ALL FACT NO FEAR: Clear and concise info about the Fukushima plants from MIT!!! (with updates)

While the MIT guys are no doubt a highly intelligent bunch of people they are only as good as the information they're working with and i suspect, though don't know, that they, like us, haven't been given enough accurate information by the Japanese government or nuclear power industry.

What disturbs me about this is the Japanese people are having a terrible time of it but many people here on ATS are concerned that they will get exposed to radiation. From what i understand is that even if all the reactors melt down it's extremely unlikely that America will be significantly effected. This is a crisis for Japan and the region, not an American crisis. If it effects America we can assume it's going to effect the whole world, and if that's the case then building nuclear power stations will turn out to be the worst idea mankind ever had. I for one don't believe that this situation will turn out as bad as that.

Some aspects of the media are causing panic, for example iIve read that people in Finland are rushing out to buy iodine, which considering the distances involved seems crazy. During the Chernobyl accident huge amounts of radiation was released but the world kept turning. Everyone not in Japan should calm down and send their love and support to them rather than panicking about their own situation.

Originally posted by predator0187

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
The truth is that the situation in Japan is fluid, and while the guys at MIT seeking publicity for the Institute are sitting in their staid respectable classroom environs, the nuclear reactor 10,000 plus miles away, plant has been battered by explosions, an earthquake and a tsunami.

These are nerds with pocket protectors talking out of the side of their arse in all their pompous don't have a clue detached glory.

The situation still continues to go from bad to worse, and I would be looking to people on the ground in Japan for information not the Dungeon and Dragons crowd.

We all know the situation is fluid, but to say that they do not know what they are talking about us a different thing. With someone of your stature here, being well respected, for you to resort to ad hominem attacks and saying that they are too far away to know is a little daft in my opinion.

They know what's going on, they know the structure and they know physics, why would we not trust scientists from one of the most trusted institutes around?

I will value their opinions much more than anyone on MSM.

Pred...

Have you met many people in the Academic/Scientific Community most especially those at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology? It's a rarefied atmosphere driven by intense competition where there is a lot of pressure to over perform. They do some outstanding work, largely in giving us through invention and development some of the technology and minds that create technology that they declare safe and beneficial (usually first for the military) and then later for us, that isn't always so safe or so beneficial. So you might want to consider these words...vested interest.

Vested interest does not always lead to honest interest, or intelligent interest.

It might seem like an ad hominem but they do wear pocket protectors and play dungeons and dragons therefore it's really just an accurate reflection of the state of the people you are 'trusting' for information.

These people aren't voicing their opinion because it's a particularly well considered or informed one but to bring the Institute prestige and to protect some of it's revenue streams. Chances are who ever designed these reactors in part or in whole are graduates of MIT.

Right now questions are focused on the safety of people in the effected Zone, what do you imagine happens when the radioactive dust settles though and inquiries start being made about fail safes they failed, or built in structural integrity thresholds that didn't perform to expectations.

It's called egg on one's face, and they are simply attempting to get out ahead of the bad publicity this is likely to generate for a community of physicists and engineers that they by and large produce and are the preferred purveyors of.

I’ll grant you that while in my humble opinion the Original Piece is little more than a had hominem attack on ATS members on whole that tends to rankle the scourges in my fasces, the truth is that I would sooner consider the wide eyed musings of a little old lady from Peoria in regards to this situation than what is essentially a Powers that Be scientific think tank like MIT.

Sorry if my thread title is considered misleading to some. I still stand by it though as this source does not aim to place fear into the hearts of everybody like many of the 24/7 news cycles do.

When it comes to nuclear energy I'd rather hear from these "nerds" at the Nuclear Science and Engineering department at MIT then some news anchor.

BTW You all do know that the cores are constantly cooling (however slowly) right? The chance for a total meltdown is constantly dropping. Not saying that people in the area will not get some contamination but the treat is dropping more as time goes by.

Thanks for everyone's responses

Respect,

AS

reply to post by AeonStorm

Authorities also banned flights over the area and evacuated most workers from the plant. Those who remained behind continued a seesaw, last-ditch effort to flood reactors with seawater to keep them cool and prevent a wider environmental and public health catastrophe.

"Their situation is not great," said David Brenner, director of the Center for Radiological Research at Columbia University. "It's pretty clear that they will be getting very high doses of radiation. There's certainly the potential for lethal doses of radiation. They know it, and I think you have to call these people heroes."

www.cnn.com...

As of now this remains a very serious, uncertain situation with very grave potential attached.

If you were a Power that Be, you are correct you would want to check with the guys at MIT as far as what is really going on...

But then you would want them to put a happy face on it for the rest of the world, and in essence have them tell us, the general public something completely different.

So while it's an impeccable source, its not an uncorrupted source as the Institute itself is the beneficiary of numerous Government Agencies from the Intelligence and Defence Departments as well as a number of foundations and corporate interests.

There are a lot of causes to be concerned in regards to this situation, that is going to lead to speculation until the event plays itself out and the dust settles.

Often the worst thing in these kinds of situations is the not knowing and the desire to want to know is overwhelming, but it still remains a situation where only time will be able to tell.

