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Will todays kids ever know a Natural Blue Sky? (Chemtrails)

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posted on Mar, 15 2011 @ 09:49 AM
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Originally posted by djcarlosa
reply to post by firepilot
 

so quick to blow this vid out of the water I take it what's being said is a lie as well maybe maybe not but I do have to say that the plane you sent me a pic of dose not look like the plane in the vid also I would like to point out the lack of markings on the plane and the lack of army/air force colours.
Also I would like to say that the stop start of the contrails is rather strange as well but I'm just a layman.


Lets just say that video is not new to ATS by any means, like I said it was an ATS member who filmed it, and he was even around to discuss it for awhile, and there have been several threads about it.

And how are they two different kind of aircraft? Both are listed at KC-10s, even the Tanker Enemy clown calls it a KC-10 too.

The US military has been gradually going to a low visibility gray paint color, instead of the European green colors. Even the A-10s that fly out of the airport I fly from, are gradually going all gray.
edit on 15-3-2011 by firepilot because: (no reason given)




posted on Mar, 15 2011 @ 10:20 AM
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reply to post by djcarlosa
 


With the greatest respect, don't search youtube for evidence, search for scientific analysis that proves how contrails are formed, why some dissipate quickly and why some linger for hours and go on to form cirrus clouds.

You sound intelligent, just consider the facts......why would anyone perpetrate a plan to poison vast areas of the globe, that would in turn poison themselves and their families........ please don't quote the earlier post which claimed that world leaders, the elites, TPTB, whoever! only appear outdoors when there is no spraying going on or that they stay indoors/cars with special ventilation, or better still they all have secret antidotes!

Seriously, which scenario do you consider to be the more likely? the above, or the fact that contrails are explained ad infinitum by science?

You decide



posted on Mar, 15 2011 @ 10:55 AM
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reply to post by djcarlosa
 


Your aircraft identification skills are lacking somewhat:


...I do have to say that the plane you sent me a pic of dose not look like the plane in the vid....



The KC-10 in that "tankerenemy" video is the SAME make and model as in the other video that firepilot posted. We are both pilots, with lots of experience....and can tell when it is the same airplanes, seen from many different angles, just from experience. Regardless of paint schemes, too.

(Seems THAT confused you as well? The different paint? Do you not realize that many airplanes have different paint designs?? ALL on the same basic shape).

Here, spend a few minutes (hopefully, several hours) and start an educational trip:

Over 20 pages of KC-10 photos.


en.wikipedia.org...

www.af.mil...


AND, know this: On YouTube, that idiot "tankerenemy" shows NO facts, just DIS-info. (Either he is very stupid....or intentionally perpetuating the "chem"-trail HOAX, don't know for sure).

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Here are some technical engineering details of the McDonnel Douglas DC-10 (the base model that the military KC-10 is derived from) showing cutaways, and clear images of the trailing edge flap hinges....theones labelled as "nozzles" by that nozzle, 'tankerenemy':

www.flightglobal.com...


edit on 15 March 2011 by weedwhacker because: the Earth shifted its polar axis, and bumped my keyboard.



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 07:05 AM
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Originally posted by Argyll
reply to post by djcarlosa
 


With the greatest respect, don't search youtube for evidence, search for scientific analysis that proves how contrails are formed, why some dissipate quickly and why some linger for hours and go on to form cirrus clouds.

You sound intelligent, just consider the facts......why would anyone perpetrate a plan to poison vast areas of the globe, that would in turn poison themselves and their families........ please don't quote the earlier post which claimed that world leaders, the elites, TPTB, whoever! only appear outdoors when there is no spraying going on or that they stay indoors/cars with special ventilation, or better still they all have secret antidotes!

Seriously, which scenario do you consider to be the more likely? the above, or the fact that contrails are explained ad infinitum by science?

You decide
There is no factual evidence that proves how contrails are formed in all cases. All previous theories especially the Appleman chart have been proven to be inaccurate and do not meet the criteria for being facts. They are just theories and are based on hypothetical speculation. They approach the best guesstimate of why and how they are formed but many contrails have formed under conditions that do not meet the speculated conditions for contrail formation.


Belfort-Groups Case Orange Report
coto2.files.wordpress.com...

