Nice thread, it's some very useful info considering the times. We're about to find out first hand what "worse than chernobyl" is like. Good luck
to all of you, S&F.
Radiation: How it Works and What it Does, page 1
Topic started on 15-3-2011 @ 03:44 AM by nithaiah
Exposure to even minuscule amounts of radiation is enough to spark deep, gut fear in most people in the modern world. Our fear of radiation is not
unfounded. In the wrong doses, it does heinous things to people. We have seen this in the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, in various nuclear
accidents, in the Chernobyl disaster, and in the effects on the natives of Rongelap and their descendants.
This has been embedded in our subconscious over the last century, and for good reason... It makes us take precautions which typically allow us to play with god's building blocks and not fatally irradiate ourselves. That instinct is also a contributing factor to our lack of a nuclear holocaust, despite having the required number of weapons and vicious primate urges to create one. However, as evidenced in the previous days with the Fukushima nuclear accident, sometimes the worst does happen, and all of our well engineered precautions fail.
After that point, most people are still in the dark about what radiation is, how it damages tissue, and how to avoid or mitigate exposure.
Defining Radiation
To quote the dictionary, radiation in the broadest sense is "the process in which energy is emitted as particles or waves." That's pretty simple. Turn on a lightbulb to witness a form of radiation, if you'd like.
Further, radiation comes in two flavors: ionizing, and non-ionizing. Ionizing radiation is radiation which is powerful enough to rip electrons off of atoms. This is the bad and dangerous kind of radiation, and it can destroy body tissues on a microscopic level. When most people say radiation, this is the kind they're talking about. For the rest of this post, you can assume that I'm of the same mind.
Non-ionizing radiation is typically less dangerous. I say typically, because major contenders in the non-ionizing radiation class are sunlight and radio waves, both of which are (mostly) our friends. It will not be dealt with here.
Ionizing Radiation
Ionization occurs when radiation rips off an electron from an atom.
Ionizing radiation comes in several further flavors. The ones of concern in the context of this post are alpha, beta, gamma, and neutron radiation.
Alpha and beta radiation are similar in that they are a byproduct of radioactive decay in which high energy, short-ranged (milimeters or less) particles are emitted. Alpha decay releases alpha particles, which are identical to helium nuclei. Beta decay releases electrons and certain antimatter particles. Alpha radiation is less dangerous than beta radiation, as an external source does not penetrate the skin. An external source of beta radiation can cause burns if it makes contact with skin. Both can be harmful or fatal if the sources of radiation are in some way ingested, as the radioactive material can become concentrated in the tissues of vital organs.
Gamma radiation is different from Alpha and beta radiation in that it is not a particle per se, but a wave frequency in the electromagnetic spectrum, similar to x-rays. In nuclear bombings and accidents, gamma radiation is released after radioactive materials have undergone alpha or beta decay. High energy gamma radiation is more penetrating than alpha and beta radiation, which means that the whole body and its tissues can be irradiated by an external source.
High energy neutrons can make other matter into sources of radiation via a process called neutron activation, which can turn otherwise well-intentioned matter into unstable, radioactive matter. They also have the ability to ionize atoms. Neutron radiation is more penetrating than alpha and beta radiation. It is sometimes more penetrating than gamma radiation as well.
How Radiation Harms
Radiation does damage to tissue by ionizing some of the atoms in the tissue cells' molecular structures. It is kind of like the cell is being shot up with an atomic machine gun with radiation bullets. As the energetic particles and rays bombard a cell, bonds in the cell's molecular structures are ripped apart and the molecules come unglued; molecule mangling free radicals can also be produced by ionization of water molecules in cells with the same result.
Many structures in the cell can be repaired, even if damaged by radiation. However, some damage done to the cell's vital structures (including DNA) cannot be repaired or there is too much damage, and this is where the problems start.
When damage occurs to a part of the cell, the cell either repairs the damage to the best of its ability, or it dies. If the cell survives to divide again, incorrectly repaired DNA can lead to cancers and abnormal tissue growths in the irradiated organism, or deformities in the organism's offspring. Most of the time, the cell can successfully repair radiation damage without mutations. This is the common effect of low occupational and environmental doses.
Due to a process called apoptosis, highly damaged cells essentially self-destruct. Apoptosis is activated by damage to DNA and certain other cellular structures. This is of particular concern in tissues which require rapid cell division and production to maintain functionality, such as the bone marrow. This is the type of cell damage that leads to acute radiation sickness and often death after exposure to high doses of radiation. On the other side of the coin, it is this very process by which many cancers are destroyed using radiation therapy.
