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Japan declares 'nuclear emergency' after quake

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posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 01:11 AM
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Page 580


Originally posted by TheRedneck
reply to post by ikonoklast

It is basically vindication IMO. There is no way the corium from reactor #3 is inside that building. All that is left of the RPV now is a huge vertical piece of pipe. I now believe that the posters who were saying they thought they saw the lid of the reactor in the explosion were probably right.

The actual corium is sitting underneath the building inside the bedrock. Apparently the rock can dissipate enough heat to keep it from moving down, at least quickly. If not, we would already have seen a steam explosion that would have dwarfed the last one. The small amount of steam indicates that the corium is now quite probably solid again, floating in seawater mostly encased in the bedrock. That steam is very hazardous, containing isotopes ranging from strontium-90 to iodine-131 to chlorine-36 and everything in between. A cool, solid mass of corium puts out just as much heat and radiation as a superheated liquid mass of corium. The heat of a meltdown is a reaction, not a cause.

Every shift of the tides is pumping that highly radioactive seawater back out into the Pacific or water back into the cracks around the corium. Seawater levels will continue to rise until everything in that area is dead. Beyond this kill zone, there will be a larger buffer zone that will harbor dying and mutating species, but will still support some kind of life.

I believe, based on TEPCO's actions, that the bedrock is cracked far too much to attempt a repair.

Northern Japan is a dead zone without knowing it. Anything within 50 miles is going to die prematurely, some fairly quickly. It will remain an uninhabitable zone for what is practically eternity.

Other countries... well, I expect there to be an adjustment on the US west coast to deal with higher radiation levels in the water. The air contamination is slowly easing, which makes me believe that it was caused by the initial explosion at #3 and not by continuing contamination of the air. Obviously, the US will be the foremost major country to see widespread effects, although the coasts of China and Russia will see some appreciable contamination as well, probably higher than the US. Smaller countries like North and South Korea will also be affected significantly.

The extent of international effects will be ultimately determined not by #3, but by #1 and #2, and possibly by #5 and #6. The plant will soon become completely unworkable; those brave heroes are going to die. Soon. I doubt they will be able to keep things under wraps after that, and therefore will be unable to get more workers. If there are reactions occurring in those other reactors, they will probably explode as well without human intervention. Ironically, the best case with #1 and #2 will be that they are melting into the bedrock as well, contaminating the Pacific more, but not blowing more isotopes into the upper atmosphere to be dumped on other countries.

The spent fuel pools will be a local problem, not an international one. They will be at least as devastating as the meltdowns to Japan.

We just witnessed the removal of Japan from the status of developed country, and a new era of radiation concerns worldwide.

TheRedneck




posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 01:14 AM
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page 451


Originally posted by TheRedneck
Folks, I simply cannot keep up with this thread as fast as it is moving... I will continue trying, but if I miss a post you really want an answer to, just u2u me with the post link... I will try to respond. But I have 6 pages of catchup this morning, and a few scrap pieces of a life. Something's gotta give.

reply to post by zorgon

I was worried about that...

The more I look at these pictures, the more I become convinced of something I had not wanted to say... but now I will. I am convinced that reactor #3 breached when that explosion occurred. I believe the corium interacted with the graphite seals in the bottom of the vessel, causing both disintegration and fire, and began dripping out through the open seals. This would have lasted minutes until the bottom of the pressure vessel opened up and dumped the whole thing onto the concrete. At the same time, workers were venting hydrogen and the bottom of the vessel was also venting gases.

There was water everywhere in that building... probably a lot form the tsunami itself. As soon as the corium hit that water, There would be a steam explosion as the water flashed into steam, which I believe was directed upwards through that hole in the picture. The steam explosion was responsible for the plume we saw, and the reason it was gray instead of white was that graphite was still burning over the source.

The pressure wave created by the explosion would also have sent fire from the burning carbon throughout the internal building structure. With all that hydrogen building up, all it took was one lone spark, one little ember to make contact with the hydrogen, and it goes off as well. What we saw was in effect two explosions.

One went off inside the building a few seconds before the other. This first was a steam explosion which was somewhat contained by the structure. In other words, it increased the pressure inside the building. This was the sound that was picked up by the helicopters. A few seconds later, the hydrogen went off as well, causing the entire building top to disintegrate and release the built-up pressure within the primary containment. This was the explosion we saw, a few seconds later.