Appleman was the first in 1953 to present charts that predict the likely hood of contrail formation.................They identifed a unique range within which a contrail should theoretically form.
However the lack of field tests to verify these models and the fact that contrails have been noted to form and spread during conditions not deemed favorable according to some of the models



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 07:37 AM
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I really don't care how many old contrail prediction charts or contrailscience/propaganda websites you want to quote from. There is absolutely no scientific facts, theories or basis that will explain or prove the reasons we see such a difference between the two "contrails" in this video other than one is an actual contrail and the other is an actual chemtrail. The difference in elevation can't explain it nor does the type of jet engine explain why one contrail dissipates so quickly while the other "persistent contrail " lingers across the entire skyline in a huge monsterous and most likely a chemically based toxic jet aerosol cloud.



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 12:33 PM
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reply to post by MathiasAndrew
 


great find my friend this vid really shows the difference but I'm sure that some will say it was of 2 planes at different heights or perhaps that the air changed so that caused the difference or maybe water content of the air or air temp or maybe the vids a fake after all when payed to bury a subject you have discredit every bit of evidence we put in front of them.
I do have to concede one point to them that internet sources are flawed and in this point it also devalues any site they wish to quote in return as you can't have it both ways I mean the internet is a huge leap forward but is flawed because anyone can change the information on sites at will.



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 12:46 PM
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Originally posted by djcarlosa
reply to post by MathiasAndrew
 


I'm sure that some will say it was of 2 planes at different heights


No reason to suppose otherwise
Although it's also obvious the larger contrail is older - hence has had more time to spread out as it drifts in high altitude winds.

Edit: oh, I see, there are actually 3 contrails. Anyway, clearly point proven. 2 are at a different altitude to the 3rd which appears behind the first.

edit on 16-3-2011 by Essan because: added comment



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 12:57 PM
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reply to post by Argyll
 


So what your saying to me is that a government or T.P.T.B wouldn't implement a project aimed to poison the whole population they govern please are you for real.
Do some research into fluoride you know the toxin they add to your water supply that is so toxic that its illegal to dump at sea that has a skull and crossbones on its label.
Its more toxic to us than lead and only just under arsenic and the human body can only expel 50% of what's ingested the rest builds up in the bones and joints now you add to that the amount of water you ingest everyday.
So you can see why I can well believe that a government could and would poison us as they have be doing it all our life's.
I would also like to point out that while I was out shopping today going around town so many people where saying how they had a cracking head ach and a horrible metal like taste in there mouths as have I my wife and my close friends I'm sure if we were to do a survey you would find that many people have been feeling the same way.
edit on 16-3-2011 by djcarlosa because: correct a mistake



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 01:38 PM
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Originally posted by djcarlosa
reply to post by Argyll
 


So what your saying to me is that a government or T.P.T.B wouldn't implement a project aimed to poison the whole population they govern please are you for real.
Do some research into fluoride you know the toxin they add to your water supply that is so toxic that its illegal to dump at sea that has a skull and crossbones on its label.
Its more toxic to us than lead and only just under arsenic and the human body can only expel 50% of what's ingested the rest builds up in the bones and joints now you add to that the amount of water you ingest everyday.
So you can see why I can well believe that a government could and would poison us as they have be doing it all our life's.
I would also like to point out that while I was out shopping today going around town so many people where saying how they had a cracking head ach and a horrible metal like taste in there mouths as have I my wife and my close friends I'm sure if we were to do a survey you would find that many people have been feeling the same way.
edit on 16-3-2011 by djcarlosa because: correct a mistake


So basicailly what we are left with, is that because in your mind that you can envision these conspiracies, is evidence to you that it is happening then. Its not about evidence, its your imagination running wild, with ideas of vast conspiracies of some nefarious group called TPTB that for no apparently reason, is poisoning people, but doing it pretty badly since there is no evidence of it and life spans are getting longer, and the population is growing.

So apparently its not about facts, information and science, its more related to imaginations and speculation, which to a conspiracy theorist, is more important than reality.