Modes of Exposure, Measurements, and Harmful Levels
Radiation exposure can occur from an external source, such as unshielded nuclear fuel or the radioactive isotipes found in fallout. External sources become internal sources of radiation if the unshielded source is somehow ingested. Internal exposure to radiation is more dangerous than external exposure.
Radiation is measured in a few different ways, each measure quantifying a different attribute of the radiation. The grays & rads and sieverts and rems are of primary focus in this post, as they are the measurements used when referring to how much radiation a person is getting.
Grays and rads measure the amount of energy absorbed by matter from radiation (absorbed dose). Sieverts and rems quantify the amount of damage done by the absorbed dose of different types of radiation (equivalent dose).
1 gray of radiation is equivalent to 100 rads. 1 sievert is equivalent to 100 rems.
The sievert is arrived at by multiplying the absorbed dose in grays by two different weighting factors. The first is the weighting factor that deals with the type of radiation. The other is the weighting factor that deals with the part of the body exposed to radiation.
weighting factors for converting grays to sieverts
Rem stands for roentgen equivalent in man. The rem is arrived at by multiplying the absorbed dose in rads by one weighting factor which deals with the type of radiation.
weighting factors for converting rads to rems
The following outlines various doses of radiation and their effects on a person if the person recieves a full body dose:
<1 Sievert
Changes in blood count can be measured, but the person will experience no appreciable symptoms. However, genetic mutations can occur even at low levels of radiation.
1-2 Sieverts
Less than half of exposed people experience a few symptoms of acute radiaton syndrome (ARS) at this dose, including nausea, vomiting, and headache, beginning 2-6 hours after exposure and lasting less than a day.
There is a latent period of about 1 month, after which afflicted people will experienced mild reduced white cell count, fatigue, and weakness.
Fewer than 5% of people exposed to 1-2 Sv will die with or without medical care, and those who do will perish after 6-8 weeks.
2-6 Sieverts
At least half of people exposed to this dose experience ARS, beginning 1 to 2 hours after exposure and lasting 1 to 2 days. Some experience mild diarrhea after 3-8 hours, moderate headache after 4 hours to a day, fever after 1 hour, and cognitive impairment for less than 20 hours.
After a latent period lasting 1-4 weeks, the exposed person experiences moderate to severely reduced white cell count, hemorrhaging, and infections.
Of individuals exposed to this level of radiation, at least 5%, and up to 50% even with medical care, will die after 4-6 weeks.
6-8 Sieverts
Almost all people exposed to this level of radiation will experience ARS. Nausea and vomiting begin after 10 minutes to an hour, and severe diarrhea, headache, fever, and cognitive impairment begin after less than four hours. The acute stage of radiation poisoning from this dose lasts less than two days.
After a latent period of less than a week, people exposed to a dose of 6-8 Sieverts will experience: severely reduced white cell count, high fevers, dizziness, vomiting and diarrhea, extreme low blood pressure, and death of 50-100% of individuals after 2-4 weeks from dehydration, starvation, and infection.
8-30 Sieverts
All people exposed to this dose will experience severe, fatal symptoms of ARS beginning minutes to less than 2 hours after exposure. There is no latent period, and death occurs 2-14 days after exposure.
30+ Sieverts
All people exposed to this dose will experience extreme, fatal symptoms of ARS, including seizures, heavy diarrhea, and incapacitation, beginning minutes after exposure, with no latent period and death in less than 48 hours.
It is possible using the above information to keep tabs on the safety of current radiation levels from the Fukushima accident.
How to Not Die
The best way to escape the harmful effects of radiation is to get far away from the source as quickly as possible. In some theoretical cases, this is impossible, such as a full-on nuclear war. In general, evacuation from an area is the only action most people may need to take. Areas where radiation levels remain high after an incident may be uninhabitable for many generations.
A fair representation of the haps
Another precaution for persons exposed to radiation is to take potassium iodide tablets, which will saturate the thyroid with safe, stable iodine and prevent thyroid accumulation of radioactive iodine-131 released in nuclear incidents.
In many cases, wearing protective clothing in an area saturated with radioactive fallout particles can significantly reduce the dose to an exposed person. Wearing dust masks can prevent inhalation of all but the smallest radioactive fallout particles.
Avoiding food or water which has even a chance of radioactive contamination can further prevent ingestion of hot particles. Radioactive caesium and strontium isotopes in cows' milk is an example.