We heard the steam explosion deep within the bowels of the primary containment walls... we saw an explosion a few seconds later when the hydrogen blew off the roof and allowed the steam to escape explosively as well. There's the difference between timing of the sound and the visual.

What this means is that radioactive particles were thrown high enough to enter the Jet Stream. Those particles, mainly I-131, have been spreading eastward across the Pacific and were found along the path of the Jet Stream. It also means that the corium is still going strong underneath that rubble; the pictures I started off mentioning still show steam rising. The small amount of steam means that there is precious little water left for the corium to interact with... that is good as it explains why no more steam explosions have occurred, but it is also bad in the sense that there is little to nothing left to even try to cool the corium.

I have also been noticing that the whole building seems to look worse every time a new picture is shown... like it is slumping down and slowly disintegrating. That's because it is. The corium is still reacting, producing copious amounts of heat and radiation from underneath it. That heat is causing an updraft like I explained some pages back. The real concern for Japan right now is that radiation levels are so high that even with a continuous updraft from the heat causing a vacuum trying to suck any particles back into it, levels at the plant are still out of control.

There is another mechanism that would allow ground readings to increase. I remember reading earlier in this thread something about the plant being situated not on soil, but on dry bedrock. That would be consistent with the observations, if the corium is quietly melting its way through that bedrock unimpeded. The heat causing an updraft would be decreasing from the plant as it moves deeper and deeper, slowing the updraft from that one plant and allowing surrounding ground conditions to worsen due to a decrease in the updraft.

Now, what does all this techno-babble mean for us? Not much really. It simply means that the China Syndrome is underway with a greater head start than we originally thought. It also means that there may be a slowing of any radioactive particles entering the Jet Stream, although not a complete stoppage by any means.

For Japan... it means that radiation levels will now start to rise quickly along the ground, as we are seeing. Oceanic radiation levels are far from peaking as well. And of course, that threat of widespread fallout from rain and downdrafts still exists and will continue for some time. Not good news, but little of that is available from inside Japan nowadays.

TheRedneck



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 01:27 AM
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Is it bedrock/mudstone or sandstone?



Interesting discussion on the physics forum about this...

Physics forum



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 02:07 AM
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Originally posted by Silverlok
reply to post by Purplechive
 


...and taking the time to respond to us that are lacking...

I would so appreciate in a layman's terms your response to the following questions:

Should I continue to track the "RPV Bottom Part" and "Safety Relief Valve 2-71D Leakage" temperatures in Unit 3?

What are the implications if they:

1. Continue to increase?

1.a. And at what temperature would this be a concern?

1.b. What would be the implications if this temperature is approached/attained?

2. Level out - no change?

2.a. Happy thoughts? A semblance of control?

3. Decrease?

3.a. Happier thoughts? Situation under control?

3.b. The crap is no longer present in this area...look elsewhere for temperature increase?

Would so very much appreciate if you could respond as simplistically as possible.

- Purple Chive


well I have some serious doubts we can trust tepco since they caught and stopped the only leak that mattered; the reactor direct data,

but ...
the implication is yet another in a long series of criticality events in what is a 'controlled ' corium melt-out , melt -off..??? an attempt at controlled melt-down

I have not thoroughly gone over the recent temp readings tepco has disgourged but in general up till now :


The oscillations have gotten to the 400C range at the sensors a couple of times , and the concern is that these times have coincided with high radiation release rates ( both into the sea and air ), incidentally just before everyone one of these "new" criticality events Tepco starts hoping around on one foot and saying how they need to use the bathroom ( pacific ocean)

if they level out you can bet your ass that Tepco will have an immediate need to suddenly find a place to put a LOT of radioactive water right now .

it you think there will be explosion of some sort that is very unlikely because Tepco has been using the "no boom no doom " meme to get people to believe this constant INVISIBLE 24/7radioactive leaking is better than simply powdering those things and then getting serious about clean-up

truly the thing is currently out of control as Tepco wants to get official sanction to pollute the ocean ( by the way they have never stopped "leaking" in the ocean , not ever not since day one) , and this program of theirs is unsustainable as it is creating 500tons of highly radioactive water a day and will need to do so for a long time unless something drastic happens...simply put it is a little like fixing a leak under the kitchen sink by constantly throwing towels under it and then throwing the wet ones in the tub and getting a new supply of towels and saying the leak is under control

I believe the bottom of the rpv ( core) the bottom of the cv and the sv temperatures are very important as they allow us to get an idea on where in the new chain of radioactive half-life the materials in and under that building are

the temp will certainly decrease after another radiation burst ( as the mass of radioactive materials is like a hot stove that is producing "x" amount of heat , these cycles are like putting a pan of spaghetti on letting all the water boil off , burning the spaghetti to carbon , throwing the mess into the tub with the rapidly accumulating wet towels and then putting on a new pan of spaghetti and beginning to measure it's temperature
I finally got caught but but i am getting a nit loopy , does that get the idea across?



