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Contradictions in the bible

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posted on May, 21 2011 @ 08:49 AM
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reply to post by Sigismundus
 


Sigismundus,

Don't worry, no bubbles bursting on this end. In fact, just the opposite. Your words, written or spoken, eventually reveal what is in your heart, as do everybody's. The more words you write on this subject, the more you prove that what the Apostle Paul said is true.

1 Corinthians 2:14 THOSE WHO ARE UNSPIRITUAL DO NOT RECEIVE THE GIFTS OF GOD'S SPIRIT, FOR THEY ARE FOOLISHNESS TO THEM, AND THEY ARE UNABLE TO UNDERSTAND THEM BECAUSE THEY ARE SPIRTUALLY DISCERNED.




posted on May, 21 2011 @ 09:16 AM
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Originally posted by Auggie
reply to post by Sigismundus
 


Sigismundus,

Don't worry, no bubbles bursting on this end. In fact, just the opposite. Your words, written or spoken, eventually reveal what is in your heart, as do everybody's. The more words you write on this subject, the more you prove that what the Apostle Paul said is true.

1 Corinthians 2:14 THOSE WHO ARE UNSPIRITUAL DO NOT RECEIVE THE GIFTS OF GOD'S SPIRIT, FOR THEY ARE FOOLISHNESS TO THEM, AND THEY ARE UNABLE TO UNDERSTAND THEM BECAUSE THEY ARE SPIRTUALLY DISCERNED.


Are you really serious?

When REAL FACTS speak - - - go to the "you lack faith and belief".

My husband's Mormon grandmother does this all the time. It is so annoying. When she can't answer a question she always responds: "because God says so".



posted on May, 25 2011 @ 09:29 AM
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reply to post by Annee
 


Yes, I am really serious. Without the Spirit of God abiding in you, the Bible will always seem to have contradictions, because we must have the Spirit of God to hopefully understand the Word of Truth.

Romans 8:5 For if men are controlled by their earthly natures, they give their minds to earthly things. If they are controlled by their spiritual natures, they give their minds to spiritual things. 6 Because for the mind to be given up to earthly things means death; but for it to be given up to spiritual things means Life and peace. 7 Abandonment to earthly things is a state of enmity to God. Such a mind does not submit to God's Law, and indeed cannot do so. 8 And those whose hearts are absorbed in earthly things cannot please God. 9 You, however, are not devoted to earthly, but to spiritual things, if the Spirit of God is really dwelling in you; whereas if any man has not the Spirit of Christ, such a one does not belong to Him. 10 But if Christ is in you, though your body must die because of sin, yet your spirit has Life because of righteousness. 11 And if the Spirit of Him who raised up Jesus from the dead is dwelling in you, He who raised up Christ from the dead will give Life also to your mortal bodies because of His Spirit who dwells in you. 12 Therefore, brethren, it is not to our lower natures that we are under obligation that we should live by their rule. 13 For if you so live, death is near; but if, through being under the sway of the spirit, you are putting your old bodily habits to death, you will live. 14 For those who are led by God's Spirit are, all of them, God's sons.



posted on May, 25 2011 @ 08:41 PM
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Hello all I'm new to these forums.

I find this discussion interesting because I am an ex christian. I'm just now coming out of the Christian faith and finding out facts that have been out there that nobody ever told me. And I'm thinking it's just because Christianity as well as exclusive religions in and of themselves are just really good at keeping any extraneous ideas from being looked at logically and with an open mind. I'm not saying all religions are like that, but for the past 20 years (basically my whole life) if I hadn't studied and researched I was effectively kept under the veil of Christian doctrine. I'm not angry at religion, I'm just angry at how it is used to keep things from people.


As for the point of this thread, I'm finding some interesting things out about Biblical contradictions. The comment about where people went before the Bible (was it Hell or Heaven?) is something that kept me wondering throughout my christian years. The reply I usually got was the people god saw as righteous went to a place between heaven and hell. I accepted this--partially, but then I read that in the OT Hell is basically the grave. Only Sheol. Only in the NT does it start making references like in Luke 13:28.

So basically every person on the face of the earth before Jesus came to save the world or the "elect" (Calvinistic doctrine sucks), just went to Hell. Had no chance to be saved by a loving god.



posted on May, 26 2011 @ 01:30 AM
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Originally posted by gypstar


As for the point of this thread, I'm finding some interesting things out about Biblical contradictions. The comment about where people went before the Bible (was it Hell or Heaven?) is something that kept me wondering throughout my christian years. The reply I usually got was the people god saw as righteous went to a place between heaven and hell. I accepted this--partially, but then I read that in the OT Hell is basically the grave. Only Sheol. Only in the NT does it start making references like in Luke 13:28.