More in-depth advice on how to survive ridiculous amounts of radiation and fallout can be found in Cresson H. Kearney's Nuclear War Survival Skills. Though written with nuclear war in mind, the same principles apply to surviving other nuclear incidents.
The Conclusion and Internet Sources
Radiation is complex and sometimes deadly. Its effects on humans and other living things are not yet fully understood even today. What we do know of it paints a picture of something incredible in some contexts and horrendous in others.
Understanding the basics of how radiation works can be helpful in deciding which precautions to take in a survival situation, and I hope some of that understanding was achieved with this post.
Online info sources:
Britannica Online on radiation effects on cells
Jefferson Labs on radiation effects on cells
Radiation effects on cells
More radiation effects on cells
ICRP recommendations for weighting factors in conversion from gray to sievert
Biological Effects of Radiation by the Nuclear Regulatory Commission
Results of exposure in rads
Nuclear War Survival Skills
Wikipedia info sources: (for what it's worth...)
Ionizing radiation
Sievert
Roentgen equivalent in man
Relative biological effectiveness (weighting factors)
This has been embedded in our subconscious over the last century, and for good reason... It makes us take precautions which typically allow us to play with god's building blocks and not fatally irradiate ourselves. That instinct is also a contributing factor to our lack of a nuclear holocaust, despite having the required number of weapons and vicious primate urges to create one. However, as evidenced in the previous days with the Fukushima nuclear accident, sometimes the worst does happen, and all of our well engineered precautions fail.
After that point, most people are still in the dark about what radiation is, how it damages tissue, and how to avoid or mitigate exposure.
Defining Radiation
To quote the dictionary, radiation in the broadest sense is "the process in which energy is emitted as particles or waves." That's pretty simple. Turn on a lightbulb to witness a form of radiation, if you'd like.
Further, radiation comes in two flavors: ionizing, and non-ionizing. Ionizing radiation is radiation which is powerful enough to rip electrons off of atoms. This is the bad and dangerous kind of radiation, and it can destroy body tissues on a microscopic level. When most people say radiation, this is the kind they're talking about. For the rest of this post, you can assume that I'm of the same mind.
Non-ionizing radiation is typically less dangerous. I say typically, because major contenders in the non-ionizing radiation class are sunlight and radio waves, both of which are (mostly) our friends. It will not be dealt with here.
Ionizing Radiation
Ionization occurs when radiation rips off an electron from an atom.
Ionizing radiation comes in several further flavors. The ones of concern in the context of this post are alpha, beta, gamma, and neutron radiation.
Alpha and beta radiation are similar in that they are a byproduct of radioactive decay in which high energy, short-ranged (milimeters or less) particles are emitted. Alpha decay releases alpha particles, which are identical to helium nuclei. Beta decay releases electrons and certain antimatter particles. Alpha radiation is less dangerous than beta radiation, as an external source does not penetrate the skin. An external source of beta radiation can cause burns if it makes contact with skin. Both can be harmful or fatal if the sources of radiation are in some way ingested, as the radioactive material can become concentrated in the tissues of vital organs.
Gamma radiation is different from Alpha and beta radiation in that it is not a particle per se, but a wave frequency in the electromagnetic spectrum, similar to x-rays. In nuclear bombings and accidents, gamma radiation is released after radioactive materials have undergone alpha or beta decay. High energy gamma radiation is more penetrating than alpha and beta radiation, which means that the whole body and its tissues can be irradiated by an external source.
High energy neutrons can make other matter into sources of radiation via a process called neutron activation, which can turn otherwise well-intentioned matter into unstable, radioactive matter. They also have the ability to ionize atoms. Neutron radiation is more penetrating than alpha and beta radiation. It is sometimes more penetrating than gamma radiation as well.
How Radiation Harms
Radiation does damage to tissue by ionizing some of the atoms in the tissue cells' molecular structures. It is kind of like the cell is being shot up with an atomic machine gun with radiation bullets. As the energetic particles and rays bombard a cell, bonds in the cell's molecular structures are ripped apart and the molecules come unglued; molecule mangling free radicals can also be produced by ionization of water molecules in cells with the same result.
Many structures in the cell can be repaired, even if damaged by radiation. However, some damage done to the cell's vital structures (including DNA) cannot be repaired or there is too much damage, and this is where the problems start.
