official for your information.
But like i said whatever. Believe all the fear mongering and buy the iodine pills
I could seriously care less. Like my parents said when i was young: "if you don't listnen find out the hard way".

I know the government is lying etc. I've been into this whole conspiracy game for more then a minute.
This doesnt mean everything thats posted on a site with ALOT of imagination is always the truth. But hey, i guess some people rather except rumors then the truth by people who actually know.

And fyi. I was saying this because most americans i see and hear talking are too busy with japan. In my opinion this is the perfect strategy to get your attention of the real thing thats happening in your back yards... FEMA.
Go look that up and see for yourself how they are using the japan situation to prepare their "nice summercamps and free transport". They even brought "some nice black plastic beds to the summercamps" Happy camping!

Good luck and the best to all of you.


p.s. Go to the FEMA site and look up their next "exercise" on the 24th of march till the 27th. Then dig a little deeper and see what i mean. I leave it at that cos to most of you "i tell only lies".

reply to post by SecretsUnfold


FEMA camps? Aren't we trying to derail this thread by actually bringing up fear mongering on a typical ats contentious topic...?

I'll help you. Can you elaborate with legitimate sources please and also explain how not debating about a global concern such as the Japan situation would help against an alleged government tactic to use their "evil" FEMA camps.

Originally posted by cosmicpixie
reply to

 

I don't think they have claimed to have already restored power, from all the news I've seen they are just in the process of attempting to do this.

I wonder how well that will work just going to plug the power in
and the DAMAGED containers with pipes blown, roofs caved in,
HIGHLY active radiation levels, sure just going to *plug it in everything be ok*..

reply to post by SecretsUnfold


"U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission Chairman Gregory Jaczko said at a congressional hearing in Washington that all the water was gone from unit No. 4's spent fuel pool. Jaczko said anyone who gets close to the plant could face potentially lethal doses of radiation.

"We believe radiation levels are extremely high," he said.

TEPCO executives said Thursday that they believed the rods in that pool were covered with water, but an official with Japan's nuclear safety agency later expressed skepticism about that and moved closer to the U.S. position.

"Considering the amount of radiation released in the area, the fuel rods are more likely to be exposed than to be covered," Yuichi Sato said."

Now, the Japanese are starting to get with the program and admit things are getting worse.

SOURCE:
www.msnbc.msn.com...


As for your FEMA "fear-mongering" you tossing around:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Funny, its almost the exact same date for the drill last year, just a different exercise. Ironically enough it was for a tsunami last year. You can check the FEMA website to see their schedule for drills. I unfortunately can't find the other threads regarding their upcoming drills (specifically the New Madrid Disaster drill) on ATS, but I know I've read them in the last month or two.

Deny ignorance, broheim, but don't support suppression of knowledge. That's point on here: discussion, investigation, dissemination. Someone 'fear mongers'- its up to the rest to shoot it down or support it with science. Digging the skepticism thought. Two sides to the same coin. =D

reply to post by

THERE IS NO SERIOUS THREAT! Yall keep talking about disaster this and disaster that. The radiaton is NOT deadly. The fires at the plants are ALL gone!

Really?? That is so good to hear!! can you please provide proof of any of this...

Because If there is no fire we need to let the Japan self defense force know so they will stop trying to figure out ways to get water on these things..

And they sure wasted alot of time putting those lead plates in those helicopters for nothing...

and we need to let all those people ..it's safe to go back to the homes they left

and we can tell those people being treated for radiation..that they must be faking it because SecretsUnfold said it's safe


That is if you can provide proof????

reply to post by SecretsUnfold


With all due respect..I see that you have been on this site for like a day....the standing rule here is ...PROOF...ya have to show some sort of proof


show me proof please...and please stay on topic...this thread is not about FEMA camps...search for pleanty of threads on that

reply to post by Electronegativity


It is frowned upon to copy and paste entire articles here at ATS and try to pass them off as your own work...

now I assume you at least read that article you posted?

§ The plant is safe now and will stay safe.

What plant are you talking about here? the one that exploded...or the one that is on fire? or the other one that exploded?

point is that article was written on like day one...things have changed alot....either way...I invite you to please show me proof that the plant is safe as of right now

Originally posted by SecretsUnfold
Ok to all of you fear mongerers.