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 02:08 PM
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reply to post by firepilot
 


You really are either stupid or government paid look it up if you don't believe most EU country's have banned fluoride from there water supply the UK haven't I see you haven't said that fluoride is not toxic that its not in our water supply but just decided to attack me and your argument about how the death rate has not increased we would have to wait 3 generations before you could prove that one way or the other but what has been noticed is the increase in joint pain in the elderly increase in cancers increase in autism A.D.D and A.D.H.D.
Also there has been a noticeable reduction in the intelligence of our children compared to the generation before.
these are facts trust me I know I have a child with major problems.
You may consider me an alarmist where as I'm real just a realist.
also if you look it up you will see the way fluoride effects the body including a dumbing down of brain function.
Do everyone here a favour and do some research before you attack someone for pointing out the truth.
edit on 16-3-2011 by djcarlosa because: added info



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 02:29 PM
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Originally posted by djcarlosa
reply to post by firepilot
 


You really are either stupid or government paid look it up if you don't believe most EU country's have banned fluoride from there water supply the UK haven't I see you haven't said that fluoride is not toxic that its not in our water supply but just decided to attack me and your argument about how the death rate has not increased we would have to wait 3 generations before you could prove that one way or the other but what has been noticed is the increase in joint pain in the elderly increase in cancers increase in autism A.D.D and A.D.H.D.
Also there has been a noticeable reduction in the intelligence of our children compared to the generation before.
these are facts trust me I know I have a child with major problems.
You may consider me an alarmist where as I'm real just a realist.
also if you look it up you will see the way fluoride effects the body including a dumbing down of brain function.
Do everyone here a favour and do some research before you attack someone for pointing out the truth.
edit on 16-3-2011 by djcarlosa because: added info


Wait, poison now takes 3 generations to have an effect? Silly me, I thought poison hurts the person who ingests it. And no, you do not have to wait to see if poison is working.

I did not attack you personally, I attacked your holding onto a conspiracy with no evidence, all because its something you can imagine happening.

There is debate about the neccessity of flouride in water yes..but, it is in toothpaste in Europe, as is flouridated salt.

Again none of this has the slightest thing to do with "chemtrails" and aviation. Just another completely unrelated thing that chemmies use for evidence of mass spraying by large aircraft.



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 03:04 PM
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reply to post by firepilot
 


Again you fail in your attempt to discredit me and again you sidestep the issue and if you had of read what I put and in what it was an answer for you can see that I was giving a proven example of a government endorsed poisoning of the general population.
There is no debate to be had on fluoride its toxic and has the warning that clearly shows it is.
So my point is valid and correct and you sidestepping this issue just goes to show that you are a payed member of a government agency.
Also I would like to point out that on a NHS web site they still peddle the lie that fluoride is good for you which just proves that cover-ups do occur.
So you saying that chemies are using this subject to validate there argument that mass poisoning dose go on just goes to show that what little creditability you have is blown out of the water.
Its a proven fact and in time so will chemtrail's become proven fact.



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 03:16 PM
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Originally posted by djcarlosa
reply to post by firepilot
 


Again you fail in your attempt to discredit me and again you sidestep the issue and if you had of read what I put and in what it was an answer for you can see that I was giving a proven example of a government endorsed poisoning of the general population.
There is no debate to be had on fluoride its toxic and has the warning that clearly shows it is.
So my point is valid and correct and you sidestepping this issue just goes to show that you are a payed member of a government agency.
Also I would like to point out that on a NHS web site they still peddle the lie that fluoride is good for you which just proves that cover-ups do occur.
So you saying that chemies are using this subject to validate there argument that mass poisoning dose go on just goes to show that what little creditability you have is blown out of the water.
Its a proven fact and in time so will chemtrail's become proven fact.


Whether or not you believe flouride is poison, has nothing to do with airplanes, aviation and your chemtrail religion.

Your whole premise is since that it is your opinion that flouride is poison, that therefore proves that a vast fleet of airplanes are therefore poisoning us too. I really dont care what you believe in for flouride and dentistry, even though apparently flouride is such a poison that its used in toothpaste and salt in europe, where you said it was banned.