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 02:11 AM
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I have put together a couple of web pages to show how the scientists are doing - the ones who are measuring radiation levels off Fukushima.

Currently they are a fair way off-shore but they are working their way inwards towards the reactors and their final testing stations will be just off the coast.

See the thread about it here.

Daily update page from Woods Hole Institute site



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 02:21 AM
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Originally posted by Wertwog
reply to post by Silverlok

you are welcome ( and nomorefedreserve and dww and everyone else thanks for the support , I finally caught up yeah ..take. that you monster..and one of those , and how abpout one of these thread ..mahahahahahahahahahaha....;-)


When this water "charges up" could it catch fire? What I'm imagining here is the ocean on fire near the release zones with 'fission water'. Probably unlikely given that mixing with the cooler ocean water would cool and cause the fission water to disperse.

Well with the oil tepco has been leaking to try and cover the radiation leakage into the ocean it might be possible and at least the ghost of Vincent van Gogh would appreciate the irony and artistry of such an event but the ocean water would inhibit the Pu/Ur hydroxide precipitation


This storage situation is going to be near impossible - we're talking thousands of tons, and I imagine that the AVEDA decontamination unit won't be able to process this volume or will fail due to the amount of Pu/U that is in such fine suspension... just guessing here but the filters would end up stressed beyond belief.


yes.
fail.
The zeolite pond will hold them for a while but those bags are going to get so 'hot' no human will be able to get near them (maybe they think they can crane then into the blue crates and then it's off to the deep blue ..? really they are going to need a special facility just to hold all of the cooling waste .)

. The big problem is most rods take several years to cool down enough to be processed so how to they plan on processing fresh hot fission products out of water ? anything that pull out is going to be so intensely radioactive human won't be able to be around it ...and they have no plan on how to stop making more as the corium poolium is still going to be putting out "x" amount of therms ( or BTU"S if you prefer) til underverse come ( and that is to see your han solo reference in your sig and raise you one ) .


edit on 11-6-2011 by Silverlok because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 02:24 AM
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reply to post by Wertwog
 

. I'm not about to throw out SFA's and Silver's analysis because some guy with a transport license shows up.

Now if he wasn't claiming to be an expert, just offering his own interpretation it would be a different matter. We're all entitled to an opinion. I'm no Nuke expert myself (but to my horror I am considered one in my field and I have the same reaction as Soundguy to it) and if someone wants to disagree with my opinions I'm fine with that, and sometimes laymen disagree with experts and prove them wrong, and I've learned an enormous amount here from laymen and experts alike. Debate is healthy and desired. Sexperts aren't always right as we have found out over and over again. But he's claiming this status because he wants our trust, that his opinion is the end of the argument, do you really expect us to give that up blindly?
edit on 10-6-2011 by Wertwog because: (no reason given)

I don't think we have to worry too much about people on this thread buying an argument or straight statement on the basis of who they sell themselves as. Most everyone here earning multiple stars has already has earned the trust and respect of those who regularly post on the basis of their post content and certainly not on the basis of whatever they have been saying their credentials are. Posters like TRN, Zorgon, Silver and SFA and some others too are offering expert and verifiable opinion, and they have earned our trust. Why the heck would anyone of us on this thread that isn't even a headliner in ATS anymore (you would have to hunt it down) readily accept 'the argument' of someone new who contradicts all that's gone before and claims we should believe them because of who they claim to be. Look we aren't meeting face to face introduced by our company or personal friends, right? So we have to depend on the post content.

For example I accept SFAs content because his posts as a body consistently make good sense, and appear very grounded in an expert understanding of the facts which support his argument. SFA, its just my opinion but you didn't need to go posting the tags and photos - but good on you anyway for believing in yourself and us enough to do so. For what its worth though, no one should go doing that. Firstly because really they could be someone elses, and because bringing that sort of stuff to the thread is doing the same thing Matador was doing. That character comes across to me as likely to be someone still catching a school bus into town every week day morning - no more and no less. Best to ignore that kind of posting.