When damage occurs to a part of the cell, the cell either repairs the damage to the best of its ability, or it dies. If the cell survives to divide again, incorrectly repaired DNA can lead to cancers and abnormal tissue growths in the irradiated organism, or deformities in the organism's offspring. Most of the time, the cell can successfully repair radiation damage without mutations. This is the common effect of low occupational and environmental doses.
Due to a process called apoptosis, highly damaged cells essentially self-destruct. Apoptosis is activated by damage to DNA and certain other cellular structures. This is of particular concern in tissues which require rapid cell division and production to maintain functionality, such as the bone marrow. This is the type of cell damage that leads to acute radiation sickness and often death after exposure to high doses of radiation. On the other side of the coin, it is this very process by which many cancers are destroyed using radiation therapy.
Modes of Exposure, Measurements, and Harmful Levels
Radiation exposure can occur from an external source, such as unshielded nuclear fuel or the radioactive isotipes found in fallout. External sources become internal sources of radiation if the unshielded source is somehow ingested. Internal exposure to radiation is more dangerous than external exposure.
Radiation is measured in a few different ways, each measure quantifying a different attribute of the radiation. The grays & rads and sieverts and rems are of primary focus in this post, as they are the measurements used when referring to how much radiation a person is getting.
Grays and rads measure the amount of energy absorbed by matter from radiation (absorbed dose). Sieverts and rems quantify the amount of damage done by the absorbed dose of different types of radiation (equivalent dose).
1 gray of radiation is equivalent to 100 rads. 1 sievert is equivalent to 100 rems.
The sievert is arrived at by multiplying the absorbed dose in grays by two different weighting factors. The first is the weighting factor that deals with the type of radiation. The other is the weighting factor that deals with the part of the body exposed to radiation.
weighting factors for converting grays to sieverts
Rem stands for roentgen equivalent in man. The rem is arrived at by multiplying the absorbed dose in rads by one weighting factor which deals with the type of radiation.
weighting factors for converting rads to rems
The following outlines various doses of radiation and their effects on a person if the person recieves a full body dose:
<1 Sievert
Changes in blood count can be measured, but the person will experience no appreciable symptoms. However, genetic mutations can occur even at low levels of radiation.
1-2 Sieverts
Less than half of exposed people experience a few symptoms of acute radiaton syndrome (ARS) at this dose, including nausea, vomiting, and headache, beginning 2-6 hours after exposure and lasting less than a day.
There is a latent period of about 1 month, after which afflicted people will experienced mild reduced white cell count, fatigue, and weakness.
Fewer than 5% of people exposed to 1-2 Sv will die with or without medical care, and those who do will perish after 6-8 weeks.
2-6 Sieverts
At least half of people exposed to this dose experience ARS, beginning 1 to 2 hours after exposure and lasting 1 to 2 days. Some experience mild diarrhea after 3-8 hours, moderate headache after 4 hours to a day, fever after 1 hour, and cognitive impairment for less than 20 hours.
After a latent period lasting 1-4 weeks, the exposed person experiences moderate to severely reduced white cell count, hemorrhaging, and infections.
Of individuals exposed to this level of radiation, at least 5%, and up to 50% even with medical care, will die after 4-6 weeks.
6-8 Sieverts
Almost all people exposed to this level of radiation will experience ARS. Nausea and vomiting begin after 10 minutes to an hour, and severe diarrhea, headache, fever, and cognitive impairment begin after less than four hours. The acute stage of radiation poisoning from this dose lasts less than two days.
After a latent period of less than a week, people exposed to a dose of 6-8 Sieverts will experience: severely reduced white cell count, high fevers, dizziness, vomiting and diarrhea, extreme low blood pressure, and death of 50-100% of individuals after 2-4 weeks from dehydration, starvation, and infection.
8-30 Sieverts
All people exposed to this dose will experience severe, fatal symptoms of ARS beginning minutes to less than 2 hours after exposure. There is no latent period, and death occurs 2-14 days after exposure.
30+ Sieverts
All people exposed to this dose will experience extreme, fatal symptoms of ARS, including seizures, heavy diarrhea, and incapacitation, beginning minutes after exposure, with no latent period and death in less than 48 hours.
It is possible using the above information to keep tabs on the safety of current radiation levels from the Fukushima accident.
How to Not Die
The best way to escape the harmful effects of radiation is to get far away from the source as quickly as possible. In some theoretical cases, this is impossible, such as a full-on nuclear war. In general, evacuation from an area is the only action most people may need to take. Areas where radiation levels remain high after an incident may be uninhabitable for many generations.