So basically every person on the face of the earth before Jesus came to save the world or the "elect" (Calvinistic doctrine sucks), just went to Hell. Had no chance to be saved by a loving god.

No, it's not Hell at all!
Of course Calvinistic doctrine sucks, but it has little or no Scriptural support.
IMO it works like this: God is outside Time, and to God all times are eternally present. After Jesus' sacrifice, his work could be (and was) applied backwards in time as well as forwards. I am a Christian Universalist, we believe that all people will eventually be with God (the only thing stopping them being their own desires, so atheists needn't worry, they won't be with God unless/until they want to be.)
Sheol/The Grave = Hell. Same thing. Look on it as simply a place to be, not Hell or purgatory, at least not yet. People end up where they are supposed to be, and IMO, your assumption that everyone who lived before the Bible went to hell, is just plain wrong.
Vicky



posted on May, 26 2011 @ 07:05 AM
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reply to post by gypstar
 

When you say.....I'm just now coming out of the Christian faith....what do you mean by that?



posted on May, 26 2011 @ 02:33 PM
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I was talking about the pool of thought about hell being a place of rampant torture and burning for eternity as taught by mainstream christianity. I myself don't believe in hell anymore. I USED TO BELIEVE that everyone before the NT went to Hell. I DONT anymore. That was the assumption people made or the reply they gave me for my simple question "Where did people go before Jesus offered salvation." Now I don't believe in any of it.

Also I recently recanted my Christian faith (telling people I'm not a Christian, and leaving its precepts altogether).

I am not a Christian anymore.



posted on May, 27 2011 @ 07:42 AM
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reply to post by gypstar
 


I'm sorry you feel that way, but I can understand why. It can be very confusing out there. May I ask what caused you to want to become a Christian? From what you have said so far, it seems your main concern was if there was a literal hell we would go to if we were not saved. It sounds as though you have convinced yourself that there is no hell and now the pressure is off, so you don't have to be a Christian anymore. Is that correct, or were there other reasons?

Are you by chance confusing religion with Christianity? Christianity stands alone, there is nothing else like it. Religion is what you see on just about every street corner. Religion always has memberships, do's and dont's, methods and ways of pleasing and approaching God. Religion may talk about Jesus Christ, and people tend to think because they talk about Christ, they must be Christians. Not necessarily so. Christianity is Jesus Christ.

Was your faith based on what the New Testament teaches about Jesus Christ....or was it based on what religion says about Jesus Christ?



posted on May, 27 2011 @ 03:38 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on May, 29 2011 @ 04:06 PM
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Originally posted by XxRagingxPandaxX
reply to post by Danbones
 
Dan, I like you and I think your a nice guy but you are so wrong. If something is right there is no reason to lie about it. Religion causes mass delusion and mass delusion is never good. I don't think religion creates morales I think it destroys them. Why? Because almost every war that has ever been fought has religion involved. since when do you need a celestial north Korea? I think you should do the right thing because it's the right thing, not because some cosmic zombie up in the sky who's his own father, who doesn't even exist tells you so.




edit on 14-3-2011 by XxRagingxPandaxX because: (no reason given)


What about the Bolshevik revolution? one of the biggest exterminations in the history of mankind neatly swept under the carpet because it was mainly christians who were killed. By Atheists
People were arrested for praying in the Soviet Union. Atheists convieniently forget this one.

The devils plan is to attack faith in God, the best way to do that is to discredit it. That's why you have people like George Bush promoting God.
Just because someone calls themself a Christian, doesn;t make them one. Nothing wrong with the teachings of Christ.

Some well known Atheists: Joseph Stalin, Nikolai Lenin, Leon Trotsky, Mao Zedong, Benito Mussolini, Adolf Hitler

Although Hitler claimed to be A catholic, that changed when he came to power.

Adolf Hitler - "I will crush Christianity under my boot like a poisonous toad.",


A bad Christian is worse than an atheist because it deters others from faith. Ask yourself how many positive thing's you hear on the news about Christianity that doesn't require your bank card.
Is there any mention of the appeals where people send thousands of storage containers full of medical supplies, soap and other neceseties every year to africa, asia...
If they did a survey on who donates more to good causes I guaruntee you Chirstians would make up the highest percentage. And i'm sure coutless Christians here can back me up on that.

The truth is people always label Christians with war. Yes it was in the Bible but in modern times you cannot blame christians for all wars. People are very quick to judge us. But you look at some of the biggest organizations that help those in need - Salvation army, Christian aid, samaritans, Alcoholics Anonymous - All free charities that are purely there to help people and most are volunteers.

And belief in God does not make you religious. Satanists believe in God mostly, but people will stick them in the same bracket as Christians, muslims, Jews...