One of the uglier aspects of these kinds of tragedies is the propensity for some to attaching their egos to predictions of the outcome and what's going on beyond the foggy situation on the ground.

We really are just going to have to wait and see.

Doom is more entertaining.

I enjoyed your post however....

The Nuclear power industry is..an industry. A business. It employs people. People who have vested interests in the continued uptake of this source of energy. Countries around the world are now questioning the safety of these plants and they are asking the experts, which for the most part have grants and funding from the Nuclear power industry. There are billion dollar contracts at stake.

In short, I struggle to trust these so called "independent" experts. Thing is, I also don't believe the doom ( read: entertainment for a a lot of Atsers).

Clearly we aren't getting the full picture but I do believe the danger is mostly confined to Japan.

No matter what happens now, it's bad, bad for the Nuclear Industry, bad for Japan and bad for us all.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Agreed.... The best picture of everything that has gone on will be afterward. I also believe that no one source is without human error (or possibly even an agenda) therefore no source is totally reliable.

I hope everyone understands I am in no way trying to downplay the situation. I'm just trying to keep a level head about it all. I also want as much fact as possible and less conjecture.

Peace,

AS

What about the spent uranium feul rods in the (decreasingly cool) cooling pools. Are they going to catch fire or not? Because, I just heard, on the radio, if they do, all hell will break loose. (Moreso than it has already).
www.nytimes.com...

Originally posted by sonnny1
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

EXACTLY!! Another thing,why hasnt M.I.T. fixed their faulty information? I can get faulty information from MSM. Those at ground zero are having the hardest time fighting this,analyzing this. All fact no fear? Radiation poisoning is as fearful as you can get.

It may not be that they are giving faulty information ... It could be the location from which they are getting their readings compared to others ... obviously the closer to the source you get (including where you are in regards to the source ie. upwind or downwind (downwind being stronger)) the stronger the reading.

My work involves air monitoring and it doesn't take much of a change in distance or direction to see a major change in particulate levels.

Respect,

AS

I really don't sense the fact nor fear in this... What facts? the "fluid" situations and conditions in Japan? The "correction" of errors in media and MIT? The statements from the Japanese government and the company that runs the nuclear reactors in question?

Just reading a quote from the company that owns em that they have never prepared or considered a devastation like this... is entertaining! Right? Isn't the various spin we are getting entertaining and amusing? and that's a fact. These company Japanese officials HAVE said they never prepared for this.

Meanwhile, many groups and individuals have long been warning of EXACTLY this situation happening. Ah the SPIN... the p r firms... the INDUSTRY IMAGE.... Main Stream Media might not be as amusing for some as for other... but General Electric built those plants and General Electric also owns NBC... go figure it all out.... Think MIT isn't in bed as well?

One might even ponder that we can learn more about this nuclear history and situation from Greenpeace, than we can with MIT.

As for the "distant" radiation and the fear factor... look at the smoke and fire alarms.... see one close by? They are radioactive too man... and MIT nor the Main Stream Media has informed you eh?

ah the P R ... the image OVER the substance!

Kind of funny to find this thread in the Disinformation forum, since that MITnse.com site is misleading, most would say deliberately so.

1. The author, Dr. Oehmen is NOT a nuclear physicist, he researches risk management economics
   
2. That website he created is NOT hosted or endorsed by MIT, DESPITE the deceptive graphics
   
3. The author refuses to do interviews with the media
   

What you are seeing here is the hand of the nuclear energy industry's public relations firm in action. As we now know, Dr. Oehmen's error-ridden Pollyannish posturing was just that, fluff and spin.

I have been getting some good information on this from local radio stations in Japan on the Short wave and HF freq bands. The information is nothing like what the MIT blog is stating, well mit is telling half the story. not to mention the U.S.MSM or NHK.

A talk show in japan stated yesterday # 2 is in meltdown, The dry well is cracked and so is the casing to the dry-well. otherwise rods and all melted the containment vessel straight though and is now at the bottom. Before I lost the signal they were saying TEPCO is going to flood the drywall and try to keep this nuclear blob from melting to the water table. what MIT is not telling you is that the plutonium is from the the #2 reactor is stilling at the bottom of the dry-well melting the concrete. It's escaping though the cracked dry-well and the steel casing around it from another recent EQ in the past two days. Hence' the high readings and why they have high readings. ( this is called a full scale meltdown)

later today another japan talk show said they were going to abandon #2 , and keep flooding the dry-well if they can without loss of life. There having a hard time getting people to fight this now. They also mentioned no contractors want the job, TEPCO is offering big bucks for those that step up for the job. That tell me it's a one way mission sort of speak. Then I guess they got a small aftershock at the station the time i was listening. then lost the signal.

Sorry to ruin your parade with MIT blogs but this is right from Japan; better than a geek with a pocket protector.

Conformation from homland security

This confirms my japan radio source on the SW HF Bands. I listened to this on the 3/29 and posted it on another thread March 29th seems I'm a little faster than HMLS. they post there information on the 30th

You might want to bookmark the HMLS site. if you don't have a SW/ HF band transmitter -receiver. HMLS seems good for information, better than than MIT blog anyway.