A fair representation of the haps
Another precaution for persons exposed to radiation is to take potassium iodide tablets, which will saturate the thyroid with safe, stable iodine and prevent thyroid accumulation of radioactive iodine-131 released in nuclear incidents.
In many cases, wearing protective clothing in an area saturated with radioactive fallout particles can significantly reduce the dose to an exposed person. Wearing dust masks can prevent inhalation of all but the smallest radioactive fallout particles.
Avoiding food or water which has even a chance of radioactive contamination can further prevent ingestion of hot particles. Radioactive caesium and strontium isotopes in cows' milk is an example.
More in-depth advice on how to survive ridiculous amounts of radiation and fallout can be found in Cresson H. Kearney's Nuclear War Survival Skills. Though written with nuclear war in mind, the same principles apply to surviving other nuclear incidents.
The Conclusion and Internet Sources
Radiation is complex and sometimes deadly. Its effects on humans and other living things are not yet fully understood even today. What we do know of it paints a picture of something incredible in some contexts and horrendous in others.
Understanding the basics of how radiation works can be helpful in deciding which precautions to take in a survival situation, and I hope some of that understanding was achieved with this post.
Online info sources:
Britannica Online on radiation effects on cells
Jefferson Labs on radiation effects on cells
Radiation effects on cells
More radiation effects on cells
ICRP recommendations for weighting factors in conversion from gray to sievert
Biological Effects of Radiation by the Nuclear Regulatory Commission
Results of exposure in rads
Nuclear War Survival Skills
Wikipedia info sources: (for what it's worth...)
Ionizing radiation
Sievert
Roentgen equivalent in man
Relative biological effectiveness (weighting factors)
reply posted on 15-3-2011 @ 08:58 AM by OuttaHere
Also useful to know would be how to interpret various readings. For example, we are getting reports from Japan referring to radiation levels in units
called mSv (millisieverts). According to the following radiation detection equipment web site, SE
International, mSv is a measurement of gamma and x-ray radiation, usually reported as mSv/hr (per hour). - Whereas the readings available at
Radiation Network and at the
Tokyo gieger counter site are in CPM (counts per minute), which is a measurement of apha
and beta radiation. The two units of measurement are not interchangeable and they measure different things.
[edit] When I posted this, the radiation network (US radiation map) was still up and running. As of this moment, however, I am getting a 404 message for the entire domain. Now, this could simply mean that their servers were overwhelmed by traffic and crashed the site (which is a distinct possibility, given the circumstances). However, it could also mean that TPTB don't want us to know the radiation readings on the west coast, as reported by ordinary citizens with geiger counters. Make of it what you will.
[edit] When I posted this, the radiation network (US radiation map) was still up and running. As of this moment, however, I am getting a 404 message for the entire domain. Now, this could simply mean that their servers were overwhelmed by traffic and crashed the site (which is a distinct possibility, given the circumstances). However, it could also mean that TPTB don't want us to know the radiation readings on the west coast, as reported by ordinary citizens with geiger counters. Make of it what you will.
edit on 15-3-2011 by OuttaHere because: new information
reply posted on 15-3-2011 @ 10:59 AM by Arbitrageur
Originally posted by OuttaHereI get a 404 for the link you posted, but not for the domain, this link works: www.radiationnetwork.com...
[edit] When I posted this, the radiation network (US radiation map) was still up and running. As of this moment, however, I am getting a 404 message for the entire domain.
To the OP, good explanation. I used to be licensed to handle radioactive materials and it's pretty close to what I remember from my training.
I would add we are all exposed to ionizing radiation every day from miscellaneous sources. One big source that affects some people more than others is radon gas, but many soils are naturally radioactive and many people don't know this. Flying is another source, and since pilots do that for a living, they get a fair dose of radiation.
So if you get a little bit of radiation from a reactor drifting your way, one question to ask is, how does it compare to background radiation sources you already are exposed to every day. In the case of Three mile island, the exposure levels weren't significantly above background levels and routine activities like flying. The Japan incident has yet to play out fully so we'll have to keep monitoring what's released.
reply posted on 15-3-2011 @ 02:01 PM by nithaiah
Originally posted by OuttaHere
Also useful to know would be how to interpret various readings. For example, we are getting reports from Japan referring to radiation levels in units called mSv (millisieverts). According to the following radiation detection equipment web site, SE International, mSv is a measurement of gamma and x-ray radiation, usually reported as mSv/hr (per hour). - Whereas the readings available at Radiation Network and at the Tokyo gieger counter site are in CPM (counts per minute), which is a measurement of apha and beta radiation. The two units of measurement are not interchangeable and they measure different things.