This is an aviation conspiracy, not a tooth conspiracy. Give us actual evidence, liike show us a chemplane base, show us modified aircraft, show us the logistical chain needed. I could care less about the conjecturing that takes place in your imagination



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 04:20 PM
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reply to post by firepilot
 


Again sounding like a stuck record it was to answer a question posed by another member.
Also I would like to say that when a chemical has the skull and crossbones label it is a poison so its not really a case of whether I believe its a poison its a proven fact or the warning would not be there now would it or are you saying that any product with that warning label say a strong cleaning product is safe and OK to add to your coffee or tea?
but you are right it dose not prove that they are spraying chemicals from planes but it dose put to rest the fact that they are capable of doing so.
As for pics of modified planes that spray the chemtrail's alas I don't have the funds to rent a plane to get that kind of prof and even if I could you would still say that it was a fake or normal contrail's.short of taking the members here who don't want to believe what we are saying and opening the door of a plane as we passed through a chemtrail nothing we say or show will ever be enough.



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 06:06 PM
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reply to post by djcarlosa
 


TPTB have been trying to get us to poison our coffee and tea for a long time.

Splenda was invented from an insecticide
www.youtube.com...



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 06:45 PM
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reply to post by djcarlosa
 


But you don't just live above one flight route. It shows the ignorance that is out there in your perception. You live below a busy flight route in the UK that serves transatlantic flights. That is a fact that you simply fail to understand. Why don't you contact NATS?

www.nats.co.uk...

From

www.nats.co.uk...

www.nats.co.uk...

You are making your own assumption of 'pointless flight routes' when it is clear that you simply don't understand the Air Traffic Control zone above you. It has been there long before you were born. Is it any wonder that people take time and effort to respond to your posts. You are simply making up your own version of what flight routes exist in your area to suit your agenda. Both military and civil aircraft routinely utilise the airspace in your region.

TJ



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 07:33 PM
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reply to post by tommyjo
 


you know for someone who is so up to date on what fly s where I find it strange how you just like to slate any thread to do with the chem trail subject.
Like any of your co slaters you profess to have all this knowage about this and that I would have thought that this subject would be a waste of your vast intellects.
As for your providing website after website to help prove your point as I've said before in a post that I concede the point that websites I may use to prove my point are invalid as in your own words they are false and inaccurate so must you as you can't have it both way's after all the internet is a great leap forward but is flawed because any information can be changed by anyone at any time.
So now we are in a catch 2 situation one on one so to speak so with us at a stalemate it would be pointless to carry on therefore why not find something more constructive to do with your time.



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 08:24 PM
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reply to post by djcarlosa
 


I'm so tired of these shills and dis-info agents. I made a new thread for "chemmies" only.
Hopefully the debunkers will respect the request made in the OP and will not interfere.

Chemtrail Debunkers Need Not Apply
www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 09:05 PM
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Originally posted by MathiasAndrew
reply to post by djcarlosa
 


I'm so tired of these shills and dis-info agents. I made a new thread for "chemmies" only.
Hopefully the debunkers will respect the request made in the OP and will not interfere.

Chemtrail Debunkers Need Not Apply
www.abovetopsecret.com...


Uh huh...typical. You chemmies just want to live in an echo chamber where you can all just agree with each other, and live comfortable in your delusions, rather than deal in reality and live with science.

Funny though, how you chemmies claim its everyone else trying to suppress information and limit debate, and well what do we have here, a thread where they want discussion limited to just though who believe in a mass aviation conspiracy of spraying that relies about hoaxed photos, junk science and misleading videos



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 09:08 PM
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reply to post by djcarlosa
 



That assumption of yours is beginning to wear very thin. All you are doing is copping out of the subject at hand. So are you trying to imply that the Air Traffic Control system above the UK is a fabrication? You admit that you are a layman in these matters. Individuals like myself who have a knowledge of aviation are in the most part bemused at your ignorance of the facts. There are numerous aviation hobby websites and forum and also professional airline forums out there. All that information on Upper Air Routes you could have found out elsewhere before trying to debate it on a conspiracy theory website. That is nobody's fault but your own. You are the one making up your version of events simply because you don't understand Air Traffic Control. Did you even take the time to watch the video on NATS or even read the description of ATC? Do you think that it is all invented and changed by the authorities in order to cover up a 'chemtrail programme'?

Why not try a bit of research on the subject? For example here is a professional Air Traffic Controller who is also an aviation enthusiast.

www.rogdabbit.co.uk...

If you do a bit of research on the web you can probably find other people out there willing to explain the airlanes in your region?

TJ



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