Fundamentally, the problem with falling for someone on the basis of photo evidence is we just want to be careful we don't get mislead falling in love with a character who is ultimately setting us up for something they want to sell us further down the line. Just saying, okay. I'm with you SFA on the basis of what you've posted so far.

Ultimately none of us know for sure who any of us are. But we can be sure about what is said here, and ultimately the argument and statements posted content speak volumes about the author with no need at all to bring any personal info to the thread.



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 02:26 AM
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Originally posted by zworld
This is maybe off topic, but maybe not. This link leads to the map for Artic ice cover.

nsidc.org...

If you notice, we are currently running at the lowest point of ice cover ever at this time of year. But you'll also notice that, all other readings for the past six months have been similar except for mid March to beginning May. Here there was a surge of coldness creating significant ice cover at a time when things are normally starting to heat up. The reason I bring this up is to query 'was this a nuclear winter type event'. Just a thought, nothing prove-able or even my area of expertise.


thermohaline currents in the air and ocean , and the inversion /low pressure that has kept the arctic clear and above average temperature the last two year factor in far more heavily than the fall-out, though in a way it is killing some of the life that may have died anyway when the deep oxygen transport mechanism coloumns / currents that operate under the North pole fail completely ( it may not, but the receding ice is reducing it significantly ) and sea life and methane releases trade some carbon credits



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 02:52 AM
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Originally posted by zworld
Im sorry if my stating my belief ...snip... people cause they dont agree with your SPECULATIONS is the best way to have other people leave a thread and lurkers not join.


matador was flat wrong about the location of the reactor . It is not in the center of the building . It CANNOT BE AS THE TORUS WOULD NOT FIT IN THE BUILDING IF IT WAS . The reactors are offset towards the turbine building s to accommodate the torus fitting under the adjoining building and staying inside the reactor building.
therefore his basic premise was wrong and it made it obvious he was under educated on this particular site .
he also had the placement of the spf pool in the wrong area the area he points to would have been the drying pool .

I have not seen conclusive evidence anywhere that the sounds were added , if there is some I would like to see it, and I personally ran a size comparison on both the rpv , cv caps and the holes in the roof of the turbine building and found a correlation with BOTH that puts the statistical odds of the caps being responsible into the 'very high probability' arena , also he seemed unaware of the end placement of the concrete containment , though it was mention in the post wert dug up for his benefit( which means he didn't bother to read it or failed to pay attention to details, either one not a quality I would want in a 'bomb' expert)

so what I am saying is he was rude , arrogant , inconsiderate , and most importantly; incorrect from the word go ....even when people were trying to be reasonable with him. That is not ganging up, or a flame war, he was simply put in his place ... if it's a spade call it a spade

And quite frankly when SF first started posting here I was both feeling ornery and drunk and just about got him mad enough to explode by constantly busting his balls , even when he was (mostly ;-) right...he forgave me for being a lout, when I admitted I was being an ass...big boys should be able to handle getting knocked on their ass once in a while .

Why should we worry if people do not join or if they leave ? We are here: sometimes right sometimes wrong and any and all are free to partake or not as they choose ...the size of fan club does not change the truth one millimeter from it's course, and even if a million doctor start believing smoking is good for you it still won't be



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 03:07 AM
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reply to post by Silverlok
 

Thanks for the lengthy reply and info. I went off to the Physics forum link posted by Wertwog and it seems it may be mudstone in Fukushima. No one appears to know for sure. Interesting that info confirming the nature of the bedrock under the nuclear plant is not available isn't it?

Looking at this from here:
earthquake.usgs.gov...

It seems sandstone, or mudstone is not the best place to build on when earthquakes are to be considered.



Soil Types and Shaking Amplification

One contributor to the site amplification is the velocity at which the rock or soil transmits shear waves (S-waves). Shaking is stronger where the shear wave velocity is lower. The National Earthquake Hazards Reduction Program (NEHRP) has defined 5 soil types based on their shear-wave velocity (Vs). We have modified these definitions slightly, based on studies of earthquake damage in the Bay Area. The modified definitions are as follows:

Soil type A Vs > 1500 m/sec Includes unweathered intrusive igneous rock. Occurs infrequently in the bay area. We consider it with type B (both A and B are represented by the color blue on the map). Soil types A and B do not contribute greatly to shaking amplification.