[edit] When I posted this, the radiation network (US radiation map) was still up and running. As of this moment, however, I am getting a 404 message for the entire domain. Now, this could simply mean that their servers were overwhelmed by traffic and crashed the site (which is a distinct possibility, given the circumstances). However, it could also mean that TPTB don't want us to know the radiation readings on the west coast, as reported by ordinary citizens with geiger counters. Make of it what you will.
edit on 15-3-2011 by OuttaHere because: new information
Millisieverts are simply a derivative of the sievert. To figure out what the measurement is in sieverts, move the decimal point left three places. Sieverts can measure gamma and x-rays, and without a weighting factor in the gray to sievert conversion, I believe gamma is the basic measure. Other types of radiation can also be measured in sieverts.
The most useful thing I can contribute regarding counts per minute is that anything over 100 seems to indicate something beyond background radiation, although higher readings are typical at high altitude, over 300 cpm, such as during a typical airplane trip.
EDIT: I found this in a different thread. It seems to indicate that 1 cpm=.01 microsieverts/hour, though I am not sure that is correct, given that different detectors have different sensitivities as to how many of the actual decays per minute they will count from a radiation source.
edit on 15-3-2011 by nithaiah because: (no reason given)
reply posted on 15-3-2011 @ 10:37 PM by Druid42
The Tokyo site was reporting 16.64 CPM. I did the math, doesn't SEEM harmful. But what about continuous exposure?
Japan UPDATE?
Yeah, no info at all.
Japan UPDATE?
Yeah, no info at all.
edit on 3/15/11 by Druid42 because: added link and comment
reply posted on 18-3-2011 @ 12:00 PM by redgreen
reply to post by nithaiah
Here's an important article. Alex Jones of infowars fame says if you read this you will be the knowledgeble person in the county.
www.bestmetalresearch.com...
Here's an important article. Alex Jones of infowars fame says if you read this you will be the knowledgeble person in the county.
www.bestmetalresearch.com...
reply posted on 18-3-2011 @ 08:48 PM by Arbitrageur
Originally posted by redgreenI'm not getting the illustrations at that link.
reply to post by nithaiah
Here's an important article. Alex Jones of infowars fame says if you read this you will be the knowledgeble person in the county.
www.bestmetalresearch.com...
I found another link with the same article plus the illustrations:
www.ki4u.com...
The illustrations are the best part, some of those I hadn't seen before. But I was pretty familiar with the rest of it already.
89-Year-Old Man Develops Bladeless Bird-Friendly Wind Turbine
Posted 11 days ago with 45 member flags
Posted 11 days ago with 45 member flags
High speed video reveals the bizarre physics of an ordinary water droplet
Posted 4 days ago with 32 member flags
Posted 4 days ago with 32 member flags
Does this video show a working self propelled magnetic engine?
Posted 7 days ago with 31 member flags
Posted 7 days ago with 31 member flags
Newest topics, updated in real-time:
Newest topics getting flags, in real-time:
AFTER MIDNIGHT: 107: Ridin' Into Town... *** Thanks For Tuning In !!! ***
ATS Live: 11 hours ago, 15 flags
ATS Live: 11 hours ago, 15 flags
Revealed: Obama Donor Sat in on IG Interviews with IRS Employees
Breaking Political News: 13 hours ago, 14 flags
Breaking Political News: 13 hours ago, 14 flags
Newest topics getting replies, in real-time:
Have anyone on ATS actually seen Obama in Reallife, have any ?
Ludicrous Online Lies: 16 hours ago, 42 replies
Ludicrous Online Lies: 16 hours ago, 42 replies
The Above Top Secret Web sites are a
wholly owned social content community of
The Above Network, LLC.
This content community relies on
user-generated content from our member contributors.
The opinions of our members are not those of site ownership
who maintains strict editorial agnosticism and simply provides
a collaborative venue for free expression.
ATS Server: www2.theabovenetwork.com
Header data: 0.002 seconds
Page processed in: 0.330 seconds
wholly owned social content community of
The Above Network, LLC.
This content community relies on
user-generated content from our member contributors.
The opinions of our members are not those of site ownership
who maintains strict editorial agnosticism and simply provides
a collaborative venue for free expression.
ATS Server: www2.theabovenetwork.com
Header data: 0.002 seconds
Page processed in: 0.330 seconds
