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Japan declares 'nuclear emergency' after quake

page: 796.htm
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posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 07:42 PM
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reply to post by Silverlok
 


Did you get a chance to see these nifty floorplans? So sorry for the language - but there are pictures to paint by number.
May help.

source

ETA: wrong link...sorry...try...these:

Link

Link


edit on 26-4-2011 by DancedWithWolves because: (no reason given)




posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 07:47 PM
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Mods, this is off topic but also does apply to this thread:

to all querying the absence of The Redneck, just because it shows he was on the site does not mean a hill of beans; if you notice, it almost always says that I am on the site, even when I am not, simply because I never log off; the only times it shows I am off site is when typing a post.

back to our regularly scheduled posting...


seeker



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 07:58 PM
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reply to post by zorgon
 



Originally posted by zorgon

Originally posted by DancedWithWolves Can anyone translate this part or find a subtitled version of this video? I really, really, really want to understand this entire video. What I wouldn't give for a babel fish right now.


Thanks for that video... Its 45 minutes.. I will look at it later tonight and get the key points


ah great thx, i asked a friend to do it but i think she's got a lot going on right now



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 08:09 PM
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reply to post by predator0187
 

Pred it appears that the trap of conversion has reared it's head here again :

it appears that Radio activity:
Becquerel, curie,rutherford ,
Exposure: Roentgen,
Absorbed dose: Grey, Rad, and
Equivalent dose : sievert, and R.E.M. or rem ( Roentgen equivalent man )
are getting entangled

a rem (dose rating) can be directly converted with little uncertainly at .01 to Seiverts but Roentgen is a different bird

This calc takes these thing into account( has both rem and roentgen): link

and wiki has a good listing on it's tables conversion page if you would like to make your own conversion taking mass / time/ surface area into account : link

Not to be a pain but I am certain of poolium deposits and they are going to have some insanely high numbers , and the cooling is now a huge problem for Tepco , the water thing at 1 only buys them some time but is going to be a huge FAIL as they get structural failure ( on a core they KNOW has containment loss ) and 'accidental' discharge into the sea, or 'leakage' and discharge into the environment, and four is equally problematic , and the radiation count, thermal images and priori predictions are running a close game here...everything is suspect from Tepco , but those numbers could be exactly true



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 08:21 PM
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reply to post by Silverlok
 


Yeah I thought we were crossed somehow. If you go to the Chernobyl wiki page and scroll down it says how high the radiation was and has roentgens and sieverts and they are using the conversion I was. The wiki page is interesting and has all the radiation from Chernobyl, it's a good read.


You may very well be right about the poolium, it might be giving off loads of radiation, Chernobyl was new fuel and in the process of fissioning. I am saying when we are talking about 4,000 Sv/h, we are talking about a nuclear explosion, not a reactor. It would be in the stages of explosion and could not be hidden. I'm thinking it is a misreading.

Pred...



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 08:28 PM
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reply to post by Moonbeams771
 


yea moonbeams, i posted that article a few pages back, & i'm glad you linked it too, as the thread's moved quite quickly today so people mightn't have seen it


it had me in tears, & by the end of it i was in such an angry tizzy with whoever reported the evac as completed when it wasn't... heads should roll for that, although it's no consolation for the people who suffered & died, nor their grieving families



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 08:33 PM
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Idaho environmental officials say radiation levels undetectable in municipal drinking water.

THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
First Posted: April 26, 2011 - 5:33 pm
Last Updated: April 26, 2011 - 5:33 pm



www.therepublic.com/view/story/77a37f49b7da48a4996b2eb60caf2d59/ID--Radiation-Drinking-Water


BOISE, Idaho — Idaho environmental officials say drinking water samples from around the state are testing radiation-free.

The Idaho Department of Environmental Quality said Tuesday that samples taken April 11 from municipal water systems show no evidence of elevated levels of radioactive iodine-131.

(...)



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 08:34 PM
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reply to post by predator0187
 


Perhaps a more mundane explanation would be the measurements are in mSv/hr in which case 4 Sv/hr is an end result. That level is still pretty damn deadly and I wouldn't want to be anywhere near it.

Considering the posts and examination of what little we have on it- that reading would seem to tie in with the reactor being refueled at the time of the quake and a pile of rods rattling down to the lower floors.



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 08:48 PM
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Originally posted by DancedWithWolves
reply to post by zorgon
 


Time traveling here to catch up.

Apologies for quoting myself but are these pics and video of the #4 Spent Fuel Pool blowing from German doc recently...finally captured in video? See video at 9:50. Stills from vid below too. Thanks for input.