Soil type B 1500 m/sec > Vs > 750 m/sec Includes volcanics, most Mesozoic bedrock, and some Franciscan bedrock. (Mesozoic rocks are between 245 and 64 million years old. The Franciscan Complex is a Mesozoic unit that is common in the Bay Area.)

Soil Type C 750 m/sec > Vs > 350 m/sec Includes some Quaternary (less than 1.8 million years old) sands, sandstones and mudstones, some Upper Tertiary (1.8 to 24 million years old) sandstones, mudstones and limestone, some Lower Tertiary (24 to 64 million years old) mudstones and sandstones, and Franciscan melange and serpentinite.

Soil Type D 350 m/sec > Vs > 200 m/sec Includes some Quaternary muds, sands, gravels, silts and mud. Significant amplification of shaking by these soils is generally expected.

Soil Type E 200 m/sec > Vs Includes water-saturated mud and artificial fill. The strongest amplification of shaking due is expected for this soil type.


Bold text is mine.

It's a bit like they were setting the place up for a catastrophe. I am still thinking along the lines those who ultimately set up the project in the beginning were thinking logically. Unlikely to have been thinking rationally though, not as we would find acceptably rational in our paradigm at least.

Yes, either that or the brightest minds do not find themselves in charge of determining where nuclear power plants are set up in Japan. Certainly greed is ultimately stupid but I do not for a moment think those who determined the locations of these plants were stupid. All things considered they knew what they were about.





edit on 11-6-2011 by Tallone because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 03:31 AM
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Originally posted by Tallone
reply to post by Silverlok
 

Thanks ... Interesting that info confirming the nature of the bedrock under the nuclear plant is not available isn't it?

Looking at this from here:
earthquake.usgs.gov...

It seems sandstone, or mudstone is not the best place to build on when earthquakes are to be considered.

..snip...

Bold text is mine.

It's a bit like they.... All things considered they knew what they were about.



It would seem for earth quakes the sand stone and mudstone would have about the same index , but I do not think the mudstone would be considered "as hard as granite " in 1967 ( whereas the sandstone was actually considered harder stone ), and building earthquake "proof buildings" was a 'computer unassisted' man power and slide rule only type job back then .

And the engineers had the unwavering assurance from GE that the 'containment's could never fail, ever under any circumstances"

I would also think mudstone would have been passed over as a building spot because of the clay content 'crackiness' in the sixties

it if is mud stone then the corium is going to have field day with all those cracks , but if it's sand stone the sand will actually slow and somewhat mitigate the coriums ability to pop ( flash over wise) . Especially if they get some boron in that basement water ( it helps make corium glass) , but some where back about page 500 on this thread someone actually got the geographical survey chart for the fukushima plant ...I'll see if I can find it .

I should point out the fukushima has zeolites and some atomic bomb manufacturing attempts were made there near the end of WWI whicih is one of the reasons the plant was placed there ...so not a lot of thought other than convenience, on the surface at least ...


edit on 11-6-2011 by Silverlok because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 05:03 AM
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Originally posted by Silverlok




I have not seen conclusive evidence anywhere that the sounds were added , if there is some I would like to see it,


This is from the PF forum and has become accepted as fact. Ive done studio engineering off and on and agree with this analysis for the most part;

i1185.photobucket.com...


and I personally ran a size comparison on both the rpv , cv caps and the holes in the roof of the turbine building and found a correlation with BOTH that puts the statistical odds of the caps being responsible into the 'very high probability' arena ,


OK, like you say, probability. Its a theory, not fact. This too has been endlessly discussed in the PF forums and to this day people agree to disagree. (I must add that a structural engineer debunked that theory but I couldn't find it). Now that TEPCO is going into reactor three, we may see a picture soon that shows the state of the RPV and that should solve the issue. Or not



if it's a spade call it a spade


I agree. Thats why I say that anyone who puts theories forward in an aggressive manner demanding they be accepted as fact is full of s*&%. And I turn off.



Why should we worry if people do not join or if they leave ?


Because they might have the answers we need.

edit on 11-6-2011 by zworld because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 06:19 AM
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Originally posted by Silverlok



Originally posted by Silverlok
reply to post by Purplechive
 


...and taking the time to respond to us that are lacking...

I would so appreciate in a layman's terms your response to the following questions:

Should I continue to track the "RPV Bottom Part" and "Safety Relief Valve 2-71D Leakage" temperatures in Unit 3?

What are the implications if they:

1. Continue to increase?

1.a. And at what temperature would this be a concern?