Now you've read all this please tell now the world is a better place without Christianity



posted on May, 30 2011 @ 08:59 AM
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reply to post by Dezero
 

Well said!



posted on May, 30 2011 @ 12:59 PM
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Contradictions demographic produced by Project Reason;

Useful for debating Theists.



posted on May, 30 2011 @ 03:14 PM
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reply to post by awake_and_aware
 


There are contradictions in the bible no doubt. Most of the contradictions are pure lack of understanding. The book cannot be read once and understood. Jesus himself said no man can have complete understanding of the scipture by himself but a group can understand together. Not those exact words but to the effect.

The point is the lesson and guidance you get. Whether one account says one man is going in and another says he is going out is not the point. No book written by man can ever be 100% faultless. And for that we have the Ten Commandments. I don't believe God would allow us not to have what we need for salvation.

Ask any devout Christian if it is just the words that make them believe. They will say no. When you read the bible and open your heart to the Lord in prayer, amazing thing's happen i peoples lives. An atheist will probably say it's just chance and randomness. Well if this whole existence is chance and randomness then someone needs to explain to me the power of prayer. I've seen a lot of thing's happen through prayer that would be too much of a coincidence to be just random.



posted on May, 30 2011 @ 04:51 PM
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reply to post by Dezero
 


Which Ten Commandmets are you referring to? I'm just curious.



posted on May, 30 2011 @ 05:23 PM
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reply to post by Dezero
 


Here's what you have to believe to be a Christian;

That God waits 100,000 years of human evolution (since we separated from the animals) Many humans life expectancy being around 25 years, disease and threats from predators were adbundant, many dying during child birth.

He finally decides to introduce a "savior" in the less literate/educated parts of the desert, where he sacrifices one individual to absolve the "sin" of the entire species.

It's as if you think before the burning bush on Mount Sinai and the handing down of the commandments that humans had no concept of what is decent, that they thought killing, theiving and raping was no problem. I can assure you if that had been the case, we wouldn't have got that far.


"Human decency is not derived from religion. It precedes it."
— Christopher Hitchens


It's an offense to my intelligence that i need some ancient objective rules in order to make me a good person. Ask yourself - if your friend was an atheist, and was a kind person, do you think you're God would punish him for eternity just because he honestly couldn't believe?
edit on 30/5/11 by awake_and_aware because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 30 2011 @ 09:59 PM
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Romans 2:13 "For merely listening to the law doesn't make us right with God. It is obeying the law that makes us right in his sight."

Romans 3:20 "For no one can ever be made right with God by doing what the law commands."

Does this contradiction have a reasonable answer?



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 11:05 AM
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reply to post by novastrike81
 



Romans 2:13 "For merely listening to the law doesn't make us right with God. It is obeying the law that makes us right in his sight."





The Leader is good, the Leader is great, we surrender our will as of this date!


Sinister religions like this emanate a totalitarian edict.



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 05:46 PM
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Originally posted by novastrike81
Romans 2:13 "For merely listening to the law doesn't make us right with God. It is obeying the law that makes us right in his sight."

Romans 3:20 "For no one can ever be made right with God by doing what the law commands."

Does this contradiction have a reasonable answer?


You're lack of understanding is blinding you. Reading from the NIV Catholic Bible is like a sinister version of chinese whispers. I have yet to meet a Catholic who has read the bible. No disrespect to them because I was also baptized catholic. there are so many thing's changed and watered down n modern bibles. Best to stick with the KJV

Did you mean this Romans 3:20 "Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin."


In other words just by obeying the Commandments you won't be without judgement. We are also judged on our unselfish acts for others...

The only valid Bible is the original King James version. All other versions have been messed with and some misinterpreted.



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 07:32 PM
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reply to post by Dezero
 


Romans 2:13 "For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified."

Romans 3:20 "Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin."

They say the same thing; please don't insult me. I was merely making a point with a more understandable English version. If you can't see that these two quotes are the same as the ones I quoted from the NIV; then it is you who are blinded.


EDIT: You still haven't answered my question on which 10 Commandments you were referring to further up the page. This time, please refrain from being insulting as I'm not attacking any position. I'm merely asking a question.
edit on 31-5-2011 by novastrike81 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 1 2011 @ 01:42 AM
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Originally posted by Dezero

You're lack of understanding is blinding you. Reading from the NIV Catholic Bible is like a sinister version of chinese whispers. I have yet to meet a Catholic who has read the bible.

Well, it looks as if you haven't met very many Catholics! (Don't respond that you were baptised Catholic, that's meaningless. I was christened Presbyterian by atheist parents, for purely social reasons, and didn't know anything about it all until I was in my teens...



Originally posted by DezeroThe only valid Bible is the original King James version. All other versions have been messed with and some misinterpreted.

This is just bizarre...
V



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