Sure looks that way, but not being able to translate I can only assume from the preceding frames.We have some translation help incoming from friends on our thread, but we need that chunk just prior to and during the 9:50 mark translated specifically to know if that is what we are seeing there. Trying to catch up. Sorry if this has been addressed. Wanted a few of our great minds on here to take a look. Posted this in the am while all you night owls were catching Zzzzs. Bottom of the page and all - just wanted to make sure it got a looksy. Thanks!

Link to post with #4 pics and video

Oh heck...here they are:






9:50 in this video is the explosion on video referring to SPF in Unit 4.




source

edit on 26-4-2011 by DancedWithWolves because: (no reason given)


I think you may be on to something. Those photos seem to be a type of night or low-light vision. This could very well be what we've all been looking for.

Any and all image analysts please look these over and comment if you would!



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 08:52 PM
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Originally posted by SFA437
reply to post by predator0187
 


Perhaps a more mundane explanation would be the measurements are in mSv/hr in which case 4 Sv/hr is an end result. That level is still pretty damn deadly and I wouldn't want to be anywhere near it.

Considering the posts and examination of what little we have on it- that reading would seem to tie in with the reactor being refueled at the time of the quake and a pile of rods rattling down to the lower floors.


That's the lines that I am thinking along. That's a pretty big mistake though, regardless of who made it, and should be cleared up ASAP.

It is deadly yes, but 4,000 is instant death where as this one you can be exposed for a short period without the same result.

It's an idiotic mistake, but I would not put it past anyone working on this plant.

Pred...



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 09:00 PM
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reply to post by predator0187
 


Pred, that is why I think all the recent photos released by TEPCO, and those are few and far between, are of only robots working at Fukushima

Robots checking levels of water. Robots trying to open doors, human hands would serve better. Robots moving debris around, instead of humans properly suited, could do with regular earth moving equipment. Robots filling reactors with water. Calls for robots from all over the world in the last two weeks. Robots. Robots. Robots. Because it's too dayum hot for humans.


Des

edit on 03/28/2011 by Destinyone because: (no reason given)

edit on 03/28/2011 by Destinyone because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 09:06 PM
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Originally posted by DancedWithWolves
reply to post by Silverlok
 


Did you get a chance to see these nifty floorplans? So sorry for the language - but there are pictures to paint by number.
May help.

source

ETA: wrong link...sorry...try...these:

Link

Link


edit on 26-4-2011 by DancedWithWolves because: (no reason given)


Nice , no I had not seen these but the overhead and side views help immensely...and don't worry about the language I shutter to admit but I am starting to recognize some of the terms( although i have no intention of spending like two or three days learning JApanese..hehe) , the nice bit is evidence from the word go has the reactor cores off centered, I have been under the assumption they are centered (photos seem to have no way of dispelling that ) but that of set shows them centered only on the long axis, I believe this will shed some new light on how and were some of the poolium is now :-)

It certainly explains the thermal photos from #4 either poolium burned through the dry-well , or it was getting transported with flowing water from the pool back into the reactor containment ( not the core proper ) and that's why the theramals have that odd three "blossoming" shape ( the RPV is actually above the poolium mass heat blocking the center somewhat )



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 09:08 PM
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TheRedneck... you is bein' monitored, yo!

sorry, couldn't resist


oops, forgot my link...

"Kan Calls For Commission To Probe Fukushima Accident"


Chief Cabinet Secretary Yukio Edano told a news conference that he expects the probe to focus on Tokyo Electric Power Co. (9501), which operates the plant, as well as the Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency and, "in a broad sense," the Nuclear Safety Commission -- two regulatory bodies.


"expects"?.... duh, i guess, huh?

e.nikkei.com...
edit on 26-4-2011 by pattonisit because: spazzing out, need zzzz's


ETA - (my caps, sorry again mods, need to learn how to highlight stuff tomorrow)


From an international standpoint as well, "WE NEED TO FIND OUT RIGHT AWAY WHETHER THIS ACCIDENT (STEMMED FROM) PROBLEMS AT FUKUSHIMA ALONE" Kondo said


eh, wtf?


i'm far too tired to contemplate the exact meaning of this statement right now... i'm going to bed, & expect to not be able to sleep on it


cheers everyone

edit on 26-4-2011 by pattonisit because: perchance to dream....



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 09:15 PM
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Originally posted by Destinyone
reply to post by predator0187
 


Pred, that is why I think all the recent photos released by TEPCO, and those are few and far between, are of only robots working at Fukushima

Robots checking levels of water. Robots trying to open doors, human hands would serve better. Robots moving debris around, instead of humans properly suited, could do with regular earth moving equipment. Robots filling reactors with water. Calls for robots from all over the world in the last two weeks. Robots. Robots. Robots. Because it's too dayum hot for humans.