1.b. What would be the implications if this temperature is approached/attained?

2. Level out - no change?

2.a. Happy thoughts? A semblance of control?

3. Decrease?

3.a. Happier thoughts? Situation under control?

3.b. The crap is no longer present in this area...look elsewhere for temperature increase?

Would so very much appreciate if you could respond as simplistically as possible.

- Purple Chive


well I have some serious doubts we can trust tepco since they caught and stopped the only leak that mattered; the reactor direct data,

but ...
the implication is yet another in a long series of criticality events in what is a 'controlled ' corium melt-out , melt -off..??? an attempt at controlled melt-down

I have not thoroughly gone over the recent temp readings tepco has disgourged but in general up till now :


The oscillations have gotten to the 400C range at the sensors a couple of times , and the concern is that these times have coincided with high radiation release rates ( both into the sea and air ), incidentally just before everyone one of these "new" criticality events Tepco starts hoping around on one foot and saying how they need to use the bathroom ( pacific ocean)

if they level out you can bet your ass that Tepco will have an immediate need to suddenly find a place to put a LOT of radioactive water right now .

it you think there will be explosion of some sort that is very unlikely because Tepco has been using the "no boom no doom " meme to get people to believe this constant INVISIBLE 24/7radioactive leaking is better than simply powdering those things and then getting serious about clean-up

truly the thing is currently out of control as Tepco wants to get official sanction to pollute the ocean ( by the way they have never stopped "leaking" in the ocean , not ever not since day one) , and this program of theirs is unsustainable as it is creating 500tons of highly radioactive water a day and will need to do so for a long time unless something drastic happens...simply put it is a little like fixing a leak under the kitchen sink by constantly throwing towels under it and then throwing the wet ones in the tub and getting a new supply of towels and saying the leak is under control

I believe the bottom of the rpv ( core) the bottom of the cv and the sv temperatures are very important as they allow us to get an idea on where in the new chain of radioactive half-life the materials in and under that building are

the temp will certainly decrease after another radiation burst ( as the mass of radioactive materials is like a hot stove that is producing "x" amount of heat , these cycles are like putting a pan of spaghetti on letting all the water boil off , burning the spaghetti to carbon , throwing the mess into the tub with the rapidly accumulating wet towels and then putting on a new pan of spaghetti and beginning to measure it's temperature
I finally got caught but but i am getting a nit loopy , does that get the idea across?


Unit 3 RPV Bottom Part - temp steady/ SRV 2-71D temp rise 42F degrees



Thanks Silver...


Unit 3:
SRV - 2-71D rose 42F degrees in 24 hours...

www.tepco.co.jp...

Unit 1: www.tepco.co.jp...

Unit 2: www.tepco.co.jp...


- Purple Chive



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 07:01 AM
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UC Berkeley Food Chain Sampling results



Dang...

At least the topsoil looks better...

www.nuc.berkeley.edu...

- Purple Chive



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 07:20 AM
link   
http://(nolink)/2011/06/10/physician-epidemiologist-35-spike-infant-mortality-northwest-citie-meltdown-result-fallout-fukushima-25311 /

and

www.democraticunderground.com...


Physician and Epidemiologist Say 35% Spike in Infant Mortality in Northwest Cities Since Meltdown Might Be the Result of Fallout from Fukushima.....

The recent CDC Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report indicates that eight cities in the northwest U.S. (Boise ID, Seattle WA, Portland OR, plus the northern California cities of Santa Cruz, Sacramento, San Francisco, San Jose, and Berkeley) reported the following data on deaths among those younger than one year of age:

4 weeks ending March 19, 2011 – 37 deaths (avg. 9.25 per week)
10 weeks ending May 28, 2011 – 125 deaths (avg.12.50 per week)

This amounts to an increase of 35% (the total for the entire U.S. rose about 2.3%), and is statistically significant.


Mild radiation poisoning causes 25% or so mortality in the first month. They've been keeping from the general public that the Northwest, and its close to home.
edit on 11-6-2011 by Unity_99 because: (no reason given)

edit on 11-6-2011 by Unity_99 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 09:08 AM
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Originally posted by Wertwog

Is it bedrock/mudstone or sandstone?



Interesting discussion on the physics forum about this...

Physics forum


Pretty sure there have been a few reposts about the journo who investigated fukushima and held up a crumbling bag of stone from it to show some bigwigs; it was soft, crumbly old sandstone.