I spoke to close friends of mine who live in Tokyo. They are totally outraged by what the commercial AND alternative media is spreading. In fact they and other japanese people call it criminal!
THERE IS NO SERIOUS THREAT! Yall keep talking about disaster this and disaster that. The radiaton is NOT deadly. The fires at the plants are ALL gone!

^^^^^^ OHHHHH REALLY!?!?!?!

"In one instance, radiation was detected in a plane’s air filtration system. Radiation was also found in luggage on flights from Japan.

Homeland Security officials would not comment specifically on the radiation at O’Hare. But Customs and Border Protection officials said they are monitoring radiation levels on flights and passengers coming from Japan.

“U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) is monitoring developments in Japan carefully and is specifically assessing the potential for radiological contamination associated with the ongoing impact of the earthquake and tsunami to Japan’s nuclear facilities,” CBP spokeswoman Cherise Miles said in an e-mail.

Customs officials said that no aircraft entering the U.S. has tested positive for harmful levels of radiation. Travelers who show signs of radiation sickness are being referred to health authorities for proper treatment."

SOURCE: chicago.cbslocal.com...

Soooo. explain to me if its "no problem", why are people coming back on flights from Tokyo "showing signs of radiation sickness and being referred to health authorities for proper treatment". How's that for some "PROOF" things aren't so rosey and non-sickening???

reply to post by crazyray


Could not have said it better myself...
Actually I was kinda shocked the thread went as long as it did without the trolls showing up



So now that they have figured out the water dumping isn't going to help..what do you think the next step they will take is?

As a physicist who rarely comments on this site I would like to say that you are having all reasons to be scared.

Links to get real information and qualified comments:

simulation of the distribution of radioactive isotopes according to current wind conditions:
www.zamg.ac.at...:50

japanese radiation detection network:
www.bousai.ne.jp...

reports officially created for the german government, updates twice daily:
www.grs.de...

blog of people who know their stuff and who are scared:
armscontrolwonk.com...

Here you can see by yourself, that the spent fuel pools are exposed to the outside and that are at the place which exploded beforehand. You can also see a strange glow in photo 2 and 3, the source of it - radiation or something green around there - I am unsure. If it is glow from radiation the radiation must be really strong. In fact there is a paper with a simulation of the gamma radiation emitted by an empty pool around. I will try to find it for you.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/0ff07f872834.jpg[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/4756e0761880.jpg[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/2a3bec6238fe.jpg[/atsimg]

"Reducing the Hazards from Stored Spent Power-Reactor Fuel in the United States" by Alvarez et al.
Paper talking about the dangers of accidents in spent fuel pools with a radiation simulation on page 14:
www.irss-usa.org...

So now that they have figured out the water dumping isn't going to help..what do you think the next step they will take is?

Maybe LISTEN to THIS guy: Michio Kaku

"Though the two helicopters dropped about 30 tons of water on the plant overnight, Michio Kaku, a theoretical physicist, told ABC that the attempts to keep the plants cool were not only foiled, but also minimally effective.

"It's like a squirt gun, using a squirt gun against a raging forest fire. They're overwhelmed, they're floundering, they don't know what to do," Kaku said."
Source: www.nationaljournal.com...

I saw video of him yesterday basically saying the same thing and that there should be a shift in priorities from using water to the "Chernobyl Solution"...start dropping sand, boron, concrete, etc. immediately. I wonder though, maybe they cant due to the heat?!?! Would the concrete melt??? Either way, it's clear the "put water on it" line of thinking isnt working. Period. End of story. Its exacerbating the release of radiation into the atmosphere and surrounding environment. Time to switch tactics and start containment....

"*-*-*-WARNING*-*-*- PUTTING ON TINFOIL HAT"

...unless TPTB are hoping to use this catastrophe as a means for a major cull to help them in their plan to lower population levels. Kill us immediately, kill us slowly over the years,kill our future kids with birth defects. Not too sure on the conspiracy angle with all this yet...

I have heard so many theories to how this is all going to play out now. I dont think anyone knows for sure. There has not been an accident like it. With these kinds of plants there are too many variables to compair their accidents. We are just going to have to wait and see. I just hope that if this or anything else effects the USA or any other country, that we can all show as much grace and civility as the Japanese have. I am in awe of how Japan is handling this. No looters, no riots, murders, or crime. Just people coming together to help each other and patiently waiting for what they need. Radioactive or not, sounds like a wonderful place to live.