Des

edit on 03/28/2011 by Destinyone because: (no reason given)

edit on 03/28/2011 by Destinyone because: (no reason given)


Yeah the robots I find funny, if the numbers they are leaking are right (37-49 mSv/h) then people could spend a bit of time in that before they are above the new legal limit of 400 mSv/h. Get people in there on shifts, they had people doing that at Chernobyl, why not here?

If it was higher than robots wouldn't work. The robots were committing suicide at Chernobyl (lol, the one drove into the hole on the roof), and couldn't function properly that's why they had to resort to human hands.

The Japanese have been incompetent on this matter, as Russia did a much better job 25 years ago. Japan should be ashamed, they refused help when they knew they would need it.

Pred...



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 09:22 PM
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reply to post by predator0187
 


corium is a bird of a different feather it builds up a 'shell' that internally 'reflects' a lot of thermal and neutron energy ( well almost all thermal ) so even as seemingly blackened lump of lava internally it is a radiation hell zone ( one of the reasons a puddle of water containing high gamma would indicate poolium underwater emitting several orders of magnitude higher radiation.

Remember thermal energy is radiatively dependent on the surface area due to extremely high 'absorption' and thusly expands on the order of the square but radiation , works on the order of the cube with a much lower average absorption ( from our navy doctor friend , perhaps one in ten interactions per unit volumne ) so the energy measurements for the two will have wildly different 'linear' relationships , you may have ten times the the radiation from the surface of the sun at a given spot but exponentially speaking a much lower density region all around it . consider your cpu , more energy per square inch on the surface of the cpu slug than on the sun , but even with non-cubically equivalent 'expansion' space not glowing red . But don't let me stop you I am no expert ... and every extra eyeball counts



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 09:27 PM
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reply to post by predator0187
 


And let's not forget the handi-caming of the screen ...why not give us the actual feed? do they think generational loss is going to hide the gamma count? perhaps we got pretty close with the earlier estimate based on a still photo and someone decided that was not good , the handi-cam thing stinks ..there is no good excuse for it



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 09:27 PM
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An underwater burst of a hydrogen bomb would be like an earthquake, and would be experienced like a tsunami.An underwater burst of a hydrogen bomb would be like an earthquake, and would be experienced like a tsunami.

In other words - the extra devastation in Sendai from the tsunami....could it be that the tsunami was worse in that area because the reactor did act like a bomb when the original tsunami hit it? The extra waves from a double impact?

What if the waves hit like crossing wave fronts?

I'm totally just riffing here. Asking the question.

How would you know that a hydrogen bomb went off under the water, when the thing that would give it away was masked by EXACTLY the same phenomena happening naturally?

reply to post by Aeons
 


The 7.2 quake that occured the day they claimed to inject nitrogen into the reactor, has never say quiet right with me. I think there is more to that "quake" and you may be onto something with you post. IMHO



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 09:35 PM
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reply to post by Silverlok
 


I am also wondering if there are two spent fuel pools in four? I keep seeing reference to a "dryer" spent fuel pool on the opposite side of the building? That may up the ante of rods or be of interest in looking at damage to the building/thermals. Just something to be aware of. They seemed to use every inch of space so two spent fuel pools (one dryer prior to dry cask storage of older rods maybe) in one building would not be shocking I guess.

Want more?

Blueprint for Unit 1

3D rendering of Units 2-5

All kinds of stuff



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 09:41 PM
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Originally posted by Silverlok
But don't let me stop you I am no expert ... and every extra eyeball counts


Yes, same goes both ways. I am no expert as well, I know particle physics and astrophysics which scratches the surface of nuclear physics, so I have learned about it but not in depth.

When 4,000 Sv/h is being talked about, the corium/poolium would have to be exploding and reaching critical mass. Chernobyl had a molten mass oozing through the plant and it only got to about 30 Sv/h so to think that these plants are putting off 4000 Sv/h sounds crazy. I'll read more and make sure I'm not talking out of my a$$ though.


That number is higher than anything I have ever seen, minus the initial explosion in a nuclear bomb, and I haven't seen any massive explosions lately that would lead to that. Remember, nuclear bombs give off very high radiation measurements but they decrease very rapidly. So it could not have been a bomb, and seems to high for even a fissioning reactor. I think it is just a mistake and should be mSv/h.

Pred...



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 09:53 PM
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reply to post by DancedWithWolves
 


Ok - I'm not going to ask where you got that.............but it does appear there's an APB out for it. So save ASAP.


Leaked Fukushima reactor's blueprint may be on Internet


A blueprint believed to be of the crippled No. 1 reactor of the Fukushima No. 1 nuclear power plant, considered to have leaked from Tokyo Electric Power Co., was posted on the Internet, an apparent violation of its regulations on protection of nuclear materials.


asahi



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