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 12:03 PM
link   

Originally posted by Silverlok

Originally posted by zworld
Im sorry if my stating my belief ...snip... people cause they dont agree with your SPECULATIONS is the best way to have other people leave a thread and lurkers not join.


matador was flat wrong about the location of the reactor . It is not in the center of the building . It CANNOT BE AS THE TORUS WOULD NOT FIT IN THE BUILDING IF IT WAS . The reactors are offset towards the turbine building s to accommodate the torus fitting under the adjoining building and staying inside the reactor building.
therefore his basic premise was wrong and it made it obvious he was under educated on this particular site .
he also had the placement of the spf pool in the wrong area the area he points to would have been the drying pool .

I have not seen conclusive evidence anywhere that the sounds were added , if there is some I would like to see it, and I personally ran a size comparison on both the rpv , cv caps and the holes in the roof of the turbine building and found a correlation with BOTH that puts the statistical odds of the caps being responsible into the 'very high probability' arena , also he seemed unaware of the end placement of the concrete containment , though it was mention in the post wert dug up for his benefit( which means he didn't bother to read it or failed to pay attention to details, either one not a quality I would want in a 'bomb' expert)

so what I am saying is he was rude , arrogant , inconsiderate , and most importantly; incorrect from the word go ....even when people were trying to be reasonable with him. That is not ganging up, or a flame war, he was simply put in his place ... if it's a spade call it a spade

And quite frankly when SF first started posting here I was both feeling ornery and drunk and just about got him mad enough to explode by constantly busting his balls , even when he was (mostly ;-) right...he forgave me for being a lout, when I admitted I was being an ass...big boys should be able to handle getting knocked on their ass once in a while .

Why should we worry if people do not join or if they leave ? We are here: sometimes right sometimes wrong and any and all are free to partake or not as they choose ...the size of fan club does not change the truth one millimeter from it's course, and even if a million doctor start believing smoking is good for you it still won't be


I'm just sitting back, waiting until everyone here has to eat crow. I refuse to discuss this subject, I've given my statements, shown the evidence, and will, as stated, simply wait until the truth is exposed. I will then allow myself one post to explain why you were all wrong.



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 12:22 PM
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reply to post by matadoor
 

I would think that if you are an expert you would jump at the chance to prove it to us by answering SFA's simple questions... I mean to you they should be simple right? If you do answer them then all our doubt will go away and I for one would be happy see you and SFA and Silver discuss this again. It's not a competition for who has the biggest dick, we just need to know why we should accept your photo as gospel. We're after the truth and if you think you have it then I don't see any reason why you couldn't easily pass his test. Can you put your ego aside for this and join the discussion reasonably? We would still welcome an educated informed and rational discussion from another expert in this area.

edit on 11-6-2011 by Wertwog because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 12:23 PM
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Originally posted by matadoor
I'm just sitting back, waiting until everyone here has to eat crow. I refuse to discuss this subject, I've given my statements, shown the evidence, and will, as stated, simply wait until the truth is exposed. I will then allow myself one post to explain why you were all wrong.


Well ya sent someone to Federal prison based on one photograph, your testimony on that photo and not a snippet of other evidence or testimony so I suppose stranger things have happened


Still waiting on that case citation BTW...



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 12:56 PM
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Originally posted by GhostR1der

Originally posted by Wertwog

Is it bedrock/mudstone or sandstone?



Interesting discussion on the physics forum about this...

Physics forum


Pretty sure there have been a few reposts about the journo who investigated fukushima and held up a crumbling bag of stone from it to show some bigwigs; it was soft, crumbly old sandstone.


That was the geoscientist Leuren Moret...



....
"The structures of the nuclear plant are directly rooted in the rock bed and can tolerate a quake of magnitude 8.5 on the Richter scale," the utility claimed on its Web site.

From my research and the investigation I conducted of the rocks in the area, I found that that the sedimentary beds underlying the plant were badly faulted. Some tiny faults I located were less than 1 cm apart. When I held up samples of the rocks the plant was sitting on, they crumbled like sugar in my fingers. "But the power company told us these were really solid rocks!" the reporters said. I asked, "Do you think these are really solid?' and they started laughing.
...

From...Japan's deadly game of nuclear roulette, Source


Also, at 19:15mins into this video she describes the geology under the site. Just skip the intro if you like and go to this spot in the vid.

edit on 11-6-2011 by Wertwog because: fixed the link




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